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Cataphract posted:warptalons are pretty bad. I'd avoid them if I were you. Noise Marines are great. make sure you check the FAQ cause they can now take the blastmaster in a unit of 5. Thanks for the further advice. There is a subgroup within my gaming group that has the philosophy of "Just bring a model and if you want to say that cultist is in fact a heldrake then gently caress it, it can be." so next time I'm going to try a much altered list to see how it works out.
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Sep 7, 2014 20:07
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Hollismason posted:It may be the pose. I will show you exactly what is wrong with the Dreadnaught kit: Big box body, legs with absolutely no depth across the profile.  /___] |
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Sep 7, 2014 20:21
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Post 9-11 User posted:I will show you exactly what is wrong with the Dreadnaught kit: I'd say if that thing was walking forward or with the legs more spread forward I'm pretty sure it'd look a lot better from the side than it really does now. Because you point it really lacks depth to it.
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Sep 7, 2014 20:29
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Just imagine that thing trying to walk  I think I'm going convert a Castellax as a dread instead of that stupid thing. Seems to have basically the same size.
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Sep 7, 2014 20:54
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SRM posted:Alternately, I could convert something that is a little less conventional. There was an old Whirlwind conversion in Rogue Trader that I could draw from instead: If your tournament allows Forge World, there is actually a variant of the Whirlwind called the Whirlwind Hyperios (appearing in IA2 and IA Aeronautica) that has a Skyfire/Interceptor gun; that could be pretty perfect for you. Failing that, I think you could make a pretty good Hunter out of that- I would cut off one of the two missile racks and put some kind of sensor/targeting thing over there to make it look more like the actual thing, but that wouldn't be absolutely required. Hra Mormo posted:I heard bikes are good now, I always wanted some bikes. Tell me about bikes. Don't tell me about airplanes or centurions because gently caress that poo poo and everything about it. What you have isn't a bad start, and if you like Bikes then they are certainly quite good right now. My suggestion to aim for would be something like this: Captain on Bike with Artificer Armor, melee weapon, Storm Shield or Khan on Bike 5 Sternguard in Drop Pod (1-4 combimelta or combiplasma recommended) 10 Tactical Marines in Drop Pod or Rhino (heavy/special can be almost anything) 10 Tactical Marines ditto 5 Bikes with two Grav Guns and Attack Bike with Multimelta two more squads of the same various support units to taste Basically what you have is a tough, aggressive army with lots of scoring units and good shooting as well as some assault potential- a flexible Space Marine list, in other words. When picking your Chapter Tactic you have a number of different options. If using Khan (and hence the White Scars tactic), your army will be VERY fast and aggressive- I would definitely say go for the Rhinos in that case. Ultramarine tactics are also a valid option, however, even if they might not be as objectively good for a bike-heavy list; the Drop Pods are the prime choice in that variation of things. Your support units can also be customized to what you prefer- Stormtalons or Stalkers can provide good ways to shoot down enemy airplanes and light tanks/infantry/monstrous creatures; Thunderfire Cannons are fantastic at tearing up enemy infantry of all kinds and can even damage light tanks; Attack Bikes are great for taking out heavy tanks; Vindicators can provide some heavy punching power, though they tend to get murdered in the process; etc. You could also look to include some allies if you're interested in that sort of thing. Primary options might be Inquisitors and their henchmen (providing a wide array of cheap support roles), assassins (powerful solo models with unique abilities), Knights (fast-moving melee threats), Space Wolves (good all-rounder units in Drop Pods or moving quickly on foot), and Imperial Guard (expendable bodies and long-range shooting.)
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Sep 7, 2014 22:59
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Got my first game with the Lynx today and it's a mean bastard. In 2v2 it destroyed a Defiler, Land Raider, Rhino, a few odds guys, then blew up taking half a 10 man Immortal unit.
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Sep 7, 2014 23:39
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HardCoil posted:Just imagine that thing trying to walk  They're so stubby and murderous.AbusePuppy posted:If your tournament allows Forge World, there is actually a variant of the Whirlwind called the Whirlwind Hyperios (appearing in IA2 and IA Aeronautica) that has a Skyfire/Interceptor gun; that could be pretty perfect for you. Failing that, I think you could make a pretty good Hunter out of that- I would cut off one of the two missile racks and put some kind of sensor/targeting thing over there to make it look more like the actual thing, but that wouldn't be absolutely required.  version of it with me.Also I was reading through my 2nd ed IG codex and it mentioned nothing about commissars summarily executing dudes. I guess they added that in 3rd when they made it grimdarker, but back then they were just frontline officers in charge of keeping everybody in line. They were immune to psychology and that's all.
