Atheism does not make you clever

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landy.: Jan 20, 2014; Lipstick Apathy

im gay

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:37

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# ? May 5, 2024 21:51

Yaldabaoth: Oct 9, 2012; by Azathoth

Dongattack posted:

Let's get this out here right now. I'm a 23 year old law graduate with an IQ of 155. My political beliefs are liberal and leftist, I listen to Metal and I enjoy violent movies, books and videogames, and I've been a Christian since birth.

Wow, a christian thinks being an atheist doesn't make you clever? What's next, a Nazi who thinks Jews aren't human?

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:38

Contra Calculus: Nov 6, 2009; Gravy Boat 2k

Yaldabaoth posted:

Wow, a christian thinks being an atheist doesn't make you clever? What's next, a Nazi who thinks Jews aren't human?

Well that Godwin didn't loving take long.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:40

Contra Calculus: Nov 6, 2009; Gravy Boat 2k

Heh, God win.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:40

GreatGreen: Jul 3, 2007; That's not what gaslighting means you hyperbolic dipshit.

OP: "if this post changes just one person's mind it will all have been worth it.

GBS - *no one changes mind*

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:41

Phil Niekro: Jun 4, 2005

i make custom with christian businesses whenever possible

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:41

Big Beef City: Aug 15, 2013

Verisimilidude posted:

Even as a young athiest I knew that being athiest was all about not believing in X but also not caring that other people believe in X. I'm a scientist, so it's hard for me to rationalize a divine or omnipotent being, especially one whose actions are dictated by a text written by dozens of different ancients, many of whom were separated by continents and centuries. That's me though. I think it's dumb when people say or do mean poo poo in the name of religion, but it's also dumb when people say or do mean poo poo in the name of athiesm.

The way people are treating it, athiesm is becoming just another religion, complete with its own texts, figureheads, and places of congregation. I'm finding it harder to "identify" as an athiest, because every time you hear something about athiests on the news or in the media it's always about what tremendous poo poo heels they are.

Really, you should /never/ hear about athiests on the news or in the media, except in the context of "more (or less) people are identifying themselves as athiests", because if you're trying to promote athiesm you're trying too hard.

same

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:42

Bulgogi Hoagie: Jun 1, 2012; We

totalbullshit

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:43

Raere: Dec 13, 2007

A woman asked me for directions yesterday and after I told her she said 'God bless you' to me. I wish I could take those directions back.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:44

I Am A Robot: Jul 1, 2006

Dongattack posted:

Let's get this out here right now. I'm a 23 year old law graduate with an IQ of 155.

Not surprising really as we mammals only use 10% of our brains.

I'm guessing he probably shouldn't have skipped those grades.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:44

4outof5: Nov 10, 2003; Leader of the ULT Right.
Grabbing pussy since April 2, 1994

counterpoint: most clever people are atheists

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:45

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

4outof5 posted:

counterpoint: most clever people are atheists

also being vocally religious does make you look stupid to all the clever atheists

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:46

FuturePastNow: May 19, 2014

You know what happens when you die?

Your friends have a party because they did not like you

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:46

Big Beef City: Aug 15, 2013

Raere posted:

A woman asked me for directions yesterday and after I told her she said 'God bless you' to me. I wish I could take those directions back.

Apparently 'it's a thing' for southerners in America to have "...and have a blessed day." at the end of their voicemail recording. This is a thing I just learned.

I don't leave "...and remember to enjoy the universe that exists without a God." at the end of mine to let people know and reinforce my thoughts.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:47

landy.: Jan 20, 2014; Lipstick Apathy

4outof5 posted:

counterpoint: most clever people are atheists

counterpoint: most goons are atheists

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:48

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

Bull Runner posted:

counterpoint: most goons are atheists

whats weird though is that unlike the rest of the internet only the theists here insist on making dumb threads about how smart they are

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:50

quakster: Jul 21, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

i think picking the good parts of every belief system is the way to go & much like islam, jojo is the light

and on the next day/he fed the evil baby its own poop/for that is the fate of all sinners/to reap what they have sown

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:51

Contra Calculus: Nov 6, 2009; Gravy Boat 2k

gggiiimmmppp posted:

whats weird though is that unlike the rest of the internet only the theists here insist on making dumb threads about how smart they are

This thread was definitely made in GBS on the Something awful forums unironically.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:53

ilikedirt: Oct 15, 2004; king of posting

*points to butt hole*

thias is where my poop comes out!!!!!!!!!

