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Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Those blue canisters are called "propane tank"s in the game files. :shrug:

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Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Technically it's a volcano space base. A minor distinction, but one that makes all the difference in your super villain lair.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Are you playing off of the same hard drive you're recording to? That would explain the texture-loading (and map) problems.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Fair enough. I'm well aware of his reputation.

Oh, and Jade, if, hypothetically, I shared your opinion on the shotgun and had the power to change it (and some other things), would you be interested? If so, don't buy any ammo upgrades.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Male Man posted:

Fair enough. I'm well aware of his reputation.

Oh, and Jade, if, hypothetically, I shared your opinion on the shotgun and had the power to change it (and some other things), would you be interested? If so, don't buy any ammo upgrades.

Actually ammo upgrades should be okay. Probably.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Jade Star posted:

I assume we're talking mods here. Wouldn't making the EDF shotgun more powerful also mean that the EDF gets to shoot me with a more powerful gun too?

Actually, not necessarily. Each weapon has separate player and NPC values for damage, vehicle damage, fire rate, accuracy, and--if applicable--explosion. For anyone interested, here's the game's definition for the assault rifle. A typical weapon like this has around 100 different values associated with it.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I took a look at the files. The EDF shotgun ("autoblaster") fires 5 pellets that do 45 damage each at point blank range, falling off to 30 at 60 meters. A basic EDF trooper has 440 hit points, so while you can kill in two point blank shots, in practice you'll need at least three solid body shots.

Meanwhile, the marauder shotgun fires 7 pellets that each deal 220 damage at point blank, falling to 45 at 50 meters. Hitting with only three of 7 pellets guarantees a kill out to 20 meters.

So there's a bit of an efficacy difference there.


This mod roughly triples the EDF shotgun's total damage (including doubling the pellet count), gives it full damage out to 5 meters, and bumps its fire rate up a hair, but keeps the NPC stats roughly the same. It shouldn't affect anything else. Probably.

To install, drop the zip into your RFG folder, extract it with default settings (so, to ..\Red Faction Guerrilla\Autoblastmore), then run Install.bat.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

anilEhilated posted:

Honestly pretty much all the shooty guns in this game suck - but you still need them because you'll run out of ammo for anything fun really fast.

The whole reason I have a modding pipeline set up is that I had planned to make a total weapon rebalance to increase ammo counts across the board and bring everything in line with That Gun. You know the one I mean. I never got it done, but I just might come back around to it.


edit: Saving this from the Purgatory of last-post-on-the-page

This mod roughly triples the EDF shotgun's total damage (including doubling the pellet count), gives it full damage out to 5 meters, and bumps its fire rate up a hair, but keeps the NPC stats roughly the same. It shouldn't affect anything else. Probably.

To install, drop the zip into your RFG folder, extract it with default settings (so, to ..\Red Faction Guerrilla\Autoblastmore), then run Install.bat.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Wanamingo posted:

As much as I understand the need to not overdo it, the game really doesn't give us the opportunity to use the construction walker nearly often enough. Especially because there are two spawn locations for it that go away after you destroy the associated buildings. I don't really think it's spoilers to say that there are two other variants, light and medium, but they both have problems of their own that will be apparent once we get to them.

e: though come to think of it, those problems could be solved by dicking around with some variables like with the EDF shotgun. Has anybody done that before?

As far as I know the files that define all the fixed spawns haven't been found/decrypted. But the pools those spawns (as well as dynamic spawns) are relatively easy to change. So while you couldn't just say "plunk down a walker at coordinates (2523, 3110)", you could add walkers--or other any other vehicle--to safehouse spawn pools. I'm fairly sure there's at least one mod that already does this.

The heavy walker might be a bit too large to fit in the garage, but as we've seen that wouldn't be much of a barrier.

The big problem with that strategy is that walkers are slow as hell, and safehouses tend to be removed from the action. I've been working on a better solution, but haven't found any leads yet.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Huh. Apparently you can fight city hall.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Brainamp posted:

Dead? Yes. Sucks? Hell no. It's almost literally the main game with the additional objective of kill other people.

iirc there were also some multiplayer specific tools and weapons.

There's a weapon/tool that got patched into single player as a new game+ bonus (although it's hardly gamebreaking, so I'm not sure why it's not just freely available), and the multiplayer has special backpacks that give you passive or active special abilities.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Wanamingo posted:

After playing with it for a bit, I'm not sure why the EDF shotgun is supposed to be so bad. Sure, each individual shot is a lot weaker than the marauder shotgun, but it fires three times as fast and holds four more rounds. All you need to do is get reasonably close to somebody, point in their general direction, and then they're dead. It works as a good complement to your other starting weapons because it fills the niche between the assault rifle and the sledgehammer, it's good for when you're close enough that you can't kill everybody fast enough with the rifle but far enough away that you can't hit them with melee. Which, in this game, I find happens pretty often.