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Sep 8, 2014 00:05
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SRM posted:I love watching Dreadnoughts stomp around in the Dawn of War games Didn't they have a move where they just spun around at the waist, arms outstretched, like some form of mechanical Zangief?
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Sep 8, 2014 00:08
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Cataphract posted:Didn't they have a move where they just spun around at the waist, arms outstretched, like some form of mechanical Zangief? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sP4R4C2vh84
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Sep 8, 2014 00:09
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SRM posted:Alternately, I could convert something that is a little less conventional. There was an old Whirlwind conversion in Rogue Trader that I could draw from instead: You should totally do the conversion and join the Whirlwind Bros  but for the tournament maybe make the turret separate and put something together based on the original Epic Hunter whirlwind variants  
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Sep 8, 2014 00:10
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Zark the Damned posted:You should totally do the conversion and join the Whirlwind Bros Oh drat, I would love to do up the old Hunter! Just out of curiosity I checked eBay and somebody had actually listed the Epicast turret for $5 so I went and grabbed it:  Old school Whirlwind counts-as AA action here we come 
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Sep 8, 2014 00:19
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AbusePuppy posted:Ultramarine tactics are also a valid option, however, even if they might not be as objectively good for a bike-heavy list; the Drop Pods are the prime choice in that variation of things. AbusePuppy, can you explain why you would prefer the drop pods to rhinos? I have three drop pod kits and I was planning on using one or more of them for my new space wolves dudes, but I'd love to be better informed on why drop pods are good for my normal marines before painting them.
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Sep 8, 2014 01:09
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You know, there is an awful, awful part of me that wants to bring an entire Epic army to a 40K tournament and try to field it (with appropriate 40K points values, of course) and then act really confused/angry when people say it isn't legal. "Everything is WYSIWYG! They're 100% GW models! I didn't even do any conversions for advantage! What's your problem with my army?!"
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Sep 8, 2014 01:11
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drgnvale posted:AbusePuppy, can you explain why you would prefer the drop pods to rhinos? I have three drop pod kits and I was planning on using one or more of them for my new space wolves dudes, but I'd love to be better informed on why drop pods are good for my normal marines before painting them. you can drop them directly onto objective points and, if purchased for troop units, are objective secured. They won't be on the table if oponent has turn one so won't give out first blood They're AV 12 all round so are tougher to destroy meaning, again, that they're better at holding objectives and are less likely to be destroyed early and give away first blood A thing to note, though, is that they are open topped and start the game immobilised meaning it is slightly easier to do more damage if you do penetrate; +1 on damage table and a roll of immobilised will rip away an additional HP.
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Sep 8, 2014 01:19
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The problem with using drop pods is building drop pods. gently caress drop pods. Drop pods.
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Sep 8, 2014 01:50
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AbusePuppy posted:You know, there is an awful, awful part of me that wants to bring an entire Epic army to a 40K tournament and try to field it (with appropriate 40K points values, of course) and then act really confused/angry when people say it isn't legal. "Everything is WYSIWYG! They're 100% GW models! I didn't even do any conversions for advantage! What's your problem with my army?!" Please do this and record it too. Sykic posted:The problem with using drop pods is building drop pods. gently caress drop pods. I dunno, I built 6 of them in an afternoon once without too much of a problem. I glued the loving doors shut because forget that nonsense, but I did it.
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Sep 8, 2014 01:53
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Slimnoid posted:Please do this and record it too. Hmmm. Now to dig out my old Epic stuff and see what I actually have... drgnvale posted:AbusePuppy, can you explain why you would prefer the drop pods to rhinos? I have three drop pod kits and I was planning on using one or more of them for my new space wolves dudes, but I'd love to be better informed on why drop pods are good for my normal marines before painting them. Rhinos and Drop Pods end up serving two very different purposes, even though they are very similar on the surface. A Drop Pod is essentially a pure delivery mechanism for aggressive armies- it puts you right on top of the enemy right away and ready to dump firepower onto them. You cannot, realistically speaking, hide from a Drop Pod (not on the table, anyways) and they are guaranteed to work in the sense that your key units will always arrive when you want and at least approximately where you want. However, once that is over and done, a Drop Pod provides you with essentially nothing- it pips out a few Storm Bolter shots and might get lucky and score an objective or Linebreaker, but the squad it carried is now stuck basically where they showed up at and the Pod itself can't really act independently in any way. Drop Pods are generally for alpha strike armies that want to hit the enemy early and hard and then just kinda keep riding that early success. In contrast, a Rhino exists to make the squad inside faster and to protect them from harm; it can move them up to 18" per turn if they don't need to shoot and makes them immune to all firepower so long as it stays alive. Even once dead, it will generally turn into a piece of blocking terrain to make shooting at them inconvenient. A squad inside can't make use of their full firepower, but being able to fire two guns out generally gives you the most important weapons from the unit. Rhinos provide actual mobility- that is, the ability to respond to an opponent's movements turn-by-turn and counter their strategy- to a squad, something that Drop Pods do not. Unsurprisingly, Rhinos are almost always part of mechanized forces, whereas a Drop Pod it expendable and thus can potentially fit into any army. Rhino armies also tend to lean more towards mid-range shooting armies that rely more on survivability than firepower to win the day. For Space Wolves, Drop Pods are generally a much better fit because SW are an aggressive army (hence Blood Claws, Thunderwolves, Lone Wolves, etc) that benefits extensively from close-range brawling matches where their (comparatively) cheap troops and excellent flexibility can be used to their fullest. SW also have the ability to bring empty Drop Pods in their FA slots, meaning they can stick in allied units that otherwise wouldn't have access to such a transport (Centurions, Inquisitorial units, Guardsmen, etc) to pull off some shenanigans.
