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quote:I'm avoiding spoilers as best I can, so could someone give a breakdown of the mechanics, skill systems, and how it plays? To replenish your stat pool you get a 'brief rest' ability which is a one-off, or can rest at designated areas for free to recover your pools completely. Now, the catch with that is, each full rest (sleep) passes the time, and there are some time-sensitive quests. So basically, the strategic layer to this seems to be, do I want to push through as far as I can with the stats I've got, potentially failing some minor tasks, or do I sleep and potentially fail some urgent quests I didn't prioritise because I was doing something else? Abilities and skills can be roughly grouped into crises/combat and exploration use. You get the initial ones during character creation and the others by trading in your experience points. Exp is acquired for solving quests/crises. Regained memories and certain dialogue branches can give a bit of experience too, so it's worth talking to everyone about everything (which you should do anyway, 'cause it's a Torment game and writing's pretty awesome), as you never know where that might lead you. Once you get a certain amount of exp points (180 in beta), you can choose one or more out of: improving stat pools, ability, skill, increasing stat pools, effort points or gaining new ability. You can only improve each of those once per level (tier). So basically, if with your first 180 points you choose a new skill and with the next 180 points you improve stats, with the following 180 you'll have a choice only between new ability, improving existing ability or increasing effort until you advance to the next tier. You get four of those 180 exp level-ups per tier. Upon advancing a tier you also get a selection of two new abilities which doesn't use up exp points. I might be making it sound more complicated than it actually is though, most of it's fairly intuitive as you play. And of course, being a beta a lot is still subject to change, not to mention some of the above might be wrong as it's a bit hard to tell a feature from a bug at this stage. Re. time-sensitive quests, I can see some people not liking it, but I really, really hope they don't change that mechanic, because it does wonders for making the world feel more alive and your choices more important. To expand on that, yes, you can fail a quest because you rested too often and prioritised other stuff in between, and no, you don't get told point blank 'you get x days to take care of this'. However, so far the only time-sensitive quests I found were clearly urgent, and even failing them didn't feel like I missed out on content, it was simply a different resolution to the stories. It's definitely not a game where you'll be able to see everything or do everything, so failing quests just means more to see next time and increases replayability. Been playing beta some more and I continue to be very impressed with reactivity and amount of alternative quest solutions. I think what I like the most is that it feels like there's no one true, 'correct' path, it's just you making choices in a living world and dealing with consequences, so props to inXile for that.
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Jan 28, 2016 16:12
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Are there appropriate non-intellect quest solutions? i.e. does this fall down the "int/wis are just better" hole that PS:T did?
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Jan 28, 2016 18:40
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I'm curious, in that 
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Jan 28, 2016 19:07
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frajaq posted:I'm curious, in that
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Jan 28, 2016 19:14
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CottonWolf posted:Are there appropriate non-intellect quest solutions? i.e. does this fall down the "int/wis are just better" hole that PS:T did?
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Jan 28, 2016 19:29
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Thanks for the write-up, that sounds interesting. How does quest failure play out? Do you get an actual resolution where your failure to act has consequences, or do you just get a notification/pop-up saying you failed?
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Jan 28, 2016 19:35
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Brother None posted:You'll have any equipment you pick up. There's some cyphers you can find in the Reef and Broken Dome as well as some makeshift weapons, but when you first wake up you have no equipment so you do have to look around. gently caress, the only skill check I passed was with that tree made of hands. Guess I should have reloaded when messing with that sludge ball
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Jan 28, 2016 19:41
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^^Haha, did you not even check the swirly things or the massive black obelisk? Or sweep through the area you woke up in?^^Litany Unheard posted:How does quest failure play out?
