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Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Medium Cool posted:

hey thats exactly where I stopped watching this terrible show

ds9 forever

that was literally like episode 2 ya big baby :colbert:

# ¿ Dec 12, 2013 18:14

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 18:09

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

what the hell I'll out myself in this thread and say I started rewatching Voyager a couple months ago and didn't think the first two seasons were all that bad. I gave up on it when the season 2 finale backpedaled on the CHAKOTAY'S BABY MOMMA plotline as hard as it could, that was p. lame.

# ¿ Dec 12, 2013 18:49

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

First Contact owns, you nerf herders!

# ¿ Dec 12, 2013 22:34

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Mirror Kira being a debauched tyrant who wanted to do her alternate universe self was p. lol

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 01:31

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

They way they dropped him off the show at the end of Season 2 was literally a last minute rewrite because the producers got squeamish about, oh gosh, having a killer trying to redeem himself? That might actually get interesting or something. That was when I gave up.

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 02:42

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Silver Alicorn posted:

there was at least one episode where the maquis wanted to mutiny but chakotay shot them down

That is one of Chakotay's most awesome moments easily. "You're sick of Federation rules?" *turns around, suckerpunch to the jaw!* "Alright, there's some Maquis rules."

He had potential to be a good character but it got flushed down the toilet at the end of season 2. I can see why Bob Beltran basically stopped giving a poo poo.

Durgat posted:

TNG > ENT > TOS > VOY > ANIMATED SERIES > DS9

Holy lolly get a load of how wrong you are

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 06:43

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Harry Kim you fuckin renegade

# ¿ Dec 13, 2013 08:29

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

NoneSuch posted:

I'm watching The Island and Neelix just showed up!

Neelix is also a random security guard who gets mind-controlled into killing himself in The Shadow. That dude pops up everywhere if you look for him.

# ¿ Dec 14, 2013 00:38

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

You know what was in Voyager and loving owned?

This thing. This thing owned. When poo poo got real it would pop out two more nacelles like an X-Wing and it was gunned to the gills, basically a Federation battleship.

If they still care about Treknerd dollar (not that they should), they should just do another series about the Dominion War, there was a gently caress ton of stuff we didn't see in DS9 they could cover and they could fill it with badass ship porn and starship tactics and whatever.

# ¿ Dec 14, 2013 00:48

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Abrams could easily make a TV show that would be a wet dream for trekkies. But yeah there's absolutely no reason the franchise owners should make the same mistake as comics and stay tied to an aging, autistic fanbase that's stuck in the 90's.

# ¿ Dec 14, 2013 01:00

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

The woman who plays T'Pol is hot but they gave her the worst possible loving haircut for her headshape. All I can see when she's onscreen is the top of her loving skull.

# ¿ Dec 14, 2013 09:15

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

etalian posted:

Who's driving the ship if the entire bridge crew is watching him sing?

every starship presumably has rotation shifts. It's just poo poo always happens to go down when the Captain/senior officers have the bridge because because

# ¿ Dec 14, 2013 20:18

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Kaboom Dragoon posted:

Quark was bragging about having copies of Vulcan Love Slave all the time, so I think it's a given that people indulging in Sherlock Holmes and William Tell fantasies is the exception rather than the rule.

It's probably considered public knowledge what people get up to on the holodeck so I always imagined the boring dinner theater poo poo they did was because nobody wants to be known as the creepy guy with the Vulcan love slave fantasies. Well except Barclay but he pretty much was already That Guy.

# ¿ Dec 17, 2013 10:03

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Shadoer posted:

Yeah, if you imagine that Star Trek "ended" with the finale of DS9 and Star Trek First Contact, almost all the major plot points going through Star Trek are tied up one way or another.

First Contact is a way nicer bookend for the whole series too, now that I think about it.

(It's a much nicer ending note than Data dying and Picard looking out into the void of space and obviously thinking "ugh, I'm too old for this poo poo.")

