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minidracula posted:*vocaloid stuff* e: Right, it's just a bunch of samples of some singer morphed around to create words. She has an accent so the vocaloid does too. Your Computer fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Jun 5, 2014 |
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Jun 5, 2014 13:04
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Sizone posted:What the gently caress do you think student loans are for? Ugh, don't remind me. I haven't even started school yet and I'm already $60k in the hole.
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Jun 5, 2014 13:30
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I was looking into vocaloids too, and what I got out of it is that almost all of them don't work on Mac unless you buy Vocaloid for Cubase. My interest dipped after that.
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Jun 5, 2014 13:37
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3S8Xkdn_Pc Don't snort cocaine just before recording a product video, kids. Your Computer posted:Are you intending to use it for Japanese or English though? The system is build on "characters" (personas?), and only two of them seem to work in English; the original Hatsune Miku (which sounds extremely creepy) and the newer "megpoid" that... honestly sounds quite good. It has a pretty strong Japanese accent though, interestingly. Vocaloid is internally built entirely around the Japanese linguistic system of chaining phonemes so making it "sing" other languages can be very entertainingly/painfully strange!
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Jun 5, 2014 17:10
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minidracula posted:Never mind, I just went to re-read the Wikipedia page, and it seems like you need at least a singer library (male or female) in a minimum of whatever language(s) you want singing done in, along with the score editor and synthesis engine. I don't know what I found so confusing some months back; maybe the Wikipedia page became clearer, or maybe I'm just reading closer now. It does seem like you'd have to buy (looking at http://www.vocaloid.com/en/lineup/vocaloid3/) at least the "VOCALOID 3 Editor" package and one of the "VOCALOID 3 Library" packages to do anything with it. Still tempts me... It's true that most of the vocaloids are not intended for English, but the number of English language versions is growing. You have to look around a bit, though. I think Best Service has some that aren't (or at least weren't) on the Vocaloid Wiki. The vocaloids that I've seen recently come with "mini" versions of Vocaloid 3 if you don't already have the Cubase Editor or the standalone product. I haven't messed with them, but those appear to come with English documentation. The mini version does appear to be Windows only (at least in the packages I've looked into), but I don't know whether that means that the actual vocaloid library itself is necessarily PC only. I really just don't know. I haven't messed with the editor yet other than to see that it installed properly. I will employ it the next time I do a song that calls for female vocals.
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Jun 5, 2014 17:12
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ynohtna posted:Vocaloid is internally built entirely around the Japanese linguistic system of chaining phonemes so making it "sing" other languages can be very entertainingly/painfully strange! Well that's the thing, the "English" versions are built to be English, but using a combination of several samples and then morphing between them. You could still do "sort-of-English" with Romanized Japanese (ai rabu yuu - I love you) for an approximation with any of the others, but it would kinda sound like crap (and even unintelligible to anyone who doesn't know how Japanese works). I think this sort of thing (vocaloids) inherently works better with Japanese, with their relatively strict consonant-vowel form. (I have no idea what any of this is called in English, I studied it for a while in Norwegian  )
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Jun 5, 2014 17:28
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Your Computer posted:Are you intending to use it for Japanese or English though? The system is build on "characters" (personas?), and only two of them seem to work in English; the original Hatsune Miku (which sounds extremely creepy) and the newer "megpoid" that... honestly sounds quite good. It has a pretty strong Japanese accent though, interestingly. Radiapathy posted:The Vocaloid Editor for Cubase does seem to be the way to go. I bought it somewhat blind. The editor's UI is in English (yay!) but the official documentation is Japanese (boo!). I don't think they even list it for sale on their English language site. (I got mine via a gray market seller on Amazon Marketplace.) AVANNA http://www.zero-g.co.uk/store/vocaloid-avanna-p502.php http://avanna-vocaloid.com/demos/ OLIVER http://powerfx.com/products/oliver It's a Wikia wiki, but http://vocaloid.wikia.com/ seems to be an OK place to get some information on third-party Vocaloids that Yamaha doesn't advertise on their site, especially English ones for Vocaloid 3 and Vocaloid 2. I think I would pick up the full Vocaloid 3 Editor from Yamaha and then one of those to start with, probably AVANNA at first, based on what I've heard so far.
