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Kyrie eleison posted:but a lot of people just hate religion for the same reason people have always hated religion, it tells you to be a good person and respect all human life, even if it's not the most pragmatic/consequentialist outcome for yourself or society which religion are we tolkein about here, theres a whole lot of them and not all of them say that
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Aug 21, 2014 10:17
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Please go to church
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Aug 21, 2014 10:18
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I have developed my own system of ethics but my revelatory impulse comes in the form of mocking internet posts
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Aug 21, 2014 10:20
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Kyrie eleison posted:i am certain atheists exists, i'm saying that some atheists have a spiritual side (which i would consider the same thing as a religious side) and that others have turned against their spiritual side in a way that results in evil ideology. oh okay I can agree with that but you also have to agree that "spiritual" in no way means "religious", they might serve analogous functions but they are not the same thing. religion means a belief in a higher power, whatever that may be. spirituality just means, idk if this is the dictionary definition, I think a concrete meaning for the term would probably prove elusive and I don't think most people have any more than a nebulous idea of what it means, but I reckon most people would agree that a reasonable estimation of the meaning of "spirituality" is a belief in the intrinsic value of certain things, IE the opposite of nihilism. I think most people's spirituality includes a certain value in human life, for example, even though objectively it has no more value than whatever we choose to give to it.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:23
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MotherFuckingT-REX posted:I have developed my own system of ethics but my revelatory impulse comes in the form of mocking internet posts
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Aug 21, 2014 10:23
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please continue to poo poo on this thread because it deserves it but I am compelled to real talk in it rn because I am high, tiaKyrie eleison posted:atheism definitely does deprive you of the 'respect for life' which is at the core of christianity. also this is a load of poo poo. if you really think this you are a nut.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:24
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I didn't read your post OP but I saw you typed all those words on the internet, perhaps you should move out of your parent's house so you can get a different perspective?
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Aug 21, 2014 10:27
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:oh okay I can agree with that thanks for understanding and yeah i think your post is pretty much right on. the point is that spirituality is a core part of our being that influences us towards higher purposes. the reason i say it is religious is that i think we draw a lot of spiritual influence from various religions including christianity, because they are the sources of spirituality in human history passed down from prior generations. also you are not the only high person in this thread
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Aug 21, 2014 10:28
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The Taint Reaper posted:I didn't read your post OP but I saw you typed all those words on the internet, perhaps you should move out of your parent's house so you can get a different perspective? lol i wish i still lived at my paretns also that my family wasnt like mostly dead
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Aug 21, 2014 10:30
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Kyrie eleison posted:thanks for understanding and yeah i think your post is pretty much right on. the point is that spirituality is a core part of our being that influences us towards higher purposes. the reason i say it is religious is that i think we draw a lot of spiritual influence from various religions including christianity, because they are the sources of spirituality in human history passed down from prior generations. No, spiritual traditions, by necessity, predate religious traditions. Organised religion is a way of codifying what is important to a society.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:33
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also I don't want anyone to think I am a deviant drug user I am only high because I took painkillers due to injury 
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Aug 21, 2014 10:34
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Abandon posted:So heres the skinny http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...ld-9681549.html I did not read a word of this
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Aug 21, 2014 10:34
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:also I don't want anyone to think I am a deviant drug user I am only high because I took painkillers due to injury You don't need painkillers for masturbation injuries.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:35
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:No, spiritual traditions, by necessity, predate religious traditions. Organised religion is a way of codifying what is important to a society. i won't disagree with this and also i'll take back my statement that atheism inherently deprives you of a 'respect for life', that was a troll statement really. but a lot of atheists do not respect life and a lot of anti-religious ideology opposes respect for life.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:36
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Kyrie eleison posted:i won't disagree with this and also i'll take back my statement that atheism inherently deprives you of a 'respect for life', that was a troll statement really. but a lot of atheists do not respect life and a lot of anti-religious ideology opposes respect for life. ISIS exists. Abandon posted:why doese everyone think this is a troll thread. its serious. my post sare always seriuous posts no one thought it was a troll thread TacticalUrbanHomo fucked around with this message at 10:42 on Aug 21, 2014 |
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Aug 21, 2014 10:38
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why doese everyone think this is a troll thread. its serious. my post sare always seriuous posts
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Aug 21, 2014 10:41
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:ISIS exists. ISIS is not motivated by the higher ideals of islam, it is motivated by political ideology that is supported by islamic scripture. i consider jesus the ultimate moral authority and i think islam has some core problems, but there are plenty of practicing muslims who are able to see the good aspects of the religion and discard the bad. ISIS is the opposite of that, it's basically a satanic force masquerading as a religious one, which is how that often goes.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:42
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:ISIS exists. P. sure this whole "respect for life" argument is just a semi-cunning way of saying "I don't like abortion but I know I'm going to get shitpounded if i outright say it here"
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Aug 21, 2014 10:42
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its the opposite AND ALSO note how dwakins trots out the foetus/embryo/whatever isnt a person argument. thats an argument that doesnt stand up to the most basic inquiry. do nt you think that lying to yourself and then making a moral jusdgement thatdecides whether somebody lives or dies based on that is sort of like siomething that a psycho killer would do
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Aug 21, 2014 10:45
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Abandon posted:its the opposite Lol if you think an embryo is capable of the same physiological or existential suffering as a born human
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Aug 21, 2014 10:47
