|
25k/yr should be below minimum wage. Flipping burgers should pay more (and does, in many places). That said, the fact that you're in detroit changes things. You're still well within your right to ask for a proper salary. Just remember that they're the assholes here, not you. If they really just dont have the finances to pay you, do you really want to be working for them? If they're a charitable organization or something then take that into consideration, but if they have money but are lowballing you because of the poor economic condition of the surrounding area, gently caress them. DONT THREAD ON ME fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Mar 5, 2014 |
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 05:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 19:12 |
|
|
Evil SpongeBob posted:I'd love to hear stories or advice on negotiating benefits as opposed to salary. Like relocation, hiring bonus, etc. Assign a number to everything: what's it worth to you, and what do you think it's worth to your potential employer. That's what they're doing. It all comes down to total cost of employment from their perspective and they'll probably amortize any signing bonus over your expected term in job (or total employment period) if they're worth anything. Health benefits are worth to you what your actual expected costs are, or the cost of desired coverage. If their coverage doesn't match up to what you want, ask for increased salary to allow for you to buy supplemental coverage to make up the difference. The post above has a few good thoughts on vacation - if you want 3 weeks and they give you two, make it up with an extra week of pay. Relocation and signing bonus are sort of in the same bucket - they're a payment to you to reduce your risk of transition. As I mentioned above, this bakes into your total comp / cost calc so if you're getting a really exceptional pay package you might need to be willing to give on this (and vice versa). Key to negotiating all these pieces successfully is to treat everything as a package deal. Don't let the company get you pinned down on pay before you know what the benefits package is like, for example. This allows you to use the tactic I noted above where you trade off increases in one area of total comp for unwillingness or inability to increase in other areas. If you get settled on pay before you know benefits, you lose a lot of the leverage that you might otherwise have.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 07:47
|
|
|
USSMICHELLEBACHMAN posted:25k/yr should be below minimum wage. Flipping burgers should pay more (and does, in many places). They aren't a charitable/NPO; it's a furniture store with several partners throughout the state and seems to be doing well. I get the feeling they are low balling me because of my lack of experience, not necessarily financial. I'll try submitting a counter offer, but if they can't even meet close to it, I will end up walking. Transmogrifier fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Mar 5, 2014 |
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 13:03
|
|
|
Transmogrifier posted:They aren't a charitable/NPO; it's a furniture store with several partners throughout the state and seems to be doing well. I get the feeling they are low balling me because of my lack of experience, not necessarily financial. I'll try submitting a counter offer, but if they can't even meet close to it, I will end up walking. As to the 90 days salary adjustment, keep in mind that a 10% raise is absolutely astonishing, so there's no way they're going to bring you up to market then if they hired you at 25k.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 15:39
|
|
|
Keep looking for jobs. Use them as practice for negotiation with dipshits and getting your backbone to calcify.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 16:25
|
|
|
Transmogrifier posted:I've been offered a full time position as a Front End Web Developer/Designer. I'm a relatively fresh out of college graduate (six months) with some industry experience. They offered me $25K/yr, which right off the bat I knew was low, and my search into entry level positions in that area shows the offer is definitely 50% less. There is a review after 90 days that could result in a pay increase, assuming I've transitioned into the web side of everything. They did not specify how much that pay increase could be. Given my lack of experience, is it still acceptable for me to request something higher? Not necessarily the 55K that entry level Front End Web Developers are making, but definitely more than 25K. DISCLAIMER: I've only negotiated once, though it was successful. I think I would ask if the offer was a typo as it's waaaaay below market and possibly less than minimum wage (didn't do the calculations). It also kind of allows them to save face and offer you a proper salary if they were lowballing you. At least this is what first came to mind when I read the situation. 2banks1swap.avi posted:Keep looking for jobs. Use them as practice for negotiation with dipshits and getting your backbone to calcify. This is the best idea.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 16:26
|
|
|
