|
Antti posted:The fees would be for non-EU students*, so it'd be light blue with an asterisk like Scotland is in the map. Don't most places have high fees for non-EU students? I know Edinburgh University has a lot of students from mainland China, and that they are a big money maker. A quick google suggest that non-EU students in Scotland are charged the full cost of the course, which ranges from £9,000 for humanities to £26,000 for medicine. It's kind of funny that our special 'take advantage of new money Chinese students' prices are still cheaper than normal US tuition fees.
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 20:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 4, 2024 07:43 |
|
|
marktheando posted:Don't most places have high fees for non-EU students? I know Edinburgh University has a lot of students from mainland China, and that they are a big money maker. A quick google suggest that non-EU students in Scotland are charged the full cost of the course, which ranges from £9,000 for humanities to £26,000 for medicine. On paper it seems nice, but our cost-cutting government is more thinking in the terms of "opening the issue". Besides outside-EU-issue, there has been talks on introducing a partial tuition fee for students who miss the "optimal study plan requirements" (something like getting at least 55 study credits per semester, 300 is the requirement for Master's). Knowing how things roll here, unfortunately it is only a matter of time and political spin work to get everyone into the program.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:01
|
|
|
Der Kyhe posted:On paper it seems nice, but our cost-cutting government is more thinking in the terms of "opening the issue". Besides outside-EU-issue, there has been talks on introducing a partial tuition fee for students who miss the "optimal study plan requirements" (something like getting at least 55 study credits per semester, 300 is the requirement for Master's). Knowing how things roll here, unfortunately it is only a matter of time and political spin work to get everyone into the program. Oh absolutely, it's the thin end of the wedge. Education should be free for everybody. I was just surprised that charging non-EU students was apparently a new thing for Finland.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:05
|
|
|
marktheando posted:Don't most places have high fees for non-EU students? I don't know about other places but France has the same fees for EU and non-EU.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:25
|
|
|
Soviet Commubot posted:I don't know about other places but France has the same fees for EU and non-EU. Ah, another addition to the list of reasons the UK is poo poo I guess.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:27
|
|
|
marktheando posted:Oh absolutely, it's the thin end of the wedge. Education should be free for everybody. I was just surprised that charging non-EU students was apparently a new thing for Finland. That's a nice sentiment to have, but the Austrian experience shows you get a lot of lazy fucks that take 10 years or longer to finish. Even a nominal fee is better than nothing. Plus, Austria/Belgium get German/French* free riders that will inevitably gently caress off back home. *not entirely free for them, but still cheaper. VV to clarify, the lazy fucks are the Austrians. Riso fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Apr 4, 2014 |
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:46
|
|
|
Oh, I see now why somebody told me that Riso is a straight up Austrian Nazi. I did not want to believe it  I'm curious, how do other countries handle this issue? Russia? China? India? Japan? Do they have fees for their native people?
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 21:50
|
|
|
Torrannor posted:Oh, I see now why somebody told me that Riso is a straight up Austrian Nazi. I did not want to believe it I'll have to confirm with my girlfriend because she knows some people in the Chinese system but apparently there are fees for high school (albeit moderate ones), and there is an established system of applying for loans from the central bank. So I guess there is some sort of required payment, though I don't know what exactly.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 22:04
|
|
|
Riso posted:That's a nice sentiment to have, but the Austrian experience shows you get a lot of lazy fucks that take 10 years or longer to finish. Even a nominal fee is better than nothing. Plus, Austria/Belgium get German/French* free riders that will inevitably gently caress off back home. This is something that's becoming a bit of a problem, however. German-language Spiegel article When I studied in Vienna four years ago I met plenty of people in their late 20s/early 30s still milling around for their degrees. I can't say that's the norm of course, but they were certainly there. A nominal fee would probably do some good. In any case that can't have it as bad as I do (~$50k in debt). The only thing that keeps me from breaking down when looking at that number is telling myself "It's just money." 
