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Before I start, I should note that I haven't anywhere near finished Shallie so my impressions of its battle balance might be a little warped. Oh and Mana Khemia 2 is my favourite of the three despite any criticism I may make of it below.Nakar posted:They're not as impactful. Roxis and Miruca don't even compare for example as there are just not enough enemy time cards for Miruca's deletion ability to be all that useful, it doesn't do anything else, and Miruca can't switch with other characters freely because most of her cards disappear if she leaves the front row (which is required when you're switching, so that's kind of an issue). Enna's deletion ability in MK2 had way more effect on the way battles played out. It was the one out of all of that game's atempts at giving characters skills that encouraged them to not switch out that was actually worth using. For better or worse, they never seemed happy with the offensive tag as often as possible thing the Mana-Khemias had going on and what I've played of Shallie seemed like it actually "fixed" it so things that don't stick around when a character tags out make more sense. quote:And MK2 kinda spread everybody's skills a bit thin because there were more characters due to the two parties thing. Using a character in MK1 felt like you were fundamentally altering the rules of the game in their particular fashion with each character in the party, MK2/Shallie are a lot more whole-party focused and it's more about using everybody. There's not some huge noticeable difference in how Wilbell and Keithgriff operate in Shallie, for example; they play closer to the rules than the MK1 cast which more aggressively breaks them. MK2's issue was kind of opposite to what you're suggesting. There was plenty of gimmickry, a lot the skills tied to it were just either useless (Yun's power-up mode thing) or not really used for the gimmicks (anything that inflicts freeze) because they were tied up in giving characters their own little vacuum sealed set up for a payoff loops in a desperate attempt to discourage tagging after every attack (that mostly didn't work). It honestly would have been cool if it had been designed around the parties as holistic wholes because then you'd have had things like the ability to inflict freeze and the multi-hitting damaging ice moves being on different characters (and therefore the turn around from inflicting freeze to benefiting from it being fast enough to be worthwhile). The gimmicks in Shallie are less Splashy but that honestly feels more like the result of designing them around the effect they have on in battle decision making as opposed to "look at how weird this character's mechanics are!" than anything.
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May 12, 2015 19:15
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The White Dragon posted:Shame, Vesperia is hands-down my favorite Tales game. Maybe check out Tales of Destiny 2 (Eternia in Japan or picky English-speaking circles), it had really fluid combat and was 2D rather than 3D. Being a PS1 title, it will, of course, be a little ghetto whenever it employs modeled effects. Considering that they made an actual Destiny 2 after the fact, I don't think it's being particularly picky to call it Eternia, since it's the easiest and most hassle-free way to differentiate what game you're talking about.
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May 12, 2015 19:23
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FirstAidKite posted:Let's all instead talk about how atelier iris 2 is not a good game and that gray deserved to be in a better game than that Is there an agreed-upon list of what the good Atelier games are because I really liked the first Atelier Iris but I never tried the later ones because some people said they started going downhill
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May 12, 2015 19:35
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Forest Thief Pud posted:Considering that they made an actual Destiny 2 after the fact, I don't think it's being particularly picky to call it Eternia, since it's the easiest and most hassle-free way to differentiate what game you're talking about. Oh, how about that. See, I had no idea there was a real Destiny 2. You learn something new every day!
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May 12, 2015 19:45
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FirstAidKite posted:Let's all instead talk about how atelier iris 2 is not a good game and that gray deserved to be in a better game than that AI2 has a faerie that kills things with guns so it's cool in my book. Too bad Noin reminded me too much of Lita design-wise and they give you a character that starts at level 1 near the end of the game. AI3 has Nell as a character which automatically makes it the worst game.