Transmogrifier posted:They aren't a charitable/NPO; it's a furniture store with several partners throughout the state and seems to be doing well. I get the feeling they are low balling me because of my lack of experience, not necessarily financial. I'll try submitting a counter offer, but if they can't even meet close to it, I will end up walking. I think working with these people will be an arduous experience for you and you have received a warning bell right up front. I suggest you tell them that your expectations are that the salary for entry level work in your industry is approximately $55k and that's what you're seeking. Not "around 55k". 55k. Do not accept a position with them for a penny less. Use this as an opportunity to practice saying no to people, to practice being firm in negotiations, and to understand that the world is full of malicious people who will take advantage of you given the chance. MAYBE you come out of it with a job that pays $55k a year, which can be nice, but I don't think you should even stop looking if you do. The way you're discussing your position in this thread; you don't sound very confident. They probably honed in on that. Entry level means exactly the position you're in; unproven in industry, but with strong evidence that you're appropriate to the work involved and relevant work experience and schooling. Which means you should be taking home that 55k. You're WAY ahead of the game compared to your peers though. Just taking the time to read up on negotiation, doing research into market pricing, and questioning if the salary you are offered is sufficient is more than many fresh grads do. You absolutely can earn more and should feel confident that with a little time and patience you can get it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 17:13
|
|
|
Thanks for all of the posts. Dwight Eisenhower, you're right in that I'm lacking a little confidence in this particular aspect of my life; whether or not they honed in on that, I'm not sure. It's very possible they're also hoping to take advantage of my recent graduate status and assume I will take any salary offer they give me if it means I'm in the door and working. I do want a good, full time position, but not by sacrificing the deserved pay the kind of work I do comes with. One of the big reasons I went into this particular field was become of the money. Regarding minimum wage versus the offer itself, 25k/yr is about 12/hr. The minimum wage in Michigan is 7.40/hr, which is stupidly low. The 25K is made worse by the fact I have a pretty good chance at an internship with Quicken Loans for 11/hr this summer, and that could turn into a full time position. Rest assured, I will ask for 55K and if I do not get it, I will walk away.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 18:07
|
|
|
Is there something keeping you in Detroit? Even aside from the furniture store's offer being laughably below the prevailing market wage, there are many, many other cities with much better job markets for a programmer or graphic designer, and most decent sized firms (and even startups in Cali) will pay to relocate you.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 18:50
|
|
|
Otto Skorzeny posted:Is there something keeping you in Detroit? Even aside from the furniture store's offer being laughably below the prevailing market wage, there are many, many other cities with much better job markets for a programmer or graphic designer, and most decent sized firms (and even startups in Cali) will pay to relocate you. Nothing aside from family and friends. I'm single, no dependents. I'm not against relocating. I sent my counter offer of 55K, citing the market of the city, surrounding areas, and nation wide, as well as my having a Bachelor's, and they fired back saying that "because it's an entry level position they can't pay that much." They offered to do 30K, which would have been the salary increase after 90 days while still having room for salary increases as I improve. I will be writing my rejection letter shortly. Thank you, again, for helping me out and giving me a little more solid ground to stand on.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 19:09
|
|
|
Transmogrifier posted:Nothing aside from family and friends. I'm single, no dependents. I'm not against relocating. For reference my very first development job (that I got totally screwed on, and wish I had known more about negotiation and had more aggression in my bones) paid $45k/year in 2003 with a B.S. in Computer Science and a couple of months interning at $10/hr. It can sting to walk on an income. But if the best they were getting to is 30K, you were never going to be viewed as anything other than a cost center, and never appreciated for your talents.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 19:52
|
|
|
Transmogrifier posted:Nothing aside from family and friends. I'm single, no dependents. I'm not against relocating. Here, I wrote it for you: quote:Hahahahahahahahahahah, no.
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 19:55
|
|
|
Dwight Eisenhower posted:For reference my very first development job (that I got totally screwed on, and wish I had known more about negotiation and had more aggression in my bones) paid $45k/year in 2003 with a B.S. in Computer Science and a couple of months interning at $10/hr. It actually didn't really sting. I already was insulted by the low offer but you guys here in the thread and others I talked to really helped reinforce what bullshit it was so I only got more annoyed. You were all absolutely right: if the best they can initially offer is 25K, chances are it's a crap place to work and I've dodged a bullet. So, again, thank you. FrozenVent posted:Here, I wrote it for you: If only.  That was my reaction for sure though, with an added, "Yeah right!"
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 20:04
|
|
|
In your email, you should say something like 'I'm sure you'll be able to find a high schooler or intern who would be thrilled with your offer.'
|
|
#
?