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2014 23:44
|
|
|
TheImmigrant posted:Not really. There are procedures for US-licensed lawyer to become licensed in England & Wales, or Australia, without having to get another degree, but it's not like waiving into DC. I've practiced immigration abroad, but I'm a solo (although probably joining a big Canadian company next month). There are also quite a few firms in cities like Hong Kong and Singapore that hire US trained lawyers, since a lot of international contracts use US law. However, student loan debt is something that never, ever goes away, so unless you plan on immigrating permanently you have to keep paying.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 00:25
|
|
|
marktheando posted:Don't most places have high fees for non-EU students? I know Edinburgh University has a lot of students from mainland China, and that they are a big money maker. A quick google suggest that non-EU students in Scotland are charged the full cost of the course, which ranges from £9,000 for humanities to £26,000 for medicine. Course I'm taking next year is around 1000 euro for subsidized students (so every European) and 10.000 euros for those without.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 00:58
|
|
|
Konstantin posted:There are also quite a few firms in cities like Hong Kong and Singapore that hire US trained lawyers, since a lot of international contracts use US law. However, student loan debt is something that never, ever goes away, so unless you plan on immigrating permanently you have to keep paying. Those are BigLaw jobs, and not realistically in reach for 90% of newly-admitted lawyers (i.e. the ones worried about debt). BigLaw starts at $160,000/year plus bonus in the major markets, but is only available to HYS (Harvard-Yale-Stanford) grads, or the top 5-10% of lesser schools. If your first job as a lawyer isn't in BigLaw, you're never going to work in BigLaw.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 01:04
|
|
|
Riso posted:That's a nice sentiment to have, but the Austrian experience shows you get a lot of lazy fucks that take 10 years or longer to finish. Even a nominal fee is better than nothing. Plus, Austria/Belgium get German/French* free riders that will inevitably gently caress off back home. So just cap it. If you've got three year courses you get four years of funding, in case you gently caress up, and you can apply for more in the event of a personal tragedy or injuries or whatever.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 02:00
|
|
|
Mister Adequate posted:So just cap it. If you've got three year courses you get four years of funding, in case you gently caress up, and you can apply for more in the event of a personal tragedy or injuries or whatever. This sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 04:50
|
|
|
That's how it works in Scotland - you get five years of funding from SAAS at undergrad level (we have four year courses); plus the chance for more if you've had to drop out due to health issues; bereavement, etc. It'd be nice if they supported post-grad education more, but at least we're better than England!
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 05:17
|
|
|
Let us see. This map is wrong. Look at the Netherlands, were I live.
To summarize: if you manage to stay a poor gently caress after getting a degree, it's basically free. If you want to do a second study, you pay your rear end off. All options in between those extremes exist, too. So, this map isn't accurate and should show a rainbow or something for my country.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 09:02
|
|
|
Czech Republic isn't completely free either. I don't know all the details, but at the very least, if you take longer to graduate than some nominal length, you have to pay for it too.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 09:41
|
|
|
Der Kyhe posted:On paper it seems nice, but our cost-cutting government is more thinking in the terms of "opening the issue". Besides outside-EU-issue, there has been talks on introducing a partial tuition fee for students who miss the "optimal study plan requirements" (something like getting at least 55 study credits per semester, 300 is the requirement for Master's). Knowing how things roll here, unfortunately it is only a matter of time and political spin work to get everyone into the program. It's the bee's knees to be a student in a country with actually good and accessible educational system and have it be on the mercy on people who are intentionally aiming it towards the shitter.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 13:01
|
|
|
Riso posted:That's a nice sentiment to have, but the Austrian experience shows you get a lot of lazy fucks that take 10 years or longer to finish. Even a nominal fee is better than nothing. Plus, Austria/Belgium get German/French* free riders that will inevitably gently caress off back home. There is a massive influx of Dutch students in Flanders, mostly because fees in the Netherlands are a lot higher and a lot of degrees in their system have a numerus clausus. Though if Carbon dioxide is to be believed, the financial burden isn't that high after all.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 13:17
|
|
|
Skeleton Jelly posted:And while simultaneously there's this increased pressure from top to graduate in time from the same poeple who'd gladly also totally wreck the system
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 13:29
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:Unsurprisingly, the average time to complete their own education from the biggest supporters of this was something like 7 or 8 years if I recall, and that's ignoring the significant numbers of people who haven't finished their studies yet. Yeah, that's exactly the case in Finland, right down to the politicians pushing for it having taken their long rear end time finishing their own studies. In their case it's usually because they spent all their time engaged in student and university politics!
