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Escape Addict posted:It's interesting that in MGS2, Kojima had Olga dress just like a man would and even had her character ignore armpit shaving, just as a no-nonsense mercenary would. I thought it was pretty progressive and realistic. Could you imagine some butch Russian chick with hairy armpits showing up in a Bond film? I liked never knowing how their powers worked because snake is always in a state of "I'll just keep doing my mission and try not to get killed" and I felt like being confronted by fantastical killers with no further explanation had me doing a similar "what the gently caress just happened? His eyes popped out... Wait is he is a lizard? The stars? gently caress this, I need to stop world war 3."
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Oct 7, 2014 12:31
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Escape Addict posted:It's interesting that in MGS2, Kojima had Olga dress just like a man would and even had her character ignore armpit shaving, just as a no-nonsense mercenary would. I thought it was pretty progressive and realistic. Could you imagine some butch Russian chick with hairy armpits showing up in a Bond film? Yes, Kojima managed to not sexualize literal children. Bravo on him. He made The Boss, who is one of my favourite video game characters of all time, but even she was much worse in her original design. Titties popping out and bouncing any time she laughed. He also made the Beauty and the Beast Corps, 4 women who matter so little that literally anything about them at all is only given after they die and in a droning phone call, then dropped immediately. Him making one good character doesn't change the fact that most women in Metal Gear, before and after The Boss, are terrible. But I am prepared to be horribly ashamed at the revelation as to why Quiet's titties gotta be all front and center.
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Oct 7, 2014 12:34
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The only thing I really have to say about Quiet's outfit at this point is that I'm laughing at people who are still on the "I refuse to buy the game" end of it because they're gonna miss out on the best drat video game to come out all year (all year next year, anyway). edit: Although after the fultoning everything demo I don't think there are actually any of those people left. CJacobs fucked around with this message at 12:46 on Oct 7, 2014 |
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Oct 7, 2014 12:43
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The whole game is a fantasy and I like there being a sexy character, a badass powerful woman from it looks like. If you aren't down with it, or it offends you I suggest the game is not for you I'm sorry. Most of the audience won't bat an eyelid. I'm not comfortable about what happened to Paz and I'm sure there are going to be horrible scenes of torture to quiet and others. That I do have a problem with but it's kojima's story, if I can't handle it I'll either stop playing or get through them as fast as possible. I'd say don't look to AAA Japanese titles to be the ones that don't objectify women. they always do and will continue to. Now excuse me while I dream of DOA beach volleyball 3.
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Oct 7, 2014 12:57
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Plenty of people refused to buy the game after all the Paz business anyway. Usually when they jam bombs into women (hi ISIS, hi Syrian army) they are already dead or close to dead awaiting rescue, but leave it to tumblr to focus on the stuff that matters.
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Oct 7, 2014 13:06
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cobalt impurity posted:Yes, Kojima managed to not sexualize literal children. Bravo on him. This is an impressive level of restraint by the standards of Japanese pop culture.
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Oct 7, 2014 13:26
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Escape Addict posted:This is an impressive level of restraint by the standards of Japanese pop culture. Yeah Kojima is basically a hero. This thread needs more news because Kojima is a perv discussion is the worst.
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Oct 7, 2014 13:29
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Quiet's costume discussion is the week long real time fight that Kojima always wanted.
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Oct 7, 2014 13:30
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This thread is the immersive tactical offended action Kojima had always dreamed of, but Sperging technology simply wasn't powerful enough... until now.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:04
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(Shut up about Quiet, that got the previous thread closed) So how about that Big Boss Inspector gadget arm eh? How many other upgrades do you think we'll get for it? We've seen it as a noise maker, sonar and taser. The one I really want to be included is Zadornovs ROCKET PEACE.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:14
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Aside from ROCKET PEACE, being able to use it as a lighter like he does in the trailer would be cool, like a way to light up dark areas without projecting huge amounts of light etc.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:18
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Maybe he can use it as a grapnel and set up tripwires 
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Oct 7, 2014 14:19
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Maybe he can use it as a grapnel and set up tripwires Just Cause 2 style hookshot gun.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:28
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Hopefully the hand can detach and it can crawl off and scout the area like a robotic Thing from the Addams family.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:44
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Holy poo poo a remote control Zadornov hand that functioned like the Metal Gear Mk 2 from MGS4 would be incredible.
