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As much of a dick as House is, I do like that he genuinely appreciates the Courier. NCR gives him a medal, Caesar gives him a loving coin but House let's him live in luxury. 
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Jul 27, 2012 00:08
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Not to diminish your point, but I think the Legion reward is that you get your face on a coin.
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Jul 27, 2012 00:09
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Out of curiosity, what happens if you try to side with House, but then ignore his orders once or twice? For example, there's one or two factions at least that he orders you to eradicate, right? I think the Brotherhood of Steel is one of them. What happens if you take one of the various paths to getting them to chill out? Does House just keep telling you to go back and murder them and block progress on his quest line until such, or does he have some kind of actual response that allows you to continue progress? e: Also unless you mean "appreciates the use of the courier and that throwing money at him will ensure his loyalty", I'm going to have to make the point that House is a manipulative, selfish, megalomaniacal, borderline-sociopathic dick who doesn't care about anyone but himself beyond what other people can do for him. TacticalUrbanHomo fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 00:15
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thehumandignity posted:Out of curiosity, what happens if you try to side with House, but then ignore his orders once or twice? For example, there's one or two factions at least that he orders you to eradicate, right? I think the Brotherhood of Steel is one of them. What happens if you take one of the various paths to getting them to chill out? Does House just keep telling you to go back and murder them and block progress on his quest line until such, or does he have some kind of actual response that allows you to continue progress? There isn't anyway to progress until you bomb everyone. I know I was shocked when doing it myself. Well, not really. A pragmatist like House wouldn't want any Brotherhood spiriting his Securitrons away and making modifications to them. So I guess what I'm saying is that mass murder is okay as long as you have a bunch of robots. Wait. EDIT: ^^^ Hey bro, in the good Karma slides for House, it says that he has a mutual respect for the Courier and that he sure knows how to pick them. So yes, you can look at it like he likes the Courier at the end. EDIT 2: VVV Yeah, but Benny is a bit of a tit. I will always maintain that Benny wanted independence for selfish reasons. This is also due to the fact that we really don't get that much of an idea of Benny's aspirations until the fort, and even then that's only when he stops running long enough for us to ask him. Mainwhile our independence can vary depending on the Courier. Good or bad, we can shape the Mojave anyway we see fit. TexMexFoodbaby fucked around with this message at 00:59 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 00:18
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House liked Benny too, until he began thinking that maybe House wasn't the answer to all of the wasteland's problems.
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Jul 27, 2012 00:25
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House is pretty chill, he gives you a nice place to crash, and you can find him snow globes and become his friend. I don't think House intends for himself to go into space, considering that he can't be moved. The way he talks about it makes it sound like it's kind of a pipe dream, since we all know how well the "colonise other planets" thing has gone in the other Fallout games. I think he'll be happy in his bunker under the Lucky 38, working on ways to make vegas a better place to live. The Omertas are always complaining that House is too distant, so he's pretty hands off in day to day living. Rebuliding industry, giving people jobs, that's perfectly doable, considering that he's the reason why Vegas is in such good condition anyway. Let's not forget that his brother cheated him out of everything, so it's understandable that they didn't get on. The only real dick moves House does, are, in my opinon, wiping out the Brotherhood (but his reasons make sense, and looking on the wiki, an option to arrange a treaty was cut), sealing Vault 21 (but he did win it fair, and he listened to Sarah when she asked him to keep some of it) and wiping out the Kings (which only happens if they side with the NCR). Compared to NCR, the Legion, or the near collapse of Vegas's social structure in an Independant ending, House is a pretty decent choice.
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Jul 27, 2012 00:42
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khwarezm posted:The House mentioned in the H&H tool factory (the one who looses his poo poo) isn't the House that appears in the game, thats his half-brother. I thought that whole thing talked about both since House was one of the H's. It's been a very long while since I did that bit though so I'm probably wrong about which one had a meltdown. House's over-sized ego is definitely a big part of his character though and, other than his physical condition, probably his biggest weakness as THE stabilizing factor in the Wasteland. Honestly though, if you do everything right, the idea is that whoever you pick, they really do stabilize the wasteland. I think the question there is which wasteland would you want to live in? It's not as interesting a question because some choices straight out suck (you're a woman and want to live free under the legion? good luck) but considering whether you'd want to live under House, the Courier, or the NCR is an interesting choice. The NCR is what's most familiar as it best resembles a modern day democratic state, so it's not a bad choice. It's just a matter of whether you think a technology-wiedling autocrat could do better. bloodychill fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 00:47
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Just started playing this and loving it. I just hope the karma system is not important at all because it's really stupid that I lose karma for taking the belongings of people I've killed after they attack me unprovoked.
