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krooj
Dec 2, 2006

Pivo posted:

I mean I'm currently writing this from a Surface Book that has an nvidia chip in the base and Microsoft controlled the whole design including special drivers and still it sometimes fucks up when you disconnect the "clipboard" from the base and you have to restart.

Jesus, dude.... Windows :negative:

Actual content:

My 2016 M7 rMB is waiting for me at work, so I should be able to provide feedback on how it compares with the 1.3 2015 for Java development with IJ.

I love this keyboard and wish it upon all Mac laptops.

krooj fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Apr 29, 2016

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Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


krooj posted:

Jesus, dude.... Windows :negative:

Oh, man, we're a Microsoft shop. What, you think I bought this thing with my own money? Yes, Windows 10, Windows Server 2012 R2, VS2015, MSSQL, Hyper-V, cluster ALL the things. Even my mouse is made by Microsoft.

But he IS talking about running Windows in a VM on a Mac. :P

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

I'm not sure how much this varies year-to-year, but we had an iMac in the office a while back that we stuck an SSD into; we were able to get around the fan problem by installing some program that controlled the fan speeds. (I can't remember what it was, unfortunately.)

smc fan control, i used it too back in the snow leopard days

jackpot
Aug 31, 2004

First cousin to the Black Rabbit himself. Such was Woundwort's monument...and perhaps it would not have displeased him.<
I'm following the instructions here to use an imac as a display for my macbook pro. But the only way it seems to work is with my macbook as the primary display (dock, desktop items, etc) and the imac as secondary - if I close the macbook (like I would with my usual external monitor) it simply goes to sleep, it doesn't know to keep the external display on. I don't want to juggle two screens, I just want one big one - can't I do this?

jackpot posted:

I ordered five "Magsafe to Magsafe 2" converters (they have a habit of disappearing in my office), and just got them in the mail...along with two USB power adapters (the little ones). Is this a thing? Like, order enough of whatever and they just chuck some in the box as a bonus? They don't come with lightning cables so they're worth about five cents to me, but I thought it was interesting.

:psyduck: You can't even order these things on the website, are they just offloading their junk?
Doh, I didn't see that. Still, it's weird that I got them, especially since at $20 they're not exactly throw-away items.

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



jackpot posted:

I'm following the instructions here to use an imac as a display for my macbook pro. But the only way it seems to work is with my macbook as the primary display (dock, desktop items, etc) and the imac as secondary - if I close the macbook (like I would with my usual external monitor) it simply goes to sleep, it doesn't know to keep the external display on. I don't want to juggle two screens, I just want one big one - can't I do this?

Are you trying to do clamshell mode without a power adapter plugged in? Because if so, that's why.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005

mediaphage posted:

Haha, I'm gonna pick up a new MacBook this summer because I want to drive my 4K display at 60Hz over DP (my 2012 rMBP only does 30Hz over DP); I'm hoping that I'll be able to pick up a Thunderbolt dock for an e-GPU and game that way (even better would be the ability to run a Vive/Rift through it). I get that this is pie-in-the-sky, I just hate rebooting when I have my laptop docked and closed.
What you're asking for is VT-d (virtual something something direct access) support but OS X doesn't have it, for anyone else curious it basically passes the hardware through straight to the VM, rather than using some virtual video card layer or whatever. In theory it's possible...but you'd need to use something else as the bare metal OS that does support VT-d, like people have done similar stuff with OS X and Windows both running as VMs on top of some thin virtualization layer/OS. Course hell if I know if that stuff would work with Thunderbolt, but it might just cause it's basically another PCIe device I guess.

But otherwise you can just hope the current virtual card stuff (which is still hardware accelerated) is ok enough.

jackpot
Aug 31, 2004

First cousin to the Black Rabbit himself. Such was Woundwort's monument...and perhaps it would not have displeased him.<

flosofl posted:

Are you trying to do clamshell mode without a power adapter plugged in? Because if so, that's why.
Yep, that's it. Awesome , thanks.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Pivo posted:

If you really want to run a VM and give it access to an external GPU, I think you should email customer support of the VM product you end up purchasing to see if they support that ... You have to understand, this is all very new technology, like the people at CES demonstrating external GPU docks on PCs were having lots of issues, so doing that on a Mac, in a VM, I couldn't even guess for a second how that would work, I'm not even sure anyone's really tried it and written something up about it. I heard on OS X trying to hot-plug a GPU on Thunderbolt causes kernel panics, and Windows typically isn't so kind to that either.