# ¿ Jun 4, 2014 10:35

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

quote:

Now, "Voyager": in praise of the Trekkiest "Trek" of all
by Ian Grey
June 11, 2013
Whatever you say against JJ Abrams� Star Trek Into Darkness�and I'd say plenty�you can't claim it lacks purpose. Like Abrams' first entry, it seems dedicated to stripping Trek of its cockeyed optimism, its sense of last-frontier adventurism, and its progressive worldview, and letting the remainder marinate in testosterone and male supremacy politics. So, all the qualities that made Star Trek special�the deep, silly, starry-eyed, predictable, always-inclusive things that sparked a half-century, trans-global love affair? Gone. In their place: a white man-centered Starfleet command. Random T&A. Plot-poaching from old Treks. The Prime Directive, scrunched. The Enterprise�a starship!�hiding from primitive aliens underwater.

As we mourn Abrams� macho Trek obliteration, it�s a good time to revisit Voyager, at once the most Star Trek-ian of accomplishments and the most despised object of fanboy loathing in the franchise's nearly 50-year history. From 1995-2001, it offered American audiences something never seen before or since: a series whose lead female characters� agency and authority were the show. It was a rare heavy-hardware science fiction fantasy not built around a strong man, and more audaciously, it didn't seem to trouble itself over how fans would receive this. On Voyager, female authority was assumed and unquestioned; women conveyed sexual power without shame and anger without guilt. Even more so than Buffy, which debuted two years later, it was the most feminist show in American TV history.

Voyager wasn�t some grrl power screed in Starfleet regalia. The ideas and emotions it explored were very much in the Star Trek wheelhouse; it just came at them from a fresh--and to some viewers, off-putting--angle. Led by Kathryn Janeway (Obie-Award-winner Kate Mulgrew), the first female Trek captain to carry a series, Voyager brought us some of the most convulsively inventive humanist science fiction this side of early Stephen Moffat-era Doctor Who.

Set in the 2370s, Voyager episodes ping-ponged wonderfully between genres and modes. We got a revolution fought in the safety of dreams (�Unimatrix Zero�) and a metaphor-rich engagement with childhood violence and memory (�The Raven�). Some episodes spotlighted the kinds of spiritual engagements that frequent Voyager scripter Ronald D. Moore would import whole-hog to his post-9/11 remake of Battlestar Galactica.

And yet to this day, Voyager is often despised in the most grotesque terms, as a Star Trek apostate. The loathing isn't as severe as it was when the show went off the air, and Trek Today published an ongoing "mock trial" titled �The Court Martial of Captain Kathryn Janeway." But while fan consensus seems to have swung around during the last 18 years, albeit with the agility of an aircraft carrier course-correcting, Voyager still inspires loathing so deep that whole Youtube channels may be required to feed it. As recently as October 2012, the sci-nerd bellwether site Den of Geek asked �Why do Star Trek fans Hate Voyager?� as if the assumption were so widely accepted as to stand unquestioned. The article hit the carotid artery of fanboy animus when it suggested that �the hatred is mostly about those first two words in the title. After all, what is Star Trek?� The self-evident answer: not Voyager.

Show creators Rick Berman, Michael Piller and Jeri Taylor clearly asked themselves the same thing. They breathed new life into a moribund franchise by taking the whole �where no man has gone before� thing and really running with it. As the critic Alan Sepinwall reminds us, a great show teaches us how to watch it. With Voyager, the fanboys would have to learn how to live without a default male lead to identify with, a hero in Kirk/Picard/Riker mode. They would have to learn to identify beyond gender, and the challenge didn't end at the captain's chair. Along with Mulgrew's fascinating, maddening Captain Janeway�bullheaded; childless by choice; at once doctrinaire and impulsive---the showrunners gave us a prickly/brilliant Chief Engineer named B'Elanna Torres (Roxann Dawson) struggling with her biracial half-human Hispanic, half-Klingon identity. By season four, ship botanist Kes (Jennifer Lien) left Voyager; her screentime was filled with a 103-episode-long redemption tale about a bemused, tragic and insanely svelte de-assimilated Borg called Seven of Nine (Jeri Ryan).