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Jan 28, 2016 19:51
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Perhaps a hamster posted:^^Haha, did you not even check the swirly things or the massive black obelisk?^^ They looked too suspicious and mohawk dude told me not to touch the obelisk 
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Jan 28, 2016 19:53
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Perhaps a hamster posted:Nah, not really. There's no single equivalent to wisdom, instead you have skills like deception, intimidation, persuasion etc. in addition to intellect, and skills are not strictly tied to stats. Like, if the check is Intellect + Persuasion, characters with high intellect and no persuasion or low intellect but with persuasion should both pass. Or, if you're trying to figure out how a piece of machinery works, you may have an option of a high intellect check, anaemnesia (sp?), a.k.a 'remembering memories easier' skill, or a lore: machinery skill, stuff like that. I'm pretty sure your party members' stats are meant to count towards checks somewhat too. So I don't think you'll have to go intellect-heavy or anything like that to get the most out of the story like in PS:T. I was more asking if there were non-talky solutions to things for non-talky characters. But yeah, multiple different skills applying for checks like in the tabletop game is definitely a good start.
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Jan 28, 2016 19:59
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Ah, gotcha. Well, it's a talky game and the combat/text ratio is definitely skewed towards the latter, so a lot of quests are still solved by interacting with characters, but you get plenty of choice in how you want to interact with them, and I definitely remember opportunities to smash a thing or steal a thing being valid solutions. Another thing is, I'm not sure you can even see options you're totally unqualified for, and my longest playthrough so far has been with a talky character, so that's what I know most about. I did play through the very first areas with different characters, and had completely different options come up when interacting with the same objects in the starting zone, so it wouldn't surprise me if there are interactions and solutions available for, say, a high-might glaive I won't even know about if I only played a talky nano. frajaq posted:They looked too suspicious and mohawk dude told me not to touch the obelisk
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Jan 28, 2016 20:28
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Perhaps a hamster posted:Another thing is, I'm not sure you can even see options you're totally unqualified for, and my longest playthrough so far has been with a talky character, so that's what I know most about.
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Jan 28, 2016 23:04
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Ah, okay, thanks for the explanation! I must've been thinking of differences in flavour text then and/or some things bugged out. Can you get different options in quests depending on your focus or tide allocation then? Speaking of, is speaking to the fathom companion the only way to check your tide attunement, or will it be displayed anywhere else in the final game?
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Jan 28, 2016 23:22
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Brother None posted:Attempting a persuasion or similar check is a "difficult task", and in the Numenera system anyone can try any difficult task. Your might/speed/intellect pool only determine how many resources you have to spend towards different types of tasks, and skills make tasks easier but they do not "unlock" tasks (they can sometimes unlock extra flavor text). There are also cyphers and abilities that can help get through conversation-related tasks. Numenera isn't really the kind of system where your "class" gates your content much, though your overall skill and ability build might determine what kind of options are easiest for you, but not really what kind of options are available. I've been keeping out of the details to not spoil myself, but this makes me a bit concerned - are these essentially dice rolls in conversation? Or is the determining factor over success or failure the amount of resources I spend?
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Jan 29, 2016 00:09
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Played it for 2 hours and had eight times where it just freezes up and the interface never goes away or enters combat and I have to alt+f4. But the parts I've seen are neat as heck. I think I'll pick it back up when it's not early access.
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Jan 29, 2016 05:49
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Perhaps a hamster posted:Ah, okay, thanks for the explanation! I must've been thinking of differences in flavour text then and/or some things bugged out. Can you get different options in quests depending on your focus or tide allocation then? Speaking of, is speaking to the fathom companion the only way to check your tide attunement, or will it be displayed anywhere else in the final game? We've been working on different designs/options on displaying tide attunement. Schurik posted:I've been keeping out of the details to not spoil myself, but this makes me a bit concerned - are these essentially dice rolls in conversation? Or is the determining factor over success or failure the amount of resources I spend?
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Jan 29, 2016 18:17
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I sure hope in future updates they just give you a character sheet prompt to fill out instead of some overly long choose your own adventure nonsense, because I'm pretty sure that will get real tiring really quick. I haven't even started the actual game yet because I don't like the idea of not knowing exactly how I'm building my character.
