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We can't negotiate with ISIS because they're fascists to the core, the point of their existence is violence.
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Aug 17, 2016 12:54
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I didn't see the debate, but this made me cackle like a maniac: quote:He says he is a feminist, but does not cry often. He is asked to look at a photo of Ant and Dec, but he does not know who they are. “I apologise humbly to Ant and Dec,” he says.
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Aug 17, 2016 12:54
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Breath Ray posted:I think we can and should negotiate with Isis. Negotiating is when two groups don't share aims and seek a compromise. Good idea. Off you go, let us know how you're getting on. ISIS will be more than willing to help in that, they'll even make a video.
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Aug 17, 2016 12:56
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Why is looking at pictures of Ant and Dec part of a political debate?
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Aug 17, 2016 12:57
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Baron Corbyn posted:Why is looking at pictures of Ant and Dec part of a political debate? I suppose it's one of those horrid "would you have a pint with candidate X" type questions.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:00
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Praseodymi posted:Owen Smith trying to steal Corbyn's "Get everyone round the table" stuff... He really is bloody useless, that the best two candidates the PLP could find to challenge Corbyn were Smith and Eagle speaks volumes as to why they're losing control of the party.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:01
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"These airstrikes are wrong, at a time when negotiations are still going. The coalition forces have acted in a reckless and provocative manner. Both sides need to get around the table, drop the rhetoric, and come to an agreement." -owed smithiband
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Aug 17, 2016 13:00
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Junior G-man posted:I didn't see the debate, but this made me cackle like a maniac: 'A feminist, but does not cry often'? Add another one to the ever-increasing stack of peculiar comments from Owen Smith about women, I guess.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:03
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Breath Ray posted:I think we can and should negotiate with Isis. Negotiating is when two groups don't share aims and seek a compromise. Maybe if we asked nicely they would make the yazidi women just normal slaves instead of sex slaves.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:04
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https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/765883142624382976
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Aug 17, 2016 13:10
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Unless this means "I think May is doing a fine job of killing the poor" these "Labour Supporters" can gently caress right off.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:12
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You can be dissatisfied without thinking any of the alternatives are better. Theresa May also has the benefit of the entire press pushing each other out the way to tongue her arse.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:17
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UKIP's leader in Wales has resigned the UKIP whip in the Assembly. 
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Aug 17, 2016 13:23
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Praseodymi posted:We can't negotiate with ISIS because they're fascists to the core, the point of their existence is violence. That's loser talk. We've negotiated with all sorts of unsavoury types before with great results. Just look at Iran and Sinn Fein brought into the international community. One of Isis's greatest PR things is they're different to anyone who's come before but they aren't.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:27
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Praseodymi posted:Unless this means "I think May is doing a fine job of killing the poor" these "Labour Supporters" can gently caress right off. It doesn't say who do you like best, it's asking if they're doing their job well. Theresa May is doing a decent job of being the Tory leader and not being David Cameron, and keeping her head down apparently
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Aug 17, 2016 13:29
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Theresa May also has the bonus in the current post-Brexit xenophobia that she/Home Office unlawfully deported thousands of foreign students. UKIP would be proud.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:31
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Breath Ray posted:That's loser talk. We've negotiated with all sorts of unsavoury types before with great results. Just look at Iran and Sinn Fein brought into the international community. One of Isis's greatest PR things is they're different to anyone who's come before but they aren't. Sinn Fein had a purpose beyond being as reprehensibly evil as humanly possibly.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:34
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Breath Ray posted:That's loser talk. We've negotiated with all sorts of unsavoury types before with great results. Just look at Iran and Sinn Fein brought into the international community. One of Isis's greatest PR things is they're different to anyone who's come before but they aren't. Not too sure about Iran but I'm pretty sure neither of them are fascists, you just don't like them.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:34