You're basically on your own. But if you've got the dough you may as well try. Enthusiast forums will be ill-equipped to help you... Apple won't care to help you one bit...

Yes yes I'm very aware I'm on my own. Everything demoed at CES has issues; it's the same way very year.

I was mostly just curious to know if someone had done it. I'll probably just boot camp with the e-GPU (which you can do even now) once a reasonable tbolt (that autocorrected to treasonable revolt) dock comes out.

japtor posted:

What you're asking for is VT-d (virtual something something direct access) support but OS X doesn't have it, for anyone else curious it basically passes the hardware through straight to the VM, rather than using some virtual video card layer or whatever. In theory it's possible...but you'd need to use something else as the bare metal OS that does support VT-d, like people have done similar stuff with OS X and Windows both running as VMs on top of some thin virtualization layer/OS. Course hell if I know if that stuff would work with Thunderbolt, but it might just cause it's basically another PCIe device I guess.

But otherwise you can just hope the current virtual card stuff (which is still hardware accelerated) is ok enough.

Cheers thanks. VMs are not my bailiwick so my understanding is limited. I suppose I could run Linux, which has had proof of concepts done, but I'll probably end up just rebooting when I wish to play. Thanks again.

mediaphage fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Apr 30, 2016

krooj
Dec 2, 2006
I'm so loving confused by this performance delta... 2016 M7 and 2015 1.3 sitting in front of me... 2015 compiles the same maven project faster, geekbenches higher on single core (highly suspect with Core-M SoCs), yet the 2016 feels significantly faster in use. It doesn't bog as hard with IJ running alongside other heavy processes like Chrome. MacBook performance... WTF?

japtor
Oct 28, 2005

mediaphage posted:

Cheers thanks. VMs are not my bailiwick so my understanding is limited. I suppose I could run Linux, which has had proof of concepts done, but I'll probably end up just rebooting when I wish to play. Thanks again.
Yeah the easiest thing to do would just be boot camp for best performance (if a VM isn't good enough), or buy/build a PC separately for gaming.

Or build a multi gamer PC rig if you really want to mess with VM possibilities :pcgaming:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuJYMCbIbPk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXOaCkbt4lI

Kinda curious if it'd be possible with the Mac Pro setup, but probably not cause only one GPU is connected to the video outputs afaik. Then again some trick might be possible with frame buffer pass through or something.

krooj posted:

I'm so loving confused by this performance delta... 2016 M7 and 2015 1.3 sitting in front of me... 2015 compiles the same maven project faster, geekbenches higher on single core (highly suspect with Core-M SoCs), yet the 2016 feels significantly faster in use. It doesn't bog as hard with IJ running alongside other heavy processes like Chrome. MacBook performance... WTF?
There's some new magic faster speed switching in Skylake (if the OS supports it) and the faster IGP which might explain it feeling faster, but hell if I know why it'd end up slower in your tests if it's not just some background process screwing things up. Higher TDP configuration throttling sooner or IGP taking up some more of the thermal headroom?

krooj
Dec 2, 2006

japtor posted:

There's some new magic faster speed switching in Skylake (if the OS supports it) and the faster IGP which might explain it feeling faster, but hell if I know why it'd end up slower in your tests if it's not just some background process screwing things up. Higher TDP configuration throttling sooner or IGP taking up some more of the thermal headroom?

Maybe? Machine feels warmer to the touch than the older one, and yeah, I was aware of the greater number of p-states and the hardware switching available in Skylake.

It's worth re-iterating: the 2016 M7 feels significantly snappier than it's predecessor. Scrolling in Google Music, multi-tasking with IDEs, etc... Oracle SQL Developer is much more responsive :smithicide:

krooj fucked around with this message at 03:16 on Apr 30, 2016

Butt Savage
Aug 23, 2007
I gotta admit, seeing the rMB's in the wild really shows how sexy and portable they are. I'm not gonna upgrade from my 2013 rMBP for like another two years, but I imagine by then the MacBooks are gonna be like today's Airs and I might end up grabbing one of those instead.

