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warcrimes posted:Wilson is still taller and way more athletic than Manziel. Manziel is taller and their combine stats were very close with Johnny being better at broad jump, shuttle, and 3-Cone drills.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:23
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Volkerball posted:Did you watch anything of him in college? Arguing about whether he can translate it to the NFL is a separate thing. Dude is wriggly as gently caress. Lol what? All that matters is how he translates in the NFL, who cares about college? I've been saying this entire time that his skills in college won't translate to the NFL game, I don't care how wriggly as gently caress he was v. Missouri's LBs. Maybe we're debating two different things, I don't know, all I'm saying is Manziel is never going to amount to anything in the NFL. When the coaching staff has to come wake you up because you overslept and missed PT because you were out drinking all night isn't going to make him a better football player, either.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:24
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Volkerball posted:He lost his poo poo out there though, and that's concerning, especially if he goes early and is expected to play for a poo poo team where bad things are going to happen. This is the big thing. I think if you sat him and worked him for a season or two he could be something good/great. If you want to tell me the guy we saw this season is going to be ready and successful in the NFL in eight months I am really skeptical.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:24
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Volkerball posted:He really struggled early on, and seemed like he couldn't get on target with anything other than screens, but you can't put the whole game on him. There were a few of those passes that, had they been better placed, the receiver would've had an easier job not fumbling it, but NFL guys can generally hold on to the drat ball in those situations. It got pretty ridiculous. He lost his poo poo out there though, and that's concerning, especially if he goes early and is expected to play for a poo poo team where bad things are going to happen. I can see why he would get so frustrated, they were really outplaying Oregon at times and kept getting killed by random fumbles. And then zero help from the defense. Physically I think he has it all to succeed, (except the eyes) reminds me of Leftwich a bit too. But mentally he is a mess.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:25
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I think Oregon's defense was absolutely swarming this game and a lot of quality NFL prospects would be panicking there. Oregon's defense was just ripping balls and delivering nasty hits everywhere, and their d-line absolutely dominated FSU's o-line. I hope the gametape comes out soon because I want to see how Mariota fared while Oregon was ahead.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:29
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Doltos posted:I think Oregon's defense was absolutely swarming this game and a lot of quality NFL prospects would be panicking there. Oregon's defense was just ripping balls and delivering nasty hits everywhere, and their d-line absolutely dominated FSU's o-line. I hope the gametape comes out soon because I want to see how Mariota fared while Oregon was ahead. Jameis dropped back to pass with like 7+ seconds multiple times and FSU ran for like 100+ in the first half. I turned the game off after the ridiculous fumble for a td so I have no idea what happened afterwards when things got super desperate
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Jan 2, 2015 07:31
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Brady throws tantrums and screams at people whenever things go badly and he seems to do OK. Winston is the most pro ready prospect you're going to get short of manning/luck
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Jan 2, 2015 07:32
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Alouicious posted:is ezekiel elliot eligible Nope. True sophomore  Mike Bennett might have worked his way into the first round. IDK if the Steelers could use him, but he might have enough punch to be an effective 3-4 DE, even though he really should be a 1-tech 4-3 DT. Otherwise, Doran Grant is a day 2/day 3 pick at Corner, and he might have helped his case out a touch with this game. Heurman was a blocker all game and didn't help himself. Devin Smith is going somewhere in the 2nd-4th range though. His deep ball skills are elite, and he's fast. Some NFL WRs coach will convince himself that he can make the guy learn short and intermediate route running just based on the raw ability the guy has.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:32
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warcrimes posted:Lol what? All that matters is how he translates in the NFL, who cares about college? I've been saying this entire time that his skills in college won't translate to the NFL game, I don't care how wriggly as gently caress he was v. Missouri's LBs. Maybe we're debating two different things, I don't know, all I'm saying is Manziel is never going to amount to anything in the NFL. I'm not sold he will be, but he does have some tools that can translate to the pro game. He has a small sample size in the NFL, but he still showed he can be elusive on the ground. He broke a bunch of first down runs, and had a solid ground game against the Bears (admittedly terrible defense). There's no doubt he can use his agility to find lanes and run with it, but he has to be able to pass for that to work. Not to mention, he needs to be able to pass what with being a quarterback and all. His ability to read a defense and find open men is about worst case scenario bad. And considering that's a "put your nose in the playbook" kind of problem, I'm not confident it's going to change soon. Not to mention his durability is obviously still a big question mark.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:32
