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Wild EEPROM posted:Keep in mind your old 17" mbp only had to push 1920x1200 (2,304,000 pixels), while the new one has to push 2880x1800 (5,184,000 pixels) - more than double the number of pixels. Yeah, right, but there's a limit to how much power the GPU can use at full tilt regardless.
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Apr 22, 2014 08:59
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Anyone else still using their Rev A 2006 MacBook? Snow Leopard stopped getting love a while ago. Safari and Chrome stopped getting support. I was using Firefox until the latest Adobe Flash update broke flash videos. I have YouTube set to HTML5 but anything embedded on a page is busted. Overall things run really crappy so I have been booting to Win 7 which runs everything fine. I'm thinking of trying some Linux distros to see if I can get something even lighter on the system but Win7 is good for now. I love this laptop and don't want to let it go but it looks like next MacBook Pro refresh I'll be looking to retire black beauty. 
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Apr 22, 2014 09:52
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My girlfriend spilled some beer on her 2012ish MacBook Pro. It seems to be dry now and nothing looks to be demolished, but I want to take it apart a bit and make sure she didn't damage the internals. What kind if screw driver do I need for unibody? A cursory google search is pointing me towards a t6 Torx but it looks like a 6 pointed star and the bottom of her laptop looks like it's a 5 pointed star.
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Apr 22, 2014 15:35
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omg chael crash posted:My girlfriend spilled some beer on her 2012ish MacBook Pro. It seems to be dry now and nothing looks to be demolished, but I want to take it apart a bit and make sure she didn't damage the internals. What kind if screw driver do I need for unibody? A cursory google search is pointing me towards a t6 Torx but it looks like a 6 pointed star and the bottom of her laptop looks like it's a 5 pointed star. If everything works do not take it apart. The answer to whether it's internally damaged by the beer is: No. It works.
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Apr 22, 2014 15:40
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Fair enough.
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Apr 22, 2014 15:50
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Star War Sex Parrot posted:Yes that is expected behavior. That's loving unbelievable.
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Apr 22, 2014 16:01
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Yeah anything that loses charge while plugged in is broken and needs to get redesigned to be fixed. I realize there aren't a ton of people with macbooks pegging the GPU and CPU playing games all the time but come on.
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Apr 22, 2014 16:55
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Pivo posted:Imagine you're using it for some heavy rendering work, CPU+GPU and lots of IO, you leave it on overnight to finish a job while plugged in and find it dead? Pivo posted:No way. Apple wouldn't stand for that, no self-respecting manufacturer would. I refuse to believe that you can place any kind of load on a laptop that would overpower the charger, and I've certainly never seen it happen, either with MBPs or other non-Apple products. revmoo posted:That's loving unbelievable. Pryor on Fire posted:Yeah anything that loses charge while plugged in is broken and needs to get redesigned to be fixed. I realize there aren't a ton of people with macbooks pegging the GPU and CPU playing games all the time but come on. spoon daddy posted:while playing intense games ... the charge slowly drains even while plugged in with the 85W charger that came with it Star War Sex Parrot fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 17:42
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Pryor on Fire posted:Yeah anything that loses charge while plugged in is broken and needs to get redesigned to be fixed. I realize there aren't a ton of people with macbooks pegging the GPU and CPU playing games all the time but come on. Macs have always done this, even cell phones do this. Nothing is broken...it's how they're designed.
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Apr 22, 2014 17:43
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This behavior has been seen in other Apple devices too, like the first generation iPad with Retina Display:quote:Note that when running at full brightness and with a heavy GPU load (e.g. Infinity Blade 2), the power adapter can't supply enough to keep the iPad charged and drive the display/internal components. quote:The iPad 4 is able to maintain charge equilibrium in the cases I tested, even under heavy load. With the 3rd generation iPad, if I ran Infinity Blade 2 while plugged in the total available battery charge would drop over time. On the 4th gen iPad, that no longer happens. I was able to maintain charge equilibrium even with the old 10W adapter on the iPad 4, pointing at overall power efficiency improvements rather than the new 12W adapter as the explanation for why this is now possible. It is possible that with fully loaded CPU and GPU cores that the new model wouldn't be able to maintain charge while powering the device, however I haven't encountered such a scenario yet.