Mar 5, 2014 20:56
|
|
|
USSMICHELLEBACHMAN posted:In your email, you should say something like 'I'm sure you'll be able to find a high schooler or intern who would be thrilled with your offer.' Literally said this to a potential employer when I was freelance. They wanted to pay me $50 per web design at a high volume. I laughed in their faces.
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2014 01:41
|
|
|
Thank you spwrozek and Kalenn Istarion. I had my first quick phone conversation with HR recently. Unfortunately, my government salary is published, but thanks for the tips on the "complete package".
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2014 01:45
|
|
|
If a company has a stated policy of paying whatever you make +10% can I assume this is just something they say hoping for an easy negotiation? I already know their ceiling for the role/level I'm interested in and I'm fine with a number there or even a little below but I'm really looking for ~20% more than what I currently make. I kind of find it weird they would really base pay on a percentage as a hard rule; what if I'm outrageously overpaid and how can they really verify whatever I'm making? I guess they could request a W2 but is that legal?
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2014 22:50
|
|
|
Sounds like they're just trying to anchor to your current pay. Just tell them to make you an offer. It's up to you to decide once they've offered it whether it's sufficient. I don't live in the states but from discussion here and elsewhere I understand it to be fully in your rights to say no to giving them a W2.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 00:54
|
|
|
Cross-postin' a bit from the Accounting thread, but is tangential to this thread as well: I'm a recent Accounting grad (May 2013) with a 3.72 accounting GPA. Midwest. Non-traditional student with a lot of customer service and manufacturing work experience, but I'm not over 30. Yet. (Still employed at a Fortune 50 company, in a role that should be management-level, but we have a habit of dangling carrots in front of our hourly people as a way to "gain experience". FML.) I've been applying around, and have landed 4 phone interviews for entry-level accounting positions in industries (not accounting firms) so far. Yay me. Unfortunately, three of these interviews asked me about salary. I took the advice of this badass thread and got them to tell me the range for the positions, which has been around $32k-$36k.  One of these was a fluffed-up payables/receivables position, so I don't really count that one. But one was a full-on Accounting position, and another was a Revenue Analyst position (which is pretty close to accounting, kinda).I'm already making more than that. My company hires fresh Accounting grads in at $57k, and we're proud that we pay market rates, so I've been using that as my number for the "my research indicates that the ballpark market rate for Accounting grads is $57k", with the expectation that maybe I might accept down to 52k-ish, depending on benefits. I'm wondering if maybe I should have said "thanks but no thanks" to these people at the end of the call? So far I've been saying things like "Well, I did say ballpark, and it could depend on what the rest of total compensation looked like . . ." with the hope that maybe the hiring manager would approve something more in line with what I want, should I make it to the next round. But, I know deep in my heart that I literally WILL NOT move for anything less than $50k, and would have to consider very strongly anything less than $52k (which is conveniently 25% above what I'm making now, give or take). 1). Anyone know if I'm aiming way too high here? 2). Ugh, maybe I should just look for stuff in manufacturing (management, etc.) and be one of those people who "got a job in something other than what his degree was in" 3). #2 is a horrible idea, somebody talk me out of this
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 00:56
|
|
|
Kalenn Istarion posted:Sounds like they're just trying to anchor to your current pay. Just tell them to make you an offer. It's up to you to decide once they've offered it whether it's sufficient. I don't live in the states but from discussion here and elsewhere I understand it to be fully in your rights to say no to giving them a W2. Also from negotiation viewpoint it's always best to force the other party to show their cards. Companies demanding things like previous salary information is driven the recruiters goal to bring you onboard without giving you a higher side offer. They pretty much take your previous salary and then just add some cost of living adjustments plus mid-range offer to cut the down the new hire cost. It's pretty much driven by how acquisition costs is one of the big metrics recruiters get graded in terms of yearly performance evaluations.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 02:16
|
|
|
