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Having overdriven fifth and sixth gears would definitely explain the EPA discrepancy between the manual and the automatic versions. Nobody wants to be downshifting twice to pass on the highway. It probably isn't that uncommon in modern 6+ speed automatics though.
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Mar 26, 2012 22:42
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Powershift posted:Not with a 4.10 rear. The 31mpg mustang has a 2.73 rear, and the performance package v6 mustang has 3.31s My V6 Pony package has a 3.73 rear. Must be a Canadian-spec thing. And I still do a 6-to-4 downshift if I'm passing on the highway, sometimes even 3rd if its a semi or a camper. Why take chances?
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Mar 26, 2012 23:43
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Seat Safety Switch posted:Nobody wants to be downshifting twice to pass on the highway. I downshift from 6th to 4th all the time to pass on the highway, sometimes even from 6th to 3rd if I really need to gun it. I actually barely use 5th gear at all except for the rare instances where the cruising speed is about 45-50mph. And my car has quite a bit more power and (especially) torque than the Toyobaru, and "only" weighs about 500 pounds more. Guinness fucked around with this message at 00:35 on Mar 27, 2012 |
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Mar 27, 2012 00:33
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Seat Safety Switch posted:Nobody wants to be downshifting twice to pass on the highway. one of the great automotive pleasures is to double-clutch, drop down 2 gears and bury the throttle
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Mar 27, 2012 01:24
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aventari posted:one of the great automotive pleasures is to double-clutch, drop down 2 gears and bury the throttle Now and forever, amen.
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Mar 27, 2012 01:28
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Why double clutch? I don't get it wasn't that for old gearboxes?
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Mar 27, 2012 01:30
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A5H posted:Why double clutch? I don't get it wasn't that for old gearboxes? Less stress on the synchros when you more closely match the shaft speeds in the gearbox. fake edit:Because: double clutch.
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Mar 27, 2012 01:33
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I do it to go from 5-4 because my syncros suck and also to get into 1st while moving.
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Mar 27, 2012 01:38
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A5H posted:Why double clutch? I don't get it wasn't that for old gearboxes? Much less strain on gearboxes with no sudden crunches if you do it right. And you can be dead smooth, which has huge benefits for keeping the car stable. Plus Double declutch is truly awesome and the reason why any car without a third pedal can go to hell
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Mar 27, 2012 01:44
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jamal posted:I do it to go from 5-4 because my syncros suck and also to get into 1st while moving. I think I have the only Subaru five-speed on the planet that can get into 1st while moving without any hassle. 80k on it too!
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Mar 27, 2012 02:33
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I only use a double clutch if I am going balls loving out and downshifting to second from anything. usually I just revmatch with a blip on the gas.
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Mar 27, 2012 02:59
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Laserface posted:usually I just revmatch with a blip on the gas. This is what I do. I've never double clutched. Ever.
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Mar 27, 2012 03:03
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Laserface posted:I only use a double clutch if I am going balls loving out and downshifting to second from anything. usually I just revmatch with a blip on the gas. I always double clutch. Not just for fun but the fact is that I began driving with cars whose gearboxes werent particularly good synchro-wise to begin with. Hammering an Italian/British car down the gears built in the 60's and 70's, it's required. Good habits have stuck even in cars where it's not needed.
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Mar 27, 2012 03:46
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Cat Terrist posted:I always double clutch. Not just for fun but the fact is that I began driving with cars whose gearboxes werent particularly good synchro-wise to begin with. Hammering an Italian/British car down the gears built in the 60's and 70's, it's required. Ive never really felt its required then again Im driving a 97 180sx with udner 150,000kms on it so its not exactly old. I sometimes need to double clutch reverse though 
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Mar 27, 2012 05:41
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It may not be required but it's a good habit anyway. why wear out the synchros if you don't have to? Plus you get to feel smug 
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Mar 27, 2012 06:08
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I contacted a Subaru dealer for information, and they sent me some kind of marketing brochure. It's clearly targeted at salespeople, and specifically mentions how to talk up the fact that it is rarer than the FR-S. I'll try to scan this thing in tomorrow.
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Mar 28, 2012 01:14
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WT Wally posted:I contacted a Subaru dealer for information, and they sent me some kind of marketing brochure. It's clearly targeted at salespeople, and specifically mentions how to talk up the fact that it is rarer than the FR-S. I'll try to scan this thing in tomorrow. Save yourself some effort, it's been done.
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Mar 28, 2012 03:50
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emoltra posted:Save yourself some effort, it's been done. Yeah, but you can't read any of that poo poo. The text's too small.