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Jul 27, 2012 01:07
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Pragmatically, I agree that House is a good choice for leading an independent Vegas, but the dude is still a dick, and also a mass-murderer, and frankly technocratic authoritarian dictatorships don't sit well with me regardless of who is in charge.  e: unless it's me. TacticalUrbanHomo fucked around with this message at 01:23 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 01:13
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Industrial posted:Just started playing this and loving it. I just hope the karma system is not important at all because it's really stupid that I lose karma for taking the belongings of people I've killed after they attack me unprovoked. The karma system affects one significant thing: Your ability to recruit Cass. And, by default, since it's borderline impossible to have negative karma, you'll be fine.
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Jul 27, 2012 01:17
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bloodychill posted:I thought that whole thing talked about both since House was one of the H's. It's been a very long while since I did that bit though so I'm probably wrong about which one had a meltdown. House's over-sized ego is definitely a big part of his character though and, other than his physical condition, probably his biggest weakness as THE stabilizing factor in the Wasteland. Well, what happened was House's older half brother (who owns H&H and was also named House) hosed house out of some inheritance or something, so years later House slowly destroys and takes over H&H which drives his brother insane with guilt and fear. The Emails in the factory mention that Robco are ramping up for a hostile takeover, which coincides with Anthony House going into full-blown tinfoil hat mode (and for good reason!)
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Jul 27, 2012 01:40
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khwarezm posted:Well, what happened was House's older half brother (who owns H&H and was also named House) hosed house out of some inheritance or something, so years later House slowly destroys and takes over H&H which drives his brother insane with guilt and fear. The Emails in the factory mention that Robco are ramping up for a hostile takeover, which coincides with Anthony House going into full-blown tinfoil hat mode (and for good reason!) Oh yeah, I remember now. The computer messages in that building were hilarious. This is completely unrelated but there's always been one thing that really bugged me about Veronica. It's probably been brought up but I haven't seen discussion - Father Elijah breaks her and her girlfriend apart because the Brotherhood is shrinking and it's important they procreate. However, their relationship doesn't negate the possibility of procreation. It's pretty clear that Veronica is dedicated enough to the Brotherhood that she'd "take one (or more) for the team" and raise the kids with her girlfriend/wife and the Brotherhood aren't in the business of dealing with sexuality. I think she even remarks that the Brotherhood would have been or was fine with similar relationships in the past before they started having serious problems. I realize that a part of it is that it draws in players because this is a modern-day issue and it's handled fairly well in the game so it doesn't feel shoe-horned in. It could be explained away that Father Elijah, being the egotistical nutcase that he is, simply wanted to exert his own beliefs on his pupil and refused to compromise on the issue and that would certainly be believable but they don't come out and say that.
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Jul 27, 2012 01:48
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Well I completely misread all of that then. I thought House was the younger sibling and his older brother screwed him out of everything. Then House became a self-made billionaire, started buying people out, and that's when his brother went insanely paranoid. I think I'd like House's backstory a bit more if it was like that because then there's some reasoning behind why he's such a egotistical dick -- he got dicked out of his inheritance and had to build his empire himself.
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Jul 27, 2012 01:50
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bloodychill posted:
Why do they need to? I took it as Veronica had too high a view of Elijah to assume that she was separated for his personal bullshit, while by the time you get to Dead Money its all ancient history to Elijah. Though not to Christine. Upmarket Mango posted:Well I completely misread all of that then. I thought House was the younger sibling and his older brother screwed him out of everything. Then House became a self-made billionaire, started buying people out, and that's when his brother went insanely paranoid. But that is what happened, its just implied that there was a bit of petty revenge on House's part when he was dealing with H&H. khwarezm fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 01:53
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bloodychill posted:Oh yeah, I remember now. The computer messages in that building were hilarious. I don't think you should read too much into the (possible) relationship between Christine and Veronica, or the Brotherhoods views on procreation; dealing with issues like artificial insemination, and the likelihood of same-sex couples having as many kids as heterosexual couples just seems a bit too far gone into hypothetical make-believe in this setting - and beyond the scope and depth of the franchise.