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Jun 5, 2014 17:49
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Doesn't Vocaloid have some massively draconian license agreement that means that anything you make with it belongs to them, though? I thought I'd heard that. Realitone has released a vocal library called Realivox Blue that sounds pretty decent. It runs in Kontakt or Kontakt Player. I got it with the introductory sale a week ago. My only complaint so far is the lack of short "a" and short "i" sounds (as in "cat" and "dick", respectively). You can use "eh" or "ah" for the short "a" sometimes, and "ee" for short "i", but it's not perfect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goDHaTz62Fs
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Jun 5, 2014 21:45
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Trig Discipline posted:Doesn't Vocaloid have some massively draconian license agreement that means that anything you make with it belongs to them, though? I thought I'd heard that. Mainly they just don't want you making certain kinds of commercial products with it, which is the same with sample libraries. So no reselling the phoneme samples, and they specifically call out ringtones and karaoke disc background vocals as prohibited uses. The weird part is where they say you're basically not allowed to use the synthesized voices to record illegal or offensive content (so any of you guys planning to program your ransom demands as Hatsune Miku had better come up with a different scheme), or anything that might be "harmful to the moral rights" of the human who sang the original vocals used in the product. (!?!)
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Jun 5, 2014 22:55
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Radiapathy posted:No, it IS more restrictive than the license for a VST, but it's pretty similar to the kind of license you get with most sample libraries... except for one really weird clause. quote:Independent of the author's economic rights, and even after the transfer of the said rights, the author shall have the right to claim authorship of the work and to object to any distortion, modification of, or other derogatory action in relation to the said work, which would be prejudicial to the author's honor or reputation.
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Jun 5, 2014 23:11
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I'm glad the country who invented the guillotine and had (has?) a national anthem about sowing wheat fields with blood from their enemies takes such a hard stance on moral issues.
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Jun 6, 2014 01:18
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That, miraculously, hasn't stopped people from releasing a rough jumpcore album with Miku cursing up a storm.
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Jun 6, 2014 10:58
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MrLonghair posted:jumpcore I learned a new word!
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Jun 6, 2014 11:42
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Also in freaky things: a bid at a new instrument via the powers of Pi and Hexagons http://www.raspberrypi.org/joytone/
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Jun 6, 2014 12:55
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Plavski posted:I learned a new word! Jumpstyle was the word someone elsewhere crowned when linking it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0z8FHFs-XsM Not a bad album in general (see related videos) for us used to sick Eurotechno and tasteful gabber.
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Jun 6, 2014 13:02
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Hooooo boy I just started composing arpeggiators for the Proteus2k. It's amazingly flexible. Look at all dem possibilities: e: In case the image never loads... 
Tan Dumplord fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Jun 6, 2014 |
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Jun 6, 2014 17:15
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I'm surprised to see the DSI Mopho is still $400, so what's the most Model-D-like analogue you can get for under $500? The brutes?
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Jun 6, 2014 22:11
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MrLonghair posted:I'm surprised to see the DSI Mopho is still $400, so what's the most Model-D-like analogue you can get for under $500? The brutes? If it absolutely has to be analog, the Korg MS-20 is probably your best bet. Usually goes for $600 new, but it regularly dips below $500 on eBay. It's semi-modular, so you get a good amount of flexibility for the price. Otherwise, I'd get the Waldorf Blofeld as it's pretty unbeatable as far as <$500 synths are concerned. Covers all of the ground that the Model D does -- three oscillators, a nice creamy 24db low-pass filter, standard amp/filter envelopes, etc. -- but also has a crazy-flexible modulation matrix, wavetable synthesis, high-pass/low-pass/comb/notch filters, multitimbral capabilities, weird alternative envelopes like ADSDSR, and on and on. It's admittedly short on knobs, but the interface is so well-laid-out that you don't really miss them. What's more, it sounds fantastic.
