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Beve Stuscemi
Jun 6, 2001




Mixing metric and SAE should be punishable with jail time

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cursedshitbox
May 20, 2012

Your rear-end wont survive my hammering.



Fun Shoe

TotalLossBrain posted:

So now the bike has a 1/4" SS shoulder bolt courtesy of the local farm supply store there instead. I'm going to hell.

Hell will be when it galls and either rounds or snaps off.



Beve Stuscemi posted:

Mixing metric and SAE should be punishable with jail time

Drilled the drz seat bolts up one size between imperial and metric each time the cheese grade threads pulled out. A rack attached to the seat mounting bolts. Pretty sure 3/8-16 was the last size.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

Beve Stuscemi
Jun 6, 2001




:jail:

Shelvocke
Aug 6, 2013

Microwave Engraver

cursedshitbox posted:

Hell will be when it galls and either rounds or snaps off.

Drilled the drz seat bolts up one size between imperial and metric each time the cheese grade threads pulled out. A rack attached to the seat mounting bolts. Pretty sure 3/8-16 was the last size.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

Are you the PO of my xr650r

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Lmao

Phy
Jun 27, 2008



Fun Shoe

Beve Stuscemi posted:

Mixing metric and SAE should be punishable with jail time

My first car was a Ford Probe and iirc this did occasionally happen in the areas of the car that weren't just a Mazda 626

cursedshitbox
May 20, 2012

Your rear-end wont survive my hammering.



Fun Shoe
lololololo

Phy posted:

My first car was a Ford Probe and iirc this did occasionally happen in the areas of the car that weren't just a Mazda 626

80s through 00s domestics were so bad.
GM ime being the worst offender. There's a sub assembly with 8 bolts. 4 imperial, 3 metric. The metric is a very different size. Do not be surprised if there's a dusting of random sizes.

This stupid farm truck of mine is from this era. has an imperial engine. Metric transmission and Transfercase. Front axle is imperial. Rear axle is metric. The chassis is a dusting of both. It's infuriating to work on. It'll have 12 and 15mm alongside 5/8 and such. The dash is rife with 7mm and 5/16 fasteners.

TotalLossBrain
Oct 20, 2010

Hier graben!
I work on extremely expensive wafer fab equipment. I assure you, we use a mix of metric and SAE. :patriot:

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Phy posted:

My first car was a Ford Probe and iirc this did occasionally happen in the areas of the car that weren't just a Mazda 626

The probe wasn't a 626 it was an mx6 :colbert:

cursedshitbox posted:

lololololo

80s through 00s domestics were so bad.
GM ime being the worst offender. There's a sub assembly with 8 bolts. 4 imperial, 3 metric. The metric is a very different size. Do not be surprised if there's a dusting of random sizes.

This stupid farm truck of mine is from this era. has an imperial engine. Metric transmission and Transfercase. Front axle is imperial. Rear axle is metric. The chassis is a dusting of both. It's infuriating to work on. It'll have 12 and 15mm alongside 5/8 and such. The dash is rife with 7mm and 5/16 fasteners.

Just the existence of 7mm fasteners is enraging. 6 and 8 are right loving there you scum

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 
Bike is in the shed for the winter so I started some deep cleaning and poking into places to see how much needs to be refreshed an—



:stonklol: aaand now I’m checking every connector on the wiring harness.

TotalLossBrain
Oct 20, 2010

Hier graben!
That's fine. Less insulation means less air resistance, which is important in electrical circuits if I remember correctly

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

That's a suspiciously European looking connector

Toe Rag
Aug 29, 2005

TotalLossBrain posted:

That's fine. Less insulation means less air resistance, which is important in electrical circuits if I remember correctly

Air is actually an excellent insulator! Think of the weight savings.

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 
So what I’m hearing is that this will actually IMPROVE my ABS.

Slavvy posted:

That's a suspiciously European looking connector

Wow just because it’s flaky and surrenders under pressure doesn’t immediately make it European. Rude :colbert:

some kinda jackal fucked around with this message at 00:35 on Jan 11, 2024

Beve Stuscemi
Jun 6, 2001




TotalLossBrain posted:

I work on extremely expensive wafer fab equipment. I assure you, we use a mix of metric and SAE. :patriot:

:bustem:

Ulf
Jul 15, 2001

FOUR COLORS
ONE LOVE
Nap Ghost
Are there seriously still SAE bits on US domestic vehicles?