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:53

Big Beef City: Aug 15, 2013

ilikedirt posted:

*points to butt hole*

thias is where my poop comes out!!!!!!!!!

Are you sure it doesn't come out of your fingertips, instead? I mean these POSTS...wow!

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:57

les fleurs du mall: Jun 30, 2014; by LadyAmbien

ilikedirt posted:

*points to butt hole*

thias is where my poop comes out!!!!!!!!!

Typical loving atheist

# ? Aug 23, 2014 19:59

EmmyOk: Aug 11, 2013

You forgot to sign your post

-TB

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:01

hhhmmm: Jan 1, 2006; ...?

I don't "get" the atheism-debate in GBS nowadays. Is it just trolling or some weird attempt to make christianity less uncool by, uhm, trolling.

I guess reading the entire OP might give a hint, but gently caress that.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:02

Dr. Faustus: Feb 18, 2001; Grimey Drawer

Dongattack posted:

I've been a Christian since birth.

Stopped reading here.

What other philosophies and belief systems did you consider and reject whilst in the womb?

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:02

Pornographic Memory: Dec 17, 2008

hhhmmm posted:

I don't "get" the atheism-debate in GBS nowadays. Is it just trolling or some weird attempt to make christianity less uncool by, uhm, trolling.

I guess reading the entire OP might give a hint, but gently caress that.

christianity is cool as aitch ee double hockey sticks brother

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:04

Big Beef City: Aug 15, 2013

hhhmmm posted:

I don't "get" the atheism-debate in GBS nowadays. Is it just trolling or some weird attempt to make christianity less uncool by, uhm, trolling.

I guess reading the entire OP might give a hint, but gently caress that.

Theism is the new anime.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:05

Mulva: Sep 13, 2011; It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

gggiiimmmppp posted:

whats weird though is that unlike the rest of the internet only the theists here insist on making dumb threads about how smart they are

This thread was not at all a quote of something someone else said and you are proving how clever atheists are by picking up on that. Good job!

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:10

Stockholm Syndrome: Mar 30, 2010

All I have to say to OP is to weigh in your upbringing. If you're conditioned as a child to believe in this so called "God" you will most likely start believing it, even if there's nothing to actually support it. On the other hand, if you're brought up in a more neutral way in terms of religion, you more likely won't adopt such views. Because there's absolutely nothing to prove there is. But yeah, your upbringing has a huge role on how you develop your views and those are very hard to get away from. Either way, it doesn't really matter as long as you don't justify doing bad things because your religion says so. Believe in anything the gently caress you want, but don't expect others to believe the same. My personal opinion is that anyone who believes in a christian god or muslim god or whatever is ignorant. All the religions say there is only one god and its theirs, but how can that be when there are multiple religions and multiple gods? It's just loving stupid if you think about it. With about a million other reasons, too. But whatever, believe what you wish as long as you're not hurting anyone.

Stockholm Syndrome fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Aug 23, 2014

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:16

les fleurs du mall: Jun 30, 2014; by LadyAmbien

Stockholm Syndrome posted:

All I have to say to OP is to weigh in your upbringing. If you're conditioned as a child to believe in this so called "God" you will most likely start believing it,

Good post + username combo

5

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:18

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

Boogaleeboo posted:

This thread was not at all a quote of something someone else said and you are proving how clever atheists are by picking up on that. Good job!

I didn't read the op

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:18

Mulva: Sep 13, 2011; It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

gggiiimmmppp posted:

I didn't read the op

Then how do you know what it was about? You read the OP and now everyone knows it. Rub your face in the shame that is this poo poo post op. Rub in it.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:22

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

i dispute the notion that anyone in this thread read the op except maybe the guy who recognized the post from somewhere else

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:24

nomadologique: Mar 9, 2011; DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

CAN GOD GET THE PRICE OF GAS BELOW 3 DOLLASR A GALLON???