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade


japtor posted:

There's some new magic faster speed switching in Skylake (if the OS supports it) and the faster IGP which might explain it feeling faster, but hell if I know why it'd end up slower in your tests if it's not just some background process screwing things up. Higher TDP configuration throttling sooner or IGP taking up some more of the thermal headroom?

BareFeats already did a GPU bench-off between the MacBook 2015 and MacBook 2016. They came to pretty much the same conclusion:

BareFeats posted:

The 2016 Retina Macbook with the Intel HD Graphics 515 produces OpenGL performance from 36% to 65% better than the 2015 Retina MacBook's Intel HD Graphics 5300.

As for OpenCL performance, the 2016 was only 8% faster.

isthisonetaken
Sep 9, 2011
College Slice

krooj posted:

I'm so loving confused by this performance delta... 2016 M7 and 2015 1.3 sitting in front of me... 2015 compiles the same maven project faster, geekbenches higher on single core (highly suspect with Core-M SoCs), yet the 2016 feels significantly faster in use. It doesn't bog as hard with IJ running alongside other heavy processes like Chrome. MacBook performance... WTF?

Just a thought but maybe if it's a new machine spotlight is indexing in the background?

GATOS Y VATOS
Aug 22, 2002


Welp, took my 2015 rMBP in and showed the genius the PPT004 error screenshot and he checked the records and noticed that I came in for the same error just a few weeks ago. He was baffled why the other crew didn't just have my battery swapped out at that time. Got my machine back in 3 days with a new battery and partially new body as well (replaced the main body surrounding the keyboard). A++++ would applecare again.

Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


GATOS Y VATOS posted:

partially new body as well (replaced the main body surrounding the keyboard)

Do we still call that the 'top case'? Since other than the display and the bottom panel it's like, the whole machine.

plz apple experts

Shaocaholica
Oct 29, 2002

Fig. 5E
When OS X cost real money, did people actually buy the family pack? The only proof you have the family license anyway is just that sticker on the box right?

edit: whoops, meant to post in the Apple software thread. Whatever.

Shaocaholica fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Apr 30, 2016

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

Shaocaholica posted:

When OS X cost real money, did people actually buy the family pack? The only proof you have the family license anyway is just that sticker on the box right?

Definitely. But plenty of assholes asked, "Uhhh, if there's no key, how would they know if I just bought the single license?"
So you'd just respond, "Well, I suppose they're relying on the honesty and honor of their customers." And maintain awkward judgmental eye contact.

Iirc it was $29 for a single and... $79 for like 5? Not sure.

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



That was after the big price drop though, I'm sure it used to be around $99 for the single, then $29, then free.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull
For a long time the standard single user license price was $129. I think the family pack was $199.

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade


GATOS Y VATOS posted:

Welp, took my 2015 rMBP in and showed the genius the PPT004 error screenshot and he checked the records and noticed that I came in for the same error just a few weeks ago. He was baffled why the other crew didn't just have my battery swapped out at that time. Got my machine back in 3 days with a new battery and partially new body as well (replaced the main body surrounding the keyboard). A++++ would applecare again.

Like I said before, the top case assembly includes the keyboard and battery on that model. You cannot order them separately. See the iFixit take apart if you are wondering why.. the battery is bonded / glued to the top case. This has been the case for every rMBP model from Late 2013 to today.

Yes, it does mean you will never be able to replace *just* the battery on any current rMBP unless some third party gets creative somehow. The flip side is that these sealed batteries are 'self calibrating' and will not really need to be run down to nothing every month or so. I do it anyway and still have 93% capacity on my Late 2013 13-inch rMBP.

It is time consuming to change, maybe the techs on that shift were overwhelmed and hoped the problem would go away by itself.

Probably the same trackpad as before.

ShadeofBlue
Mar 17, 2011

BobHoward posted:

For a long time the standard single user license price was $129. I think the family pack was $199.

Yah, up to and including 10.5 I believe.

binarysmurf
Aug 18, 2012

I smurf, therefore I am.
My 27" Late 2012 iMac has some image retention marks on the bottom left and right of my screen. Do I have to get the entire screen replaced?

I recall someone posted a link a while ago that effectively flashed colours on screen (like a strobe light) and suggested this running this site for 24 hours may help. Can anyone repost that link?

Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


binarysmurf posted:

My 27" Late 2012 iMac has some image retention marks on the bottom left and right of my screen. Do I have to get the entire screen replaced?

I recall someone posted a link a while ago that effectively flashed colours on screen (like a strobe light) and suggested this running this site for 24 hours may help. Can anyone repost that link?

LCDs have image persistence (or retention as you said) sometimes, but you'd really have to try hard to cause it and notice it. You don't need to flash colours, just display white, that lights up all the pixels. Uh, that could be as easy as creating a PNG file the same resolution as your display and displaying it in full-screen mode. No need to bring strange software into this. And 24 hours is excessive, but you sure can try it.

If it persists after 24 hours of plain white, there may be something else going on. Does the persistent part actually resemble some sort of UI element you've had consistently displayed? And I mean CONSISTENTLY like 24/7 for months or years?

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



It could also be screen contamination, that happened to my 2010 iMac and needed replacement.

GATOS Y VATOS
Aug 22, 2002


Binary Badger posted:

Like I said before, the top case assembly includes the keyboard and battery on that model. You cannot order them separately. See the iFixit take apart if you are wondering why.. the battery is bonded / glued to the top case. This has been the case for every rMBP model from Late 2013 to today.

Yes, it does mean you will never be able to replace *just* the battery on any current rMBP unless some third party gets creative somehow. The flip side is that these sealed batteries are 'self calibrating' and will not really need to be run down to nothing every month or so. I do it anyway and still have 93% capacity on my Late 2013 13-inch rMBP.

It is time consuming to change, maybe the techs on that shift were overwhelmed and hoped the problem would go away by itself.

Probably the same trackpad as before.

Wild. What's interesting is that the trackpad looks slightly more translucent than it did before. But you are probably right and my eyes are just being weird because the top case is brand new on it. I dunno. Nonetheless I'm really happy.

Three-Phase
Aug 5, 2006

by zen death robot
One thing I noticed: I have a high-end HP workstation laptop at work, and my personal notebook I got was a 13" rMBP.

The screen on the rMBP is infinitely better than the screen on my HP laptop despite it being much smaller. It's easier to read, it's clearer, and it's like the HP's LCD is all washed-out in comparison. It's hard to describe, on the HP it's like taking a picture and turning down the contrast and color saturation compared to the rMBP.

It also has the best trackpad ever on a laptop, and I hate using trackpads.

It's far from perfect but the MBP is the best laptop I've ever owned. I do get a lot of "omg you spent $1500 on a laptop?" comments.


Is it just me or is this guy just insufferable. As. Hell.

Three-Phase fucked around with this message at 00:39 on May 2, 2016

Otis Reddit
Nov 14, 2006
So I'm trying to install El Capitan to a Mac Mini, but the installer won't recognize any of my drives. I think this is because they are not correctly formatted for OS X, but unfortunately, I don't have access to a running Mac that I can run Disk Utility on. Is there any analogue to this program that I can run on a Windows machine so that I can get this drive detected in the OS X installer?

Thanks loads. :)

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



Otis Reddit posted:

So I'm trying to install El Capitan to a Mac Mini, but the installer won't recognize any of my drives. I think this is because they are not correctly formatted for OS X, but unfortunately, I don't have access to a running Mac that I can run Disk Utility on. Is there any analogue to this program that I can run on a Windows machine so that I can get this drive detected in the OS X installer?

Thanks loads. :)

Why not use the Disk Utility that's baked into the installer?

GutBomb
Jun 15, 2005

Dude?
You can make a bootable usb flash drive of the installer and run disk utility off of it

http://www.macworld.com/article/2981585/operating-systems/how-to-make-a-bootable-os-x-10-11-el-capitan-installer-drive.html

Otis Reddit
Nov 14, 2006

flosofl posted:

Why not use the Disk Utility that's baked into the installer?

Big time newblord here. How do I pull that up?

Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


From the menu up top under Utilities, after you launch the installer.

treiz01
Jan 2, 2008

There is little that makes me happier than taking drugs. Perhaps administering them, designing and carrying out experiments that bend the plane of what we consider reality.
Hey dudes, I picked up a 2015 13" Macbook Pro in February and I am loving it! This is my first Mac though, and I don't have time to skim 700+ pages of this thread so is there a list of the most useful Mac apps out there?