Evil SpongeBob posted:I'd love to hear stories or advice on negotiating benefits as opposed to salary. Like relocation, hiring bonus, etc. I tried to negotiate on vacation time when I accepted my current position. It's a smaller tech company, in the 50-100 employee range. The benefits at the time were not super competitive in the industry, but they said they were working on improving them. The defined benefit policy was 2 weeks/yr to start, and the job I was considering leaving was 3 weeks/yr. I went back and forth a couple of times, basically telling them I was declining the job unless they could increase the vacation time. They just straight out refused to do it, but every time they came back with another 3-4k/yr. I ended up taking the job once they upped the salary by about 5k from their starting offer (which was already about 5k over my previous job's salary) plus a signing bonus of a few thousand dollars. It still amuses me that they were happy to increase my salary by like 3x the dollar value of a week of vacation, but hey at some point money talks. But now since I've joined the vacation policy has been upped to 3 weeks/yr across the board, sick time has improved from use-it-or-lose it to roll-over, health insurance costs have decreased, and our Fidelity 401k now has cheap Spartan index funds to choose from. So huzzah. I don't know if that really answers your question very well, but in my one experience trying to play hardball on benefits they were pretty unwilling to budge on stuff like vacation/sick days, but were happy to increase salary or pay a signing bonus.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 02:58
|
|
|
OK so I can pretty much blow by that 10% thing. It only came up when an external recruiter contacted me and I pretty much said "ok whatever cross that bridge if I reach it" but both the internal recruiter and company haven't mentioned 10%. They told me the hard ceiling for the level I'd be at and since its a large company I assume that is probably truth and not a negotiation thing. I'd be happy at that number or a little under but at my pay + 10%
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 03:55
|
|
|
Zarin posted:Cross-postin' a bit from the Accounting thread, but is tangential to this thread as well: I don't know accounting salaries that well, but if you've done your research and are confident in the salary range then stick to it, particularly since you're already in a job that pays nearly as well. A lot of places will market jobs that are essentially book-keeping or data entry as accounting so you need to be really careful about what they're asking you to do. Have you considered going to CPA route? You need to spend some lovely years getting your letters but once you have it your options open up considerably and the salary range goes up noticeably as well.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 03:59
|
|
|
Xguard86 posted:I guess they could request a W2 but is that legal? There are a small number of companies that request your W2. They are all awful, as you could expect.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 04:15
|
|
|
Guinness posted:I don't know if that really answers your question very well, but in my one experience trying to play hardball on benefits they were pretty unwilling to budge on stuff like vacation/sick days, but were happy to increase salary or pay a signing bonus. It's the whole point of the negotiation either party rarely gets everything but you tend to come out instead vs. accepting the standard offer from the recruiter without any negotiation tactics. In your case you got a bigger signing bonus and also better starting salary.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 04:20
|
|
|
Kalenn Istarion posted:I don't know accounting salaries that well, but if you've done your research and are confident in the salary range then stick to it, particularly since you're already in a job that pays nearly as well. A lot of places will market jobs that are essentially book-keeping or data entry as accounting so you need to be really careful about what they're asking you to do. Have you considered going to CPA route? You need to spend some lovely years getting your letters but once you have it your options open up considerably and the salary range goes up noticeably as well. I definitely want to get a professional designation; trick is, even if I take the test, I'm not a CPA until I have work experience. Same with CMA or CIA. The plan is to pick up an Accounting job that pays better than what I make now, grind out a test while gaining the experience, and then either get more pay there or go wherever I want after that. I have done the research though, and while $57k is what my company pays, I'm tossing that out as a "high end" with the expectation that I'll accept something somewhat less for a smaller company, etc. Worst case, I'll just pursue something in my current field and just forget accounting altogether, I guess. There are certainly other avenues to pursue, such as American Society for Quality certifications or Six Sigma Black Belt, etc.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 05:08
|
|
|
Why not talk to HR at your current shop to see if there are any spots open to make the move?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 05:25
|
|
|
Kalenn Istarion posted:Why not talk to HR at your current shop to see if there are any spots open to make the move? There aren't, unfortunately. I had an interview in Fall 2012, and company policy states that I cannot interview again until Fall 2014. Otherwise, the company is hemorrhaging employees at both the management and hourly level currently, so there are not many opportunities for advancement at the moment. Everyone I have talked to is under the impression that any open jobs have already been filled before they were even posted, but are posted for the sake of formality. (Yay policy) I did talk to HR at one point when I was rejected for a position due to the fact that I graduated in Spring 2013 and they were looking for December 2013 graduates. In other words, I was rejected because I already had my degree. HR brushed me off with an excuse that I proved false in under five minutes.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2014 05:35
|
|
|
