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Seriously, Atlantis is great, Sheppard is awesome and if you don't like it you don't like Stargate. It had a lot of dumb stuff from time to time, but it has the same fun heart of SG-1.
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Mar 13, 2012 19:11
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Is Atlantis a good show? Yes. 
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Mar 13, 2012 19:22
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:Atlantis does genuinely improve over time, starting with the second season, eventually matching and maybe surpassing SG:1. But then they also bring in a new noble savage who is essentially a more blindly aggressive, monosylabic, Teal'c with none of the character depth. I think you could make an argument that Greer consciously chooses to be that way because being a blindly loyal soldier allows him to avoid having to deal with this own inner demons. Teal'C had a bit of that going on, as well. There's no excuse for Ronon, though.
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Mar 13, 2012 21:49
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Greer was awesome and once we got his backstory he was even more awesome. Dude just wanted to shoot things man!
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Mar 13, 2012 21:51
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I don't care what anyone says but Ronon is awesome if only for the episode where McKay saves his life and he walks up to him all stern and poo poo then smiles and gives him a big ol' hug.
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Mar 13, 2012 21:58
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I dunno, I recently finished up bulldozing through SG1 again on netflix, and just started SGU for the first time. I tried really hard to get into Atlantis when it was starting on TV, but the dialogue seemed pretty bad to me. I only watched 4 or 5 episodes, but Mckay's smarmy sarcasm and whining were just too grating, and none of the other characters seemed memorable. Is it really worth trying? Is the general consensus that it ACTUALLY gets better than SG1 at its best?
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Mar 13, 2012 22:35
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I liked Ronon, especially the episode with him and Teal'c kicking rear end on midway together. His interactions with Teal'c were great in that episode too. Stargate is a fun show, it can do serious but is the best when it doesn't take itself seriously. SG:U was a serious take, and that didn't start too well.
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Mar 13, 2012 23:58
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fuzzi posted:I dunno... it's campy cheesy sci-fi. Some people enjoy it and some people don't but it sounds like Stargate isn't really the franchise for you. Atlantis doesn't get less cheesy so you should probably stop now. The thing is, I really enjoyed Farscape, which is about as campy as cheesy as they come. Half the plots reminded me of stuff you'd pretend as a child running around in the back yard, just with adult intentions and themes mixed in. But it was imaginative, fun, and the characters, while petty, were constantly playing each other to get what they wanted. Atlantis, on the other hand, has Weir and Sheppard being juvenile and bullheaded, but rather than there being an interpersonal struggle between the main characters they just condescend to everyone else with a "if you don't like it you can get out"  attitude which is vindicated by the obtuse writing no matter how unreasonable and preposterous.I'm giving Atlantis until the end of season 2 to improve, though, since the consensus is that it gets better. I've heard people complain about the last few seasons of SG-1, but apart from the Orai plotline being awful I'm enjoying season 9, if only because Ben Browder seems to enjoy the part no matter the quality of the story.
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Mar 14, 2012 05:02
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Weir is essentially a less hateful Janeway. A lot of that is down to the writing, but some of the blame has to fall on casting. The second Weir wasn't a patch on the first, she couldn't convey any of the authority, intellect, or charm that the character was meant to have in abundance. While I really enjoyed my marathon of SG:A last year, I got the feeling that they would have loved to have been making Farscape, but just couldn't bring themselves to pull far enough out of the Star Trek-esque rut the franchise had fallen into to let loose. By the time SG:U rolled around they were clearly determined to make a gritty and grim series, but again were stuck in an almost Enterprise style 'safe' mindset until far too late to save the programme. Personally I thought Ben Browder, and Claudia Black for that matter, were great in SG1. They brought a lot of energy to a flagging and flabby (it's spelt O'Neill, with XXLs) series. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Mar 14, 2012 |
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Mar 14, 2012 05:25
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I'm terribly embarrassed, I cared so little for Weirs character that this is the first I'm hearing that there was more than one Weir actress. Like, seriously, they used multiple actresses?
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Mar 14, 2012 07:01
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The SG-1 episode that setup Atlantis had one actor then on the actual Atlantis series they ended up using someone else.
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Mar 14, 2012 07:05
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There was like three, first two were in maybe one or two episodes in SG-1. She took over for about two hours before hammond came back. Really doesnt matter too much since she's never mentioned again till Atlantis.
