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Zephro posted:Yeah, this is the thing. Have the yes campaign ever pointed to Ireland? Irish independence happened under much less favourable conditions than Scottish independence would. Nowadays, though, do you think anyone at all seriously advocates re-merging with the UK? Never mind the No line that an independent Scotland would instantly fall into the sea. Some stuff would change, the country might be slightly richer or slightly poorer, but it would basically be fine in the end. These are both pretty commonly made points: a lot of this was said during the Commonwealth Games as well, which is literally an organisation of former British territories, none of which wish to rejoin. The Irish are certainly watching the referendum pretty… intently. Admittedly the official Yes campaign has mostly avoided Irish comparisons (preferring Norway, Sweden and the like) because of the inevitable Saki posted:Hopefully independence works out better for the Scots than it has the Irish. The Republic is not doing very well. Entirely unrelated to having left the UK, though. By that line of argument the UK should have stuck with the Romans to evade its own banking crash  . Ireland's got its problems, sure, but at least they're of their own making and something they can fix themselves this time around.
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Sep 4, 2014 13:05
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Zephro posted:Bush->Clinton->Bush->Obama->Quite Possibly Clinton. Not forgetting the Kennedys and their remaining weak claim to the throne 
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Sep 8, 2014 17:46
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Shyrka posted:It's a step up from being compared with Mugabe... right?  From New Statesman after Darling suggested Salmond was Kim-Jong-Il  A lovely UKIP intervention which also references Daleks
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Sep 9, 2014 17:16
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marktheando posted:People tend to be nasty online where they are anonymous, and yeah twitter is especially bad, but I haven't encountered any nastiness in person. In fact I've been very pleasantly surprised by how reasonable the non-online discussion has been, from canvassers from both sides, and from talking to friends and family. I was just at a friend's engagement party where the room was pretty evenly split (even the happy couple were on opposite sides) and there was some nice drunken discussion on the referendum. I even got into a debate with a homeless guy when I went out for a smoke (he was a committed no). I've been doing canvassing and the most hostile receptions you get are from people who are in the middle of something or think it's too late in the day for people to be knocking on their door. The 'nastiness' thing simply isn't real on the street.
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Sep 9, 2014 17:49
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Regarde Aduck posted:You are a traitor. I'm not calling for you to be shot but you are a traitor. So is most of the left in regard to Scottish independence. Wanting the UK to be broken up for vague reasons of spiting the tories or the laughable promise that it will inspire greater social fairness in England, is complete and utter nonsense. What we'll have is too weaker countries, one leftist, one rightest. Both economically troubled and weak in the face of a rising China and Russia. Scotland will be subsumed within the EU and either lose its identity (but for some weird reason it won't bother them this time) or worse, the EU will end up under the thumb of Russia. England will either face the same fate or worse, split from the EU and be isolated. The future looks loving great my leftist comrade. This is better for Yes than any of our campaign materials.
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Sep 9, 2014 19:07
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ReV VAdAUL posted:Orange order marches are the best thing. I know you're not entirely serious but don't forget it's of course about religion as well. I lived in the Netherlands for a while and fwiw they are flat out horrified by what the OO do with their royal house's name (the Dutch monarchs are still Oranje). This in a country desperately defending their right to blackface.
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Sep 23, 2014 23:59
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Whoever wins, we lose.
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Sep 25, 2014 16:37
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Spooky Hyena posted:In Scotland, they don't have a legal right to enter your home, and they also can't prosecute you without having proof that you've been watching live or as-live (ie, stuff recorded using your sky box) broadcast footage. You can even have a TV plugged in and ready to receive broadcasts, but if they don't catch you doing it from outside your house there's nothing they can prosecute for. Building on this, you know those vans they drive around? They can only differentiate between seperate buildings, so if you're in a block of flats it's not impossible they've just block mailed your entire building. They literally cannot tell unless someone rang that snooper line about you.