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Oct 7, 2014 14:45
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Don't be dumb babies if someone's talking about something on topic that you don't like. Just post about something else if it upsets you. The main thing I want in the final game is to have Kid Mantis as an assist buddy to throw flaming whales at enemies. That's worth more than a dog buddy.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:18
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cobalt impurity posted:Yes, Kojima managed to not sexualize literal children. Bravo on him. He totally sexualizes Paz, though.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:37
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I swear, The End's parrot's son better be hidden somewhere in Africa for me to recruit. DP.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:39
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Dr. Stab posted:He totally sexualizes Paz, though. She's a Secret Adult!! Truly the most anime Metal Gear game and that's really saying something. Honestly Quiet's outfit is stupid but it feels a lot less embarrassing than just about everything with Paz.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:48
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Peace Walker really is the most anime Metal Gear game. The Monster Hunter and bubble popping missions really solidify it. And ROCKET PEACE too I guess.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:52
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Surlaw posted:The main thing I want in the final game is to have Kid Mantis as an assist buddy to throw flaming whales at enemies. That's worth more than a dog buddy.
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Oct 7, 2014 15:59
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It would probably be best if characters dying in a mission removed them from being usable but kept them in the story, otherwise I'm just never using any characters that I like.
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Oct 7, 2014 16:08
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There's plenty of games where plot characters have permadeath immunity. Instead of dying, he can just get injured.
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Oct 7, 2014 16:20
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RJWaters2 posted:I swear, The End's parrot's son better be hidden somewhere in Africa for me to recruit. DP. I'm hoping I can recruit DDP. He'd've been nearly thirty during Phantom Pain, so it could work.
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Oct 7, 2014 19:27
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:I'm hoping I can recruit DDP. He'd've been nearly thirty during Phantom Pain, so it could work. 
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Oct 7, 2014 20:47
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CJacobs posted:Peace Walker really is the most anime Metal Gear game. The Monster Hunter and bubble popping missions really solidify it. The most videogame Metal Gear game. (also the most anime, but not for the reasons cited). These are good examples of why Peace Walker is my most favorite of the series. It strips away a lot of the cinematics in favor of something that can simply just be played. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the cinematics, but the series, until Peace Walker (technically Portable Ops) has been far too constraining in favor of strictly following a script that I lost steam going into MGS4, and have still never completed a playthrough of the game. This is one reason I am incredibly psyched for TPP. It looks like it will largely have a similar mission based progression as Peace Walker, which means the script is likely going to be spliced up and facilitate taking a bunch of side missions (or else replaying missions) at the player's discretion. At the same time, those 'peace walker' style missions should otherwise take place in large open maps in the same vein as Ground Zeroes. Heck, even GZ presents this pretty well, where you are (can) return to the same map with different objectives. That sort of style also has the benefit of including strictly "fun" missions, like the bubble popping missions without really breaking any of the pace or tone of the script as a whole. Additionally, it affords including other odd missions that carter more toward pure stealth/pure aggression/etc without really interrupting the player's own sort of narrative in the script at large. So, say the player wants to play Snake strictly non-lethal, they can keep playing the game between story missions to blow off steam by going guns blazing in some optional missions/replay earlier story missions.
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Oct 7, 2014 22:39
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InnercityGriot posted:... especially when you consider that Kojima is responsible for the best female character in games, The Boss. Not really. Though she inspires a lot of emotion in all of us, she doesn't really have much of a character beyond being competent and patriotic. his kingly woes fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Oct 7, 2014 |
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Oct 7, 2014 22:47
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his kingly woes posted:Not really. Though she inspires a lot of emotion in all of us, she doesn't really have much of a character beyond being competent and patriotic. While I wouldn't consider her the strongest female character in games, she's pretty drat close. The Boss has independent motivations, commands respect from drat near everyone (even long after she's dead), and doesn't have the faintest whiff of a romantic interest. She's not sexualized in any way (boob scar included) and is very competent as you say. Considering MGS3 came out in like '04, The Boss was head and shoulders above most women depicted in games and probably still is 10 years later.
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Oct 7, 2014 23:57
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MeatwadIsGod posted:While I wouldn't consider her the strongest female character in games, she's pretty drat close. The Boss has independent motivations, commands respect from drat near everyone (even long after she's dead), and doesn't have the faintest whiff of a romantic interest. She's not sexualized in any way (boob scar included) and is very competent as you say. Considering MGS3 came out in like '04, The Boss was head and shoulders above most women depicted in games and probably still is 10 years later. Her motivation is "complete the mission" and while she sticks to it tenaciously and sacrifices everything for it, it's not a motivation that originates from her. All that other stuff you mention is either stuff she doesn't do or her being perceived as powerful and commanding. She certainly is, but that doesn't make her more of a character than Female Shephard. Meryl in MGS1 had more of an arc than the Boss.