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Mar 14, 2012 07:06
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Invalid Validation posted:There was like three, first two were in maybe one or two episodes in SG-1. She took over for about two hours before hammond came back. Really doesnt matter too much since she's never mentioned again till Atlantis. Yes, the Lost City, the episode of SG-1 that immediately led into Atlantis.
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Mar 14, 2012 12:00
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I think it was one of those situations where the initial choice for the role turned out to be terrible to work with, so they scrambled and got a replacement.
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Mar 14, 2012 12:22
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zVxTeflon posted:The SG-1 episode that setup Atlantis had one actor then on the actual Atlantis series they ended up using someone else. There's also the third actress they used for replicator-Weir.
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Mar 14, 2012 13:34
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Flatscan posted:There's also the third actress they used for replicator-Weir. She'll always be Fran to me.
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Mar 14, 2012 16:11
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The Dark One posted:I think it was one of those situations where the initial choice for the role turned out to be terrible to work with Was THAT what it was?
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Mar 14, 2012 19:01
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Vertigo One posted:I dunno, I recently finished up bulldozing through SG1 again on netflix, and just started SGU for the first time. I tried really hard to get into Atlantis when it was starting on TV, but the dialogue seemed pretty bad to me. I only watched 4 or 5 episodes, but Mckay's smarmy sarcasm and whining were just too grating, and none of the other characters seemed memorable. Is it really worth trying? Is the general consensus that it ACTUALLY gets better than SG1 at its best? No, Atlantis is never better than SG1's best. It's better than SG1's worst, but it's hard not to be better than the Ori arc. Atlantis is a cheesier show, but once you accept that it's smooth sailing. Season 1 is a bit ropey because it's still trying to play it straight, but once McKay and Sheppard start riffing off each other more and they retool the Wraith a bit it gets a lot more fun. Also the space corn.  Ur Getting Fatter posted:There's no excuse for Ronon, though. Ronon just wants to kill Wraith and gently caress poo poo up. There's literally nothing else to his character, yet he's still more dynamic and interesting than Teyla.
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Mar 14, 2012 19:13
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IRQ posted:No, Atlantis is never better than SG1's best. It's better than SG1's worst, but it's hard not to be better than the Ori arc. Space corn was SG1, not Atlantis.
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Mar 14, 2012 19:16
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It makes more sense if you remember that SG1 was supposed to be cancelled in favor of Atlantis.
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Mar 15, 2012 00:26
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I still firmly believe that if they canceled SG1 when Atlantis started, and then continued the SG1 story in a show called Stargate Command (as initially proposed), it would have went on much longer.
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Mar 15, 2012 00:28
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Atlantis is great, if only because of Sheppard and McKay. Their interactions were always hilarious. I think it worked because Sheppard is also written to be crazy smart, but is just less educated. It's a much better setup than stupid hero with genius sidekick that is all too common.
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Mar 15, 2012 00:58
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GreenNight posted:I still firmly believe that if they canceled SG1 when Atlantis started, and then continued the SG1 story in a show called Stargate Command (as initially proposed), it would have went on much longer. What would the point of that show be?
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Mar 15, 2012 01:03
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zVxTeflon posted:What would the point of that show be? It would basically be SG1 without the name. They wanted to due it since the team has changed so drastically.
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Mar 15, 2012 01:05
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Is there any reason that O'Neill, Sheppard and Mitchell are all pilots? As in, do the creators of the show have some personal reason for having an obsession with them? For such a military-fetishistic show, I'd expect them to choose a background more appropriate for the job of an SG team (like Army SF), rather than pilots who have minimal training in small unit tactics, ground combat, diplomacy with local populations, etc.
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Mar 16, 2012 12:17
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Breakfast All Day posted:Is there any reason that O'Neill, Sheppard and Mitchell are all pilots? As in, do the creators of the show have some personal reason for having an obsession with them? For such a military-fetishistic show, I'd expect them to choose a background more appropriate for the job of an SG team (like Army SF), rather than pilots who have minimal training in small unit tactics, ground combat, diplomacy with local populations, etc. I believe O'Neill was a AF Special Operations as well. I vaguely recall him saying he did Special Ops in the 80s, and I know that in the alternate timeline in Continuum, he was in Special Operations. Although, just chalk it up to flyboy envy.
