Strong Sauce posted:

Nah Maro said on his blog that they would never reprint it regardless of backs. Obviously corporate has decided that's not the case.

Captain Invictus posted:

Simply Simon posted:

I played against this deck twice, once even with the Micromancer combo, they made big turns (two in a row even!), played a bunch of Lotuses and Moxen, then eventually I did get a turn and my lovely zombie deck ate their face. I think they forgot to put in a wincon, unless it's "lol I ancestral recall into time warp", which is p win tbf

Leperflesh posted:

This is a good post about Commander.

Let's stop having another rehash of "commander: bad? or not bad?" in the thread, thanks. It's been done to death, and there's also a separate Commander thread.

If only.

Guys I'm kind of sick and have been busy with family stuff and my sick cat so I'm sorry this thread got ignored for like three days. Please don't use a gap in the attention of mods as an opportunity to be assholes to each other.

Gynovore posted:

Uhhh yeah I do not want to topdeck a Mox Emerald on Turn 8.

Captain Invictus posted:

yep that's the problem jim found, it's kinda difficult to actually win with it. You can blink the poo poo out of the little jerk and fill your deck with 8 copies of the power nine which is pretty funny, but then you have to do something with it.

Gynovore posted:

Uhhh yeah I do not want to topdeck a Mox Emerald on Turn 8.

LGD posted:

upkeep isn't a particularly interesting mechanic inherently, though "ongoing costs for above rate [thing]" is certainly workable design space, its just that most upkeep stuff wasn't particularly good/above rate (otoh cards with ongoing disadvantages that were above rate did see extensive play: i.e. Ernham, Juzam, Serendib)

cumulative upkeep definitely has a lot more going for it as a mechanic since the timing component makes it inherently interesting and scaling stuff (or not) is easy and has a bunch of mechanical space to work with (plus stuff like Psychic Vortex where the "upkeep" is an advantage) - but by default it's also harsh enough that the payoff needs to be really good to make it worth playing (Mystic Remora is a pretty good example of most of these aspects)

echo and fading/vanishing cover a lot of the same space respectively and imo generally do it better

Gynovore posted:

Uhhh yeah I do not want to topdeck a Mox Emerald on Turn 8.

Time posted:

I’m playing murktide online right now - match 5 with a trophy on the line. My opponent is on burn and it’s game three. I have telegraphed I’m holding up counterspell with lethal on board, opponent is hellbent. I pass the turn and see in chat

“Get wrecked”

Hits me with exquisite firecraft. Lmfao

Captain Invictus posted:

yep that's the problem jim found, it's kinda difficult to actually win with it. You can blink the poo poo out of the little jerk and fill your deck with 8 copies of the power nine which is pretty funny, but then you have to do something with it.

Time posted:

I’m playing murktide online right now - match 5 with a trophy on the line. My opponent is on burn and it’s game three. I have telegraphed I’m holding up counterspell with lethal on board, opponent is hellbent. I pass the turn and see in chat

“Get wrecked”

Hits me with exquisite firecraft. Lmfao

Khanstant posted:

Mystic Remora was the one that got me thinking about the mechanic, albeit I misunderstood it initially. Most of the other ones I've seen randomly were not good enough to use even without upkeep. I do like the idea of cumulative cost and tax on certain things, could even be a kind of balance check to early advantages from steamrolling. Mythic Rares kinda seem to be lacking a balance or tradeoff for it's optionally increased power per mana, dunno how upkeep/tax might play into that.

Echo and such are good spins on the same idea and I haven't played with em much yet, I think I will keep that in mind for a deck theme eventually.

MasterBuilder posted:

Do people not play song of creation in that deck?

mcmagic posted:

lol thanks LR!

Gynovore posted:

Uhhh yeah I do not want to topdeck a Mox Emerald on Turn 8.

Entropic posted:

lmao I remembered that they got some sort of crypto sponsor around the time I stopped listening to them, but I forgot it was FTX specifically. Has Marshall posted any kind of mea culpa for promoting them yet?

Entropic posted:

lmao I remembered that they got some sort of crypto sponsor around the time I stopped listening to them, but I forgot it was FTX specifically. Has Marshall posted any kind of mea culpa for promoting them yet?

A big flaming stink posted:

with this version you do!




this was mostly stolen from crokeyz with a bit of tweaking the numbers. i added the paradox engine because it makes going off so much easier, especially if you're too low on life for bolas' citadel

Leperflesh posted:

People who received money to advertise for a product or company have zero liability when that company implodes or has committed fraud etc. and it'd be completely absurd to do anything else.