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 14:10
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:We constantly have politicians telling people that they should finish their studies faster here in Denmark, with policies directly supporting that goal. (Student grants only cover 12 semesters, plus a multiplier to your grade for the purpose of entry into your chosen education if you move on quickly to your tertiary education.) Unsurprisingly, the average time to complete their own education from the biggest supporters of this was something like 7 or 8 years if I recall, and that's ignoring the significant numbers of people who haven't finished their studies yet. There is an economic incentive for the state to push for faster graduation as that will churn out skilled workers at a faster pace, every year spent by a student finishing up their degree is a year of lower contribution to taxes and pensions by said student. 12 semesters is still a very good cover, it would allow you to either take two separate bachelors, or a master with 1 years of "backup" time, which is pretty drat nice. Here in Sweden we have a similar system and I honestly do not see any real problem with it. The fact that people "pick the wrong degree" and quit 2 years in is unfortunate but there also has to be a limit on the amount of years you are eligible for support, where it should be can be discussed but 1 year is pretty fair in my opinion. Also, here in Sweden it is free to study, and all students can get 240 weeks worth of government grants, but as this government grant is too low to pay for rent etc (~310 EUR/month) a great deal of students take extra government sponsored student loans (~900-1000 EUR/month) to pay for living expenses and such during their study time, and the amount of time you are eligible for these loans are tied to your 240 weeks of government grants. The end result is that about 70% of all Swedish students end up with debt when studying.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 14:19
|
|
|
Antti posted:Yeah, that's exactly the case in Finland, right down to the politicians pushing for it having taken their long rear end time finishing their own studies. In their case it's usually because they spent all their time engaged in student and university politics! Zudgemud posted:There is an economic incentive for the state to push for faster graduation as that will churn out skilled workers at a faster pace, every year spent by a student finishing up their degree is a year of lower contribution to taxes and pensions by said student. Zudgemud posted:Also, here in Sweden it is free to study, and all students can get 240 weeks worth of government grants, but as this government grant is too low to pay for rent etc (~310 EUR/month) a great deal of students take extra government sponsored student loans (~900-1000 EUR/month) to pay for living expenses and such during their study time, and the amount of time you are eligible for these loans are tied to your 240 weeks of government grants.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 15:15
|
|
|
Phlegmish posted:There is a massive influx of Dutch students in Flanders, mostly because fees in the Netherlands are a lot higher and a lot of degrees in their system have a numerus clausus. Well, things used to be a lot better in the Netherlands. Not strange that people are complaining. On top of that, there's often extra grants available for people who spend part of their studies abroad. Oh and by the way, the exact same story, politicians who spent way too long finishing their studies making policies to push students to finish faster - even if that's impossible. They don't seem to realize that some studies, such as those in Technical Universities, simply cannot be finished in a nominal time.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 15:41
|
|
|
Map of Indo-European migration and the expansion of Indo-European languages.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 15:42
|
|
|
While interesting, that map could benefit from better formatting.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 15:53
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:The only moral delay is my delay! I'm pretty sure you read that specific situation a bit wrong, people did not study medicine in Denmark because the Swedish university system was that horrible or expensive (though the grading scale differences most likely factor in), they did it because Sweden have had a pretty crap policy for training medical doctors, with not enough places in the educational system to accommodate the domestic need. So a lot of Swedish students that wanted to study medicine have had to study abroad even to just fulfill the domestic demand for medical doctors, and Denmark is close and have a very good and compatible medical education soooo...  I don't know if I understand your position either but as far as I know when you study abroad you get grant/loan money from your home country and you can not utilize the study benefits of the host country unless you are a citizen of the host country. If you mean you simply throw more money at your universities then that might very well be true I guess.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 16:05
