Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

cioxx posted:

Believe it or not, the military always makes life and death decisions and evaluates the price of human life as conditions change on the ground.

I never advocated purposefully bombing civilians, but if it incapacitates Gaddafi's propaganda machine it saves a lot more lives.

People in cities would be far more willing to aid the resistance when they're not being bombarded by 24 hour propaganda that skews against the rebels. I would prefer if they used precision targeting on the critical infrastructure that makes those broadcasts possible.

I wouldn't see always, but there is a bit of 'cold arithmetic' to many types of military planning.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

VikingSkull posted:

It's possible that military fuel stockpiles are running low, but it's probably not connected that closely to the civilian market. I'd suspect that coalition forces are a bigger problem for military movement within Libya than fuel concerns are at this time.

Well, the military's fuel needs have been dropping lately. :v:

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

A Winner is Jew posted:

Basic training in the US lasts 10 weeks, or a full 22 more days beyond the first bloodshed on the 15'th, and IIRC about 2-3 weeks before the first Libyan army defections really took place.

Full basic training takes a while, yes, but even just covering some basics would be an improvement from 'untrained rabble' that the rebel fighters have been showing so far. Hell, just a general 'keep your head down' bit would do wonders. Emphasize the importance of digging in and you've made artillery much less effective. Touch upon some anti-armor stuff and you've got guys that are semi-dangerous in cities.

It's not going to be good training in such a short time, but you'll get some return at least. Though honestly I really don't think this is what's going on. If there is training of the rebels by others, they're probably giving them a more thorough yet still shortened course.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

evilweasel posted:

Funny thing will happen when they do that too.

To call people that don't see things the way that you do stupid or uneducated is wrong, but that's not really the problem. It's more one of intellectual curiosity. When you draw most or all of your information from one or two sources, you're limiting your understanding and critical thinking.

I think that's really one of the worst aspects of "The truth is in the middle" South Park thinking, that type of thinking also tends to result in people that do not investigate things in depth as well, instead the sides are just reduced to ridiculous characatures.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

On the other hand, he may feel safer with his gold with him than being held by a "You can trust your gold with us" member of the regime.

Edit: And would you trust cash from a guy that's known to counterfeit in the past?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Amazing how orderly the migrant workers were being. Shame that others showed up to try and get on, causing chaos.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

They're submunitions from a BM-21 Grad launcher so likely there was no helicopter involved.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

It's absolutely amazing to me to see the continued large number of protesters in Syria. People going out when the question is less "Will they shoot at us" and more "How much will they shoot at us?"

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

NPR's morning hour today with the BBC World Service had a bit on it with Syria. A BBC reporter was talking to Syrian refugees in Lebanon about what had happened, including a 70-year-old woman who was shot in the leg as she tried to cross the border.

A Syrian state official was interviewed afterwards and claimed that the reported shelling and shooting in the story were because of smugglers in the area and that there were no protests.

Edit: BBC World Service player link (Dunno if it'll work right): Full program here

Taerkar fucked around with this message at 16:43 on May 20, 2011

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Definitely sounds like Yemen is moving into the endgame scenario, or at least the end of this phase. Next, of course, will be who is in charge afterwards, which could be a full-fledged civil war.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Every time the Rebels push the loyalist troops back, their stockpile of more modern weapons increase.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Mr. Sunshine posted:

Let us be realistic here, whether the rebels are armed with F2000s or AK-74s will do very little to change the overall strategic outcome. Infantry weapons simply have a very limited impact on modern warfare, and on the grand scale of things the difference between the AK-74 (which I assume is what the rebels are mainly using) and the F2000 is fairly minuscule. However, if your choice is between an F2000 and that homemade shotgun you had to unscrew the barrel to reload....

When the previous weapons that the rebels used were 'hatchets, stones, molotovs, and maybe the occasional hidden gun' then yes they do make quite a difference.