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Breath Ray posted:That's loser talk. We've negotiated with all sorts of unsavoury types before with great results. Just look at Iran and Sinn Fein brought into the international community. One of Isis's greatest PR things is they're different to anyone who's come before but they aren't. They arent new. Theyre just the biggest of their kind. But comparing them to Iran and sinn fein. Uh No Rigged Death Trap fucked around with this message at 13:38 on Aug 17, 2016 |
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Aug 17, 2016 13:35
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Junkozeyne posted:That's conflating two different issues though. Most countries agree that anything physical that you have can be warranted even if it would incriminate you. A key to a safe, a device like an RSA token or even your fingerprint to unlock a biometrical locked device are things that you have and you have to cooperate with the courts. The other issue is whether content of your mind can be warranted for possible self-incrimination. It's a contested issue if you have to actively remember stuff like a password and I would argue that if that isn't self-incrimination then you pretty much gut the whole concept of it. If the police wants to access the contents of locked physical devices they are welcome to try to overcome the encryption but expecting your cooperation is worrying. But that was a legal question settled within months of the first combination lock being sold. If the way into a warranted premises is only in someone's mind they still have to open it up. RIPA Ch.3 was about codifying the previously common-law offence in a new context to avoid throwing the dice in court, as has tended to be the trend in English law since World War 2. Guavanaut posted:In the case in question what the CACP want amounts to the powers given under RIPA in the UK, that an individual can be compelled on pain of criminal charge to hand over an encryption password, which does not currently exist in Canada. Opponents are saying that it amounts to self-incrimination, and therefore should not be allowed. That's similar to what Liberty said in the UK, but they were going against far more powerful forces than a police chiefs' lobby and during a period of mass moral panic, so it fell on deaf ears. That's the bit that I'm hoping falls flat on its rear end. I don't know enough about Canadian law to comment on the exact circumstances, but I strongly suspect requiring full judicial review (or anything other than a rubberstamp with review at trial) of disclosure will last about ten seconds when they realise just how large a task that is. When simple traffic offences can require dozens of disclosure notices (checking phone records to see if a device was in use can take 5 or 10 requests on it's own) then unless you're going to employ hundreds of new judges it'll fall to pieces immediately. The vast, vast majority of RIPA Ch.2 disclosures are this sort of very simple thing. The IP Bill does address some of the more contentious edge cases around using that data in ways that represent a more severe infringement on civil rights, and I'll be very surprised if the Canadians don't settle on to that sort of system (or perhaps the one in most of the USA where it's handled as an administrative subpoena - effectively the same thing but with even less oversight). And Canada forcing us to drop RIPA as part of a trade deal (which just isn't going to happen, but let's play along for the sake of the argument) wouldn't be setting a precedent by any sane interpretation of the words or the concept.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:38
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Praseodymi posted:Not too sure about Iran but I'm pretty sure neither of them are fascists, you just don't like them. I didn't say they were. I just said they were unsavoury. Basically I don't believe in Isis exceptionalism. Again, the point of negotiation is to explore the possibility of peaceful coexistence.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:43
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Breath Ray posted:I didn't say they were. I just said they were unsavoury. Basically I don't believe in Isis exceptionalism. Again, the point of negotiation is to explore the possibility of peaceful coexistence. You're dumb.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:45
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This is great lmao
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Aug 17, 2016 13:46
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Praseodymi posted:Unless this means "I think May is doing a fine job of killing the poor" these "Labour Supporters" can gently caress right off. You want 50% of current labour supporters to gently caress off?
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Aug 17, 2016 13:51
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37104864 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/17/owen-smith-suggests-islamic-state-should-be-involved-in-syrian-p/ http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/aug/17/isis-should-get-round-the-table-with-uk-middle-east-says-owen-smith-labour youch he's definitely going to walk it back as soon as an advisor can pass him a note
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Aug 17, 2016 13:54
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mediadave posted:You want 50% of current labour supporters to gently caress off? Makes a change from McTernan wanting 90% to.
