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Pervis posted:There's some statistic that we were building ships faster than our enemies could build torpedoes to sink them with. That might be a bit of an exaggeration but our naval production, facilities, and technology dwarfed that of everyone else, especially once it was up to speed. That sounds like a useless statistic anyway - there are only so many torpedoes that your surface and submarine fleet can consume. They would have to find a surface target first, then get into a position to launch them with a chance of a kill. Torpedoes are not like artillery shells or rifle cartridges in the scale of production required for them because there are millions of artillery guns and rifles and millions of good targets for them each day, but there are only a limited number of submarines and torpedo boats and destroyers that carry torpedoes and they seldom find targets worth a shot. So if fewer torpedoes are manufactured than enemy ships are produced at some point then it's just a matter of there being plenty enough torps in the stock already.
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Feb 17, 2015 01:05
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Nenonen posted:That sounds like a useless statistic anyway - there are only so many torpedoes that your surface and submarine fleet can consume. They would have to find a surface target first, then get into a position to launch them with a chance of a kill. Torpedoes are not like artillery shells or rifle cartridges in the scale of production required for them because there are millions of artillery guns and rifles and millions of good targets for them each day, but there are only a limited number of submarines and torpedo boats and destroyers that carry torpedoes and they seldom find targets worth a shot. So if fewer torpedoes are manufactured than enemy ships are produced at some point then it's just a matter of there being plenty enough torps in the stock already. Also, many of those ships will be far behind the front lines or in other theaters entirely - your submarines, carriers, TB's, etc only have the opportunity to confront a fraction of them anyway. That said it is a very worrying sign when your nation cannot produce an expendable component of ships as fast as your enemy can produce entire ships.
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Feb 17, 2015 01:20
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If the Japanese can maximize warship casualties for the Allies, it won't matter how many transport/cargo ships they build.
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Feb 17, 2015 01:41
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The Oklahoma is still alive... and mobile. Grey did not get a points jump that would have happened from the sinking.
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Feb 17, 2015 03:46
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Kinugasa rackin' up kills. Go lucky ship! 
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Feb 17, 2015 06:26
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Donitz was also hoping that the experienced captains and chief engineers were irreplaceable. Sink enough ships, and they won't have enough sailors to crew them/
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Feb 17, 2015 19:24
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AtomikKrab posted:The Oklahoma is still alive... and mobile. I'm beginning to wonder if the KB actually raided the right island during the opening salvo or if the Japanese pilots come back from bombing a load of pine trees with tales of totally nailing every BB in the fleet.
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Feb 17, 2015 19:25
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whitewhale posted:I'm beginning to wonder if the KB actually raided the right island during the opening salvo or if the Japanese pilots come back from bombing a load of pine trees with tales of totally nailing every BB in the fleet. Sit Rep: The Japanese bombed the Big Island and caused some extra lava flows but no ships were damaged.
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Feb 17, 2015 19:54
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Or maybe the pilots knew they'd screwed up but they figured reporting that might not have gone too well with the higher-ups, so they lied and decided to wing it from there. ...heh. "Wing it". And they're pilots. Heh.
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Feb 17, 2015 20:17
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So will the Allied AI take proper advantage of it's soon arriving overwhelming carrier power or will it simply sortie out each new carrier one by one to be sunk as soon as it arrive? Meaning will Grey ever see a proper Task Force 38 with 15+ Carriers? For all the  the Kido Butai gets that poo poo was bushleague compared to the US Fast Carrier Task Force.
Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Feb 17, 2015 |
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Feb 17, 2015 20:30
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:So will the Allied AI take proper advantage of it's soon arriving overwhelming carrier power or will it simply sortie out each new carrier one by one to be sunk as soon as it arrive? Meaning will Grey ever see a proper Task Force 38 with 15+ Carriers? I haven't played as Japan but the scenario creators do seem to try to replicate the real strategies during the war. Most likely the AI kept the individual CV TF's from war's start initially, and will move to grouping them more in 2's and 3's. I'd guess that at some point it would start lumping lots more together, although the Air Combat TF size limit is 25 ships, and you are supposed to have a 1:2 escort ratio or something, so maybe not quite as big as reality. A lot probably depends on if Grey updated the game/scenarios recently, too, as one of the devs has been rolling out changes/fixes in the form of patches on the forums for years. At the very least I just saw the Japanese AI pull off a very historic looking Midway invasion with CV, surface combat, and invasion TF's, with a several-days-before invasion of Attu and Kiska. The AI does do some really dumb things but I would guess the Allied AI has some scripts in there that would actually give a human Japanese player problems, especially late war. I've heard AI vs AI largely works out as it should, and given the Japanese AI's behavior the Allied AI would have to group CV's together and use them for escorting invasions and other stuff in order to actually beat the Japanese AI, as unescorted TF's get eaten by torpedo bombers and patrolling CV/CVL TFs.