Infantry weapons can make a very big difference, especially if they allow you to drive off enemy infantry from the enemy vehicles.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

His idleness posted:

No. I mean your freedom fighting rebels are using Al Qaeda fighters and Al Qaeda is backing the rebellion.
I also mean muslim fundamentalists are behind the fighting and are waiting to put Libya back in the dark ages if they win.
I'm sure the vast majority of people don't want to be a part of some Islamic caliphate.
Which thanks to the western imperialistic intervention is likely to happen.
Why didn't you know these things?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...aeda-links.html

How many times has this link been brought up? More than a dozen times now?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Another cry of wolf by Gaddafi? Why should the rebels believe him at this point?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Chortles posted:

In fairness, King Abdullah II of Jordan seemed to try and get ahead of his own country's revolution, but seems to have stumbled somewhere along the way...

So what exactly is going on in Jordan right now? I thought it was relatively quiet.

Taerkar fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Jun 20, 2011

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

There needs to come a time when people recognize that force is required to get peaceful actions to happen. Look how resistant CQ is to leaving now and how they are still attacking civilians. How do you think he would be acting if all NATO did was ask him nicely to stop over and over again?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Hell, the tires look fine as well. Doesn't look to be all that much deformation of the structure either so it wasn't a very hot fire at all.

Might just be the quality of the picture but it doesn't look like there's any glass shards at all in those windows.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Jut posted:

That's a bit of a kick in the teeth for the UK military which have in recent times lost lives due to a shortage of body armour

Depends on the type of body armor though. Some stuff has use for police but is pretty much useless for military applications. No plate carriers, for example, would limit them to slower pistol rounds.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

So I guess they're finally satisfied with the size of the crater at Waddan?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Rocket-based weapons like the Scud have a lot more destructive power than artillery rounds, especially on a per-shot basis, but they don't have the barrage ability unless used en-masse.

The earlier comparison to the V-2 is an apt one. They're (ineffectual) terror weapons, not strategic weapons.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

KashiMane posted:

:words:


All that I can think of when I read your posts is this. How old and tattered is your Che shirt that you're wearing while you spout this stuff?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

octoroon posted:

Mythbusters episode incoming.

They already did it.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really


Personally I like this one more. That looks like a top hat on the one guy's head:

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Taerkar fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Sep 28, 2011

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Fruity Rudy posted:

That seems really unlikely. The video was uploaded months ago and by sheer coincidence a bunch of people randomly decided to get upset about it on 9/11? It's just... unlikely.

I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out to be a mixture of the two. Some groups wanted to do something since it was the anniversary, but the recent release of that completely idiotic and reprehensible video in Arabic gave them the spark that they needed to get a riot going.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Arzy posted:

I would prefer Vilerat's death be avenged but that's just me.

I'm not advocating starting another War but we need a valid response to our citizens being assassinated.

Sure, why not. Makes sense that the 'Eye for an Eye' arm is pointing to us now. Better act, right?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Brown Moses posted:

Reports that Afghanisatn and Pakistan have both blocked Youtube in response to the video.

Also

Terry 'Complete Scum' Jones posted:


"The fact that angry protesters climbed the wall at the U.S. embassy in Cairo, today, ripped down the American flag and tore it apart further indicated the lack of respect that Islam has for any other religion," Jones said in the statement. "Islam is a religion that is totally incompatible with Western free society."

"How dare that guy punch me in the face after I tell him that he, his family, and everything he holds dear is absolute poo poo and that he's a horrible person that should be spat upon. What a monster!"

Again, Freedom of Speech does not mean freedom from the consequences of it.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

evilweasel posted:

This is in somewhat poor taste considering it's not Jones that got punched in the face.

If only it was him, but that's not the point. He's trying to use what happened as a "See! See! I told you they're all terrible" bit, conveniently ignoring that he was provoking them in the first place.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

DAS Super! posted:

Yeah attacking an Embassy is pretty serious poo poo. Considering its thought of as US territory as I remember. Correct me if I am wrong. Plus also election year.