This was an e-mail chain that went back and forth between myself and a local recruiter. I had been offered a position at $30/hr, but it had zero benefits (no PTO, 401k, anything). I think it's a good example of telling someone to go gently caress themselves in the most polite of terms. For reference, I had countered asking for 5 days of PTO time.Recruiter posted:Deviant– We got word back from our VP and the PTO was not approved. Sorry but we tried. As we talked about yesterday, I’m hoping that you keep the big picture in mind with the great pay of $30/hour, the company being $CLIENT, the doors that it can open up for you, and everything else we talked about. Deviant posted:I'm afraid I'm going to have to decline. I thank you for all your time, help, and consideration, and I apologize for the inconvenience I've caused to both $COMPANY and $CLIENT. Recruiter posted:Well that’s disappointing for all parties. For future reference, you should definitely make sure you understand all aspects of positions moving forward so you don’t waste your time and the companies time. I’ll make sure Eric and I get together to discuss what he did or did not talk with you about so moving forward we can make sure everything is on the table with other candidates so we don’t run in to the same issue. Here is where I lose my poo poo. I wrote and rewrote this e-mail for about 4 hours. Deviant posted:Thank you for your candor in our ongoing discussion regarding the position. Unfortunately, it appears as though we won't be able to negotiate a set of agreeable terms. While I regret not learning of the policies regarding overtime, and holiday earlier in the process, I could hardly negotiate effectively prior to a formal offer being made. Furthermore, I don't see negotiation for a position as 'wasting time', nor do I appreciate the vague threat implied by 'we really don’t want to have to tell $CLIENT you declined the offer based on this as that won’t look good for you or us.'. As such, I must respectfully decline the position as well as employment with $RECRUITER a whole. In conclusion: Always negotiate, you owe recruiters less than nothing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 16:34
|
|
|
You handled that incredibly well, much better than I would have.
|
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 16:42
|
|
|
 There's no way that recruiter is for real.
|
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 17:27
|
|
|
Hand of the King posted:
They exist. Apex Systems. I also copied that last email to his boss, and about an hour later I got a much more polite apology. Deviant fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Mar 10, 2014 |
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 17:42
|
|
|
Man, recruiters, particularly third-party, are terrible. I don't even bother looking at third-party recruiter messages anymore, especially the ones that won't tell you the name of the company they're recruiting for up front. I know there are decent recruiters out there, I've dealt with a small handful of them and they were mostly first-party recruiters. But man the majority of them are just awful and give everyone a bad rep. You handled that pretty well.
|
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 18:05
|
|
|
Echoing the "you handled that well." When someone gives you a crappy offer and says "but think of the other benefits" the natural inclination is to say "screw this." And 99 times out of a 100 (or maybe 999 out of a 1000) that's the right response. There are some pretty wild exceptions to the rule where you take a short term hit for a long term gain, but it's impossible to know if it'll be worth it up front.
|
|
#
?
Mar 10, 2014 20:30
|
|
|
I have a phone interview for a position on Wednesday, and my friend who works there briefed me. It's a small company, and he said they're going to ask me straight up what my salary requirements are, as they did to him. It's not with HR, it's with the head of the department who would be my boss. Apparently they just want to know what you expect to make. This is also pretty close to a 'dream job' for me. I would consider even taking a pay cut for this job, it's closer to home, they have catered lunch and dinner, subsidize public transportation, etc etc. They even do a 401k and in my industry that's actually kind of rare. Also stock options! My current job has no 401k, no stock, and is an hour commute. How do I approach this? The would be great career wise, even at a pay cut, but I obviously don't want to take one if I don't have to.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 00:22
|
|
|
You tell them your max you want to see and work from there. Something like 'I would expect to make $X based on the responsibilities of the position'. They may offer you less and you can go from there.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
Hopefully this isn't breaking rules/derailing, but this thread makes me so happy that I am changing careers from teaching to engineering. With teaching I had over 5 years experience, graduate hours, and multiple certifications. I was literally stuck at 30K per year though. For five long years! I couldn't demand more because of the statewide public salary scale, and on the other side, principals had literally no authority to offer me more. I had a combination of certifications that got me hired on the spot for 2 of my last 3 positions. But none of that could get me a higher salary. I have a feeling that if schools were private entities with private funding, I would be making my dream number by now and wouldn't have left teaching. Thanks for nothing, state of North Carolina.  I can't wait to get through school a second time and actually be able to have a salary discussion with private sector employers, even though for my first job I don't anticipate being able to negotiate very much. But any number > 30K is going to make me drool.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 02:30