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May 12, 2015 19:47
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Everybody in AI2 was annoying as gently caress except gray. The most annoying was the pixy dude with the gun. IMO
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May 12, 2015 19:50
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FirstAidKite posted:Everybody in AI2 was annoying as gently caress except gray. Viese is pretty cool. Erebus posted:Is there an agreed-upon list of what the good Atelier games are because I really liked the first Atelier Iris but I never tried the later ones because some people said they started going downhill Mana Khemia > Mana Khemia 2 > Atelier Iris 1 > Atelier Iris 2 > Atelier Iris 3
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May 12, 2015 19:59
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Forest Thief Pud posted:Considering that they made an actual Destiny 2 after the fact, I don't think it's being particularly picky to call it Eternia, since it's the easiest and most hassle-free way to differentiate what game you're talking about. And the actual Tales of Destiny 2 is a direct sequel, even. It's easy to miss because it had no translation but that is where Reala is from, as IIRC she has cameoed in translated games. Also, for the translated PSP release of Eternia (only in Europe, granted; it didn't come out in the States) it was called Tales of Eternia. So yeah, no reason not to. Prism fucked around with this message at 20:12 on May 12, 2015 |
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May 12, 2015 20:08
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She cameo'd in Graces, along with fellow Destiny Team alumni Veigue and
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May 12, 2015 20:21
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I've now put 2.5 hours into P4G and still haven't fought a battle other than that one story battle where you just attack a few times and then fall asleep.
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May 12, 2015 20:32
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Erebus posted:Is there an agreed-upon list of what the good Atelier games are because I really liked the first Atelier Iris but I never tried the later ones because some people said they started going downhill Compare this with some of the more recent ones like Rorona/Totori/Meruru/Ayesha/Escha&Logy and you'll see some pretty significant differences. Time management is a primary thing, like doing stuff costs you time and you have to not use too much of it, they tend to be more task-oriented and less story-oriented. Rorona and E&L barely have a story, you can't get the actual story in Meruru until NG+, and Totori and Ayesha require you to actively pursue the story. Mana Khemia 1/2 and Shallie don't exactly have good stories, but they're a bit more narrative-oriented since they lack a time limit. Non-Iris/MK games also tend to be a good bit girlier. Softer colors, more cutesy/innocent heroines, frilly designs, "badass" characters are mostly relegated to side roles (although it's amusing in Rorona when you finally get Sterk, an actual trained knight, and he whips unbelievably more rear end than your ragtag band of young girls and wandering entertainers), a greater emphasis on casual friendship stuff and less on epic storylines. The music also gets worse, but not always.
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May 12, 2015 20:33
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Tired Moritz posted:Mana Khemia > Mana Khemia 2 > Atelier Iris 1 > Atelier Iris 2 > Atelier Iris 3
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May 12, 2015 20:39
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Tired Moritz posted:Mana Khemia > Mana Khemia 2 > Atelier Iris 1 > Atelier Iris 2 > Atelier Iris 3 As the one person alive who likes AI3, I have to defend it by saying it had a really good battle system before Mana Khemia existed, and I love sidequest-based game design. ... I can't really defend AI3 all that much, actually, I just like it because it invented the time card battle system thing. I can't even REMEMBER what the plot of the game is.
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May 12, 2015 20:42
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SelenicMartian posted:Where does the PSP port of MK fit into this?
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May 12, 2015 20:42
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SelenicMartian posted:Where does the PSP port of MK fit into this? It would fit on the list if it was a playable game but it's actually a playable powerpoint slideshow so...
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May 12, 2015 20:44
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Come on guys, it's not THAT bad. (If you get the digital version). UMD? Don't joke with me. No, seriously, don't.
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May 12, 2015 20:51
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The PSP port have a glitch where you can't synthesize all the items in the game, thus preventing you from getting 100%. Amazing. NIS' translations are terrible.
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May 12, 2015 20:58
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Infinity Gaia posted:As the one person alive who likes AI3, I have to defend it by saying it had a really good battle system before Mana Khemia existed, and I love sidequest-based game design. I like it! It's almost a really good game. Shame about it being at least twice as long as it should be.
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May 12, 2015 21:06
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Tired Moritz posted:The PSP port have a glitch where you can't synthesize all the items in the game, thus preventing you from getting 100%. Amazing. NIS' translations are terrible. Wait, what? This is the first I'm hearing of this. Edit: Well, poo poo. Apparently, the bonus weapons are not synthesizable. gently caress you, NIS? RadicalR fucked around with this message at 21:53 on May 12, 2015 |
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May 12, 2015 21:50
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Dross posted:I've now put 2.5 hours into P4G and still haven't fought a battle other than that one story battle where you just attack a few times and then fall asleep. P4's tutorial stretch is a bit long, but once you're off the leash you're free for the rest of the game. Plus its setting up a whole bunch of things.