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Jun 7, 2014 00:09
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He could always wait for Korg's Arp Odyssey reissue.  But anyway, the Blofeld is awesome. I really need to do more with it since it has one of my favorite filters: the comb filter. That thing is just pure  .
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Jun 7, 2014 00:34
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treasureplane posted:If it absolutely has to be analog, the Korg MS-20 is probably your best bet. Oh crap I forgot about that holy grail, my guys haven't talked much about it and yes, dissatisfaction and the bad habit of not using reference gear to listen in so I pick up artefacts and the slightest ugly stepping. The MS-20 would let me do the YMO and DAF cover business, with a midi-CV box I could do what I need for on-location fun with keytar and SP404. On the other hand I have never had anything Waldorf, and so many of me Swedish synthesizer nerds swear by their stuff. Hrm.
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Jun 7, 2014 00:38
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So, hardware is not for me. I've never been a musician but I've enjoyed creating weird sounds, textures, rhythms and whatnot for years with VSTs; all for my own consumption (I can't remember the last time I completed a full tune). So last year I started eyeing up some modest bits of hardware to play with - nothing fancy, just something to compliment my 'setup' of Live running on a laptop. I nearly got a Volca, I nearly got a Microbrute, I nearly got a Mopho, I nearly got a Nanozwerg..... Eventually, a month ago, I finally took possession of a TT-303. And I loved it. The sound, the eccentric functionality, the tweakability. Only I found out pretty soon it was a pain in the arse to integrate with my existing setup. It was doable, but it all seemed a bit 'Heath Robinson' what with MIDI leads/interface all cluttering the place up, I had hassle syncing with the DAW, gain staging....blah, blah.... Well, within two weeks the novelty had worn off. I still loved the TT but it was, and remains, infinitely easier to compose my stuff without all the hoops that adding hardware introduced. Now maybe if I had a whole suite of complimentary hardware synths and could omit the DAW from the equation it would be a different story but from my experience having just the one hooked up was like trying work with a ball and chain attached. It hindered creativity rather than inspired it. Thinking perhaps my attitude would change if only I bought a suitable drum machine to go with the TT I bought a TR-8. I opened the box, played with it for a couple of hours (it's very nice), realised it's never going to get used, and returned it the next day. Yesterday I sold the TT (which stung a bit). But I'm now back to my happier, noodling, VST-based self. The hardware spell is broken! The moral? Dunno. Maybe in the future when hardware synths can be integrated as transparently as VSTs into DAWs then I might take another look.
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Jun 7, 2014 00:42
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MrLonghair posted:Oh crap I forgot about that holy grail, my guys haven't talked much about it and yes, dissatisfaction and the bad habit of not using reference gear to listen in so I pick up artefacts and the slightest ugly stepping. The MS-20 would let me do the YMO and DAF cover business, with a midi-CV box I could do what I need for on-location fun with keytar and SP404. Just wanted to clarify that I meant the MS-20 Mini -- the original MS-20 tends to be quite a bit more costly. As far as stepping goes, it's not an inherent issue with non-analog synths, it's just the result of inadequate engineering. For example, I've never had any stepping issues on the Blofeld. treasureplane fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Jun 7, 2014 |
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Jun 7, 2014 00:44
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Kilmers Elbow posted:So, hardware is not for me.   Basically I couldn't spend money on technicalities and directed it towards synths and synths only, because those were the fun toys. When it came to the point that I would need more cables and a mixer and freeing up space to put it all and whatnot, I apparently couldn't be bothered. I "only" put around €1000 into it before I realised that I should just buy a beefier computer that could run more than 8 vsts concurrently, which is what I thought switching to hardware would solve for me. I'm keeping some of it as toys, but should I ever get over myself and start making music again it's not likely any of the harware will feature in it.
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Jun 7, 2014 01:08
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Kilmers Elbow posted:The hardware spell is broken! Workflow is a legitimate concern and should certainly factor into your buying (and selling) decisions. I came to my own epiphany on this matter a few months ago and am actively in the process of preparing my vintage gear for sale. I'm only keeping hardware synths that I can easily program from the hardware, but are modern enough that I can automate them from Cubase. Also, they must have a distinct enough sound that they justify the space they take up in my room. So, Blofeld, Pulse 2, and Rocket stay. Everything else goes.