Leperflesh posted:

People who received money to advertise for a product or company have zero liability when that company implodes or has committed fraud etc. and it'd be completely absurd to do anything else.

A big flaming stink posted:

with this version you do!




this was mostly stolen from crokeyz with a bit of tweaking the numbers. i added the paradox engine because it makes going off so much easier, especially if you're too low on life for bolas' citadel

A big flaming stink posted:

with this version you do!

this was mostly stolen from crokeyz with a bit of tweaking the numbers. i added the paradox engine because it makes going off so much easier, especially if you're too low on life for bolas' citadel

LGD posted:

oh yeah, nearly all of those original cumulative upkeep cards were horrendous/unusable and nearly instantly recognized as such in their original context

Silhouette posted:

Counterpoint: Delusions of Grandeur + Donate

Silhouette posted:

Counterpoint: Delusions of Grandeur + Donate

Pablo Nergigante posted:

New stuff from the upcoming Explorer Anthology 2 on Arena

evilweasel posted:

people who advertised FTX have literally already been sued

i am not saying the lawsuits will succeed but i am saying it is a good idea when there are a bunch of lawyers with very sympathetic plaintiffs to, uh, be very careful about what you say because defending against lawsuits costs money even if you win

mcmagic posted:

they don't have legal liability but they do have liability to me calling them shitheads, laughing at them and thinking worse of them.

Leperflesh posted:

are they going to sue steph curry and larry david?

LGD posted:

oh yeah, nearly all of those original cumulative upkeep cards were horrendous/unusable and nearly instantly recognized as such in their original context

the entire low-powered time period of The Dark->Homelands was pretty wretched and any given set only really contributed a tiny handful of standout cards to tournament decks, which otherwise leaned heavily on core/earlier sets

Ice Age was better than the other sets in that time period, but was still low powered and didn't really buck that pattern, since its profound/defining impact on early M:tG came through Necropotence, with most other cards being roleplayers (Demonic Consultation, Incinerate, Icequake, etc.)

the jump in card quality from Mirage on was extremely noticeable and heartening (Alliances actually had a ton of powerful/impactful cards but the overall feel and design was uneven/weird/transitional)

Khanstant posted:

That's wild, had no idea. I kinda assumed these old sets I browsed full of just lovely cards were actually full of little gems that had their time to shine only back in the very early metagames and formats. Seems the reality was for a long time they kinda printed crap without too much of an idea what would be played with much of it and the road to sets being something fun in limited environments was a longer road than just alpha/beta. This somehow doesn't make me want to draft a crusty ancient set any less, especially if it wasn't designed for that environment.

I opened some Strixhaven packs last night and I wasn't around to play it, but going through the packs without knowing anything from the set, I still kept finding familiar cards. A card that's just Epic Confrontation with diff costs and art, same for Broken Wings. Which with a few more drafts under my belt makes sense, keeps a green deck feeling like a green deck across drafts. but it also kinda made these mysterious new-to-me strixhaven cards feel less exciting in a way since I'm starting to be able to expect/predict certain things in each set (and i assume this will also translate to me being able to appreciate the unqiue cards and little things that make a draft environment different than others).

In any case, will probably always have an underlying desire for some weird limited environment where these super lovely old cards are actually things you consider putting in deck on purpose. I guess what I'm really describing is a cube made up of exclusively terrible cards, such that less-terrible ones become bombs through merely approaching just-mostly-unplayable.

Khanstant posted:

That's wild, had no idea. I kinda assumed these old sets I browsed full of just lovely cards were actually full of little gems that had their time to shine only back in the very early metagames and formats. Seems the reality was for a long time they kinda printed crap without too much of an idea what would be played with much of it and the road to sets being something fun in limited environments was a longer road than just alpha/beta. This somehow doesn't make me want to draft a crusty ancient set any less, especially if it wasn't designed for that environment.

I opened some Strixhaven packs last night and I wasn't around to play it, but going through the packs without knowing anything from the set, I still kept finding familiar cards. A card that's just Epic Confrontation with diff costs and art, same for Broken Wings. Which with a few more drafts under my belt makes sense, keeps a green deck feeling like a green deck across drafts. but it also kinda made these mysterious new-to-me strixhaven cards feel less exciting in a way since I'm starting to be able to expect/predict certain things in each set (and i assume this will also translate to me being able to appreciate the unqiue cards and little things that make a draft environment different than others).

In any case, will probably always have an underlying desire for some weird limited environment where these super lovely old cards are actually things you consider putting in deck on purpose. I guess what I'm really describing is a cube made up of exclusively terrible cards, such that less-terrible ones become bombs through merely approaching just-mostly-unplayable.