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:24

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

no one's beliefs are wholly rational and founded on reality, and making religion your particular irrational belief connects you to a community and sometimes (though obviously not always) is attached to a better moral code than you'd have otherwise

i'd still rather be an atheist and a good person, though

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:25

Professor Shark: May 22, 2012

Dongattack posted:

Let's get this out here right now. I'm a 23 year old law graduate with an IQ of 155. My political beliefs are liberal and leftist, I listen to Metal and I enjoy violent movies, books and videogames, and I've been a Christian since birth. Baptised, confirmed of my own free will, son of a priest (who are pretty notorious for rebelling against their father's religious beliefs just for the sake of it). I'm part of the Anglican Church of England, which is pretty much the result of Henry the 8th getting pissed off with the catholics not allowing him to divorce his wife(s). We're the state religion of the UK, if you could even say the UK has one, we're pretty liberal about most things, women priests, gay priests, homosexuals in general, sex before marriage, contraception, we take the modern, reasonable way of looking at all of them. At the end of the day, the Bible taught us about forgiveness and being excellent to one another. It had a bit of a round-about way of doing it but what do you expect for a 2000 year old book written entirely by clerical males? It's gonna be a bit out of date, you've gotta read it in context.

I have no problems with anyone's beliefs. Be whatever you want, as long as you believe (or don't believe) for a good reason. But here's what I really don't like, trend-atheism/trend-theism (also referred to as e-atheism, since it seems to be most prevelant in the domain of anonymous blogspammers and Digg-users).

In my late teens, I spent a long time thinking. Yeah, just sitting around and thinking, thinking about faith. Thinking about what it is that I believe in. Rationalizing the various conflicts and contradictions that faith presents us with, looking at the viewpoints of other faiths, or those with no faith at all, taking into account the new things we discover every day and factoring in the influence of science. Some people would claim that, if I had indeed done that, I'd have come to the conclusion, as an intellectual, rational thinker, that God does not exist. They would of course, be wrong.

My beliefs center around several factors. Firstly, it is important for us as human-beings to realize our own limits, and the limits of our understanding. Centuries ago we believed the world was flat. "The Bible told us so!", would be the first cry. Wrong, it really didn't. In the Old Testament, Job 26:7 explains that the earth is suspended in space, the obvious comparison being with the spherical sun and moon. The Old Testament, you remember that one? The one with the fiery bushes, the pillar's of salt, the cool plagues and such? Even that managed to get it right. There's a few more references as well to the 'round' earth (and before you say anything, flat is not a shape, it could have been a flat octagon for all they knew) but I'm not going to go into that yet. We've had computers for less than a century, powered flight for just over a century and of course our amazing horseless carriages. Genetics, electricity, nuclear-bombs, toaster-strudel, the world is in the palm of our hands! And it didn't take us too long did it?

Reality-check, we're still primitives. In the great scheme of things this technology is a mere blip on the historical radar. We've got an awful long way to go before we're able to dissect and understand the mysteries of the universe. We haven't even put a man on Mars yet, let alone left our solar system to find out what exactly is out there. How can it be that we have suddenly, so recently, become so arrogant as to believe we know more than we really do? The Laws of Science are written by man, based on our understanding of how things work. They are theories that, while prove true today, may be debunked by another amazing discovery tomorrow. Which leads onto my next point.

Name this quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". Arthur C Clarke, physicist and author, smart fellow. It also hilights the point I'm making. Our understanding of the universe is peerless only amongst ourselves. We are not as smart as we think we are. Just as fire wowed the neanderthals, what would it take to wow us? What would make our jaws drop and our minds boggle? Well, any sufficiently advanced technology of course. And what is technology after-all? Man-made machines. The concept of technology is a human concept, a concept that may, in other parts of the universe, not even exist, replaced by something even more advanced than that, so advanced that we cannot comprehend it. Not surprising really as we mammals only use 10% of our brains.

So where am I going with this? Simple really, take yourself off of your high-horse, you, and the human race, is not as smart as it thinks it is. Now, open your mind a little, and let's explore some possibilities.

The definition of a God. Let us turn to the good book.

Wikipedia.