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Aug 17, 2016 13:57
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goddamnedtwisto posted:And Canada forcing us to drop RIPA as part of a trade deal (which just isn't going to happen, but let's play along for the sake of the argument) wouldn't be setting a precedent by any sane interpretation of the words or the concept. If won, it is at the very least an encouraging sign of pushback against self-incrimination based on thought, which will hopefully spread.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:00
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ronya posted:he's definitely going to walk it back as soon as an advisor can pass him a note https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcrPoIyTf-c
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Aug 17, 2016 14:03
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Gonzo McFee posted:You're dumb. I'd like to know what you disagree with and why otherwise push off
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Aug 17, 2016 14:13
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tooterfish posted:He doesn't need a note, he needs this. I dunno about you but I'd far rather Owen Smith not get a competent press officer.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:13
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As abysmal as these are for labour its not totally surprising. In here job as PM May has blocked chinese spies from melting down power plants and hosed of on holiday, there really isn't much yet (that can't be pawned of as a continuation of the last government) to actually be dissatisfied with. Even as someone who despises May from her time at the Home Office if someone rang me up and asked me I wouldn't really say I was dissatisfied with what has happened so far perhaps because I'm dreading whats still to come 
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Aug 17, 2016 14:17
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ronya posted:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37104864 We don't know. We would all hope that it happens quickly, we would all hope they stop being a murderous terrorist organisation and try and bring about peace EDIT: wait wtf "Owen's experience of helping to bring about peace in Northern Ireland is that eventually all parties who truly believe in delivering peace have to be around the table." What did Owen Smith have to do with the Northern Ireland peace process lmao. Wasn't he still working for Pfizer back then? GEORGE W BUSHI fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Aug 17, 2016 |
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Aug 17, 2016 14:19
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thespaceinvader posted:I dunno about you but I'd far rather Owen Smith not get a competent press officer. The thick oval office needs a talking to, not a note.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:23
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He SPADed for the northern ireland secretary before that, 2002-2005 ie largely overseeing decommissioning and not letting it run off the rails. the hard work had already been done - inasmuch as he played a role, he didn't screw it up though
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Aug 17, 2016 14:25
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Breath Ray posted:I'd like to know what you disagree with and why otherwise push off I disagree with your continued posting.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:27
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vodkat posted:As abysmal as these are for labour its not totally surprising. In here job as PM May has blocked chinese spies from melting down power plants and hosed of on holiday, there really isn't much yet (that can't be pawned of as a continuation of the last government) to actually be dissatisfied with. Similarly, I'm not too terribly pissed off with her except for one glaring omission that she didn't replace Hunt. I'm sure there are things that are going on backstage which will piss me right off when they become public knowledge, but mostly right now things have been pretty quiet. I mean, if I was polled I'd probably say I was dissatisfied on principle, so tooterfish posted:I'm just a bit angry that he'd just hand the Tory press that on a plate. Some are already ignoring Corbyn's comments and spinning it as "Labour would negotiate with ISIS!!!11!" He, like the rest of his PLP rebel comrades, needs to do his job or dehumanise himself and face to deselection.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:28
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Gonzo McFee posted:I disagree with your continued posting. Put ppl you dont like on ignore instead of whining Baron Corbyn posted:We don't know. We would all hope that it happens quickly, we would all hope they stop being a murderous terrorist organisation and try and bring about peace Wow great minds eh!
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Aug 17, 2016 14:50
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Breath Ray posted:I think we can and should negotiate with Isis. Negotiating is when two groups don't share aims and seek a compromise. Negotiating with ISIS would make heads roll. Literally. mediadave posted:You want 50% of current labour supporters to gently caress off? 50% of labour supporters are loving morons so yes, I would like them to gently caress off into the sea.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:53
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The big disaster out of the debate this morning isn't Owen Smith's appeasement towards ISIS. Nope, it's Jeremy Corbyn's ignorance of Ant & Dec. Is it just me or is the idea that you have to have staffers to brief you on pop culture so you can pretend to be normal not really cynical, unpleasant & disingenuous? Just reminds me of The Thick of It where Hugh is forced to watch bits of Eastenders.
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Aug 17, 2016 14:58
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Unless they are taking part in a quizshow I do not care if MPs can identify celebrities and it does not affect my voting decisions.
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Aug 17, 2016 15:04
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