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not a complex setup and somehow we have an invincible town vanilla come onnnn
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Mar 14, 2024 20:46
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 02:51 |
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Killing opop and, if they are VT, dans nets is a scum kill with near 100% certainty before we fall victim to a failed lylo
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Mar 14, 2024 20:48
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Tired Moritz posted:not a complex setup and somehow we have a Fake day action role
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Mar 14, 2024 20:49
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if you don't mind I'm going to summarize all my stuff in one place 1. I am definitely a gunsmith. This is basically verified at this point. 2. I have a 'no kill' result on opop. Which means: 3. if opop is scum, then I must also be, and this is an elaborate scum gambit. but 4. My investigations have been entirely consistent with my play this game, and are not consistent with the logical course of action a scum gunsmith would take. The 'its scummy to claim an investigation on a person the scum nightkilled' idea is predicated on the claimer not actually being a gunsmith. In order to justify this, then it would have to have been specifically me performing the nightkill, instead of using my investigative action. This is an extremely specific scenario. So, in order for opop to be scum, I must be scum. In order for me to be scum, I must be a scum gunsmith. In order for me to be a scum gunsmith, I must have deliberately chosen to forego obtaining a solid alibi night one. Here's the other possibility, which requires no elaborate and specific chain of necessities: the uncleared people are the scum.
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Mar 14, 2024 20:50
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Maybe I'm the idiot here but I can't think of anything that would make any sense for Dans here. Either it's a faulty vig, or some other person saved me, I just don't buy anything else
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Mar 14, 2024 20:50
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As I said, I would personally choose FoS as the person to go for first. See my earlier posts: I believe he is attempting to encourage moritz's line of thinking in order to secure a mis-elimination. He did this quite a lot yesterday, and he's continuing it today. I do not think moritz is scum. grandicap i also think is less likely to be town. So maerlyn, cube, and keats are the other people I would consider for an elimination today, but I'm pretty happy with FoS.
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Mar 14, 2024 20:52
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Caveat: opop could be a godfather. but given we still don't know what's going on with the failed kills, i consider this very unlikely. so I am inclined to treat my investigation on him as having high veracity.
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Mar 14, 2024 20:53
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sharkmafia posted:As I said, I would personally choose FoS as the person to go for first. See my earlier posts: I believe he is attempting to encourage moritz's line of thinking in order to secure a mis-elimination. He did this quite a lot yesterday, and he's continuing it today. grandicap: less likely to be scum*
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Mar 14, 2024 20:53
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theres a very obvious possibility that opop is a redirector which was also something we were floating around yesterday in regards with rwc's killRhymes With Clue posted:Well I think Opop is scum but I guess 3P is possible. I considered targeting Opop, Maer, and FOS, and I would never have gone for Yuming, Dans, or probably Cube and Shark. Rhymes With Clue posted:Oh, my message said my kill attempt succeeded. But I did not target Yuming and if my kill worked, what happened to the scum NK? Rhymes With Clue posted:My claim, and everything I've said the whole game, is 100% true.
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Mar 14, 2024 20:54
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why did we swerve to fancy again
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Mar 14, 2024 20:56
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Shark is just arguing their same wifom nonsense circularly so I'm going to stop humoring it. One of Opop or Dans is lying and therefore scum or tow sabotaging itself for no reason. We must eliminate scum today or tomorrow or we lose. Killing opop is our ticket to ensuring this happens.
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Mar 14, 2024 20:57
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Tired Moritz posted:theres a very obvious possibility that opop is a redirector which was also something we were floating around yesterday in regards with rwc's kill So who did I redirect the vig to?