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Doltos posted:I think Oregon's defense was absolutely swarming this game and a lot of quality NFL prospects would be panicking there. Oregon's defense was just ripping balls and delivering nasty hits everywhere, and their d-line absolutely dominated FSU's o-line. I hope the gametape comes out soon because I want to see how Mariota fared while Oregon was ahead. This absolutely did not happen at all. The Oregon defense was typically soft bend but don't break and the line got dominated What nasty hits did come were after easy 8-12 yeard gains on the reg.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:36
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Doltos posted:I think Oregon's defense was absolutely swarming this game and a lot of quality NFL prospects would be panicking there. Oregon's defense was just ripping balls and delivering nasty hits everywhere, and their d-line absolutely dominated FSU's o-line. I hope the gametape comes out soon because I want to see how Mariota fared while Oregon was ahead. FSU's defense quit, and it's noticeable at the end. Especially on that 20 or so yard TD run he had. There was no one anywhere. I'm more interested in that 3rd quarter, although my initial impression was that Carrington kid and 81, the TE, made those quick drives possible. joe football posted:Brady throws tantrums and screams at people whenever things go badly and he seems to do OK. Winston is the most pro ready prospect you're going to get short of manning/luck There's angry losing your poo poo, and there's "holy gently caress I'm in over my head" losing your poo poo, and the latter is worrying.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:38
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FSU handed a lot of turnovers right to Oregon, but it's hard to say that the defense caused it because they were literally just dropping the ball untouched or throwing it straight to an Oregon defender on the first contact. But the offense definitely capitalized.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:40
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Volkerball posted:There's angry losing your poo poo, and there's "holy gently caress I'm in over my head" losing your poo poo, and the latter is worrying. Yeah his problem wasn't yelling at his teammates, it was how he visibly performed once things were getting really bad. The deeper in the hole they got, the more he clearly was losing his focus and making bad decisions. The turnovers that were his fault were all after the team started losing and were all from rush decisions, dumb actions. I mean. hell, his own coach was calling him out for it.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:43
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NippleFloss posted:FSU handed a lot of turnovers right to Oregon, but it's hard to say that the defense caused it because they were literally just dropping the ball untouched or throwing it straight to an Oregon defender on the first contact. But the offense definitely capitalized. Some of it was bad luck, but some of it was sloppy play by the receivers. At the end of the day it was just that Oregon could score more reliably than FSU for whatever reason and the team gave up after they were 2 scores behind or so.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:43
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Yeah his problem wasn't yelling at his teammates, it was how he visibly performed once things were getting really bad. The deeper in the hole they got, the more he clearly was losing his focus and making bad decisions. The turnovers that were his fault were all after the team started losing and were all from rush decisions, dumb actions. I mean. hell, his own coach was calling him out for it. To be fair to him, he can't even legally drink yet. Although google tells me his birthday is on Tuesday. Too bad he can't legally walk into a bar and drown his sorrows in a bottle of jack this weekend. He'll have to wait for the next one. 
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Jan 2, 2015 07:45
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Mel Mudkiper posted:Yeah his problem wasn't yelling at his teammates, it was how he visibly performed once things were getting really bad. The deeper in the hole they got, the more he clearly was losing his focus and making bad decisions. The turnovers that were his fault were all after the team started losing and were all from rush decisions, dumb actions. I mean. hell, his own coach was calling him out for it. Which turnovers were his fault? He had one INT that the WR dropped right into the Oregon defender. I'll give you the fumble on the scramble play in which he slipped trying to make a throw. So one bad turnover.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:48
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wandler20 posted:Which turnovers were his fault? He had one INT that the WR dropped right into the Oregon defender. I'll give you the fumble on the scramble play in which he slipped trying to make a throw. So one bad turnover. I don't have clips to go through but I remember a pretty bad one immediately preceding the "calm down or get benched" speech that was on him. Maybe I was wrong though, I wasn't really assigning blame to each turnover at the time as much as laughing at them.
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Jan 2, 2015 07:51
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Cyrus Jones looked very good in today's game. Is he considered the top corner prospect?
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Jan 2, 2015 07:52
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wheez the roux posted:hopefully winston can redefine draft bust. ryan leaf was 17 years ago its time for someone new to take the throne Considering what they gave up for him RG3 has to be in consideration
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Jan 2, 2015 08:03
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Winkie01 posted:Considering what they gave up for him RG3 has to be in consideration He had a good season though
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Jan 2, 2015 08:06
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Volkerball posted:To be fair to him, he can't even legally drink yet. Although google tells me his birthday is on Tuesday. Too bad he can't legally walk into a bar and drown his sorrows in a bottle of jack this weekend. He'll have to wait for the next one. Laffo if you think he isn't getting drunk anyway with little to no effort in procuring alcohol.