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Jun 7, 2014 01:08
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Sadly, the KingKorg exhibits stepping in several of the models, namely sync sweeps and high res Acid filter sweeps. The latter case goes to the other point though: having no experience with a 303, the model might be accurate. I already experienced this with the VPM oscillators, where steps during sweeps at high modulation depths were actually inherent to FM, not a limitation in the model. That said, the legitimate complaints are edge cases, and they're limitations in the VA modelling. There seems to be sufficient resolution in the encoders or interpolation in the model that transitions are free of aliasing.
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Jun 7, 2014 01:38
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Trying to do the LP sample based beats business on a JJOS MPC1000 made me feel hardware was in the way, but selling that and getting an SP404SX put me back on the right path. Sampling and assigning something to a pad in a couple of seconds, would only get better with an SP12 mode and a non-ghetto pad-mute method. Gotta find the right stuff. I started out making .mod music on Amiga so I like working with some restrictions and limits.
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Jun 7, 2014 02:14
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MrLonghair posted:Trying to do the LP sample based beats business on a JJOS MPC1000 made me feel hardware was in the way, but selling that and getting an SP404SX put me back on the right path. Sampling and assigning something to a pad in a couple of seconds, would only get better with an SP12 mode and a non-ghetto pad-mute method. Renoise.
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Jun 7, 2014 02:30
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MrLonghair posted:Gotta find the right stuff. I started out making .mod music on Amiga so I like working with some restrictions and limits.
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Jun 7, 2014 02:52
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I'm confused as to what people mean when they say they can't seem to "integrate" hardware into their setup? All I've ever done is simply send MIDI notes to whatever synth and then recording back into the DAW, with on-the-fly knob tweaking. Maybe if it's a Minibrute I'll have it interact with some CV to the eurorack, but really that about it. Is there some type of sequencing or complex analog integration I'm missing out on?
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Jun 7, 2014 04:32
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ExiledTinkerer posted:Also in freaky things: a bid at a new instrument via the powers of Pi and Hexagons That looks rad, too bad it's probably going to be, like, 2-4k$.
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Jun 7, 2014 05:19
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Kilmers Elbow posted:So, hardware is not for me. Ditto, but I went a different direction. For me hardware is noise toys, as long as I'm happy with what I do I don't really care if I finish anything. For me, I get a bit too much computer time so hardware was (and is) a way for me to keep making music without staring at a computer. I realized that a setup where I was driving synths and a DAW together would never work for me because if I'm actually trying to make a song workflow is more important than actual knobs, and I'm happier with pure VSTs. That said, I went a different direction. I unloaded a shitload of rack stuff and all my Eurorack (except what I can't sell) and most of my synths and then kept three synths, the TB-303, the TB-3, and the A4. I bought a mixer, and for now I've still got a Phatty I'm trying to sell but basically that's enough self contained knobs to gently caress with some acid or psytrance or whatever and have me be happy with how it sounds. I don't pretend to be and have never called myself a musician, I'm just a guy who likes noise.
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Jun 7, 2014 06:46
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The Cleaner posted:I'm confused as to what people mean when they say they can't seem to "integrate" hardware into their setup? The cables do tend to be a rats nest given time. I'm at 32 physical MIDI cables and about the same number of audio channels and seem to spend more time on DYMO labelling and bundling than music making. The way that works for me is to do the basic composing using VSTs and then come back and replace tracks with physical sources if it helps the sound. That seems to make the music easier and keep the gear playful.
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Jun 7, 2014 06:55
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Kilmers Elbow posted:So, hardware is not for me. Composition wise I'm about 80% VST right now, especially since I got Bazille which everyone should download the beta version because it owns. The only hardware I use when composing is the K2000 because to me it's still the best sounding sampled piano and the hardware controller for spark 2 which really doesn't count. Between the MS-20 and/or VST's with the Mangler I've found they work as a super unique sound pallet to compliment established melodies and excel when I use them to add another layer over a part to really make them pop. Outside of the A4 & an analogue drum machine (or two) I'm getting I'm done with "synth" hardware... but now that I'm happy with my synth setup I've started working on getting gear for my guitar... and because I hate all 3 of the amp/effect VST's I've tried, Hail Satan hardware ahoy. 