"God most commonly refers to the deity worshipped by followers of monotheistic and monolatrist religions, whom they believe to be the creator and ruler of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the various conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, perfect goodness, divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence. God has also been conceived as being incorporeal, a personal being, the source of all moral obligation, and the "greatest conceivable existent"

Hmm, a tall order one might think. Could such a being exist? Some argue that logically, he could not, however, there is very little logic in denying the possibility that a being or beings of such power and advancement exist that they could indeed, be considered 'God' within our definition. That's not to say that God is a small green alien with a flying saucer and a phaser though that would give some of the overzealous fundamentalists something to sweat over, much to our amusement. But what is this God? A creator? Sure, we create. We create technology, we're getting to the stage of being able to create life in one form or another, using the basic building blocks of nature. Could it not be surmised therefore that it is entirely within the realms of possibility that someone or something created those building blocks? Like a programmer creates a new program, someone must have also created the coding language in which he created it. We scramble for answers. We come up with theories. Some believe in the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. Some believe a man in the sky created it everything in 6 days and then mooched around on the 7th. Which is valid?

Neither, and both. They attempt to apply meaning to something where meaning may, or may not exist. Creationism and the Big Bang are in that sense, as bad as each other. They are both merely attempts for us to explain the unexplainable. The Big Bang contradicts our laws of physics (something most catalyse an explosion, therefore something must have been there in the first place, where did that come from, at which point your brain melts). The Creation Story contradicts our laws of physics (Same reasons, who created God after all?). Everything we've so far managed to come up with, from the sublime to the ridiculous, the complex to the simplistic, it's an exercise in desperate straw-clutching. At the end of the day, we don't know jack.

And that's ok. Someone once said that the journey matters more than the destination, it's not the winning, it's the taking part, at least ya tried sport. These explanations of where it all comes from, be they ancient or modern all boil down to the same need. To know. Who'd have thunk it, we've got brains for a reason, and they rather like being used. Those neurons like to be fired, the little grey matter likes a little exercise every once in a while. Just as the Creation Story was a way to explain an unexplainable concept, so is the Big Bang theory. If one were to compare the human mind to a computer, try feeding the Big Bang theory to the medieval man, and it's like trying to shove Bioshock into a Commodore Vic20. Good luck. And what will our children's children's children's grandchildren's children think of our Big Bang theory? My money's on exactly the same thing.

So what am I trying to tell you, stop asking questions, stop looking for answers and just believe whatever the hell suits ya? Absolutely not. Believe whatever suits you, but question it, never stop thinking, never stop asking or learning. In this day and age it seems people are way too willing to believe, or not believe. Belief, or non-belief should be a life-long arduous process and it should end involuntarily, when you fall over dead. Someone (there's a lot of talkative someone's aren't there?) once said 'Never stop believing', I say, "Never stop trying asking yourself what you believe, and why".

It's time to criticize, so let me load port and starboard cannon and fire a volley at both atheists and theists alike. Believing, or not believing, does not make you intelligent. Smart people do not come to a conclusion on the basis of insubstantial evidence. Smart people do not mindlessly attack other people's beliefs just because they don't comform to their own. Smart people do not assume that their own rigid, poorly formed definitions of logic and faith, reason and belief are mutually exclusive and that if one exists, the other cannot. Smart people think outside the box, not pick fights with those poor souls trapped in it.

What makes you intelligent, is knowing why you believe what you believe. Knowing that you are but one mind, and knowing that at any time you could be proven wrong, only for that person to be proven wrong ad infinitum as we as a race advance.

I suppose you're waiting for my personal beliefs, waiting for this to be some kind of sermon, preaching why my God is better than your God, or non-God. You'll be waiting a long time, because it's not coming. My personal beliefs are just that, personal, they're mine, they belong to me. You cannot take them away from me, only I can. What I can give you though, are my opinions.

Right now shots are being fired. They're not physical shots, they're bullets and shells of ignorance and bigottry. And it's no one-sided battle let me tell you that much. Factionalized camps everywhere you can imagine. Atheists, Theists, Satanists, Christians, Republicans, Democrats, Capitalists, Communists, every group you can imagine, all shouting 'Your God/Non-God sucks, mine is better!'. These days, the internet's become their battleground. So much for sharing knowledge, we're sharing ignorance.