This was a Consulate, not an Embassy. So it's more of a field office and, as such, not considered sovereign territory, I believe.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

The reported use of FN2000s does lead a bit more credence to the attackers having at least some link to Gaddafi's troops as those weapons were apparently mainly used by the units controlled by his sons. Of course they could have been war spoils, so that does not in any way make it an absolute guarantee.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Not surprising at all. They're getting more angry and fed up with the situation.

Anyone know when Turkey last had a major military exercise?

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

NPR just had a mention about the Syrian military apparently using improvised bombs consisting of "cooking gas tanks with shrapnel wrapped around them". Has there been any other information regarding this yet?

They mentioned that there was a nation-wide shortage of cooking gas in the country for a while now.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Brown Moses posted:

CJ Chivers and a few other of my arms examining buddies have been looking at the Saudi military "weapons" create spotted in Syria by the BBC, and come up with their own conclusions, well worth a read.

Clearly it contained medals. The opposition forces wanted to recognize great achievement in the fight, an important step for keeping up morale.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Delta-Wye posted:

I was wondering how you managed to get a big red title in a couple weeks of having joined the forum, but I figured it out pretty fast once you started posting.


So, tell us about how awesome Manila is.


It's times like this that I really wish I was better at remembering names.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

I'm just saying that he had some good ideas.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Brown Moses posted:

Well they must have captured a lot of AA ammo from those air defence bases they raided, and certainly at least some ZU-23-2s, and when they start getting massed up with plenty of ammo they can pose a real threat to helicopters.

It's likely no coincidence that we've seen more shoot downs recently. Increasing experience on the rebel side and better AA equipment are a dangerous combination for Regime pilots.

It was most likely something on board going up. That is a pretty big explosion for what is likely 23mm AAA.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Charliegrs posted:

But don't chaff and flares get dropped at the same time automatically?

They're combined into a general countermeasure shot. This is a picture of a C-130 (Probably an AC-130) that is discharging countermeasures. Flares are supposed to be hotter than the plane to distract heat-seeking missiles (short-range weapons) while the chaff is intended to clutter a radar image, disrupting radar-guided weapons (missiles and AAA guns with radar tracking). Of course if they're as low as they are in some of the videos that have come out, the good ol' eyeball is still quite usable.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Crasscrab posted:

Most likely from the government stockpile. We've been seeing a lot of unexploded cluster bomb munitions which is a good indicator that these have been sitting in storage for awhile, likely since the 70s and 80s.

This is something that most people don't think of. Weapons actually do have a shelf-life, especially stuff like bombs and other types of high explosive ordinance. At the very least there is a maintenance issue with the detonators but for at least some types of ordinance the actual explosive can degrade. A combination of these factors (and of course extra factors like quality of the weapon to begin with) can lead to UXO due to increased failure rate, general duds, and even premature detonation.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

That video is a bit odd. It almost seems like it loops at one point.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Paradoxus posted:

Seems like this was kinda poorly planned. No visable ground support and exposing the back of the tank to return fire instead of the more aromored front? Could it be that the target was too far away for the crew to worry about anti tank infintry? And the firing from the back to make it easier for the driver to GTFO if they see any return fire?

The front of the BMP isn't exactly all that much more armored than the rear so it doesn't really matter what side is exposed. Backing into the spot to shoot means that they can easily move forward back into cover.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really

Party Plane Jones posted:

We'd never have all 11 out at sea at one time, at most we'd have 6/7. The whole reason why there are that many carrier groups is when one goes into port for a major overhaul that lasts several years another comes out of drydock to take its place. Other navies don't have that luxury so you end up with weird situations that they have to account for (like the Royal Navy having carriers that they couldn't do anything with because they had retired the planes that flew off of them).

We also have about as many (9) Marine Amphibious Assault Ships that are more or less equivalent to many other of the carriers in the rest of the world (~40k tonnes, I believe)

  • Locked thread