The show also expected viewers to spend time with an Asian Operations Officer (Garrett Wang), a half-black, half-Vulcan tactical officer (Tim Russ), and a Native American First Officer (Robert Beltran) before finally meeting the crew's significant male Caucasians, none of whom fit the traditional Buck Rogers/Flash Gordon/Luke Skywalker/James Kirk descriptors. One was the hilariously arch medical hologram played by Robert Picardo. The other was helmsman Tom Paris (Robert Duncan McNeill).

In the context we're exploring here, Paris is particularly fascinating. In theory, he was there carry the flag for straight male heroic signifiers, but there were clues that he was actually there to tweak people's expectation that science fiction adventures had to put a straight white guy at center-stage. The character spent his off-time saving helpless women in his virtual reality simulation of �30s SF serials, Captain Proton -- a sweet spoof of the brand of outer-space swashbuckling that Roddenberry embraced on the original Star Trek, and that continued, in a more intellectualized way, on The Next Generation.

Having devastated the usual gender order of Trek product, Bergman, Piller and Taylor then demolished the idea of what their show would do, by putting its characters, and by extension its viewers, in a defensive crouch.

This series wasn't built around officers that could project military force, which is itself essentially masculine, whenever they needed to, and expect to be backed by the full faith and credit of Starfleet, even when they'd done something wrong or stupid. They were isolated, deprived of the usual political-military support network that made all other Trek adventures, including Deep Space Nine, so comforting to fans.
The story began when the USS Voyager was hurled by an energy wave 70,000 light-years, to the butt end of the universe. After that, her mission was simplified: aim Earthwards for a 75-year journey home that the crew was unlikely to survive.

And that was it. No Starfleet hijinks, no strutting around the galaxy, just 150 or so people stuck together for life. Voyager often feels less like a continuation of Trek as we know it than a challenge in the form of a question: "So you think you know what Star Trek is?" The series is an anti-action, existential feminist family drama, shot through with a persistent melancholy that reflects the crew�s desperation.

Yes, it's still Star Trek, but the sheer unfamiliarity of the crew's predicament was disorienting. This far end of space is haunted by the violence of war. Mass violence carries more weight here, arguably, than in any other incarnation of Star Trek, and it's no stretch to suggest that the show's tragic attitude toward war comes out of its female-centered perspective.

Here, military violence is portrayed not as a stereotypical male general might see it, but as it might be viewed by the equivalent of a diplomat, or a representative of the Red Cross, or the United Nations. It's a catastrophic event that engulfs whole civilizations, displaces whole species. It causes wounds that don't heal for generations, or starts new conflagrations. Voyager constantly meets races and species that are starting a war or recovering from one, and keeps stumbling upon the ghostly remnants of obliterated civilizations. This strain of sadness is so persistent that the show often feels like gentle critique of the military-macho strain that ran through the original series, the films based on it, as well as many episodes of the more self-aware The Next Generation. (David Gerrold, screenwriter of "The Trouble With Tribbles", has said that series creator Gene Roddenberry modeled James T. Kirk on John F. Kennedy, who was socially liberal but also a military hawk and a womanizer.)

The episodes' plots did little to reassure viewers who felt unmoored from the Trek they knew and loved, but the best of them could stand toe-to-toe with the most provocative science fiction in TV history. In �Night�, the crew meets black-skinned aliens who live in eternal darkness and would prefer to remain that way. The Lovecraftian �Species 8472� haunts several episodes, and is so un-anthropomorphically bizarre and deadly that it's best to deal with them by running the other way. Other episodes deal with spiritual crises -- with the question of what, if anything, happens after we die, and whether there is a God, or gods, or some other higher intelligence keeping watch over the material world. In �Mortal Coil�, upbeat ship chef and Morale Advisor Neelix (Ethan Phillips) loses the faith in the afterlife that lets him cope with his species� genocide. When he dies and is resurrected by Borg technology, he realizes there is nothing after death but�nothing. �Barge of the Dead�, meanwhile, finds B'Elanna Torres suffering visions of the Klingon version of Hell accompanied with her mother, damned because of B'Elanna�s inability to accept herself.