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Sep 8, 2014 02:31
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AbusePuppy posted:Hmmm. Now to dig out my old Epic stuff and see what I actually have... Thanks, that's about how I saw it, and why my drop pods were going to go to my small space wolves group rather than my ultramarines. I just find the rhinos really useful for line of sight blocking and getting me where I want to go in maelstrom games. For my space wolves, I think I'm going to just build the stormclaw box as grey hunters and throw them in the pod, then put the terminators and the HQ dude into one of their new transports and just have an allied group of cool looking guys. It won't be very good, but the person I play against most is primarily space wolves with a small vanilla marines detatchment so it'll be a fun inverse matchup.
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Sep 8, 2014 03:11
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Would the Ork Warband Detachment be a good starting list for a new Ork player?
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Sep 8, 2014 04:03
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ThNextGreenLantern posted:Would the Ork Warband Detachment be a good starting list for a new Ork player?
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Sep 8, 2014 04:08
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I remember Epic being a rather decent ruleset after a certain point then it got all hosed up. I've for a long time wished GW would have initially went with like a 15MM or 20MM game format. Just a little bit bigger slightly than Flames of War is what I want that's all.
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Sep 8, 2014 04:25
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Hollismason posted:I remember Epic being a rather decent ruleset after a certain point then it got all hosed up. I've for a long time wished GW would have initially went with like a 15MM or 20MM game format. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Flames of Warhammer would get a lot of my money. I think Epic is neat but the scale is too small to get the character of my favorite part of 40k, which is the infantry. 15mm would be a happy medium between Epic and regular 40k.
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Sep 8, 2014 04:30
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SRM posted:It's basically a fuckload of boyz and some characters, right? I don't think it's a bad idea. Consensus in my game group is that big mobs of Orks don't really do it anymore though, and that multiple 10-man units are the way to go since they basically ignore the Mob Rule table. I've only played one game against the new dex though, and I blasted those Orks just the same. 6 boyz units, gretchin, nobz/manz, mek, warboss. I feel like a new player might run into trouble doing a footslogging list without objective secured, so I don't know if I would recommend the warband in particular. The hammer of wrath thing seems like a fairly rare occurance to me, and while the waaagh every turn looks good on paper, I think it'd be most worthwhile if you were really committed to getting into close combat with everything. Which might be your thing! I'm rather fond of shooty orks myself, so my bias may be showing. Model-wise, having 60+ boyz, some gretchin, nobs and two HQ's is a very solid core that you could then expand from in a number of ways [you could choose to mech up, or just buy more toys to supplement your big walking mob. Mek guns or a morkanaut or something, maybe? Lootas would be good as well.] Granted I have not played 7th yet, but i've been watching a ton of battle reports and Claim Objectives Good seems like an extremely important rule for troops-heavy armies. Ignite Memories fucked around with this message at 04:45 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 04:42
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Yeah it' get a lot of my money as well, I like that size of miniature, and really love the Flames of War stuff if it was just slightly bigger. Epic for me is to small, 40k is slightly to big, plus with that size Fliers etc... would be a lot more easily managed, right now their just so loving huge on the battlefield. You can get a ton of detail into 15mm and still make the model's intricate etc.. Drop Zone Commander I think is 10mm, I just want slightly bigger than Flames of War. Trying to find some good examples of 15mm Scifi miniatures so people can see them. Also 40k isn't technically 28mm or whatever it's actually slightly bigger. Here's some good examples of Tyranids at 15mm http://www.rebelminis.com/terrormites.html Hollismason fucked around with this message at 04:46 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 04:44
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SRM posted:It's basically a fuckload of boyz and some characters, right? I don't think it's a bad idea. Consensus in my game group is that big mobs of Orks don't really do it anymore though, and that multiple 10-man units are the way to go since they basically ignore the Mob Rule table. I've only played one game against the new dex though, and I blasted those Orks just the same. Okay, I've seen this stated before, but could someone explain the "10-man units" thing concerning mob rule to me? It seems counter to how the book explains mob rule and leadership tests in the codex but more than a few people have said this.