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Apr 22, 2014 17:49
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Higher wattage chargers tend to be larger and more expensive and when 0.01% of your users have any need for such a thing you're just wasting everyone's money. Most manufacturers ship smaller chargers than would be needed to support a laptop with everything going at full tilt 24/7. If you need a render box, buy a bloody workstation.
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Apr 22, 2014 17:56
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If it's by design, it's a massive design flaw. Period. The AC adapter absolutely should be able to provide enough power to run every single component in the machine at maximum. That's *the point* of plugging it in. Call me hyperbolic or whatever if you want, that's just silly.
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Apr 22, 2014 17:57
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Pivo posted:If it's by design, it's a massive design flaw. Period. The AC adapter absolutely should be able to provide enough power to run every single component in the machine at maximum. That's *the point* of plugging it in. Call me hyperbolic or whatever if you want, that's just silly. Pivo posted:I've certainly never seen it happen, either with MBPs or other non-Apple products. Choadmaster posted:Higher wattage chargers tend to be larger and more expensive and when 0.01% of your users have any need for such a thing you're just wasting everyone's money. Most manufacturers ship smaller chargers than would be needed to support a laptop with everything going at full tilt 24/7. This also calls back to the MacBooks several years ago that couldn't run at full speed without a battery installed because the power draw could exceed the MagSafe's power output and then the system would have nothing to draw from.
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Apr 22, 2014 18:01
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benisntfunny posted:If everything works do not take it apart. The answer to whether it's internally damaged by the beer is: No. It works. This is very wrong. If a lot of beer was spilled on it, then yes their is likely liquid damage. The second the liquid comes in contact with electrified components (they are always electrified when a battery is plugged in) damage is done. It happens instantly and just because the machine is working now doesn't mean it will forever. It may experience weird issues later on, it may not. Liquid damage can sometimes not display an issue until something major is done like an OS update, or it may never show at all. That being said, don't bother opening it. You won't be able clean or fix anything, and you may just break something else. Just back up everything all the time and wait until it kicks.
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Apr 22, 2014 18:31
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Well, I'm not worried about breaking anything if I open it up. I've built loads of machines, went to school for computer science, and I'm your average nerd posting a technology forum, etc.That being said, I've never, ever opened a Mac book. Perhaps I just shouldn't open it, just a little worried. That drat laptop is her life.
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Apr 22, 2014 19:28
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Quick newbie question: Last night my battery was at 84%, I plugged the MacBook in, shut the case and went to bed. When I woke up this morning and opened it back up, it still said 84% - I unplugged the power adapter and it shot up to 100%. Is a software bug or did I do something wrong?
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Apr 22, 2014 19:31
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omg chael crash posted:I've built loads of machines, went to school for computer science, and I'm your average nerd posting a technology forum, etc. omg chael crash posted:Perhaps I just shouldn't open it, just a little worried. That drat laptop is her life. Star War Sex Parrot fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 19:34
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Macbooks and MBPs (not Airs or retinas) are very easy to disassemble and reassemble if you're methodical about it and follow a guide. Having appropriate tools is very important though, like a spudger and the correct sized drivers. You'll need a screw tray, and label it with post-its as you go along. There are a lot of screws. A lot of the connectors are very sensitive and the screws are very easy to strip. I do agree though that there's not much to be gained by opening it up. You won't be able to repair liquid damage, the best you'll be able to do is replace failing parts. If it works, it works! Beer is worse than water, if you're lucky it just cut power when it shorted out and nothing was damaged. Pivo fucked around with this message at 19:40 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 19:38
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Also, I assume her data is backed up, right? Right?
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Apr 22, 2014 19:39
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Star War Sex Parrot posted:None of which qualifies you to be poking around inside of laptops, which frequently aren't designed to be user-serviceable and use things like adhesives and hidden snap-tabs to hold themselves together and can break if you don't disassemble in the correct order with the correct tools. Yeah, this I certainly understand. I'm probably not going to open it, just wanted to find out what my options are here. Most everything she has is backed up, and we transferred most of her school stuff to my desktop just to be sure. Art students, impossibly large files. Took all day. Thanks, guys.
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Apr 22, 2014 19:43
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omg chael crash posted:What kind if screw driver do I need for unibody? A cursory google search is pointing me towards a t6 Torx but it looks like a 6 pointed star and the bottom of her laptop looks like it's a 5 pointed star.