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Mar 14, 2024 21:02
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WE DONT KNOW IF ITS A VIG
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Mar 14, 2024 21:02
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Ah, ok, so it's not a vig, but I redirected it to someone and that's why I didn't die, of course
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Mar 14, 2024 21:12
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fool of sound posted:Shark is just arguing their same wifom nonsense circularly so I'm going to stop humoring it. no, it's killing you. but feel free to explain the way in which my chain of logic doesn't make sense instead of attempting to handwave it with a catchphrase. for everyone else: the essential question is this. Which is more likely? that all of those things are true, or that the people with nothing clearing them- some combination of fos, maerlyn, keats, and cube, most likely, but especially fos- are the scum? mafia is all about judgement of probabilities, and what is most plausible. i would hope that the town is cognizant enough of this fact to not believe that invoking a term is an actual counterargument.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:13
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we can kill opop if that means tired moritz will stop whining about it but the fact that y'all are clinging to this idea that I'm not what I say I am despite various evidence to the contrary is stupid
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Mar 14, 2024 21:19
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sharkmafia posted:mafia is all about judgement of probabilities Yup and it is 100% certain that we will hit scum between opop and dans thanks for your support.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:20
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What is you theory of day 1 that involved both dans and opop being town? Anyone, please.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:21
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fool of sound posted:What is you theory of day 1 that involved both dans and opop being town? Anyone, please. my theory: Dans Macabre posted:Thinking about this... I can see a town or a scum opop lying about not knowing how he survived my attempt. Could be to cast doubt on whether future exec or nk attempts would succeed. I still am leaning towards likely town.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:25
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Opopanax posted:Ah, ok, so it's not a vig, but I redirected it to someone and that's why I didn't die, of course the thing that you could redirect was the rwc kill. i have no idea what is going on with dans and you should feel the same instead of just zoning out and ignoring that dan has a mystery day action where nothing happened.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:25
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sharkmafia posted:there are basically four possibilities, now that i think about it: You specifically though shark. This is from day 2, when you were defending opop. What shenanigans do you think could happen on day 1 of this game that the OP says is simple?
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Mar 14, 2024 21:28
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Dans Macabre posted:my theory: If opop is town and STILL lying about bulletproof then they are sabotaging their own win condition for no reason. I don't buy it.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:28
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I think this is everything claimed so far, plus or minus the past page or so of posts.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:29
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We should not kill opop. as long as I'm reiterating things, let me reiterate my argument on fool of scum. Grandicap made a very good point when he noted that the scum did not think that rhymes with clue would flip scum. It therefore makes sense for them to take advantage of this. The obvious way to do this is to set up a misquorum on opop or myself, using the rhymes misquorum as justification. Getting both of those done would put them extremely close to winning. As I've said, I believe that moritz is genuine. He's putting too much conviction and emotion into his posts for it to be an act, and anyway, his play this game matches a pattern i've seen from him before, when he was town. So I don't believe moritz is actually doing this. Fool of sound, however.... fool of sound posted:My theory is still that Opop is just bulletproof scum in a game with a vig, and that goes triple if RwC is actually a second vig. fool of sound posted:Oh cool love when people claim to have investigated someone who died the same night so there's no breadcrumbing or posting behavior that could verify it. And you could have checked to make sure that it WAS a vig since, you know, it failed? fool of sound posted:Bullshit. It would change your posting behavior. You would be able to point to posts where you were asserting that you wouldn't vote for them, defensing them, leaving them out of your sus lists, ect. There's a reason scum like to claim that they targeted dead people, even beyond running the risk of being counterclaimed. fool of sound posted:Shark why wouldn't you check Opop, given that's the big contentious mystery? was absolutely posting like he was setting up a misquorum based on a presumed RwC town flip. I would direct your attention to the second post in particular, which susses me on the assumption that rwc was going to flip town. That's my read: mortiz town, fos second fiddling a town with an incorrect theory to try to make themselves look good and force a mis-elimination. I've already made this point earlier but I wanted to lay it out as clearly as possible. Vote FoS.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:33
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I think I still want to vote Dans today. If it's not Dans, then it's Opop + Shark. If it is Dans, then we get to stop spinning our wheels. TMor seems townie. Maer, Keats, FoS, Grandi are my questionable column. FoS is making a reasonable case on why it COULD be scumShark, and I am glad that the case is being made, but that's not the most straightforward explanation, and it seems like they're pushing too hard. I can buy Shark picking Shwinn N1 every game. If I didn't believe it, I'd sign up for a BnR account and double-check some of those games, but that's a half-step too far for me right now I think.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:34
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Shark continuing to reiterate posts and arguments they already made instead of answering the big question about dans and opop.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:35