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Sep 25, 2014 21:29
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Detector vans stopped being usable at all once the analogue signal got switched off (and would have had rapidly-dwindling hit rates before that as more and more televisions moved to digital tuners), but realistically stopped being practical some time before that when the density of homes with televisions going up met the price of database searches coming down and it got more economically viable to just blast mail at everyone without a license. They used to park them outside our student flats, but I didn't realise how total a bluff it actually was.
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Sep 25, 2014 21:41
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serious gaylord posted:It's up to you to go 'look, I don't have any of these apps, heres my store history to prove i never downloaded them. I've also never visited the BBC sport website while a live stream was being shown, I've never used iplayer to watch a live broadcast' etc etc. Eagerly awaiting my day in court for having a Blackberry. My defence will be that I couldn't have possibly watched anything on it because it is terrible 
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Sep 25, 2014 22:31
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Is there a breakdown somewhere of the party affiliations of the MPs voting against Iraq War III: If At First/Second You Don't Succeed?
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Sep 26, 2014 18:28
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Obliterati posted:Is there a breakdown somewhere of the party affiliations of the MPs voting against Iraq War III: If At First/Second You Don't Succeed? Never mind this, I found one: Labour 23 + teller Tories 6 LD 1 SDLP 3 PC 2 Respect 1 SNP 5 + teller Green 1
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Sep 26, 2014 18:32
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ReV VAdAUL posted:Should left wingers also start acknowledging racism, homophobia etc etc are things that exist and need to be co-opted by the left? If not why is a force that has consistently weakened the majority and empowered the elite be adopted by left wingers? How can hatred of the other ever be a good thing?s Said it before, will say it again: I'm a fourth-gen immigrant and the only guys who want me back on the coffin ships look like this:  If we want to talk about how nationalism's a problem, let's start with British nationalism.
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Sep 27, 2014 16:20
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ReV VAdAUL posted:~The only moral nationalism is my nationalism~ Cute sidestep. Find me some Scottish equivalents with that sort of widespread support.
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Sep 27, 2014 16:33
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Coohoolin posted:The only way you could possibly think the campaign was wholly devoid of any socialist rhetoric is if you never ever ever engaged in it. Like, seriously. It's amazing how quickly Jim Sillars has disappeared from Unionist rhetoric as well. Unless his 'day of reckoning' is now interpreted as some kind of counselling session I guess.
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Sep 27, 2014 18:43
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baronvonsabre posted:
Back before the referendum when Devo Max was polling at 60% the definition was full control of everything except, as you say, defence and foreign affairs.
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Sep 27, 2014 19:01
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e: nvm
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Sep 27, 2014 19:27
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The obvious solution is that Dave and Ed change places for a bit and lead each others' parties. It's not like it'd make any real difference after all.
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Sep 28, 2014 10:19
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Fangz posted:You do realise this 'principle' is enormously regressive, don't you? Would you mind elaborating on this?
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Sep 28, 2014 11:49
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Zohar posted:'People who don't get benefits shouldn't pay taxes' do you not see the problem here coffeetable posted:rich kids who don't need welfare get a tax cut Think I get it now actually, thanks for explaining something surprisingly obvious.
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Sep 28, 2014 12:31
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Maybe a slight tangent, but does this make Green policies like minimum income regressive?
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Sep 28, 2014 15:46
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Zohar posted:Why would it? Wait, I remain an idiot, I mean basic income rather than minimum. If I understand correctly, it involves granting a flat sum of money to everyone, including people who don't need it, in a similar fashion to Acaila's suggested tax exemptions.
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Sep 28, 2014 15:54
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Yeah, this point has been very well clarified for me, thanks for the explanations. I'm glad I don't have to stop liking that policy, I was worried I was secretly regressive
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Sep 28, 2014 16:22
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serious gaylord posted:Writing letters from his ivory tower while wondering what he can do to help out the serfs toiling in the mud below. I see what you did there, m'lord.
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Sep 29, 2014 01:00
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Broniki posted:"Gordon Brown has called for 100,000 Scots to sign a petition demanding that Westminster keeps its vow on further powers for the Scottish Parliament." Wait, Westminister reneging on promises? But they signed a pledge 
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Sep 30, 2014 23:57
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