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Feb 17, 2015 20:53
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Would the game engine even be able to handle 15 CVs in a task force or even two smaller task forces in the same hex? I thought there were problems when the numbers got that high.
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Feb 17, 2015 21:02
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Not the Steel Scientist! The coolest name, lost to the waves...
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Feb 17, 2015 21:11
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CannonFodder posted:Would the game engine even be able to handle 15 CVs in a task force or even two smaller task forces in the same hex? I thought there were problems when the numbers got that high. The Allies get a penalty to CAG coordination if they have too many CVs in a task force ("too many" meaning >~100 aircraft in 1942, >~150 in 1943, or >~200 in '44). There used to be a bug when using large numbers of fighters and bombers that would really only happen late-war, but I think that's been fixed.
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Feb 17, 2015 21:49
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HisMajestyBOB posted:The Allies get a penalty to CAG coordination if they have too many CVs in a task force ("too many" meaning >~100 aircraft in 1942, >~150 in 1943, or >~200 in '44). Task Force 38 could put up over 1,000 planes into the air so that's some bullshit. Unless you count subdivisions in which it had 3 but that still is way over 200 planes each. To give some idea to how loving powerful this force was, during the Okinawa campaign, it included: 17 Carriers 8 Fast Battleships 19 Cruisers 59 Destroyers All sailing together as one strike force. And that was just the Fast Carrier Task Force of the 5th fleet. The 7th fleet was far larger and included like 200 destroyers, 40 Cruisers, 30 escort carriers, and a dozen Super Dreadnaught Battleships, including 6 that were 'sunk' at Pearl Harbor. The Kido Butai at its absolute height had: 6 Carriers (keep in mind that Japanese carriers carried only about 2/3 the complement of planes that US carriers did) 2-3 Fast Battleships 10ish Cruisers 25ish Destroyers They could have had more battleships but the Yamatos were kept preciously guarded at Truk for 2 years and didn't sortie out at all. And the Ise Class Battleships became some useless bastard battleship/carrier hybrid. The Japanese were fuuuuuuuuuucked. Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Feb 17, 2015 |
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Feb 17, 2015 22:14
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The Americans actually did have historical problems coordinating several Carrier groups pretty far into the war, and no matter how good you are there's gonna be problems operating a thousand planes at once at optimal efficiency.
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Feb 17, 2015 22:40
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Task Force 38 could put up over 1,000 planes into the air so that's some bullshit. Unless you count subdivisions in which it had 3 but that still is way over 200 planes each. Just because the US could historically put up 1,000 planes at once doesn't mean it didn't suffer some efficiency losses from acting in a task force that large. One thousand planes can still be very effective without being exactly five times as effective as 200 planes.
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Feb 17, 2015 22:58
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Not My Leg posted:Just because the US could historically put up 1,000 planes at once doesn't mean it didn't suffer some efficiency losses from acting in a task force that large. One thousand planes can still be very effective without being exactly five times as effective as 200 planes. Oh I thought that was a max amount thing. Yeah that makes sense then.
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Feb 17, 2015 23:02
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rip today
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Feb 18, 2015 00:37
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Returning to the land war in Malaya. I recently started reading 'Singapore the Japanese Version' by Colonel Masanobu Tsuji. He was the chief of operations and planning staff for the 25th Japanese Army in Malaya and was involved in the detailed planning and execution of the campaign for Singapore. The book was originally written in Japanese and was intended as a somewhat revisionist companion to Winston Churchill's fourth volume of his history of WWII 'The Hinge of Fate'. First published in Japan in 1952 one year after Churchill's book it was eventually translated into English due to efforts of H V Howe who had been the military secretary to the Australian minister for the army during the war. It was published in Australia in 1960, it was eventually reprinted as a paperback in 1997. It was the original hard cover version that fell into my possession. OK big wind up so what? It is an amazing insight into the whole IJA with reflections on the experience of the Chinese campaign and the devastating defeat to the Russian army leading up to the preparations for the Malaya campaign. It soon becomes clear that the key to their success was the result of what were experimental jungle warfare doctrines that, although rushed, were the fruits of a determined year long effort. These innovations included, Bicycle engineers and the amphibious landing of horses in the tropics (Thought impossible). At the centre of the whole edifice however was the knowledge that Singapore was undefended from the landed side. Part of the haste was a fear that something would be done about this complete gift despite there being no sign of any measures being employed to rectify it. Possibly the most interesting aspect of the narrative is the translators desire to render it as close to the literal Japanese as possible. Expressions like Doro Nawa (that was the nick name for the Taiwan Army No. 82 Unit) Literally Robber Rope. Expresses the sentiment that you catch the robber then you make the rope to confine them. The nearest English adage is 'Close the door after the horse has bolted' and clearly expresses the view that even before the attack on Pearl Harbour there was a strong sense in the IJA that there had been insufficient preparation and that the forces available weren't properly equipped, trained or experienced to undertake the tasks required of them. This possibly reflects the conservative nature of some in the IJA because they apparently spent ten years training and developing the force for the attack on China. I'm only part way into it but I'll probably finish it before the IJA in this time line take Singapore.