|
|
|
For what it's worth, the penalty instituted by the Dutch government for those who took too long getting their degrees was abolished not even a year after it was passed, and polls showed that the proposed loan-only system the new education secretary wanted to introduce would cause so many prospective students to not even consider going to university that it's now apparantly being 'restructured'. So, a few bright points at least.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 16:44
|
|
|
Zudgemud posted:I'm pretty sure you read that specific situation a bit wrong, people did not study medicine in Denmark because the Swedish university system was that horrible or expensive (though the grading scale differences most likely factor in), they did it because Sweden have had a pretty crap policy for training medical doctors, with not enough places in the educational system to accommodate the domestic need. So a lot of Swedish students that wanted to study medicine have had to study abroad even to just fulfill the domestic demand for medical doctors, and Denmark is close and have a very good and compatible medical education soooo... Zudgemud posted:I don't know if I understand your position either but as far as I know when you study abroad you get grant/loan money from your home country and you can not utilize the study benefits of the host country unless you are a citizen of the host country. If you mean you simply throw more money at your universities then that might very well be true I guess.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2014 16:44
|
|
|
Most popular football clubs in France
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 10:41
|
|
|
Where does the map come from?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 10:42
|
|
|
Kurtofan posted:Where does the map come from? From another forum. I don't know if it's accurate but from what I know OM is by far the most popular team in France and they probably have more fans than all other teams combined, yet I find it hilarious they would be more popular than PSG in Paris. I guess that makes sense only if you go by political allegiances, considering OM is the leftist team while PSG is the right-wing, snobs' team?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 10:48
|
|
|
It's also sadly hilarious that the PSG is the more popular team in the Centre region (where I live) instead of one of the local clubs. We're so clearly dominated by the capital culturally.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 11:10
|
|
|
 Map of Governorates of Livonia and Estonia. On a scale of 40 versts. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 11:55
|
|
|
3peat posted:Most popular football clubs in France Olympique de Marseille is more popular than PSG in Paris?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 22:59
|
|
|
It's hard to tell considering how it's cut into regions instead of departments. Being from Paris' suburbs though, Marseille is indeed pretty popular. Kurtofan fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Apr 6, 2014 |
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 23:32
|
|
|
Kurtofan posted:It's hard to tell considering how it's cut into regions instead of departments. I'm sure it would make a lot more sense on the departmental level. I have a very hard time believe that Rennes is more popular than Lorient in Finisterre and Guingamp in Côtes d'Armor.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 23:41
|
|
|
Benito Hitlerstalin posted:Why aren't you rioting? Because in America violence is never used as a solution to problems (cut to laugh track)
|
|
#
?
Apr 7, 2014 17:06
|
|
|
 quote:Where's Ukraine? Each dot depicts the location where a U.S. survey respondent situated Ukraine; the dots are colored based on how far removed they are from the actual country, with the most accurate responses in red and the least accurate ones in blue. (Data: Survey Sampling International; Figure: Thomas Zeitzoff/The Monkey Cage) The less Americans know about Ukraine's location, the more they want U.S. to intervene e:Apparently the Awful App can't handle apostrophes. Honj Steak fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Apr 8, 2014 |
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2014 19:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 4, 2024 07:43 |
|
|
Faber posted:
It's very interesting that there is a straight line corresponding to some line of latitude in the middle of Russia & Western China. People (mostly) seem to know it's in Europe or maybe the Middle East and not Asia, and that's reflected on this map. That's pretty neat.
|
|
#
?
Apr 8, 2014 19:35
|
|