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Mar 28, 2012 04:04
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MiniFoo posted:Yeah, but you can't read any of that poo poo. The text's too small. Here's a better version
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Mar 28, 2012 04:13
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News post http://www.autoblog.com/2012/03/28/early-subaru-brz-sales-running-at-4x-projections-in-japan/ quote:The Subaru BRZ is off to an impressive sales start in Japan. According to Subaru, the two-door is besting the automaker's sales projections by wide margins. As of right now, Subaru has sold 3,551 of the coupes, which is around four times the company's estimates. Fuji Heavy Industries put out a very conservative number of 450 units per month as a sales goal for the BRZ before the vehicle hit the market.
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Mar 29, 2012 00:20
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Does anyone get the feeling that the Scion version will tank?
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Mar 29, 2012 00:22
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Preoptopus posted:Does anyone get the feeling that the Scion version will tank? Depends on the pricing. If the BRZ is within $1k or so with the extra goodies it has then yes.
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Mar 29, 2012 00:39
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Preoptopus posted:Does anyone get the feeling that the Scion version will tank? I really don't think that's going to happen
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Mar 29, 2012 00:42
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Ribkid's getting a BRZ
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Mar 29, 2012 00:50
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Preoptopus posted:Does anyone get the feeling that the Scion version will tank? I think the problem will be that it can't benefit from brand reputation as much as Subaru will or Toyota could. Granted, Toyota hasn't produced any interesting cars in NA in my lifetime, but they build solid, dare I say even fun, trucks, and they can go on reputation for those old enough to have driven or owned a Supra (like my Dad... He had to give it up when I was born). And I loved driving my Toyota truck; had they offered the GT86 when I was shopping, it's even possible that brad loyalty would've led me to ignore Ford altogether. To throw that away with Scion branding, just to draw customers into a fairly lacklustre brand just seems unwise.
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Mar 29, 2012 01:07
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WT Wally posted:I contacted a Subaru dealer for information, and they sent me some kind of marketing brochure. It's clearly targeted at salespeople, and specifically mentions how to talk up the fact that it is rarer than the FR-S. I'll try to scan this thing in tomorrow. This was my experience at the Denver Auto Show last weekend, they had both Scion and Subaru next to each other, which I found ironic. The Scion rep talked up all the after market parts that will be available, while the Subaru rep told me how rare the car is and that I should get a coupon for $250 off.
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Mar 29, 2012 01:32
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The Scion/Toyota version certainly isn't getting named in the hype surrounding this car like the Subaru version is. I could definitely see Toyota just recouping their investment and bailing out if Subaru outsells them significantly. The good thing, though, is that Subaru really doesn't need Toyota for this car to stay in production.
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Mar 29, 2012 02:10
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The hype machine hasn't even started for Scion yet. This is their halo car and their long beach event is the first week of April. It's going to get hot and heavy if scion really is going to be the "less rare" one.
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Mar 29, 2012 02:13
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Preoptopus posted:Does anyone get the feeling that the Scion version will tank? I can see enthusiasts who just want a track/summer car going for the scion. No real need for navigation or HIDs when you just drive it at events/on weekends. Certainly my plan if they actually get some decent pricing up here in Canada. Of course that'll probably make up a tiny fraction of sales.
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Mar 29, 2012 02:25
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I'd buy the Scion over the Subaru because of no haggle pricing and it's cheaper. I'm sure at least some other people feel the same way. I bought a new tC in 2005 and the entire process was so incredibly painless that it'd be a pleasure to buy another Scion.
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Mar 29, 2012 02:30
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Im betting Subaru is going to outsell the poo poo out of Scion because like the previous post said, TRD has not had a non-4x4 fan base in a long time. Nobody thinks of Toyota as sporty anymore unlike Subaru whose entire market has a soft spot for performance. As a marketer, I will be looking forward to the Scion campaign. (Their XB ones were weak like the car IMO) Where I feel the Subaru looks better, my heart is leaning Scion just because my first car was a 88 'rolla and well, you understand... I just hope that It's not filled with that poo poo plastic that they put in the last few Camerys. I'm going to have to sit in both to make a decision but I'm willing to bet the Subaru is just going to feel so much nicer inside. Driving the two is going to be interesting as hell too. ALL that said, with how things are going, I will be seriously considering either a lightly used one in the next few years, and it's all going to come down to price. Preoptopus fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Mar 29, 2012 |
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Mar 29, 2012 03:20
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Black Is Black posted:This was my experience at the Denver Auto Show last weekend, they had both Scion and Subaru next to each other, which I found ironic. The Scion rep talked up all the after market parts that will be available, while the Subaru rep told me how rare the car is and that I should get a coupon for $250 off. I had a similar experience at the Denver show with Subaru bragging about the car, and Scion bragging about the aftermarket. When I asked about tire width at Subaru they told me 225, and the possibility of up to 235 in the rear. Same question at Scion was met with SO I SEE YOU'RE ALL ABOUT STYLE WE ARE GOING TO OFFER 19'S FOR IT AND YOU COULD ALSO GET A BIGGER WING AND A BODYKIT. Somehow I was deemed worthy enough to sit in the Aventador nearby, but was unable to check out either the BRZ or the FR-S.