|
|
|
Beast of Bourbon posted:I have a phone interview for a position on Wednesday, and my friend who works there briefed me. It's a small company, and he said they're going to ask me straight up what my salary requirements are, as they did to him. It's not with HR, it's with the head of the department who would be my boss. Apparently they just want to know what you expect to make. This is also pretty close to a 'dream job' for me. I would consider even taking a pay cut for this job, it's closer to home, they have catered lunch and dinner, subsidize public transportation, etc etc. They even do a 401k and in my industry that's actually kind of rare. Also stock options! My current job has no 401k, no stock, and is an hour commute. If they're generous on benefits they usually won't be lovely on pay, although it is possible. I would take your target salary (not your minimum acceptable salary), add 10 or 15% and start there. You never know, they might shoot for the high end of the market for a reason. If they're smart, they will apply the value of their off-market benefits to your total comp calculation in their counter-offer so you need to figure out what that stuff (plus the dream job value) is worth to you to derive your minimum acceptable total comp: - what's daily lunch and dinner cost for you * 260 - fuel savings from shorter commute or value of transit subsidy if you take transit - tax benefits of 401k and any employer matching Add all that to the salary they give you in their counter-offer and compare that number to what you're getting paid now and what an external source says salaries in your industry are.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 03:02
|
|
|
Deviant posted:They exist. Apex Systems. Oh Jesus. My friends and I have a game where we gently caress with bottom feeding, email-spamming recruiters from companies like this. I'm in UX, but about once a week I'll get a posting about a 3-month, Jr. PHP developer job across the country for 1/8th of what I make. Usually we let those go, but we like to treat the more persistent ones to belligerent, rambling, all around insulting emails that we copy each other on. Some of the recruiters are seriously terrible people. FrozenVent posted:As to the 90 days salary adjustment, keep in mind that a 10% raise is absolutely astonishing, so there's no way they're going to bring you up to market then if they hired you at 25k. Really want to highlight this. I can't speak for all industries, but in the technology world, once you're working for a company, you're basically making all you ever will make without another offer in hand. Bonuses come and go with the economy, and they're pegged at a percentage of your salary, so if you start low, your bonus will be low too. Raises will only ever be a handful of percentage points a year. Stock options are generally completely worthless unless you're at hot startup or going in at an executive level. Contract-to-hire will be, at best, a lateral move. I really can't emphasize enough how important it is to start at a salary that makes you happy. By all means, take other benefits into account when you're negotiating that last 10%, but at the end of the day if the dollar amount is not something you're satisfied with, it will not change substantially until you leave or are ready to leave for another offer. Make it count.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 05:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 19:12 |
|
|
So I have a verbal offer from a large company, which I received yesterday, and an email from them with "offer Components". It's a consulting firm that deals mostly with Microsoft technologies. I referred a friend to this company by way of a recruiter who had emailed me about the same position 9 months ago (at the time I wasn't interested in moving.) I was expecting to make the same, if not more than that friend. When he interviewed he had no consulting experience, no Microsoft Certifications, a bachelor's degree from a smaller public university (I believe it was Robert Morris) and 6 years of technical experience. I just finished the interview process, and my qualifications, vs his are I have 2 years of consulting experience, an MCSE (high level microsoft certification) and 5 years technical experience, as well as 2 straight years of experience in the piece of software that they were looking to hire for. When we started the process, they asked me how much I wanted to make. Knowing his salary, I said 95-100k. They said that the way to do that would be to get me in the "Consultant" position (which is the position he is in). The offer finally came today and it was base $86k with $5k signing bonus, and 10 days vacation (I would be losing 5 vacation days if I moved). This offer was presented by a different internal recruiter than the one I had been working with. I know that their promotion scheme hinges on actual consulting experience and you are supposed to get raises the more Microsoft Certs you have. They said if I want to start March 31st that I need to get back to them by friday, and if I want to start mid-April I have until next week. Is it too late to go back to them and say "I believe I'm worth the 95-100 that I initially asked for, and would like to start at 3 weeks vacation." I'm terrible at this negotiation thing! I also am expecting an offer from another large consulting firm today (was actually supposed to get it yesterday but never heard from them). Should I use that as a play? I read the thread but I don't know if this applies to large firms that have strict definitions for positions and what they pay. Any suggestions would be much appreciated!
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2014 15:38
|
|