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Feb 1, 2016 06:31
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Other than your alignment with the Tides and your gender, you get to customize everything in the end anyway if you want to change your mind or don't like the things the game chose for you. Of course, whatever shape the opening sequence finally takes, it will be one of the first things that gets modded out.
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Feb 1, 2016 06:37
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Stokes posted:I sure hope in future updates they just give you a character sheet prompt to fill out instead of some overly long choose your own adventure nonsense, because I'm pretty sure that will get real tiring really quick. I haven't even started the actual game yet because I don't like the idea of not knowing exactly how I'm building my character. You can change your choices freely after completing the narrative characterbuilding.
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Feb 1, 2016 12:11
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Stokes posted:I sure hope in future updates they just give you a character sheet prompt to fill out instead of some overly long choose your own adventure nonsense, because I'm pretty sure that will get real tiring really quick. I haven't even started the actual game yet because I don't like the idea of not knowing exactly how I'm building my character. They follow the Elder Scrolls method of build your own character, put you through the "roleplay" mode then let you change schtick before the end of the dungeon But yea I really don't want to play that introduction to the tides sequence again lol, neato dialogue but one playthrough was enough. Iirc I don't think you can make le classic end of dungeon save like Elder either, the cutscenes don't work out that way, maybe that's something that could be changed. I could be wrong though. Perhaps a hamster posted:Some skills are not currently implemented and cyphers are unbalanced, so it's hard to see what the complete picture will be like. In the beta the main thing is managing your stat pools (might, speed, intellect) versus the times you need to rest. Basically, most actions require a roll with one of the stats used. If you want to increase your success chance, you can add extra effort points, which also come out of your stat pools. As your stat pools get used up, you can't afford to spend effort to make tasks easier, which is bad news in case of crisis or a difficult action. +1 excellent explanation. Urthor fucked around with this message at 12:43 on Feb 1, 2016 |
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Feb 1, 2016 12:40
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Do you get aligned to a tide by doing whatever the tube monster wants or by doing the exact opposite, completely dominating their insticts and making them wonder, as they're dying, why they did this thing? Because the guy told me not to just do what the tube monster wants but I don't know if he means "ever". Or why I'd want to be aligned with Blue on purpose, for example.
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Feb 1, 2016 20:01
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The monster in each vat is the epitome of the corresponding tide. Doing exactly what it wants will attune you strongly to that tide while forcing it to do something different is more likely to slant you towards a different tide. The idea is to think about what your character would do in that situation, ignoring what the monster wants, and that will determine which tides your character has most affinity for.
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Feb 3, 2016 00:58
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First patch is out. Fixing a lot of blockers, optimizing etc, but will likely break existing saves.
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Feb 4, 2016 21:32
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Added Sir Arthour. The most important patch note. He's a character from the tabletop game. That's all I'll say. CottonWolf fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Feb 4, 2016 |
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Feb 4, 2016 21:41
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Is it known when it will be released?
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Feb 11, 2016 10:46
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Boz0r posted:Is it known when it will be released? They haven't said anything definitive, but unless something goes really bad I'd expect a release before the end of the year.
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Feb 11, 2016 16:02
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We are aiming for a 2016 release, yes, but nothing more specific to note than that at this time.
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Feb 11, 2016 17:51
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New update, writing's done... Reading comments, people are really salty about the release delay and use of Early Access, huh? 
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Mar 8, 2016 00:24
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The commenters are being really stupid, but that being said selling early access for quick cash is going to bring up these kind of issues, and there is no reason for any developers to be surprised when people start complaining.
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Mar 8, 2016 06:12
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People crying for beta access to everyone or everyone above a certain tier are hilarious in how oblivious they are to how loving dumb that would be.