The bigottry and the condemnation has to stop. The sad thing is, I'm having to condemn the condemners. Isn't it lowsy how you generally have to be a hypocrite in order to make a point these days? Food for thought. We can look at the extremes and see the simplistic, secular vs sacred, trend-atheists vs fundamentalist evangelical christians, the most common stereotypes. But in reality, it's so much more complicated than that. It's this stereotyping and narrow-minded attitude that prevents us as a race from achieving the greatness we can. I could make as many decrees as I wanted till I was blue in the face, and I'm going to just to let off a little steam mind you,

"Trend-atheist Digg users, shove your agendas where the sun don't shine, refusing the possibility of a supreme-being does not make you a genius or a radical thinker, it makes you a bloody sheep hiding behind a cloak of anonymity"

"Evangelical Fundamentalist morons, get your overly simplistic, judgmental, dogmatic Crayola God out of my face, you have about as much understanding of the universe as a wet lettuce. That does not make you holy, pure, or guaranteed a private booth at the big game in the sky, it makes you a bloody sheep hiding behind a cloak of propaganda that you only believe because you're told to"

Wow, that feels good, I can understand why you internet-bound condemners like it so much. Gives you that warm, fuzzy feeling doesn't it? What, I'm not allowed to indulge in such a guilty pleasure every once in a while? Play fair

Where's my conclusion? Hell if I know. Did you have the mistaken impression this was some carefully constructed plea for tolerance? Absolutely not, it's an angry slap in the face to my peers. Wake the hell up and use your brain, because my God/Non-god/Explosion/Man-in-the-sky/Vic20 gave you it for a reason.

SWEET POST GOOD THREAD

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:25

Pornographic Memory: Dec 17, 2008

Boogaleeboo posted:

Then how do you know what it was about? You read the OP and now everyone knows it. Rub your face in the shame that is this poo poo post op. Rub in it.

i dont know where a guy would get the idea that a thread entitled "atheism does not make you clever" was about a guy trying to be smart and take atheists down a peg or some other retarded religious debate

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:25

Mulva: Sep 13, 2011; It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

Pornographic Memory posted:

i dont know where a guy would get the idea that a thread entitled "atheism does not make you clever" was about a guy trying to be smart and take atheists down a peg or some other retarded religious debate

Neither do I, this is GBS. What the gently caress would make you think that?

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:27

nomadologique: Mar 9, 2011; DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

Quickscope420dad posted:

Good post + username combo

5

LMAO CHILDHOOD IS HOSTAGE CRISIS 101

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:29

Al Harrington: May 1, 2005; I used to be an adventurer like you, then I took an arrow in the eye

Dongattack posted:

Let's get this out here right now. I'm a 23 year old law graduate with an IQ of 155. Not surprising really as we mammals only use 10% of our brains.

LOL

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:32

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# ? May 5, 2024 21:51

Azraelle: Jan 13, 2008

Dongattack posted:

Let's get this out here right now. I'm a 23 year old law graduate with an IQ of 155. My political beliefs are liberal and leftist, I listen to Metal and I enjoy violent movies, books and videogames, and I've been a Christian since birth. Baptised, confirmed of my own free will, son of a priest (who are pretty notorious for rebelling against their father's religious beliefs just for the sake of it). I'm part of the Anglican Church of England, which is pretty much the result of Henry the 8th getting pissed off with the catholics not allowing him to divorce his wife(s). We're the state religion of the UK, if you could even say the UK has one, we're pretty liberal about most things, women priests, gay priests, homosexuals in general, sex before marriage, contraception, we take the modern, reasonable way of looking at all of them. At the end of the day, the Bible taught us about forgiveness and being excellent to one another. It had a bit of a round-about way of doing it but what do you expect for a 2000 year old book written entirely by clerical males? It's gonna be a bit out of date, you've gotta read it in context.

I have no problems with anyone's beliefs. Be whatever you want, as long as you believe (or don't believe) for a good reason. But here's what I really don't like, trend-atheism/trend-theism (also referred to as e-atheism, since it seems to be most prevelant in the domain of anonymous blogspammers and Digg-users).

In my late teens, I spent a long time thinking. Yeah, just sitting around and thinking, thinking about faith. Thinking about what it is that I believe in. Rationalizing the various conflicts and contradictions that faith presents us with, looking at the viewpoints of other faiths, or those with no faith at all, taking into account the new things we discover every day and factoring in the influence of science. Some people would claim that, if I had indeed done that, I'd have come to the conclusion, as an intellectual, rational thinker, that God does not exist. They would of course, be wrong.