Also, I am ordering an Akitio Thunder2 (second hand, a full eGPU setup minus the GPU) so that I can take my MBP with me to my friends houses instead of my gaming tower! I love how versatile this little laptop is, and it is what I use primarily unless I am specifically gaming.

Otis Reddit
Nov 14, 2006
Thanks all!

tuyop
Sep 15, 2006

Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted

Fun Shoe

treiz01 posted:

Hey dudes, I picked up a 2015 13" Macbook Pro in February and I am loving it! This is my first Mac though, and I don't have time to skim 700+ pages of this thread so is there a list of the most useful Mac apps out there?

Also, I am ordering an Akitio Thunder2 (second hand, a full eGPU setup minus the GPU) so that I can take my MBP with me to my friends houses instead of my gaming tower! I love how versatile this little laptop is, and it is what I use primarily unless I am specifically gaming.

*boots laptop, hard shuts down, boots gpu, turns on laptop and boots to Windows, BSOD, turn it all off, sacrifices a chicken...*

"This is so versatile I swear guys just wait up for me I'll be there for gtav soon!"

*miscounts psu warmup time, spots smoke, plugs power into a "cleaner" outlet, shits pants, boots into Windows, gpu not recognized..."

"Oh nevermind."

Buys a PS4.

Weedle
May 31, 2006




Three-Phase posted:

One thing I noticed: I have a high-end HP workstation laptop at work, and my personal notebook I got was a 13" rMBP.

The screen on the rMBP is infinitely better than the screen on my HP laptop despite it being much smaller. It's easier to read, it's clearer, and it's like the HP's LCD is all washed-out in comparison. It's hard to describe, on the HP it's like taking a picture and turning down the contrast and color saturation compared to the rMBP.

It also has the best trackpad ever on a laptop, and I hate using trackpads.

It's far from perfect but the MBP is the best laptop I've ever owned. I do get a lot of "omg you spent $1500 on a laptop?" comments.

Welcome to Mac ownership. Everything is just a little bit better :smug:

enojy
Sep 11, 2001

bass rattle
stars out
the sky

treiz01 posted:

Hey dudes, I picked up a 2015 13" Macbook Pro in February and I am loving it! This is my first Mac though, and I don't have time to skim 700+ pages of this thread so is there a list of the most useful Mac apps out there?

Also, I am ordering an Akitio Thunder2 (second hand, a full eGPU setup minus the GPU) so that I can take my MBP with me to my friends houses instead of my gaming tower! I love how versatile this little laptop is, and it is what I use primarily unless I am specifically gaming.

http://macapps.link

It's a cool repository of a lot of popular free and paid applications with brief descriptions of each. You can batch install them (really handy on a fresh OS X install) and I believe they all install via the curl command in terminal, directly from the creator(s) of the application(s) so it's pretty safe. I feel like 95% of whatever people here would recommend is probably on this site. If Cheatsheet isn't on there, feel free to grab that (holding Cmd toggles a pop-up that shows you any application's keyboard shortcuts, useful for learning many of OS X's alternatives to any Windows shortcuts you may be accustomed to.)

stevewm
May 10, 2005

Three-Phase posted:

......It also has the best trackpad ever on a laptop, and I hate using trackpads. .......



I have never understood why so many laptop manufacturers get the trackpad wrong. Many PC laptops have horrid tiny trackpads with awful textures like rubbery type material, or the entire trackpad wobbles around (Lenovo I am looking at you...). And pretty much universally bad tracking.

Oddly enough the best trackpad I've used outside of my rMBP, was a $200 Acer Chromebook a friend recently bought. Felt like glass, nice smooth texture, and excellent tracking.

Shaocaholica
Oct 29, 2002

Fig. 5E
I could deal with PC trackpads up until Apple removed the physical button and then all the consumer PC laptop makers thought they could copy that only with cheap rear end parts and drivers. Even most high end PC laptop buttonless trackpads suck rear end.

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Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



Shaocaholica posted:

I could deal with PC trackpads up until Apple removed the physical button and then all the consumer PC laptop makers thought they could copy that only with cheap rear end parts and drivers. Even most high end PC laptop buttonless trackpads suck rear end.

The only one that even comes close is the Logitech T650 and even that is half-assed on the diver side. Plus it still doesn't solve the laptop issue for PCs since it's for desktop use like the Magic Trackpad.

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