Because in the time it takes to shoot someone three times point blank with your shotgun, you can shoot them 7 times with your assault rifle, which also kills them, but is more ammo efficient and effective to a much longer range. You're not gaining anything by giving up a weapon slot, and those are at a huge premium.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

SpookyLizard posted:

Det charges are totally shaped charges. This is why your minefield was less successful compared to slapping a pair of charges to a car and blowing it skyhigh. Instead of mining the road with det charges, mine it with a car or two with det charges on it! The same is true for buildings.

Unfortunately, they're not. There's a value in the explosion definition for shaping explosions, but nothing uses it. It may not even work.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Woebin posted:

Yeah, since the PC version of the game got updated not all that long ago it does multiplayer through Steam. I think they even added a few maps! I'd definitely be up for multiplayer if it happens and I'm not away at the time.

Also a thing from the sub-par sequel was added which allows reconstruction of destroyed things. I think it becomes available in single player at some point, haven't played far enough on PC myself to know for sure though.

It's reserved for new game+, but can be pretty easily be activated anytime with a mod.

And I'd probably jump in for a match of multiplayer. I have no idea what it's like.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I may have tripled the impulse the shotgun delivers to ragdolls. At about 16:40 you can see Jade shotgun a guy into a guard shack so hard the wall crumbles.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
The joke about the bridge is that it's really handy to have around for some of the time trial missions.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Merry Christmas, explosion fans. Because of a, uh, questionable request, there are two versions of this iteration.

Implus
Implusplus

Changes:

Implus:
All small arms now make more exciting ragdoll physics.
Small arms can cause light environmental destruction. It's not enough to bring down a building alone, but you can wear down cover, and firefights should leave the surrounding area pleasantly full of battle damage.
Remote charges now deal much less damage to vehicles currently occupied by the player, but impart twice the force. I'm sure you can find some applications.

Implusplus:
In addition, the radius of remote charges is doubled. You're welcome, Jade.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

goatface posted:

Hammer, detpacks, magic gun and rocket launcher are all you need.

The only issue is longevity. Fully upgraded that's just 30 detpacks, 30 rifle shots, and 15 rockets. More than enough for any one skirmish, but you'll spend a lot of time running from ammo box to ammo box.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I forgot to take into account that several weapons (mostly vehicle- and emplacement-mounted weapons) are flagged so the AI will attempt to shoot through cover to hit you. Normally that's just a cinematic thing, since they can't actually penetrate cover, but with this mod those concrete barriers are alarmingly fragile. I'll do some testing and try to get the values better dialed in.

Thanks for the feedback. It's very helpful.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

ikanreed posted:

Everything in the game feels built for multiplayer balance, not single player fun.

There are separate stat blocks for multiplayer weapons. :shrug:

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Bruceski posted:

I had the same issue with delayed explosives and disappearing detpacks. It happens in heavy-fire situations so I think it's Implus overtaxing the physics engine needing to calculate all the bullets. Haven't uninstalled the mod yet to confirm it goes back to normal.

I suspect you're right. The added environmental destruction works by generating tiny, silent, invisible, zero-force explosions on every shot. It's usually not a problem, because they're generated, calculated, and destroyed very quickly, but there is a global explosion limit, and enough dudes with machine guns could run up against it.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I've just been using lovely temporary file hosting. I'll get it on a proper host ASAP.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Lynneth posted:

Because of this LP I reinstalled Guerilla (via steam this time), and I want to try out Implus, but the filedropper links don't appear to work for me, be it on firefox or IE. Did they get taken down or something? Because it always redirects me to the main site.
That said, the explosion limit might be less of a problem if you remove the environmental destruction ability from the basic rifle. That one's pretty much the most common weapon anyways, I think.

Implus
Implusplus

No changes, just a real file host.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Cythereal posted:

Yup. Also, I think the Heavy Metal mission you dismissed to start the liberation mission also gives you a combat walker.

I think the next guaranteed combat walker you'll see will be in Eos, a heavy metal mission at a gas station.

There's an EDF garage waaaaay up in the northernmost point of Eos that spawns one in free-roam.

Also there's a 1.1 version of Implus coming soon. I wanted to get that explosions problem fixed before Jade got to the Oasis liberation mission, but v:shobon:v. It also features some improvements to the Grinder and enables a fully functional but unused vehicle I discovered in the files. Spoilers: it's amazing.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
There is a reasonable path through there, although it helps to pre-clear some pipes. Routing is super important for those transporter missions. Almost none of them will give you autonavigation even approaching the optimal course.

By the way, Jade, next time you need to fill a few minutes, there's a rather extensive Easter egg to check out near the Mohole.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Major_JF posted:

I though they were just aesthetic.