My beliefs center around several factors. Firstly, it is important for us as human-beings to realize our own limits, and the limits of our understanding. Centuries ago we believed the world was flat. "The Bible told us so!", would be the first cry. Wrong, it really didn't. In the Old Testament, Job 26:7 explains that the earth is suspended in space, the obvious comparison being with the spherical sun and moon. The Old Testament, you remember that one? The one with the fiery bushes, the pillar's of salt, the cool plagues and such? Even that managed to get it right. There's a few more references as well to the 'round' earth (and before you say anything, flat is not a shape, it could have been a flat octagon for all they knew) but I'm not going to go into that yet. We've had computers for less than a century, powered flight for just over a century and of course our amazing horseless carriages. Genetics, electricity, nuclear-bombs, toaster-strudel, the world is in the palm of our hands! And it didn't take us too long did it?

Reality-check, we're still primitives. In the great scheme of things this technology is a mere blip on the historical radar. We've got an awful long way to go before we're able to dissect and understand the mysteries of the universe. We haven't even put a man on Mars yet, let alone left our solar system to find out what exactly is out there. How can it be that we have suddenly, so recently, become so arrogant as to believe we know more than we really do? The Laws of Science are written by man, based on our understanding of how things work. They are theories that, while prove true today, may be debunked by another amazing discovery tomorrow. Which leads onto my next point.

Name this quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". Arthur C Clarke, physicist and author, smart fellow. It also hilights the point I'm making. Our understanding of the universe is peerless only amongst ourselves. We are not as smart as we think we are. Just as fire wowed the neanderthals, what would it take to wow us? What would make our jaws drop and our minds boggle? Well, any sufficiently advanced technology of course. And what is technology after-all? Man-made machines. The concept of technology is a human concept, a concept that may, in other parts of the universe, not even exist, replaced by something even more advanced than that, so advanced that we cannot comprehend it. Not surprising really as we mammals only use 10% of our brains.

So where am I going with this? Simple really, take yourself off of your high-horse, you, and the human race, is not as smart as it thinks it is. Now, open your mind a little, and let's explore some possibilities.

The definition of a God. Let us turn to the good book.

Wikipedia.

"God most commonly refers to the deity worshipped by followers of monotheistic and monolatrist religions, whom they believe to be the creator and ruler of the universe. Theologians have ascribed a variety of attributes to the various conceptions of God. The most common among these include omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, perfect goodness, divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence. God has also been conceived as being incorporeal, a personal being, the source of all moral obligation, and the "greatest conceivable existent"

Hmm, a tall order one might think. Could such a being exist? Some argue that logically, he could not, however, there is very little logic in denying the possibility that a being or beings of such power and advancement exist that they could indeed, be considered 'God' within our definition. That's not to say that God is a small green alien with a flying saucer and a phaser though that would give some of the overzealous fundamentalists something to sweat over, much to our amusement. But what is this God? A creator? Sure, we create. We create technology, we're getting to the stage of being able to create life in one form or another, using the basic building blocks of nature. Could it not be surmised therefore that it is entirely within the realms of possibility that someone or something created those building blocks? Like a programmer creates a new program, someone must have also created the coding language in which he created it. We scramble for answers. We come up with theories. Some believe in the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. Some believe a man in the sky created it everything in 6 days and then mooched around on the 7th. Which is valid?

Neither, and both. They attempt to apply meaning to something where meaning may, or may not exist. Creationism and the Big Bang are in that sense, as bad as each other. They are both merely attempts for us to explain the unexplainable. The Big Bang contradicts our laws of physics (something most catalyse an explosion, therefore something must have been there in the first place, where did that come from, at which point your brain melts). The Creation Story contradicts our laws of physics (Same reasons, who created God after all?). Everything we've so far managed to come up with, from the sublime to the ridiculous, the complex to the simplistic, it's an exercise in desperate straw-clutching. At the end of the day, we don't know jack.

