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Zucc traveled with the team 
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May 25, 2015 22:13
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The Captain Clutch narrative will not be carrying the day, as it turns out. Despite the fact that his feat was still really impressive.
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May 26, 2015 05:12
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Faaaaarrrrrrtt. Bad time to be lazy about a dump and change you dweebs.
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May 26, 2015 05:13
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Pancakes by Mail posted:The Captain Clutch narrative will not be carrying the day, as it turns out. Despite the fact that his feat was still really impressive. More like Captain C-Luck! Boom. Roasted.
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May 26, 2015 05:16
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matt beleskey is going to get ridiculously overpaid
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May 26, 2015 05:21
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 ecstasy of victory, agony of defeat etc etc really great photo, honestly (credit @GinaFerezzi for the LA Times)
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May 26, 2015 05:27
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Right timing but wrong angle for the Orr-shot though
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May 26, 2015 05:28
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Pancakes by Mail posted:
With a rapist alcohol pirate grinning about it all.
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May 26, 2015 05:29
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Finally, a drat OT win. If we lost that i was about to completely lose grip with reality.
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May 26, 2015 05:49
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More upset about that Hawks loss than the pens getting knocked out So obvious the fucks were gonna come out flying, really wish Chicago had started that ot sharper
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May 26, 2015 06:23
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Sharks Eat Bear posted:More upset about that Hawks loss than the pens getting knocked out Or the game.
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May 26, 2015 07:26
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Jesus Christ Beuach was terrible in that game. He really should be benched for Wiz in the next game but it wont happen. The Catch 22 of completely outplaying your opponent is your goalie goes cold and completely shits the bed on his first 10 shots faced.
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May 26, 2015 11:33
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How is the Chicago defense holding up with the workload? Also poor Timonen. 8 minutes of ice-time, -2, and watched both goals go in right in front of him.
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May 26, 2015 12:53
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anyone who thinks "clutch" isn't a thing has never hit a tee shot with a bunch of strangers watching
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May 26, 2015 14:16
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bewbies posted:anyone who thinks "clutch" isn't a thing has never hit a tee shot with a bunch of strangers watching Unclutch performer here and I can attest to this....
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May 26, 2015 14:43
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I don't think I've ever seen a puck go almost straight down the line and in like that before
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May 26, 2015 14:56
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The Hawks playing with their backs to the wall is going to be a fun sight to behold. The series will go 7 games only because I'll be at a bachelor party on Saturday and won't be able to watch it. 
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May 26, 2015 15:38
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I have tickets for a Cubs game on Saturday I mean, I'd blow the Cubs game off to watch Game 7 it just sucks it has to come to that.
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May 26, 2015 15:41
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Kevlar v2.0 posted:The Hawks playing with their backs to the wall is going to be a fun sight to behold. The series will go 7 games only because I'll be at a bachelor party on Saturday and won't be able to watch it. The Hawks taking it to 7 is all I want. Game 7 ot. I don't even care who wins if it happens. I love OT
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May 26, 2015 15:42
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RC Cola posted:The Hawks taking it to 7 is all I want. Game 7 ot. I don't even care who wins if it happens. I love OT I was angrier that the OT ended quickly, then that the Hawks lost.
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May 26, 2015 15:48
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Scrotos posted:I was angrier that the OT ended quickly, then that the Hawks lost. Exactly. I was geared up to watch all of the overtime hockey and they stole it from me.
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May 26, 2015 15:53
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bewbies posted:anyone who thinks "clutch" isn't a thing has never hit a tee shot with a bunch of strangers watching "Clutch" is basically a measure of confidence and confidence waxes and wanes over the course of playing sports. I don't think it exists in the way people think it does. Some stretches of play you have that confidence, and some stretches of play you don't, and then people attach labels to that based on whether your stretch of good play coincided with games arbitrarily deemed important. Yet whether you have that confidence or not in those important situations is mostly random and luck of the draw, especially at the highest level of sports.
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May 26, 2015 16:09
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Nail Rat posted:I have tickets for a Cubs game on Saturday At least they'll give scoring updates at Wrigley. They did when I was at a Cubs game during the Bulls/Cavs series.