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Mar 8, 2016 13:35
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Worked for Divinity: Original Sin. And it's not like the betas aren't immediately leaked to the torrents, they're just cutting off some people who could actually give feedback.
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Mar 8, 2016 13:45
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Megazver posted:Worked for Divinity: Original Sin. And it's not like the betas aren't immediately leaked to the torrents, they're just cutting off some people who could actually give feedback. So, on a very basic level, giving some people something for free that other people paid for sounds like a good idea? I personally didn't back that tier, but if I had and this happened, I think I'd be justified in wondering why I paid for it in the first place. Remember that this is different from backing the game in general, this is an additional thing those people paid for. Another example would be putting everyone into the same "top" tier of credits. It may sound petty, but the people in the top tier paid for something that others are now getting for free. Again, this is different from, say, the game getting 20% cheaper one month after launch or something. You can't disrespect one set of backers/customers just to placate a bunch of people who regret not backing a different tier.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:35
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Many people crying for access would be useless to the (beta process) project and complain how "incomplete" the game was.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:46
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That too. From the comments a lot of people can't even grasp the concepts of beta and early access.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:55
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Schurik posted:So, on a very basic level, giving some people something for free that other people paid for sounds like a good idea? I personally didn't back that tier, but if I had and this happened, I think I'd be justified in wondering why I paid for it in the first place. No, it's just ultimately a less bad idea than not doing it. Basically, the first wave of Kickstarter rpgs hit before Early Access really became a thing and they figured out what the good practices for backer tiers were. Larian ultimately realized that they needed as many eyeballs on the beta much more than the extra money for alpha/beta access, so they offered it to all the backers and offered the opportunity to either spend that money on other addons or get a refund. Then, when they Kickstarted their next game, they included the Alpha/Beta access in the basic get-the-game tier from the start. And Early Access people getting into the beta for less money than the backers is just a recipe for a shitstorm. Planetary Annihilation tried to work around this by selling the Early Access for $85, which was the price of the beta access tier, and boy oh boy did they get made fun of for it. If Inxile are smart they'll do what Larian did.
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Mar 8, 2016 15:57
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Too many people think "beta" means starcraft beta - where the game is totally complete and they are just gathering metrics and balancing things.
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Mar 8, 2016 17:04
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Megazver posted:No, it's just ultimately a less bad idea than not doing it. On this level I agree with you - I have no dog in this race so ultimately they should probably do what serves the game best. My thinking is just that by giving in, you're exchanging one set of angry voices for another.
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Mar 8, 2016 17:04
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Schurik posted:So, on a very basic level, giving some people something for free that other people paid for sounds like a good idea? I personally didn't back that tier, but if I had and this happened, I think I'd be justified in wondering why I paid for it in the first place. I haven't looked at the numbers recently, but my understanding is the lowest level of backer tier + beta add-on matches what early access people are paying. How is that "free"?
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Mar 8, 2016 21:10
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Airfoil posted:I haven't looked at the numbers recently, but my understanding is the lowest level of backer tier + beta add-on matches what early access people are paying. How is that "free"? "Free" as in "getting something you didn't pay for". Maybe I wasn't clear about this, but I'm not comparing Kickstarter beta tier and early access, but Kickstarter tiers explicitly *without* beta access and those with it. I paid for a physical collector's edition (plus a bunch of other stuff), which was a lot of money, but no part of my pledge included beta access. Even though what I paid is several times more than, say, the most basic pledge plus beta access, at no point do I feel (nor should anyone else for that matter) entitled to the beta. e: forgot a word Schurik fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Mar 8, 2016 |
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Mar 8, 2016 22:33
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Schurik posted:"Free" as in "getting something you didn't pay for". Maybe I wasn't clear about this, but I'm not comparing Kickstarter beta tier and early access, but Kickstarter tiers explicitly *without* beta access and those with it. True enough. I paid extra for the early version because I have no willpower, but that's all on me.
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Mar 8, 2016 22:43
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