Peeking at the files, each of the two upgrades deals about an additional third more damage to NPCs, vehicles, and structures. The baseline hammer will instantly kill any human other than the very toughest EDF (who are likely to immediately die from impact damage after getting ragdolled), so you probably won't notice the difference.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Some fun facts about that walker mission:

To my knowledge, that's the only appearance of those EDF trucks. I have no idea why they don't spawn generally.

The walker in game files is known as "Walker_Flamer".

There's a (non-functional) flag in the weapons tables to indicate a weapon is "flame" class. It could be something left over from Saints Row 1 (which RF:G's engine is forked from--there are a couple leftover files referencing Saints Row mechanics like respect and gang hatred), but also considering the above I can only assume this mission was going to be an even more horrific war crime.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Brainamp posted:

That's honestly pretty surprising. I mean I know old engines just get reused and improved for new projects, but SR1's engine was pretty freaking archaic by the time RFG rolled around.

I'm pretty sure Saints Row 1 wasn't even released yet when RF:G development started.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Guess what's editable?

It's actually a little wonky. When the construction range gets increased, it sort of stretches the hitbox and creates a small deadzone right in front of you. Still worlds better than default.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Implusplus

Highlights:
No more explosion overflow.
An unused vehicle has been added to Eos and Oasis safehouses. Spawns about 20% of the time. You'll know it when you see it.
Grinder should be a bit more attractive weapon. Larger ammo pool and faster disks.
Reconstructor unlock is now available any time (from the upgrade bench), rather than being restricted to the post game. It also repairs significantly more stuff at once from farther away. As mentioned, you'll miss stuff you're right next to for some reason.
All sledgehammers have had their effect on ragdolls increased to match the top upgrade level's, then quadrupled.
Thermobaric rockets can be restocked from ammo boxes.


There are a bunch of things I ran into I couldn't change. Singularity bombs are unrestockable and can't be added to the ammo locker, even when those flags are removed. The jetpack's fuel capacity and recharge don't respect the values set in the files, nor can I change its flight characteristics. Any attempt to run a mod while loading the DLC will cause a crash.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I didn't, I just removed the small arms destruction feature.

I tried setting the explosions to terminate more quickly, but they'd still hit the cap, and the nature of the parser made it impossible to enable an explosion for the player but not for NPCs. In the end it was more trouble than it was worth.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
I first started modding RFG because I felt there were a bunch of dud weapons, which is a bit of a black mark when your only two ways of interacting with your environment are shooting it with guns or smashing into it with a vehicle. The overarching goal was to expand the list of functional approaches to add more replayability. It's as revitalizing to me as it is to you.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Panboy posted:

I installed the mod myself, and i got the demo challenge where you have to play golf with the oil barrels, the max level sledge had some interesting results, it may have imparted more force than expected for that particular event. it worked fine, but I don't think i should have been able to hit 4 barrels at once.

The changes I made shouldn't have an effect on that challenge.

edit: It seems to work fine for me.

Male Man fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Feb 19, 2016

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Yeah, you're totally not supposed to be able to refill your thermobarics on that demo challenge. There's no special code to specify how much ammo you get from crates in the challenges, which I guess is why they're used so sparingly.

You're welcome.

Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing

Jade Star posted:

Oh right, there is the Sam's story DLC or something. I'll have to double check that I have it and will totally do that if I do.

All Steam versions should have it, but if you don't uninstall mods, it'll crash when you start it up. I've tried to get around it, and the best I've managed is it not crashing until I place a remote charge. Fortunately, its attitude toward weapon balance is a little more forgiving than the base game's.

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Male Man
Aug 16, 2008

Im, too sexy for your teatime
Too sexy for your teatime
That tea that you're just driiinkiing
Don't bother collecting those power thingies. They only unlock a cheat that doesn't do anything by the time you can get it.

As empty as this DLC is, some of the new weapons and vehicles really show how the designers felt the game balance should lean in light of lessons learned. You start holding more than half again as many remote charges as Mason ever could, the vehicles are bigger and tougher (some even sporting that super Gauss turret you were using at the end of the first mission), and while the Spiker is just a generically powerful gun for shooting dudes, at least it impales them with goddamn harpoons. They realized that their primary goal should just be giving the player tools that have an effect on the world.

The base game's weapon and vehicle design tended towards realistic examples with some sci-fi bits glued on (the assault rifle is literally named "m16" in the files), which I kinda suspect is the result of RF:G's design originating in an era when Saint's Row 1 was the gameplay model. Comparing that to the DLC stuff and extrapolating really makes me wish that we had a proper successor to Guerilla. Imagine what could be done today with an explosion-first philosophy and an extra generation-and-a-half of hardware to throw at destruction calculations.

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