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Jun 7, 2014 07:13
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0dB posted:The cables do tend to be a rats nest given time. I'm at 32 physical MIDI cables and about the same number of audio channels and seem to spend more time on DYMO labelling and bundling than music making. No I mean, what I've been hearing from people is "I bought an analog, couldn't get it to integrate with my DAW, how do people use hardware?" You are like the opposite extreme.
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Jun 7, 2014 07:39
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Oh god, which one am I? 
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Jun 7, 2014 07:51
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The Cleaner posted:No I mean, what I've been hearing from people is "I bought an analog, couldn't get it to integrate with my DAW, how do people use hardware?" I think these people are the same kind of people who buy trap sample packs, they expect hardware to sound amazing right out of the gate when tossed into a mix because it's ~analogue~ Also I've decided I no longer like Hawai'i: 
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Jun 7, 2014 08:22
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Cable spaghetti can seriously be conquered, I did it when I had the most hardware I ever did and filled a not too shabby MX9000 mixer, it's just that cable spaghetti is a pain in the rear end and requires a good amount of vertical space and the right furniture to deal with. Also, money buying shorter lengths instead of cheapest possibles.WAFFLEHOUND posted:they expect hardware to sound amazing right out of the gate when tossed into a mix because it's ~analogue~ On their $299 Beats By Dre "studio headphones, maaaaaaan", and entirely dry. I need headphones that are the quality and huge head-friendliness of the Sennheiser HD25s, but can be used as reference. HD25s are more for hearing what cannot be heard and engineering, and not giving anything near a correct image of what is heard on 99% of other equipment.
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Jun 7, 2014 09:27
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The Cleaner posted:No I mean, what I've been hearing from people is "I bought an analog, couldn't get it to integrate with my DAW, how do people use hardware?" Ended up getting a Kiwi Technics Patch Editor and a couple Roland original programmers for the synths the PE didn't support, but that only addresses the patch programming side- and it can be unsatisfactory at that. (I've found it easier to program the MKS-80 from the front panel.) I ultimately realized I wanted true plugin-style control, and there are plenty of plugins and libraries that cover all my personal Roland needs (plus just about anything else I could possibly want to do musically). I still love my gear. I'll just get better mileage out of software. EDIT: The Waldorf synths I'm keeping are not only easy to program and automate- they're FUN to use, too. I like fun. EDIT 2: And I will probably die with the SY-85, only because it would cost more to ship than I could sell it for on eBay and CL stresses me the gently caress out. Radiapathy fucked around with this message at 09:41 on Jun 7, 2014 |
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Jun 7, 2014 09:31
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The Cleaner posted:No I mean, what I've been hearing from people is "I bought an analog, couldn't get it to integrate with my DAW, how do people use hardware?" No, it's more like not knowing how to set up your gear so that you can actually write music with it from your DAW. There's a whole layer of midi/audio interface stuff that can be kind of a pain to deal with. I still haven't got a proper audio interface yet, so actually making music with my gear is a bit of a hackjob.
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Jun 7, 2014 09:33
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Number Two Stunna posted:No, it's more like not knowing how to set up your gear so that you can actually write music with it from your DAW. There's a whole layer of midi/audio interface stuff that can be kind of a pain to deal with. I still haven't got a proper audio interface yet, so actually making music with my gear is a bit of a hackjob. I was like you once then I wised up and got a proper DAW setup with a really good interface (Focusrite Saffire Pro 40). The old setup I had was a Shure SM57 going into the mic mini-jack of a Hercules Gamesurround Fortissimo III for recording guitars, bass, and vocals and an internal loopback for recording drums. Get an interface. It's so much better.
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Jun 7, 2014 09:38
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