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Mar 29, 2012 04:56
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I know you guys are speculating about the U.S. market, but Subaru's recent announcement of 3500 units in Japan in two months is less than half the amount and took a month longer than it took Toyota to get 7,000 preorders of the 86 in Japan. Here's their release. Only in Japanese though. http://www2.toyota.co.jp/jp/news/12/03/nt12_0302.html
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Mar 29, 2012 05:44
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Preoptopus posted:Im betting Subaru is going to outsell the poo poo out of Scion because like the previous post said, TRD has not had a non-4x4 fan base in a long time. Nobody thinks of Toyota as sporty anymore unlike Subaru whose entire market has a soft spot for performance. As a marketer, I will be looking forward to the Scion campaign. (Their XB ones were weak like the car IMO) Thought I'd stop lurking the thread and throw in my 2 cents. You certainly have a point regarding Toyota and Subaru's contempory market, but there are probably a lot of people like me who reminisce over the days of Toyota sports cars and still feel some brand loyalty. I own a 91 JDM MR2 Turbo and this has been my benchmark for a fun, sporty car. For years I have been hoping that Toyota would produce something similar, but there have been very few cars comparable to the SW20 MR2 as far as power/weight ratio, while still being relatively affordable. The Toyobaru is definitely the closest thing to come along and I'm really keen to see how it drives. I understand that the appeal of this car is the balance and handling, but I have to say that the promise of a 280 hp turbo version is the real clincher for me. There's nothing quite like driving a light-weight well balanced car with an overabundance of power. Even if you aren't using it all the time, it's nice to know you've got the power there if/when you need it.
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Mar 29, 2012 05:47
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ubachung posted:but there are probably a lot of people like me who reminisce over the days of Toyota sports cars and still feel some brand loyalty. I'd like to see any sort of market research done by Toyota confirming this. This loyalty might well account for a decent proportion of the sales, but I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't really exist, either.
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Mar 29, 2012 05:56
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I doubt it's the sort of thing that would make people rush out and buy one, but for an already commited buyer deciding between the Subaru or the Toyota it might influence the choice. I'm not sure why you want market research to back up my purely speculative opinion.
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Mar 29, 2012 06:06
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kimbo305 posted:I'd like to see any sort of market research done by Toyota confirming this. This loyalty might well account for a decent proportion of the sales, but I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't really exist, either. I think the problem is that they went so long with gently caress all to offer that many of the people who reminisce about a Toyota sports car are in my Dad's situation: they can afford a lot more car at this point, so the FR-S really isn't even on the radar. Either that, or they are enough of a car guy that they bought a very old one, in which case brand loyalty will take a back seat to performance. Other than the odd Celica and (extremely rare) MR2, I don't think anyone in my generation (in North America at least) can really remember seeing sporty Toyotas. Most of us have certainly never driven one.
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Mar 29, 2012 06:10
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kimbo305 posted:I'd like to see any sort of market research done by Toyota confirming this. This loyalty might well account for a decent proportion of the sales, but I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't really exist, either. While not a "study", there was an article in the New York Times specifically about nostalgia for Japanese cars from the 70s and 80s in the US. "But in the past decade, those bargain-price models from the 70s and 80s have been revisited by a generation of enthusiasts who grew up riding in the back seats." http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/05/automobiles/revenge-of-the-econobox-early-japanese-imports-find-admirers.html
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Mar 29, 2012 06:12
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PT6A posted:I think the problem is that they went so long with gently caress all to offer that many of the people who reminisce about a Toyota sports car are in my Dad's situation: they can afford a lot more car at this point, so the FR-S really isn't even on the radar. Either that, or they are enough of a car guy that they bought a very old one, in which case brand loyalty will take a back seat to performance. Other than the odd Celica and (extremely rare) MR2, I don't think anyone in my generation (in North America at least) can really remember seeing sporty Toyotas. Most of us have certainly never driven one. You're probably right on this, although I imagine it depends to some extent on what market you are in. I live in Australia and Supras, Celicas and MR2s have been relatively common around here for as long as I can remember. Things are obviously somewhat different in other parts of the world.
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Mar 29, 2012 06:23
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Yeah, the US never received any really hot Celicas, so the nameplate doesn't really have much cachet. They are common enough to that you will come across one daily, but people don't generally think of them as being anymore impressive than say, a Tiburon. That being said, Lexus does make the IS, which is a pretty good car. The primary reason, besides price, that people don't think of it when they think of sporty cars is probably because you can't get the 3.5L with a manual transmission. With a manual, the IS-350 would definitely be on my radar. Also, the IS-F is a hell of a car and a proper successor to the Supra, in my eyes.
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Mar 29, 2012 06:32
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