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May 26, 2015 16:44
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Ginette Reno posted:"Clutch" is basically a measure of confidence and confidence waxes and wanes over the course of playing sports. I don't think it exists in the way people think it does. Some stretches of play you have that confidence, and some stretches of play you don't, and then people attach labels to that based on whether your stretch of good play coincided with games arbitrarily deemed important. Yet whether you have that confidence or not in those important situations is mostly random and luck of the draw, especially at the highest level of sports. Also non-athletes have the perspective that such a situation would be enormously stressful (see the golfing with witnesses vs alone comment) but pro athletes have encountered "the biggest series/games/shift of their life" countless times throughout their decades of development. Stat analyses have shown clutch to primarily be noise in the data, but the common mind wants to attribute their inherent feelings to the players they root for and against, and clutchness and the hot hand and the slump-buster and all that jargon makes for easily embraced narratives. So, death to the sports media.
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May 26, 2015 18:04
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Kevlar v2.0 posted:At least they'll give scoring updates at Wrigley. They did when I was at a Cubs game during the Bulls/Cavs series. Not good enough for Game 7 of the WCF come on man. I'll probably show up to the game to get the free Chicago Whales jersey they're giving away and then head to a bar.
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May 26, 2015 18:41
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Kevlar v2.0 posted:At least they'll give scoring updates at Wrigley. They did when I was at a Cubs game during the Bulls/Cavs series. Hopefully the Ducks will make his Cubs experience better by closing this thing out tomorrow
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May 26, 2015 18:43
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Ross Angeles posted:Hopefully the Ducks will make his Cubs experience better by closing this thing out tomorrow Or hopefully not, because baseball is just an excuse to drink that's not necessary if there's hockey on. Ducks/Lightning will either have games starting at 5 PM or 8 PM every night and so would be terrible.
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May 26, 2015 18:49
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kalensc posted:Also non-athletes have the perspective that such a situation would be enormously stressful (see the golfing with witnesses vs alone comment) but pro athletes have encountered "the biggest series/games/shift of their life" countless times throughout their decades of development. Stat analyses have shown clutch to primarily be noise in the data, but the common mind wants to attribute their inherent feelings to the players they root for and against, and clutchness and the hot hand and the slump-buster and all that jargon makes for easily embraced narratives. All true. "Clutch" still exists. I think that the best example is kicking a football. Kicking a football is not a very difficult thing to do physically speaking. If you've played soccer competitively at any point, you can probably kick a field goal from 50 yards out more often than not without any sort of serious practice. There's hardly any difference between college and pro kickers when it comes to the straight-up ability to kick the ball; in a lot of cases, younger college guys can kick a lot further than veteran pros can. The hard thing isn't the physical act of kicking: it is the ability to do this one simple thing perfectly, with your teammates relying on you and with tens of thousands of fans in the stadium and millions more at home watching. The reason guys make it to the NFL and stay there for so many years isn't their physical ability to kick the ball, it is their ability to kick a ball while under huge amounts of pressure. I think your point is that, for the most part, guys you see in pro sports are all "clutch" at least relative to you and I and their peers that they've left behind at various levels of the game, not necessarily because they lacked the physical ability, but because they lacked some critical mental faculty. This is certainly true. However, if we acknowledge that a key difference between amateurs and pros is pros are more "clutch", then it seems like we have to acknowledge that there has to be a spectrum amongst pro players as well. Guys like Roy and Messier, or Michael Jordan or James Worthy, they weren't just visibly better in the playoffs, they raised their statistical output considerably despite playing against tougher competition. They were quantifiably better players in high pressure situations. I agree also that a lot of the "clutch" narrative is misattributed or overused or straight up wrong, but that doesn't mean that there aren't players out there who it does apply to. There are, they are rare, but they exist.
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May 26, 2015 18:58
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bewbies posted:I agree also that a lot of the "clutch" narrative is misattributed or overused or straight up wrong, but that doesn't mean that there aren't players out there who it does apply to. There are, they are rare, but they exist. It's impossible to know if they do or don't. Messier outperforming his regular season PPG could easily be considered random statistical noise. If he played 1000 playoff games I'm betting his playoff PPG would end up right around where his regular season one is.
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May 26, 2015 19:27
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I'm still irrationally irritated at that dump in attempt last night by Playoff Zero Bryan Bickell. He has plenty of open space and one job: to get the puck deep in the zone while the Hawks make a line change. I just don't get why he tries to blast it in as hard as possible when a soft chip into the corner would have worked much better.