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Feb 18, 2015 00:43
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Prime Minister Grey Hunter was stabbed to death in his bed last night and replaced by a more 'enthusiastic' staff officer who better embodies the Samurai spirit. RIP
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Feb 18, 2015 06:22
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   We drive off a American sub.   Just because I'm not attacking for a while, that doesn't mean we are going to stop the bombing.  We can now take Port Moresby – once our troops have rested of course!  We also take another base in Borneo.   Not a busy day as a lot of my guys are resting.  I've decided to pull the Kido Butai back to Japan. They are low on planes after three months of hard fighting and in need of some minor repairs. Better to get this done now while I'm slogging through the Philippines. Grey Hunter fucked around with this message at 07:27 on Feb 18, 2015 |
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Feb 18, 2015 06:27
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You forgot the update for yesterday, the 17th.
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Feb 18, 2015 06:29
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The entire KB was sunk on the 17th, but Grey's not allowed to talk about it.
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Feb 18, 2015 06:41
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It will be ignored for the rest of the war, as the LP plays out just. as. normal.
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Feb 18, 2015 06:42
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Iba would be a great place to send some battleships on a bombardment mission.
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Feb 18, 2015 07:03
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drat, fixed now. SPOILERS
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Feb 18, 2015 07:27
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YOU SAW NOTHING CITIZENS
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Feb 18, 2015 07:46
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Jeez Grey, you're really intent on using up those air wings. Good to see my lucky ship at 0 damage across the board though.
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Feb 18, 2015 07:57
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dublish posted:Jeez Grey, you're really intent on using up those air wings. Good to see my lucky ship at 0 damage across the board though. ... Except for the 9 systems damage.
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Feb 18, 2015 08:20
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Rogue0071 posted:... Except for the 9 systems damage. Well, poo poo.
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Feb 18, 2015 08:30
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Rogue0071 posted:... Except for the 9 systems damage. Eh. Thats just wear and tear from being at sea for three months - hence why I'm bringing them back. The air groups is the same, mostly losses from bad landing and the such, with those few bad days of bombing accounting for twenty planes or so.
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Feb 18, 2015 09:21
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How are they doing for pilots? I've never looked at the Japanese setup, whats the average exp/primary skill level they start out with and how much of those dudes are still around? You're definitely able to feed better skilled pilots into carrier wings against the Nip AI, but losing any >60 exp DB pilot in an untimely raid feels like a big loss, and I can only imagine how it goes when playing as Japan.
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Feb 18, 2015 11:44
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   We cause some losses with the bombing today.  Port Moresby continues to go well. We take more casualties, but the destroyed squads are all on the British side.   We hit Moelmien again. The destroyed squads are on our favour, and this base is cut off.  Well, it certainly is now.   The fight for Luganville starts up again, I think I can win this one now.  Some nice land battles, but I'm going to have to think about hitting Iba again soon. I need to do it, even though I know its going to hurt! The Allied warships seem to have all but vanished from the seas. 
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Feb 18, 2015 18:49
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Koesj posted:How are they doing for pilots? I've never looked at the Japanese setup, whats the average exp/primary skill level they start out with and how much of those dudes are still around? You're definitely able to feed better skilled pilots into carrier wings against the Nip AI, but losing any >60 exp DB pilot in an untimely raid feels like a big loss, and I can only imagine how it goes when playing as Japan. As the Japanese, can Grey circumvent doctrine of "keep them there til they die" and have aces shuttled back to the main islands to become trainers, like he did with his allied campaign?
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Feb 18, 2015 19:43
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Would it be worth using his otherwise fallow battlewagons to bombard Iba? And when the heck is he going to get around to securing Palembang?
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Feb 18, 2015 19:51
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Volmarias posted:Would it be worth using his otherwise fallow battlewagons to bombard Iba? And when the heck is he going to get around to securing Palembang? In the real war, Japan invaded Palembang 5 days ago.
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Feb 18, 2015 19:53
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They also have already invaded Singapore(that finished on the 15th).
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Feb 18, 2015 20:19
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Has anyone claimed the cruiser Tone as their ship? I'd like it, if it hasn't been taken.
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Feb 18, 2015 20:29
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Mahler posted:Has anyone claimed the cruiser Tone as their ship? I'd like it, if it hasn't been taken. It's been taken.
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Feb 18, 2015 20:32
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