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Kyrie eleison posted:ISIS is not motivated by the higher ideals of islam, it is motivated by political ideology that is supported by islamic scripture. i consider jesus the ultimate moral authority and i think islam has some core problems, but there are plenty of practicing muslims who are able to see the good aspects of the religion and discard the bad. ISIS is the opposite of that, it's basically a satanic force masquerading as a religious one, which is how that often goes. but see to ISIS what you consider to be the true "ideals of Islam" does not matter, and what you think about jesus matters even less. if you're going to arbitrarily decide that some people's religion isn't religion because it doesn't fit in to your worldview of how religion is good, then that isn't just logically fallacious, it's utterly delusional.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:47
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respect for life is dumb, a lot of life is bullshit respect for human beings on the other hand
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Aug 21, 2014 10:48
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fascism apologist also proponent of eugenics. shocking.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:49
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Quickscope420dad posted:Lol if you think an embryo is capable of the same physiological or existential suffering as a born human thats a weird definition of humanity
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Aug 21, 2014 10:49
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You should be able to kill infants
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Aug 21, 2014 10:50
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Some people are dicks and some people aren't, and this fact transcends all race, gender, nationality, religious / political / cultural affiliations. You can be a religious dick or an atheist dick. Saying someone's dickness is a result of their non/religiousness is just loving terrible
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Aug 21, 2014 10:50
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Abandon posted:AND ALSO note how dwakins trots out the foetus/embryo/whatever isnt a person argument. thats an argument that doesnt stand up to the most basic inquiry no argument does, its impossible to argue anything because literally any opinion will be destroyed by the most basic inquiry
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Aug 21, 2014 10:50
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Abandon posted:thats a weird definition of humanity Life is suffering and let this earth lay fallow
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Aug 21, 2014 10:51
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:but see to ISIS what you consider to be the true "ideals of Islam" does not matter, and what you think about jesus matters even less. if you're going to arbitrarily decide that some people's religion isn't religion because it doesn't fit in to your worldview of how religion is good, then that isn't just logically fallacious, it's utterly delusional. you're being kind of confrontational, i'm trying to respect islam as a religion by pointing out it has higher values which are good in nature, and that ISIS chooses to ignore them and instead choose the most violent/political aspects. a lot of muslims draw spiritual strength from islam which is good and legitimately makes them better people and they are welcome members of human society, but anyone who uses islam as a tool to behead lots of people in today's world has clearly gone off the deep end. i'm defending religion as a concept against those who think religion needs to be done away with altogether. religion has a great deal of value because it connects us to our past and to the highest values of our past. we should draw inspiration from the higher values as much as we can in order to satisfy our own lives and set groundwork for the future.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:53
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Kyrie eleison posted:you're being kind of confrontational, i'm trying to respect islam as a religion by pointing out it has higher values which are good in nature, and that ISIS chooses to ignore them and instead choose the most violent/political aspects. a lot of muslims draw spiritual strength from islam which is good and legitimately makes them better people and they are welcome members of human society, but anyone who uses islam as a tool to behead lots of people in today's world has clearly gone off the deep end. I agree with you that religion is important and good. Choosing to pretend that the bad aspects of it don't exist is a poor way of making that argument, however.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:54
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MotherFuckingT-REX posted:You should be able to kill infants I unironically agree, infants are basically non-human animals.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:55
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why cant we beecock threads
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Aug 21, 2014 10:57
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:I agree with you that religion is important and good. Choosing to pretend that the bad aspects of it don't exist is a poor way of making that argument, however. i don't think the bad aspects don't exist, i think that people should make theological arguments to discard the bad elements as they always have throughout history. jesus is the clearest example of this to exist because he overturned a lot of bad theology by appealing to the higher values in scripture and in spirit.
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Aug 21, 2014 10:58
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Hogge Wild posted:why cant we beecock threads ? what
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Aug 21, 2014 10:59
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Kyrie eleison posted:i don't think the bad aspects don't exist, i think that people should make theological arguments to discard the bad elements as they always have throughout history. jesus is the clearest example of this to exist because he overturned a lot of bad theology by appealing to the higher values in scripture and in spirit. And I agree that they should, but they don't (always), so you can't just say that only non-religious or anti-religious ideology is irreverent to the value of life, nor can you say that ISIS is not a religious group just because you don't like their religion.
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Aug 21, 2014 11:01
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self styled catholic intellectuals/philosophers are probably the most-deserving-of-mockery people on earth. for evidence see a confederacy of dunces
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Aug 21, 2014 11:03
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Wow, this thread took a sharp turn to fagsville real quick.
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Aug 21, 2014 11:05
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Hobohemian posted:Wow, this thread took a sharp turn to fagsville real quick. Happened at the thread title
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Aug 21, 2014 11:07
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:And I agree that they should, but they don't (always), so you can't just say that only non-religious or anti-religious ideology is irreverent to the value of life, nor can you say that ISIS is not a religious group just because you don't like their religion. i agree that people use religious ideology in a way that is against life, but i oppose such interpretations and i continue to support the higher values of religious teaching against those who think the solution is to abolish religion altogether. it's late and i have to sleep now but i enjoyed the discussion, cheers
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Aug 21, 2014 11:10
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Ocean Book posted:congrats on misunderstanding literally everything worth understanding about human history and the development of society Educate me then. What have I misunderstood exactly?
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