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Apr 22, 2014 19:44
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I've been using my aTV 2 a lot more recently, since the Remote app lets you search via keyboard on the iPhone and I don't have to rely on typing stuff out on the remote. I also love being able to put my phone's screen on the TV to show people stuff and it got me to wanting to upgrade my late 2010 MBP to a new retina laptop, since it doesn't have the Airplay functionality  . How does mirroring the retina resolution work on a 720p aTV? Does it scale down and blow up everything to fit on the TV?
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Apr 22, 2014 20:03
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There's no scaling done. Non-Retina secondary displays are treated sort of as if they were a non-Retina Mac to begin with. The image is just rendered at the native resolution of the panel, rather than in HiDPI mode and then scaled down. It would be too resource-intensive to render the non-Retina display in HiDPI mode and then scale it down. You can actually see the assets (high-res buttons and such) get switched out when you move a window from a Retina display to a secondary monitor. On a 720p Apple TV you'd get the option to extend at 1280x720 natively. edit: wait are you specifically wanting to mirror the display or just extend it? I know you said 'mirror' but since the feature is called "AirPlay Mirroring" for both mirroring and extending, I want to be sure. It's a bit different for mirroring, in which case yes it just scales your existing rMBP resolution. Star War Sex Parrot fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 20:07
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Mirroring, specifically. My parents were over at my apartment this weekend and I was mirroring my phone to the aTV while we browsed real estate in the area, rather than having to fumble a laptop around the couch trying to look at pictures. It was nice, but could be better with the laptop mirroring.
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Apr 22, 2014 20:18
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omg chael crash posted:A cursory google search is pointing me towards a t6 Torx but it looks like a 6 pointed star and the bottom of her laptop looks like it's a 5 pointed star. PSA: Pentalobes and Torxes ARE NOT THE SAME loving THING. If you use one on the other you will likely wind up stripping the screw. Star War Sex Parrot posted:I believe Apple is up to using two sizes, maybe three: one for the iPhone and another for the MBPs. That makes me believe it's a Retina MBP, since they stick pentalobes on devices that aren't considered user-serviceable. P5 for rMBPs, P4 for iPhones. Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 20:27
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Star War Sex Parrot posted:Yes that is expected behavior. Ok, thanks. It was just startling to see my battery drained to like 60% after an hour or so of playing. I guess I should tone down the graphics level in game or should I just scale the resolution down or both? spoon daddy fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 20:54
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spoon daddy posted:Ok, thanks. It was just startling to see my battery almost drained. I guess I should tone down the graphics level in game or should I just scale the resolution down or both?
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Apr 22, 2014 20:56
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I stealth editted to suggest that it was about a 40% drain after an hour or so.
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Apr 22, 2014 20:59
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Yeah 40% in an hour doesn't seem right to me.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:00
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kloa posted:Mirroring, specifically. Beautiful thing about computers vs phones is multitasking. Don't mirror, do airplay extended then full screen safari to the secondary display. No scaling on either side and will look a whole lot better. With regards to building computers before, comp sci and etc, laptops are a different beast, MacBooks especially. They require crazy specific and usually apple created tools to take apart, and there's lots of very specific little tricks to take stuff apart/put stuff back together that you'd never figure out on your own. Certain stuff, like Mbp (not retina or air) batteries and standard hdds/memory are super easy, but once you get passed that it's not usually worth it. Take the advice here of everyone and don't bother opening it. Just keep in mind that MacBook now officially has no warranty, even if you have AppleCare and you can get no repairs done by apple with the exception of a full liquid damage repair. From this point on that machine should never ever be in a state other then 100% backed up or your girlfriend will hate you someday when it fails.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:09
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spoon daddy posted:I stealth editted to suggest that it was about a 40% drain after an hour or so. How's your battery life otherwise? Maybe your battery is failing? Otherwise like starwars said it could be MagSafe board, or even a bad MagSafe adapter/the wrong wattage. Take it to the fruit stand, they have a specific diagnostic that will test for those specific things. Bring your MagSafe adapter with you.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:11