In a lighter vein, the �Fair Haven� episode threw viewers out of SF entirely and into �Ireland�, courtesy of the ship�s virtual reality holodeck. Captain Janeway meets--and modifies to taste--a hot Irish hologram that she utilizes for some carnal R&R. The episode uses its SF tropes to correct assumptions of female guilt and sexual self-pleasure, specifically the idea that it's impossible for a woman to sleep with a man and not become romantically involved.

When Voyager was firing on all cylinders, stories this rich popped up every week. And as mentioned, at the heart of many of them was the ex-Borg named Seven of Nine. With her ice blond hair frozen in a �50s up-do, her curves packed into a series of absurdly tight space-leotards, and a manner of often hilarious extreme hauteur, Seven of Nine was a sexually remote Hitchcockian fatale in SF drag, and one of the most richly imagined characters in TV history. Seven�s backstory is that the Borg stole her when she was only six, quashing her identity and filing her body with cybernetic implants that link her to the Borg hive-mind. Captain Janeway liberates her from the Borg in �Scorpion: Part 2� and spends the rest of Voyager helping her regain her individuality in increments, switching deftly between the roles of therapist, role model, teacher and mother. Seven earns her redemption through the storms of multiple personality disorder, body dysmorphia, trauma responses, and intimacy terrors. In other words, a thinly veiled, story of child abuse survival, and one that�s proving to be a great inspiration to survivors now, in the real world.

Watching Voyager today still a delight, but it's also illuminating in ways that aren�t so delightful. It�s impossible not to feel crestfallen at the systemic de-evolution that we've seen since. This supposedly great age of TV has give us many fascinating artistic innovations, but its representation of women is problematic at best. If you look at most of many of the high watermarks of the last two decades -- shows such as The Sopranos, The Shield, Mad Men, Breaking Bad, Boardwalk Empire, Justified and Sons of Anarchy -- they're all mainly concerned with alpha males struggling to hold onto their privilege during changing times. That's only a "universal" story if you agree that straight white males really are the universe.

In the meantime, the self-determined female leads of Voyager -- and Buffy, and a handful of other unusual genre series -- have been supplanted by strong female characters that aren't really as strong as they seem. As former Salon TV critic Heather Havrilesky noted in her New York Times piece, �TV�s New Wave of Women: Smart, Strong, Borderline Insane�, even our richest female leads come with a soup�on of instability. "I don�t mean complicated, difficult, thorny or complex," she writes. "I mean that these women are portrayed as volcanoes that could blow at any minute. Worse, the very abilities and skills that make them singular and interesting come coupled with some hideous psychic deficiency."

And so the title character of Nurse Jackie is a pill head. Homeland's Carrie Mathison is a bipolar wreck. The reporter Zoe Barnes on House of Cards is a semi-sociopath who sleeps with a powerful man twice her age to get scoops. The female characters on The Newsroom feel like a man's condescending fantasy of how smart professional women acted thirty years ago, only needier. The Following demands that Claire Matthews either beg her serial killer ex-husband not to gut her, or her alcoholic wreck of an ex-lover to save her.
Illness, mental disarray and hormonal imbalance are, of course, the traditional weapons wielded to cut the threat level posted by intelligent, aggressive female heroes.

Flying in the face of that are the women of Voyager. No matter what psychological damage or tragic history they had to overcome, they always were what they were, not what they suffered from. What Trek fans who dislike Voyager are feeling might not actually be hate. It may be more like an aggravated fear verging on outright panic that a type of TV heroine that that they thought had been eliminated or marginalized in the years since the series ended won't be forgotten, and could rise again.