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Jan 2, 2015 10:07
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If Winston does bust, at what point do FSU quarterbacks become undraftable in early rounds? It'd be a pretty amazing cautionary tale right after Christian Ponder and EJ Manuel all two years apart.
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Jan 2, 2015 10:49
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NippleFloss posted:FSU handed a lot of turnovers right to Oregon, but it's hard to say that the defense caused it because they were literally just dropping the ball untouched or throwing it straight to an Oregon defender on the first contact. But the offense definitely capitalized. Though it should be mentioned that as things got worse, Winston's accuracy just loving tanked. It was weird, it wasn't just him forcing things to try and get back, balls he was hitting earlier were going in random directions. I don't think I have ever seen that before.
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Jan 2, 2015 11:37
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Shrimpy posted:If Winston does bust, at what point do FSU quarterbacks become undraftable in early rounds?
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Jan 2, 2015 11:38
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Wolfy posted:Never. I assume that NFL teams aren't stupid enough to take things like that into consideration. You root for the Raiders and still assume this?
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Jan 2, 2015 12:51
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Let's get back to the real topic at hand Danny Shelton, Hau'oli Kikaha and Shaq Thompson are gonna own the poo poo out of Ok St. in the Catcus Bowl, and y'all will love whichever one you draft
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Jan 2, 2015 13:03
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Shrimpy posted:If Winston does bust, at what point do FSU quarterbacks become undraftable in early rounds? Laffo if you had any faith in those two clown shoes
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Jan 2, 2015 13:51
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This thread is bordering on QBWINS revisionism. I realize this is a function of the Oregon offense but like 22 of Mariota's 26 completions were on screen passes, and at least in the first half, his accuracy on anything above intermediate depth was an adventure. It'll be interesting to if whichever team drafts him decides to tailor their offense to his talent or force him into their pre-existing one. It might get ugly if it's the latter.
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Jan 2, 2015 15:01
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Ozu posted:This thread is bordering on QBWINS revisionism. I realize this is a function of the Oregon offense but like 22 of Mariota's 26 completions were on screen passes, and at least in the first half, his accuracy on anything above intermediate depth was an adventure. I still think Winston is better but I thought the exact same thing as this about Derek Carr and he at least shows signs of being better than that... So you never know once you get a guy into an NFL offense.
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Jan 2, 2015 15:40
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Winston said after the game that he wants to play baseball in the spring. If he does that, he'll be ineligible for this draft and be playing at least one more year of college football. How much teams' plans does this gently caress over
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Jan 2, 2015 15:54
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Chris James 2 posted:Winston said after the game that he wants to play baseball in the spring. If he does that, he'll be ineligible for this draft and be playing at least one more year of college football. Not the Bucs
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Jan 2, 2015 16:01
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Mariotta was hilariously inaccurate last night
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Jan 2, 2015 17:07
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Winston is taking that loss so personally that he's not even going to ask the draft advisory board for an evaluation. Make of that what you will.
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Jan 2, 2015 17:36
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Shrimpy posted:If Winston does bust, at what point do FSU quarterbacks become undraftable in early rounds? Both of those guys were significant worse in college and got overdrafted based on physical ability by QB desperate teams.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:03
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MourningView posted:Both of those guys were significant worse in college and got overdrafted based on physical ability by QB desperate teams. Also, weren't those both terrible QB classes?
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Jan 2, 2015 18:24
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Sataere posted:Also, weren't those both terrible QB classes? EJ's was, but Ponders class had two QB's who were possibly going #1 overall right up until the end. It was a really hyped up class, although it didn't really pan out. They just really liked Ponder, and he was their guy.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:28
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Miami had ponder at 15 that year and would have taken him. That would have likely meant no pouncey and no Tannehill Yikes.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:33
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AAA DOLFAN posted:Miami had ponder at 15 that year and would have taken him. That would have likely meant no pouncey and no Tannehill Really? I remember the story at the draft was that he was a late 1st rounder, and more likely a second rounder. That sort of justifies the Vikings not trading down I suppose, which seemed like the stupidest thing ever at the time.
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Jan 2, 2015 18:35
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Volkerball posted:Really? I remember the story at the draft was that he was a late 1st rounder, and more likely a second rounder. That sort of justifies the Vikings not trading down I suppose, which seemed like the stupidest thing ever at the time. He got picked up on the tail end of a run for drafting QBs. If you needed one, they were going fast, so you'd have to pounce
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Jan 2, 2015 18:43
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FSU Jr DE. Mario Edwards is entering the draft. He's a 3-4 DE that adds/drops weight as needed (has gone from 270 - 310 depending on what's asked of him). Has played everywhere on the line besides Nose Tackle
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Jan 2, 2015 19:01
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