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Oct 8, 2014 00:04
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cobalt impurity posted:Yes, Kojima managed to not sexualize literal children. Bravo on him. He caved to temptation in Snatcher and Policenauts though. 
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Oct 8, 2014 00:07
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Yeah the boss isn't the strongest character as she mainly exists as motivation and an obstacle for Snake. Though its funny that of all the legendary soldiers out there (Big Boss, regular Snake) she is the only one that everyone treats like a scary badass. I mean Volgin was basically pissing himself anytime she looked at him sideways. That was cool.
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Oct 8, 2014 00:10
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CharlestheHammer posted:Yeah the boss isn't the strongest character as she mainly exists as motivation and an obstacle for Snake. I love the scene in the torture chamber where Volgin questions her loyalty and she gives him the 'You don't trust me!?' while she advances on him and he practically shits his pants and goes 'OH GOD I WASN'T SERIOUS PLEASE DON'T KNOCK ME ON MY rear end AGAIN".
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Oct 8, 2014 00:20
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CharlestheHammer posted:Yeah the boss isn't the strongest character as she mainly exists as motivation and an obstacle for Snake. This is a really superficial reading. She's lionised as the absolute pinnacle of what a soldier should be throughout most of MGS3 and Peace Walker by absolutely everyone, even posthumously.
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Oct 8, 2014 00:50
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Smegmatron posted:This is a really superficial reading. Seems like an accurate reading to me. She only exists to be Big Boss's figurative mother. She has to be the absolute pinnacle of what a soldier should be, because it serves BB's origin story. And note how one-dimensional this is. The series doesn't really show or explain how she's the perfect soldier. Other characters just say so and we take them at their word. It's the cheapest way to confer that status. http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Strong_female_characters#Criticisms posted:her strength is primarily a narrative tool to measure a male protagonists' progress in his emotional maturity plot arc, in which his full maturation is signaled by getting the girl, and her interior life or own motivations are not portrayed (such female characters often feature in works that fail the Bechdel test) acksplode fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Oct 8, 2014 |
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Oct 8, 2014 01:04
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Surlaw posted:She's a Secret Adult!! Truly the most anime Metal Gear game and that's really saying something. The 'Date with Quiet' mission will just involve her showing up dressed as normal and glaring at you a lot.
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Oct 8, 2014 01:16
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his kingly woes posted:Her motivation is "complete the mission" and while she sticks to it tenaciously and sacrifices everything for it, it's not a motivation that originates from her. Her motivation is loyalty to the USA, which she can't state to anyone, even Snake, as doing so would risk causing World War 3. Her involvement in MGS3 is originally to retrieve this thing, both for the monetary value and the value of the intelligence it contains. When that spirals out of her control by way of Volgin launching a nuke at russia (that she brought in to complete that mission), her mission is changed to making *everyone* believe that she defected, to protect her home country from getting into World War 3 with russia. The "everyone" bit is why she only ever harps on about "the mission", instead of explaining that she's protecting the USA, since no defector from the USA would want to do that. * In that sense, her motivation is pretty much exactly the same as Captain America's, only she actually sacrifices herself for it. You can argue that that's kind of shallow too, and i would agree, but patriotism is certainly something that's inherent to people and more than a mindless plot point. * It's kind of funny to see real people be as dense about this as Snake is.
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Oct 8, 2014 01:21
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Mithaldu posted:You can argue that that's kind of shallow too, and i would agree, but patriotism is certainly something that's inherent to people and more than a mindless plot point.
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Oct 8, 2014 01:32
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Everyone in this thread would buy a Boss-themed game in a heartbeat, which, while admittedly not a flawless diagnostic of strong writing, is pretty cool.
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Oct 8, 2014 01:35
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acksplode posted:Patriotism can certainly be a mindless plot point. If the extent of The Boss's motivations is "she is very patriotic," well, that doesn't say a ton for her depth as a character. I'm not trying to defend her as some kind of god character with amazing writing, but some people seem to think she is nothing more than an unbelievable cardboard that follows a script that no real human being ever would. * Though tbh, i forgot about this, but her motivation is later even changed into her wishing to avoid war for humanity at large, through a singular experience she undergoes. Mithaldu fucked around with this message at 01:42 on Oct 8, 2014 |
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Oct 8, 2014 01:39
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Calling The Boss an American patriot isn't entirely correct, I feel. Both she and EVA were under the Philosophers' thumb, the former ideologically and the latter more literally. The peace she died for was the shadowy rule of a reestablished Wisemen's Committee. Zero did nothing wrong
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Oct 8, 2014 01:40
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