What they're feeling is the terror of potential.

Ian Grey is a New York writer whose work on visual arts, music, and identity politics have been published by Press Play, Baltimore City Paper, Lacanian Ink, The Prague Post, The Perfect Sound, Salon, Gothic.net, Smart Money, Time Out New York, and other forums. A novel on trauma, sex work and sound is now being shopped.

# ¿ Jun 8, 2014 23:35

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Star Trek sure was great, shame they haven't made anything new since 2001 :shepface:

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 02:55

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

The Bible posted:

Voyager movie

These guys still got it

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 03:09

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

I would be down for a voyager movie set 10 years after their return to earth. Harry Kim has told his parents to gently caress off and become an electronic musician. Tom Paris is divorced, fat and has to send his alimony checks to the Klingon consulate. Now the Doctor must reunite them to stop Chakotay, who has been living as a tour guide in Central America, from going back in time to change their lovely lives.

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 03:20

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Just cast someone good as Lore and have him own nuKirk and nuSpock a poo poo ton.

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 07:29

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Shinzon just started shaving his skull as a teenager so the Reman women wouldn't think he was gross.

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 22:00

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Pretty much exactly, although the way the director phrased it on the DVD is still hilarious: "I wasn't that familiar, erm, with the mileu of 'the Star Trek.'"

Also in my opinion DS9 had already taken the classic Star Trek setting to its limit. Setting aside First Contact (which I like, if you don't w/e) Voyager also stretched the borg out as villains pretty much as far as you could go. Enterprise finally tried something really new with the chronal war but the first season is just a boring slog of retreads: the Vulcans get slotted into the Romulans' role, there's an obligatory Ferengi episode, etc. DS9 took the Federation as a concept and actually challenged it, showed how a massive war plays out in the Alpha Quadrant, and filled in a lot of information on the mainstay races. A reboot was virtually inevitable because they had pretty much done the most interesting stuff the Alpha Quadrant had to offer already.

# ¿ Jun 11, 2014 22:30

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

It was cool whenever they remembered Janeway was actually a former science officer and could come up with treknobabble solutions as well as anybody. Which I think happened maybe... twice?

# ¿ Jun 12, 2014 04:20

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Baronjutter posted:

I always found it weird how in the future humans have basically he exact same cultural and racial mix as 80's or 90's USA. I don't think this is racism on the part of the casting, but a chilling reminder that in WWIII china/india/pakistan all nuked each other and europe barely survived. In fact from what we can see in startrek, north america was the only place that really survived the gene-wars or what ever. They then went out and re-colonized the world doing their best to ape the long dead cultures that came before. People with connections to those places were obviously sent there with priority, but sometimes they had to be "close enough" with chinese being sent to Japan, or Yorkies being sent to France. America only had so many ex-pats and minorities to re-colonize the world with.

That or just lazy racist casting that, through all its progressive noise, failed to remember that a vast majority of the world isn't american let alone white.

At least DS9 had the lowest number of white humans.

Also humans in the federation are still pretty racist and there's totally a sense of human superiority with all the other members being there for decoration. They're always talking about "advancing human knowledge" or doing something for "humanity" and people often talk like the federation or enterprise is 100% humans. That's another odd thing, with how many federation members there are humans would be a very tiny minority. Humans have what, earth and some lovely under-developed colonies? Each member is at least their home-world plus their own lovely colonies if they have any. Maybe not every planet in the federation is as populated as earth, but even so there's tons of members, each probably having a homeworld with a few billion. But maybe humans make up the military caste in federation society with members simply maintaining local defense fleets.

That or the accusations that the federation is an expansionist power simply enslaving the galaxy with a softer touch than any of the other self-titled empires do is true. Maybe there's a glass ceiling for non-humans and it's really hard for them to get into starfleet other than a token amount for PR reasons, but kept human-majority so the rest of the federation knows who the boss is. Once you're in the federation your planet's resources are all fed towards Sol to fuel the shipyards of mars and support the massive military-industrial complex of Earth. It seems like every other human is in starfleet or working for starfleet. Humans have positioned them selves as the military and political leaders over a vast majority of aliens they've duped, bribed, or blackmailed into their "federation".