I’ve been working on my cars for like 30 years now and never had occasion to use the SAE half of my tools other than for spark plugs and hose clamps (1/4”). I honestly thought it was a thing of the past except for boutique brands like H-D.

Phy
Jun 27, 2008



Fun Shoe

Slavvy posted:

The probe wasn't a 626 it was an mx6 :colbert:

Ok, yeah, but the junkyard I trawled for engine and brake parts never had any mx6es in them but they sure had 626es that I plundered

The valve cover on the 2.0 was literally the exact same but with a Ford logo machine-screwed on instead of a Mazda one

quote:


Just the existence of 7mm fasteners is enraging. 6 and 8 are right loving there you scum

Are we talking the thread or the head? I had to disassemble some rails in my fridge to clean it that were attached with tekscrews with a 6.5mm head. The first socket set my dad gave me for Christmas (many years ago) had a bunch of n.5 metric and x/32 imperial sizes, and this is the first time I've needed any of them.

cursedshitbox
May 20, 2012

Your rear-end wont survive my hammering.



Fun Shoe

Ulf posted:

Are there seriously still SAE bits on US domestic vehicles?



Yes. Seatbelt anchor bolts.


7mm head. The actual thread pitch is something akin to a #10 sheetmetal screw but carved by drunks.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Yeah I'm referring to the heads. I have also encountered x.5mm screws, my old e23 bmw had iirc 6.5mm hex screws for some stuff

Fun fact: on some bikes, the cylinder head studs have rolled on threads and are 9mm diameter :getin:

Ulf
Jul 15, 2001

FOUR COLORS
ONE LOVE
Nap Ghost

cursedshitbox posted:

Yes. Seatbelt anchor bolts [...] carved by drunks.
Well as long as it's nothing important.

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 

cursedshitbox
May 20, 2012

Your rear-end wont survive my hammering.



Fun Shoe

I've done road side diesel engine swaps in trucks and even I won't touch one of these*.



* Probably at some point will have to do one. *sigh*

Ulf
Jul 15, 2001

FOUR COLORS
ONE LOVE
Nap Ghost

Congrats! … did it need it?

I have this problem on long trips where I get really inside my head and become convinced that something on my bike is going wrong. I start to think my clutch cable feels like it’s fraying (I carry a spare now), or that I can see oil smoke in my exhaust, or that my stator has gone out. Last year I was halfway between Ely and Tonopah when I became convinced my clutch was slipping. The clutch had 70,000 miles on it and I didn’t know how it’d been ridden for the first 20k, so it was plausible enough to my road-addled brain. I spent the next 1,000 miles of that trip doing as little slip as possible, got home, bought new plates, pulled the old ones out, and they were still at factory thickness.

It was still fun to change them, and I don’t worry about my clutch anymore.

TotalLossBrain
Oct 20, 2010

Hier graben!
Cold and snow this weekend. I think it may be a good opportunity to check the valve clearances on the KLX140 (150 hours? I really don't know), KLX300R (~140 hours), and KX250 (45 hours).

shacked up with Brenda
Mar 8, 2007

TotalLossBrain posted:

Cold and snow this weekend. I think it may be a good opportunity to check the valve clearances on the KLX140 (150 hours? I really don't know), KLX300R (~140 hours), and KX250 (45 hours).

Unless they start poorly I wouldn't.

bizwank
Oct 4, 2002

Ulf posted:

I have this problem on long trips where I get really inside my head and become convinced that something on my bike is going wrong.
I do this regularly on my ~10 minute commute. Most of it is through an industrial area and there's one section where I always smell what can only be described as burning clutch and even though I know it's whatever I'm riding by and not my bike, part of my brain still worries about it. Same thing every time it's raining and I smell road grime cooking off my exhaust headers.

bizwank fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Jan 12, 2024

TotalLossBrain
Oct 20, 2010

Hier graben!

shacked up with Brenda posted:

Unless they start poorly I wouldn't.

They start and run great. I just get really nervous ignoring regular maintenance intervals

some kinda jackal
Feb 25, 2003

 
 

Ulf posted:

Congrats! … did it need it?