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Pivo posted:If it's by design, it's a massive design flaw. Period. The AC adapter absolutely should be able to provide enough power to run every single component in the machine at maximum. That's *the point* of plugging it in. Call me hyperbolic or whatever if you want, that's just silly. I am an electrical engineer. At work, I design networking chips. Did you know that it is accepted practice in network engineering to simply drop packets under super high load or other exceptional circumstances? Betcha didn't, with an attitude like that. Don't get me wrong, we don't like drops, but we do lots of design work based on the reality that they may have to happen. The only real sin is to do something like emitting what we call a "runt packet" -- one which gets sent partially, but is chopped off without transmitting the full frame. You want to send properly formatted packets, or nothing at all. So we spend real labor on making sure that when we fail, we fail gracefully, insofar as you can call "deliberately vaporizing the whole packet" graceful. This issue is exactly the same kind of thing. Laptops of the type Apple specializes in (solid performance, but engineering tradeoffs are tilted towards long battery life) are sprinters, not long distance runners. If Apple was designing 10 pound gaming brick laptops, you'd be right to be annoyed by an AC adapter which could not power peak gaming loads indefinitely, but that's not what they're targeting. A real "massive design flaw" would be if the system crashes after it completely drains the battery. Which it might, if it can't detect that it needs to throttle back. (e: I do agree with SWSP that a drain of 40% in an hour doesn't sound right. The rMBP has a 95 Wh battery. 40% of that is 38, i.e. the system is drawing about 38W from the battery. A slow drain of a few watts would be understandable, but that much should not happen.) BobHoward fucked around with this message at 21:21 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 21:13
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Is there a higher-wattage adapter you can buy to prevent this problem from happening? If not then it seems like kind of a scandal to me.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:28
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revmoo posted:Is there a higher-wattage adapter you can buy to prevent this problem from happening? If not then it seems like kind of a scandal to me. Did you even read the post above yours? Even if a higher wattage adapter existed, this would make the battery have difficulty charging with the correct adapter.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:34
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That's for the engineers to worry about before they release a broken product...
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Apr 22, 2014 21:42
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BobHoward posted:I am an electrical engineer. At work, I design networking chips. Did you know that it is accepted practice in network engineering to simply drop packets under super high load or other exceptional circumstances? Betcha didn't, with an attitude like that. Of course I knew that. You don't need to be an electrical engineer to know that. I studied computer science and the principle is simple: if you get more packets coming in than you can send out, you're eventually going to run out of space to buffer them. BobHoward posted:This issue is exactly the same kind of thing. Laptops of the type Apple specializes in (solid performance, but engineering tradeoffs are tilted towards long battery life) are sprinters, not long distance runners. If Apple was designing 10 pound gaming brick laptops, you'd be right to be annoyed by an AC adapter which could not power peak gaming loads indefinitely, but that's not what they're targeting. So you both agree with me. He was complaining about a noticeable battery drain under high load even while plugged in, which shouldn't happen. I don't really think that the cost consideration of an 85W vs 100W (for example) power brick is terribly meaningful. If you say it should just be a few watts, why not ship a 90W adapter? To save a few cents on a thousand dollar+ computer? That's not very Apple-like. Justify it all you want, I don't like it, but I don't use my MBP as a desktop replacement so it doesn't affect me. Pivo fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Apr 22, 2014 |
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Apr 22, 2014 21:44
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revmoo posted:Is there a higher-wattage adapter you can buy to prevent this problem from happening? If not then it seems like kind of a scandal to me. Once again as everyone has said it sounds like 40% in an hour is a failure of his charger. I have a rMBP that I game on and I've noticed it will either charge slowly, or drain slightly under load. I've never had it drop below 60% or die. It's probably either a bad charger, or it will stabilize. What's the follow up of the story, did it drain below 60% down to 0?
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Apr 22, 2014 21:46
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Pivo posted:So you both agree with me. He was complaining about a noticeable battery drain under high load even while plugged in, which shouldn't happen. spoon daddy posted:the charge slowly drains even while plugged in with the 85W charger that came with it
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Apr 22, 2014 21:46
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Pivo posted:I don't really think that the cost consideration of an 85W vs 100W (for example) power brick is terribly meaningful. If you say it should just be a few watts, why not ship a 90W adapter? To save a few cents on a thousand dollar+ computer? That's not very Apple-like. Justify it all you want, I don't like it, but I don't use my MBP as a desktop replacement so it doesn't affect me.
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Apr 22, 2014 21:48
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Seems like a design flaw where you can't use a Macbook PRO for long rendering jobs might affect a large percentage of the overall user base. Are we absolutely sure this is really a thing? I tried looking for power draw specs for the late 2013 15" and couldn't find anything to confirm that it actually can draw more than the rated power from the supply. It really seems hard to believe that they really did this.
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Apr 22, 2014 22:00
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