That alien federation president in DS9 was totally their obama, used by humans to say all accusations of human-centrism was unfounded and that the federation is living in a post-species world.

Who bought Quark an SA account?

# ¿ Jun 12, 2014 22:01

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

The original idea was for Tasha Yar's half-romulan character to be behind the coup which would have made a ton more sense at least, but IIRC John Logan and the producers needed to shoehorn in a major plot for Picard so they came up with the clone thing and agh god why do I remember so much trivia about this awful loving movie :psyduck:

# ¿ Jun 12, 2014 23:03

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Shadow posted:

I love that he planned that for weeks but couldn't simply not shave his cheeks. The "evil twin with the fake mustache (beard)" cliche was retarded.

Although that episode was kinda stupid in general.

God forbid the TV show about space politics have any fun moments, huh?

# ¿ Jun 17, 2014 23:02

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Tellarites are walking, talking pigs who have an entire culture based around turning everything into an argument and laying down sick burns. How can you note love them?

# ¿ Jun 17, 2014 23:09

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

IIRC the all-spandex costumes they wore in the first season of TNG had to be constantly ironed (while being worn!) to stay completely wrinkle-free and actually started causing knee/back problems for the actors because they were basically onesies held completely tight by stirrups under the shoes. :pseudo:

# ¿ Jun 27, 2014 00:32

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

SolidSnakesBandana posted:

I think Neelix isn't that bad. At least he means well. I think the real worst character in all of Trek is Kes. Just sucks the life out of every scene she's in. Plus the fact that she's like two years old and has some gross-rear end mating poo poo going on.

Also the episode where Tom marries Kes, then they have a daughter who marries Harry Kim and then they have an asian son. All over the course of a couple years.

Kes's actress was just bad, tbqh

However she also did the voice of Agent L in the Men in Black cartoon so she'll always be aces with me for that!

# ¿ Jun 27, 2014 07:06

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Everything that happened in that episode was some kind of sick sexual fantasy for the writer, including the sac of empty skin growing on her back

# ¿ Jun 27, 2014 08:04

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

I love that season 2 episode where the station's automated security system goes nuts and starts progressively ramping up ways to kill everyone onboard. They ask Dukat for help and he gets to be a huge smug dick until he gets stuck with them, then it turns into him and Kira arguing until Garak tells Dukat to stop flirting haha.

# ¿ Jul 1, 2014 05:41

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

"They never went anywhere with it" is basically the refrain of Voyager.

# ¿ Jul 1, 2014 06:15

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

I suspect a big part of why TNG holds up so well, even though it has a ton of downright stupid episodes, is the cast actually liked each other and largely enjoyed their work. Some of Voyager's regulars were clearly dissatisfied with the show and I think it reflected in Garrett Wang and Robert Beltran's acting. But who knows maybe I've read too many Star Trek Insiders and I'm projecting. :v:

# ¿ Jul 1, 2014 22:11

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

redshirt posted:

The Enterprise/Nemesis combo broke me/broke Trek.

We are a generation that basically lost our souls in 2002

# ¿ Jul 2, 2014 04:57

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

TheCenturion posted:

Ooh, ooh, or better yet, Voyager gets back to a major Starbase. Janeway turns to Chakotay (staring into his good eye, regarding his horribly scarred face) and says 'I got them home, Chakotay. Was it worth it?' Suddenly, a phaser rings out, and she's killed. Camera pans over to Harry Kim, who's been desperately trying to maintain his Starfleet morals and ideals the entire series. "No," he says, tears streaming down his face. "It wasn't."

Replace line with "CHAKOTAY DON'T TELL MY PARENTS"

# ¿ Jul 3, 2014 00:27

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

My actual feeling is you could do those themes and do them well without turning Star Trek into Warhammer 40,000, you know? Also Khan is a common given and family name in much of Asia, if it was a title I assume it'd follow his name as in "Noonien Singh Khan."