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Dans Macabre posted:we can kill opop if that means tired moritz will stop whining about it but the fact that y'all are clinging to this idea that I'm not what I say I am despite various evidence to the contrary is stupid Hell probably start insisting I'm a reverse death Miller instead. Jk he's already said he's going to use it to chain lynch you and then scum win
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Mar 14, 2024 21:36
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I would put a sizable sum of real dollars that Dans is a vig. We have a gunsmith. Town vig is an excellent counter to put in vs a gunsmith. The action was ##throw out. This is an excellent and flavorful action to represent a vig in a kitchen game. In a low power game, this is excellent game design if it is Scum RB Scum Ninja (Optional could be goon) Scum Godfather vs Gunsmiths (Optional could be goon) SK Town Tracker Town Gunsmith Town Vig (Faulty? Maybe just as a miller vs the gunsmith) Town protective role (Maybe) 7x or 8x VT So, everything from my POV comes from Dans being a town vig. It just makes sense. So, Opop could be a scum BP maybe. But why wouldn't a scum BP claim the power. By not claiming it, he has opened himself up to exactly this. It is an alignment neutral claim, by not claiming it he has been on the block or at least a large point of discussion every day. I would put a much smaller amount of real dollars, but still an amount of real dollars that Opop is town here too. The behavior doesn't make sense to lie about the BP. TM, I think you are fixated on this thing that isn't a thing. Scum are going to be happy to rile you up and throw up a smokescreen for everything else.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:37
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fool of sound posted:You specifically though shark. This is from day 2, when you were defending opop. What shenanigans do you think could happen on day 1 of this game that the OP says is simple? I'm sure I don't know. which is why I checked opop last night. What I do know is that opop gave a 'no kill' result. and the 'simple setup' means a godfather role would be unlikely to coexist with whatever the kill resistance is about. I would vote dans over opop if it was between those two choices, but considering that dans's action really really looks like a vig, i'm inclined to not want to kill either of them. If opop is scum, then I have to be. I'm not sure why you're asking me this question as if you think i'm convinceable if you actually think i'm scum. Do you think i'm scum?
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Mar 14, 2024 21:37
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that's not a real question, by the way. You don't, because you're scum.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:39
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fool of sound posted:What is you theory of day 1 that involved both dans and opop being town? Anyone, please. Dans is a town vig (faulty) and is essentially there only as a miller for the gunsmith to get tripped up on.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:39
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CubicalSucrose posted:I think I still want to vote Dans today. What? Putting opop aside for a second, you really don't think it's possible that shark and my role claims are legit?
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Mar 14, 2024 21:39
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sharkmafia posted:If opop is scum, then I have to be. I'm not sure why you're asking me this question as if you think i'm convinceable if you actually think i'm scum. Do you think i'm scum? Lmao yes why would I ask questions of someone I think is scum? That wouldn't be very mafia at all!!!!\ Give me a theory as to what happened day 1 or you are lying.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:39
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Grandicap posted:Dans is a town vig (faulty) and is essentially there only as a miller for the gunsmith to get tripped up on. So a bastard role in a basic mafia game? Bullshit.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:39
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How is any town player so terminally incurious about the how day 1 happened in a simple mafia game? There is no explanation in which both are town, and shark has spent a vast amount of time and effort trying to keep suspicion off of both of opop and dans.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:43
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Grandicap posted:Dans is a town vig (faulty) and is essentially there only as a miller for the gunsmith to get tripped up on. thats crap and if dan's pm said nothing about that, thats hosed up. and if dan's pm does say something about that and dan is acting like this for some reason, thats even more hosed up.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:43
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fool of sound posted:Shark continuing to reiterate posts and arguments they already made instead of answering the big question about dans and opop. No? Ok, SK is a really difficult win condition. Giving scum a gunsmith here really shits on the SK. The only value to having it for scum is SK hunting. If you want to shelter scum from SK shots, give them some sort of protection. But that isn't helpful becuase the SK flipped with a jugg power. Since Shark found the SK, they are a gunsmith. Since giving a gunsmith to scum is bad design vs a SK who's only bonus power is to waste a night action to become unstoppable with a BP add on for taht night, that makes shark town. If shark is town, then Opop has an investigation clearing them. Opop could be godfather vs gunsmith I guess, but it isn't my first loving choice. It isn't my 4th loving choice.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:44
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fool of sound posted:So a bastard role in a basic mafia game? Bullshit. Tired Moritz posted:thats crap and if dan's pm said nothing about that, thats hosed up. and if dan's pm does say something about that and dan is acting like this for some reason, thats even more hosed up. A vig that doesn't work is a bastard role? Wow you have a low bar for mod-bastardry.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:45
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Grandicap posted:A vig that doesn't work is a bastard role? Wow you have a low bar for mod-bastardry. A role PM that lies to the player is bastardry yes.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:46
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 02:51 |
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imagine if youre town at mylo and you used your gun just for it to fail. you dont just give missing info in your role PMs. its not fun.
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Mar 14, 2024 21:46
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