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Sep 8, 2014 06:44
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TheOneOutside posted:Okay, I've seen this stated before, but could someone explain the "10-man units" thing concerning mob rule to me? It seems counter to how the book explains mob rule and leadership tests in the codex but more than a few people have said this. If a unit is 10 or more dudes they start infighting when they fail morale tests. Only having 10 man squads keeps them from eating themselves every time they get shot at.
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Sep 8, 2014 07:00
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Sykic posted:The problem with using drop pods is building drop pods. gently caress drop pods. Use MDF ones instead! 
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Sep 8, 2014 07:01
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ThNextGreenLantern posted:Would the Ork Warband Detachment be a good starting list for a new Ork player? I don't play Orks but I've played extensively against them. My opinion is that the warband eats up too many points by default. By the time you've bought every squad, you then need to kit them out so they don't die to a stiff breeze, and then you're basically stuck with that as your entire army. No objective secured either. For what it's worth I'd say a good ork army uses their artillery (lobbas!!), either a warboss with MaN in a battlewagon/boss on a bike with bikers coupled with painboys, and then a solid core of minimum 60 boys in 2-3 squads. Orks suffer from a lack of momentum sometimes - if you kill their transports or blunt their charges by killing half a squad it can be tricky to recover. Always try to take power klaws as these can be the clutch 2-3 kills you need to change the tide of a combat where you're only s3 after the initial charge. Painboys are excellent. Kustom force fields are excellent. Out flanking scorcha buggies are bloody excellent and so loving cheap it should be illegal (three of those is a real no brainer in most lists - they eat backfield units).
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Sep 8, 2014 07:14
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Has there ever been an edition where the whirlwind was any good? To me its always been one of those "fun, but not really great" models in the SM books.
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Sep 8, 2014 07:19
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NTRabbit posted:Use MDF ones instead! Nice.
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Sep 8, 2014 08:03
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SRM posted:If a unit is 10 or more dudes they start infighting when they fail morale tests. Only having 10 man squads keeps them from eating themselves every time they get shot at. I thought if they had ten or less it makes it really easy to lose the whole unit if they fail a morale test?
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Sep 8, 2014 09:15
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Cool, they're bringing Space Hulk back.
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Sep 8, 2014 09:42
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serious gaylord posted:Cool, they're bringing Space Hulk back. Did someone finally notice they're being slowly murdered by a host of small count skirmish games, or did the broken watch tell them the right time of day again? Seems like a reaction to Deadzone and the new Infinity 'game in a box' starter set. Not that it's a bad thing.
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Sep 8, 2014 09:48
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I'll be interested to see if its a re-issue with maybe new missions, or if they've re sculpted anything.
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Sep 8, 2014 09:53
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Where did we see this? Maybe it's a tie-in with the video game coming out?
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Sep 8, 2014 11:44
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REAL MUSCLE MILK posted:Where did we see this? Maybe it's a tie-in with the video game coming out? All the stores are reposting another terrible teaser video about making sure to check the website Friday night.
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Sep 8, 2014 12:09
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Hollismason posted:You can get a ton of detail into 15mm and still make the model's intricate etc.. You could try Planetfall, Spartan has been teasing it for an impending release. It's 10mm, but has bigger units than DzC, the big robot here is on a 100x100mm base, though infantry are still the same size 
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Sep 8, 2014 12:29
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drat it Ghost Hand, not only do you keep making me jealous regarding 40k flea markets but now I'm trying to figure out how I would do an IG themed Tau count-as contingent in the same vein as BuffaloChicken's squat army as a possible allies.  
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Sep 8, 2014 12:51
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ThNextGreenLantern posted:Would the Ork Warband Detachment be a good starting list for a new Ork player? I don't think so. I'd stick to regular Combined Arms Detachments. Too much of the strategy relies on Boyz (and sometimes Gretchen too) to play a list where you're lacking Objective Secured, IMO. As an aside, Gretchen have been a nice use of 35 points to have an 11-model unit that comes out of reserve and can go to ground on an Objective with the Objective Secured special rule. But they're pretty useless without it.
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Sep 8, 2014 12:59
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BULBASAUR posted:Has there ever been an edition where the whirlwind was any good? To me its always been one of those "fun, but not really great" models in the SM books. I don't even think it's that fun. Two weak blast markers is pretty loving boring.
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