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May 13, 2015 02:50
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Dross posted:I've now put 2.5 hours into P4G and still haven't fought a battle other than that one story battle where you just attack a few times and then fall asleep. You'll soon reach a point where you're tired of fighting and just want to chill with your little sis. Persona is kind of a game of extremes and trying to strike a balance between them.
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May 13, 2015 03:49
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Dross posted:I've now put 2.5 hours into P4G and still haven't fought a battle other than that one story battle where you just attack a few times and then fall asleep. The tutorial is the worst offender but p4 is like 80% dialogue 20% combat in general
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May 13, 2015 03:53
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Nakar posted:There's a big difference between "games that are like Atelier Iris" and most other Atelier games. Iris and the Mana Khemia games and to a lesser extent Atelier Shallie (but not the previous games in Shallie's series) are fairly close to each other, but MK and Shallie are a lot closer to the traditional Atelier structure as opposed to a normal JRPG structure, though none of them has a true time limit like "real" Atelier games do. I hate time management stuff in games, so I guess those are out. I just liked the relative simplicity of Atelier Iris (kind of reminded me of playing Lunar on the PS1 in contrast to convoluted poo poo like Xenogears) and filling out the recipes for shops. I guess I should try Mana Khemia.
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May 13, 2015 04:10
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atelier shallie doesn't have time management
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May 13, 2015 04:20
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Erebus posted:I hate time management stuff in games, so I guess those are out. I just liked the relative simplicity of Atelier Iris (kind of reminded me of playing Lunar on the PS1 in contrast to convoluted poo poo like Xenogears) and filling out the recipes for shops. I guess I should try Mana Khemia. Get Shallie. It removes the time management aspect.
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May 13, 2015 04:25
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Ibram Gaunt posted:The tutorial is the worst offender but p4 is like 80% dialogue 20% combat in general Eh, I'm not so sure about that. I think your really forgetting how long the last few dungeons are, and the fact that there is very little story except for the beginning/end of them.
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May 13, 2015 04:26
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goldjas posted:Eh, I'm not so sure about that. I think your really forgetting how long the last few dungeons are, and the fact that there is very little story except for the beginning/end of them.
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May 13, 2015 04:34
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It's the same for the fighting games.
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May 13, 2015 05:04
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Well uh apparently Dragon Quest 8 is getting a 3DS remake: http://www.siliconera.com/2015/05/12/dragon-quest-viii-announced-for-the-nintendo-3ds/
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May 13, 2015 07:07
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So they're just skipping 7?
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May 13, 2015 07:08
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morrie as a party member? holy poo poo
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May 13, 2015 07:11
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Dross posted:So they're just skipping 7? 7 already has a 3DS remake. In Japan.
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May 13, 2015 07:11
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Endorph posted:i played p4 last year: 80% dialogue 20% combat is right on the money. Of course the problem is you'll be going through the majority of that 20% in lengthy chunks. Early on the game encourages you to make several trips to the dungeon but once you get Kanji you can basically go through them in one sitting which realistically take 2-4 hours. That's 2-4 hours of straight random battles and nothing else. Heaven forbid if you want to do the sidequests and optional bosses. But man, it makes Chilling With Nanako Time that much sweeter when you get back.
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May 13, 2015 07:30
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Endorph posted:morrie as a party member? holy poo poo  Square Enix, if you localize this, I will throw money at you e: Also I will take whatever opportunity I can get to replace Jessica with someone who isn't a Dragon Quest offensive mage, because they are pretty much across the board worthless once you have someone else with debuffs Panic! at Nabisco fucked around with this message at 07:39 on May 13, 2015 |
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May 13, 2015 07:36
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comes as no surprise to anyone http://www.siliconera.com/2015/05/12/imageepoch-have-begun-bankruptcy-procedures/
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May 13, 2015 08:34
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Did they make anything good
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May 13, 2015 08:37
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They made official Game of Every Year 'Time & Eternity'!
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May 13, 2015 08:42
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You're gonna have to be more specific
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May 13, 2015 08:43
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FirstAidKite posted:Did they make anything good They also made 7th Dragon which I have an inexplicable loyalty towards because it is stylish as gently caress
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May 13, 2015 08:44
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luminous arc is one of those games where the main characters are incredibly boring but the side characters are really fun and interesting
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May 13, 2015 08:45
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