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Mar 16, 2012 13:06
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O'Neill worked for the Phoenix Foundation in the 80s.
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Mar 16, 2012 13:28
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tenh19 posted:I believe O'Neill was a AF Special Operations as well. I vaguely recall him saying he did Special Ops in the 80s, and I know that in the alternate timeline in Continuum, he was in Special Operations. There was that one episode where they got stuck in virtual reality and O'Neill had to relive an assault where most of his squad got killed. So he was a special forces dude.
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Mar 16, 2012 13:41
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Kurt Russell was a suicidal airman in the original movie, so I guess they just decided to carry it over to the show. I mean, SCG is also run by the Air force. The show even got some award by the air force for the portroyal of airmen and the airforce in general. They even had a couple of actual generals in cameo appearences.
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Mar 16, 2012 14:20
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zVxTeflon posted:What would the point of that show be? Wasn't it going to be sort of a West Wing-ish thing about the Stargate program going public and dealing with all of that?
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Mar 16, 2012 15:17
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The united states military is a mess of self-sufficiency and mercantilism. I appreciate the implied expediency of just letting the Airforce continue to have the program after they happened to figure out how to make their big dumb inscrutable cyberhoop work. But I think it would have been funny if they had done a one-shot episode with an SG team comprised of a super hyperbolic joint task force, with a big stupid Marine muscle guy and a campy Navy EOD mechanic and a scrawny Airforce physisict and a wildcard Army Ranger. Plus someone from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration Commissioned Corps. Played by Claudia Black.
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Mar 16, 2012 15:25
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Breakfast All Day posted:Is there any reason that O'Neill, Sheppard and Mitchell are all pilots? As in, do the creators of the show have some personal reason for having an obsession with them? For such a military-fetishistic show, I'd expect them to choose a background more appropriate for the job of an SG team (like Army SF), rather than pilots who have minimal training in small unit tactics, ground combat, diplomacy with local populations, etc. I don't think O'Neill was a pilot though? Carter was.
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Mar 16, 2012 16:43
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IRQ posted:I don't think O'Neill was a pilot though? Carter was. They were all air force outside people like Daniel bobkatt013 fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Mar 16, 2012 |
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Mar 16, 2012 16:49
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I always assumed it's because they were the best of the best pilots, which means they are really pretty drat intelligent people. I also always thought that actual Special Forces like the SAS (Rangers, Delta, lol) were pretty drat smart in their own right, and that when you are talking about people of that caliber the line blurs - a special ops soldier is definitely someone that you could reasonably expect to be a pilot as well. Mind and body.
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Mar 16, 2012 17:06
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Eikre posted:The united states military is a mess of self-sufficiency and mercantilism. I appreciate the implied expediency of just letting the Airforce continue to have the program after they happened to figure out how to make their big dumb inscrutable cyberhoop work. They had Marines with them a few times. I think one of the earlier episodes O'neill suggests to Daniel that they go through the gate first because if his wifes on the other end the marines would just shoot the gently caress outta her.
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Mar 16, 2012 17:23
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MrBling posted:Kurt Russell was a suicidal airman in the original movie, so I guess they just decided to carry it over to the show. Generals? Hell, the secretary of the air force was in one.  And Dicky Anderson is an honorary brigadier general, thanks to SG1.
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Mar 16, 2012 17:39
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bobkatt013 posted:They were all air force outside people like Daniel Yes I know that, but that doesn't mean they were all pilots. The majority of the air force isn't.
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Mar 16, 2012 18:43
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The USAF seems to be an official sponsor of the show which explains why the air force runs everything.
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Mar 16, 2012 19:47
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Mu Zeta posted:The USAF seems to be an official sponsor of the show which explains why the air force runs everything. The Air Force ran everything in the movie, too. I think they got that afterwards, for not portraying the military as hackneyed villains like every other everything that isn't a war movie.
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Mar 16, 2012 21:34
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McSpanky posted:The Air Force ran everything in the movie, too. I think they got that afterwards, for not portraying the military as hackneyed villains like every other everything that isn't a war movie. Just like a Michael Bay movie, as long as you're portraying the military in a positive light they'll give you support.
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Mar 16, 2012 22:05
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