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May 26, 2015 19:31
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Ginette Reno posted:It's impossible to know if they do or don't. Messier outperforming his regular season PPG could easily be considered random statistical noise. If he played 1000 playoff games I'm betting his playoff PPG would end up right around where his regular season one is. Mess played 236 playoff games in a 18 year window, Roy played 247 in the same. That's many times the number required to comfortably eliminate random variation as an explanation.
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May 26, 2015 19:34
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Messier outperformed his regular season numbers by not making the playoffs in his final 7 years when he was a much less capable offensive player.
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May 26, 2015 19:38
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bewbies posted:Mess played 236 playoff games in a 18 year window, Roy played 247 in the same. That's many times the number required to comfortably eliminate random variation as an explanation. A much simpler explanation is that Messier didn't make the playoffs in the last seven years of his career. His numbers up to 96/97 were 1552pts in 1272 games. Aka a ppg of 1.22 compared to 1.25 ppg in the playoffs. He performed exactly as he was supposed to. Clutch ain't real in team sports. I can KINDA buy the pressure thing in individual sports, but it's a non-entity in something that isn't a single repeatable act like a football kick or golf swing.
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May 26, 2015 19:40
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TMMadman posted:I'm still irrationally irritated at that dump in attempt last night by Playoff Zero Bryan Bickell. He has plenty of open space and one job: to get the puck deep in the zone while the Hawks make a line change. The Hawks get massive brain farts that lead to goals seemingly 99% of the time.
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May 26, 2015 19:43
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INSPECTAH DECK posted:Messier outperformed his regular season numbers by not making the playoffs in his final 7 years when he was a much less capable offensive player. Even if you delete his last 7 years his playoff numbers are still better, though the margin is a lot closer (1.22 vs 1.25). I'm not in a position where I can do the math but I'm willing to bet that is still a statistically significant difference.
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May 26, 2015 19:44
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TMMadman posted:I'm still irrationally irritated at that dump in attempt last night by Playoff Zero Bryan Bickell. He has plenty of open space and one job: to get the puck deep in the zone while the Hawks make a line change. Because he's a big dummy who's bad at hockey and gets paid $4 million a year to be bad at hockey  I really hope the Hawks find people dumb enough to take Sharp and Bickell from them for a second rounder or a ham sandwich, that'd help out a lot with this cap situation. Hey Bickell's only got one terrible contract year left everyone
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May 26, 2015 19:45
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bewbies posted:Even if you delete his last 7 years his playoff numbers are still better, though the margin is a lot closer (1.22 vs 1.25). I'm not in a position where I can do the math but I'm willing to bet that is still a statistically significant difference. If he scored at exactly the same rate during the playoffs as he did in the regular season he'd has 288 points, 7 less than he actually did. His PPG was better in the playoffs than the regular season 7 times out of 17 (41.17% of the time). I will admit a strong personal bias against Messier as a Canucks fan though.
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May 26, 2015 19:57
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Nail Rat posted:
I don't see a problem
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May 26, 2015 20:07
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Messier sucks but maintaining an equivalent or slightly better scoring rate when the bottom X teams are eliminated and the matches are at the tail-end of a long and brutal season is impressive. An impressive athlete doing an impressive feat that others have often failed to achieve. I call that "excellence at sport", but some people love putting athletes into boxes and stats into tiers and then you have the five-star clutch 20-point playoff power performer debate or whatever. quote:I agree also that a lot of the "clutch" narrative is misattributed or overused or straight up wrong, but that doesn't mean that there aren't players out there who it does apply to. There are, they are rare, but they exist. Agreed Bewbies. I think that "clutch" is a classic example of a topic with (A) a terribly definition that is extremely subjective, and (B) while there are some concrete facts which could be used to support/contest an argument (seen in the last page or two of this thread) the vast majority of debates involve incomplete or deceptive statements like "Toews scores so many late goals to tie a game = Captain Clutch" and then well there's nowhere to go with that discussion. tl;dr - death to power rankings and voting on awards, all hail the beep-boop mathputer champions
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May 26, 2015 20:12
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Everyone sucks, winning is a fluke.
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May 26, 2015 20:19
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