I don't really have an A/B example of my bike to test against, but I do think that the clutch felt like it was slipping. It's my project bike and I was actually really excited to get it down to nuts and bolts and this was a good excuse to refresh the clutch on a high mileage motor.

I suppose egg on my face if I take it out in the spring and nothing's changed, but it was still a really fun expedition. I had a lot of fun wrenching on it, and I found a ton of other stuff I need work on refreshing in the process.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

shacked up with Brenda posted:

Unless they start poorly I wouldn't.

Personally I think doing stuff before it becomes a potentially damaging problem is the way to go

shacked up with Brenda
Mar 8, 2007

Slavvy posted:

Personally I think doing stuff before it becomes a potentially damaging problem is the way to go

What damaging problem do you refer too?

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Burned valve seats usually

shacked up with Brenda
Mar 8, 2007

Slavvy posted:

Burned valve seats usually

I just don't live in a world where great running bikes burn valve seats I guess.

The risk on his kx is timing chain or tensioner wear really, but should be 100hrs unless he's an A rider racing weekend to weekend.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

?? If your clearances are tight enough to make the bike hard to start, it's already doing valve and seat damage. So you check the clearances periodically to prevent it getting to that point. Idk what else to say.

shacked up with Brenda
Mar 8, 2007

Slavvy posted:

?? If your clearances are tight enough to make the bike hard to start, it's already doing valve and seat damage.

This is colossally incorrect

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

:shrug:

The absolute cornucopia of heads I've had to rebuild because people only started to care when the bike got hard to start disagree

shacked up with Brenda
Mar 8, 2007

Slavvy posted:

:shrug:

The absolute cornucopia of heads I've had to rebuild because people only started to care when the bike got hard to start disagree

Nice nice

This is the second set of posts you've made in response to me that I've shared around the shop lol

cursedshitbox
May 20, 2012

Your rear-end wont survive my hammering.



Fun Shoe
It's totally a thing.
It depends on the construction and metallurgy of the valve. Sodium filled valves are more 50/50 with the valve guide and valve seat sharing the sink. Solid valves rely heavily on the valve seat sinking the heat. They're not really popular in high power densities and turbo applications because of such.

There's an entire science behind cutting valves and seats for minimal turbulence and maximum heat transfer. The grind, angles, and number of cuts influences heat dissipation. This is a whole topic on its own.

Engines with poorly designed valve seats are known to drop them at the first inkling of running coolant warm. ie: Third generation Chrysler Hemis.
5 valve Yamahas and Ti valved Hondas are sensitive to valve lash and will absolutely burn a valve before it shows much in the way of symptoms.




https://www.eaton.com/de/de-de/catalog/engine-valvetrain/engine-valves.html
https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2022/may/pilot/savvy-maintenance-failure-to-rotate

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

shacked up with Brenda posted:

Nice nice

This is the second set of posts you've made in response to me that I've shared around the shop lol

Cool man

cursedshitbox posted:

It's totally a thing.
It depends on the construction and metallurgy of the valve. Sodium filled valves are more 50/50 with the valve guide and valve seat sharing the sink. Solid valves rely heavily on the valve seat sinking the heat. They're not really popular in high power densities and turbo applications because of such.

There's an entire science behind cutting valves and seats for minimal turbulence and maximum heat transfer. The grind, angles, and number of cuts influences heat dissipation. This is a whole topic on its own.

Engines with poorly designed valve seats are known to drop them at the first inkling of running coolant warm. ie: Third generation Chrysler Hemis.
5 valve Yamahas and Ti valved Hondas are sensitive to valve lash and will absolutely burn a valve before it shows much in the way of symptoms.




https://www.eaton.com/de/de-de/catalog/engine-valvetrain/engine-valves.html
https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2022/may/pilot/savvy-maintenance-failure-to-rotate

Yeah. Everything with titanium valves is insanely sensitive to tight clearances from what I've seen.

helno
Jun 19, 2003

hmm now were did I leave that plane

Beve Stuscemi posted:

Mixing metric and SAE should be punishable with jail time

I spent the last year working on some gas turbine standby generators.

Jet is Rolls Royce and uses immaculately machined silver plated whitworth fasteners.

Gearbox was GE and used imperial.

Generator was CGE and was metric.

Also company policy means no adjustable wrenches.

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Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

helno posted:

whitworth

Unspeakable horror

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