And that's ok. Someone once said that the journey matters more than the destination, it's not the winning, it's the taking part, at least ya tried sport. These explanations of where it all comes from, be they ancient or modern all boil down to the same need. To know. Who'd have thunk it, we've got brains for a reason, and they rather like being used. Those neurons like to be fired, the little grey matter likes a little exercise every once in a while. Just as the Creation Story was a way to explain an unexplainable concept, so is the Big Bang theory. If one were to compare the human mind to a computer, try feeding the Big Bang theory to the medieval man, and it's like trying to shove Bioshock into a Commodore Vic20. Good luck. And what will our children's children's children's grandchildren's children think of our Big Bang theory? My money's on exactly the same thing.

So what am I trying to tell you, stop asking questions, stop looking for answers and just believe whatever the hell suits ya? Absolutely not. Believe whatever suits you, but question it, never stop thinking, never stop asking or learning. In this day and age it seems people are way too willing to believe, or not believe. Belief, or non-belief should be a life-long arduous process and it should end involuntarily, when you fall over dead. Someone (there's a lot of talkative someone's aren't there?) once said 'Never stop believing', I say, "Never stop trying asking yourself what you believe, and why".

It's time to criticize, so let me load port and starboard cannon and fire a volley at both atheists and theists alike. Believing, or not believing, does not make you intelligent. Smart people do not come to a conclusion on the basis of insubstantial evidence. Smart people do not mindlessly attack other people's beliefs just because they don't comform to their own. Smart people do not assume that their own rigid, poorly formed definitions of logic and faith, reason and belief are mutually exclusive and that if one exists, the other cannot. Smart people think outside the box, not pick fights with those poor souls trapped in it.

What makes you intelligent, is knowing why you believe what you believe. Knowing that you are but one mind, and knowing that at any time you could be proven wrong, only for that person to be proven wrong ad infinitum as we as a race advance.

I suppose you're waiting for my personal beliefs, waiting for this to be some kind of sermon, preaching why my God is better than your God, or non-God. You'll be waiting a long time, because it's not coming. My personal beliefs are just that, personal, they're mine, they belong to me. You cannot take them away from me, only I can. What I can give you though, are my opinions.

Right now shots are being fired. They're not physical shots, they're bullets and shells of ignorance and bigottry. And it's no one-sided battle let me tell you that much. Factionalized camps everywhere you can imagine. Atheists, Theists, Satanists, Christians, Republicans, Democrats, Capitalists, Communists, every group you can imagine, all shouting 'Your God/Non-God sucks, mine is better!'. These days, the internet's become their battleground. So much for sharing knowledge, we're sharing ignorance.

The bigottry and the condemnation has to stop. The sad thing is, I'm having to condemn the condemners. Isn't it lowsy how you generally have to be a hypocrite in order to make a point these days? Food for thought. We can look at the extremes and see the simplistic, secular vs sacred, trend-atheists vs fundamentalist evangelical christians, the most common stereotypes. But in reality, it's so much more complicated than that. It's this stereotyping and narrow-minded attitude that prevents us as a race from achieving the greatness we can. I could make as many decrees as I wanted till I was blue in the face, and I'm going to just to let off a little steam mind you,

"Trend-atheist Digg users, shove your agendas where the sun don't shine, refusing the possibility of a supreme-being does not make you a genius or a radical thinker, it makes you a bloody sheep hiding behind a cloak of anonymity"

"Evangelical Fundamentalist morons, get your overly simplistic, judgmental, dogmatic Crayola God out of my face, you have about as much understanding of the universe as a wet lettuce. That does not make you holy, pure, or guaranteed a private booth at the big game in the sky, it makes you a bloody sheep hiding behind a cloak of propaganda that you only believe because you're told to"

Wow, that feels good, I can understand why you internet-bound condemners like it so much. Gives you that warm, fuzzy feeling doesn't it? What, I'm not allowed to indulge in such a guilty pleasure every once in a while? Play fair

Where's my conclusion? Hell if I know. Did you have the mistaken impression this was some carefully constructed plea for tolerance? Absolutely not, it's an angry slap in the face to my peers. Wake the hell up and use your brain, because my God/Non-god/Explosion/Man-in-the-sky/Vic20 gave you it for a reason.

Just gonna quote this 8 year old quote since I too cannot think of anything funny that happened in the last 8 years.

# ? Aug 23, 2014 20:33

The Something Awful Forums > Archives > General Bullshit > Atheism does not make you clever

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