# ¿ Jul 3, 2014 00:31

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Even Neelix had the potential to be a good character. Yea he was a lovely possessive boyfriend to Kes but he is basically a junk dealer from a species that got genocided in the galactic third world, no poo poo he was gonna be kind of a shifty/shady dude. It was actually a cool idea to have Voyager basically reliant on him as a guide and have him give basically this underclass/realistic perspective on stuff when he's like "don't even waste your time with these guys, they're assholes." Kind of reminds me how Sacajewa's husband in the Lewis and Clarke expedition was this totally abusive alcoholic rear end in a top hat cuz that's the kind of dude who tends to end up away from civilization on the frontier. I liked it whenever they hinted that his constant cheerful attitude was basically his cover for being an enormously messed up person who'd lived through an actual genocide and that one episode where he comes face to face with this guy who was basically Dr. Mangele to the Talaxians was p. good. Too bad they undermined the character by having this alleged self-sufficient survivor walk right into danger more often than Scooby Doo

# ¿ Jul 4, 2014 00:07

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Trixie Hardcore posted:

I always got the impression that what annoyed Tuvok was all the dipshits on Voyager, not trying to be a Vulcan. He seemed to have that Vulcan poo poo down but had a short temper for humans (and Neelix) insisting he not behave like a Vulcan.

Tuvok clearly enjoyed playing his lute, missed having it with him but obviously wasn't going "waste replicator rations" by re-creating it & it always annoyed me that Janeway didn't just replicate him a loving lute & insist he keep it. Like, bitch, you've known him for years, you know he misses his goddamn lute. He mentions it aloud a couple times. That one time everyone was hallucinating the thing they wanted most Tuvok hallucinated his wife & his lute. There's an otherwise terrible episode about these aliens that age backwards & when they are old they are little kids that get eaten by a cave or some poo poo & Tuvok sings them a Vulcan lullaby & it's like drat Tuvok is a better character than this show deserves.

Poor Tuvok, even Harry had his stupid loving flute. Incidentally how lol is it that tiger moms are still around in the 24th century

E: also what was great is how Neelix prides himself on being this worldly jack-of-all-trades and because of how Ocampans soak up knowledge Kes was basically completely better than him at all his own skills after like one year, in my head canon that's why he was always acting like Kes would leave him for the first Tom Paris to look her way

Harime Nui fucked around with this message at 00:32 on Jul 4, 2014

# ¿ Jul 4, 2014 00:14

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

redshirt posted:

A bold assertion:

The best Trek is when they are focusing on a species other than human.

The best TNG episodes, for example, in general, are the ones dealing with Klingon or Romulan affairs.

The best DS9 episodes explore Cardassia or Bajor or the Dominion.

The only exception to this assertion are DS9 Ferengi episodes. I just couldn't care about the happenings on Feringar.

The Magnificent Ferengi is a great loving episode, actually

Otisburg posted:

Holy poo poo what episode has Ensign Kim's mom being a Tiger Mom? My friend say it is I who am the racist because I think Kim is lazily written as the stereotypical emasculated "omega male" Asian stereotype, so I require more evidence to make fun of his Star Trucks.

At various points Janeway says about Harry "I promised his mother I'd take care of him!" Basically the implication is Harry's mom literally called up the captain of her adult son's first ship and was all aggressive PTA-style "you better make sure my boy does good and doesn't get into mischief out there!"

poo poo they even have that one episode where the evil clown literally mocks Harry for being a giant emasculated baby.

# ¿ Jul 5, 2014 02:44

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Night Crew killin it

# ¿ Jul 5, 2014 05:06

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# ¿ May 4, 2024 18:09

Harime Nui: Apr 15, 2008; The New Insincerity

Let's all stand together, Neelix fans

# ¿ Jul 11, 2014 22:33

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