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Jul 27, 2012 01:57
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khwarezm posted:Why do they need to? I took it as Veronica had too high a view of Elijah to assume that she was separated for his personal bullshit, while by the time you get to Dead Money its all ancient history to Elijah. Though not to Christine. Fair point. quote:I don't think you should read too much into the (possible) relationship between Christine and Veronica, or the Brotherhoods views on procreation; dealing with issues like artificial insemination, and the likelihood of same-sex couples having as many kids as heterosexual couples just seems a bit too far gone into hypothetical make-believe in this setting - and beyond the scope and depth of the franchise. Well, it's an issue they brought up so like a lot of the more interesting side-stories in the game, it percolated in my mind a bit. I think khwarezm is on the money with his explanation of the issue. I had forgotten how much Veronica sort of idolized Elijah. e: not going to grognard this all up in here bloodychill fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 02:03
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JawKnee posted:I don't think you should read too much into the (possible) relationship between Christine and Veronica What do you mean by possible? Isn't it pretty clearly a thing?
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Jul 27, 2012 02:06
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Started a 9 STR/9 END/9 LCK/Unarmed run, and holy jesus punching everything to death is so viscerally satisfying. Now I'm regretting not changing up my skills more thoroughly on previous reruns.
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Jul 27, 2012 02:07
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Kharmakazy posted:What do you mean by possible? Isn't it pretty clearly a thing? As far as I know Veronica never gives you Christine's name, or mentions Elijah in the breakup involving whoever her partner was; similarly Christine doesn't (or rather can't) tell you Veronica's name. It's implied sure, I'm just saying it isn't a guaranteed thing.
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Jul 27, 2012 02:08
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JawKnee posted:As far as I know Veronica never gives you Christine's name, or mentions Elijah in the breakup involving whoever her partner was; similarly Christine doesn't (or rather can't) tell you Veronica's name. It's implied sure, I'm just saying it isn't a guaranteed thing. Very true. Hell, Veronica does not even know that Elijah allegedly split them up. It's implied of course. But we don't get any concrete evidence because they didn't record Elijah's last words! Dammit, Dead Money! I'm still bitter!
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Jul 27, 2012 02:16
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The wiki says that Elijah broke them up and considering Christine can give you an attack for Veronica, it feels safe to say she's the one. I seem to recall from the game that someone in the Brotherhood straight up says Elijah broke them up but again, it's been a long while. e: actually that might be Elijah's attack. K, I'm going to have to play this game again. It's too good and my memory needs to be refreshed. bloodychill fucked around with this message at 02:18 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 02:16
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Just finished Old World Blues for my first DLC and I am so glad I did. Being a NRG/SCI/SNK build, I am loving every perk, implant and item I get. Also, I will never EVER have to worry about microfusion cells again. Having to carry an antenna for no good reason was kinda stupid though. Only good for the occasional joy of bashing deactivated things. In the main game I'm just starting The House Always Wins, I and the Wild Card side quests. [spoilers]Going to Caesar's fort hasn't helped me in finding the chip, though. Nothing but a bunch of legionaires who are angry that i continued to kill them after receiving the mark[/spoilers]. How close is this to the endgame, because I want to make sure I get all the DLC done before then.
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Jul 27, 2012 02:17
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bloodychill posted:The wiki says that Elijah broke them up and considering Christine can give you an attack for Veronica, it feels safe to say she's the one. I seem to recall from the game that someone in the Brotherhood straight up says Elijah broke them up but again, it's been a long while. The attack is gained from Elijah's holomessage. VVVV As I said, it's implied but not guaranteed, and frankly that had literally nothing to do with the point I was making originally. VVVV JawKnee fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 02:23
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JawKnee posted:As far as I know Veronica never gives you Christine's name, or mentions Elijah in the breakup involving whoever her partner was; similarly Christine doesn't (or rather can't) tell you Veronica's name. It's implied sure, I'm just saying it isn't a guaranteed thing. Yeah, it's possible there were two different lesbian couples of roughly the same age working under the chapter Elijah was heading that were split up by him.
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Jul 27, 2012 02:37
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So what's the 'good' path as far as the main quest goes? I would've thought staying true to House was the way, but he's kind of a jerk and also makes you murder factions apparently? I'm only up to House Wins III and wondering if I shouldn't go golfing.
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Jul 27, 2012 03:27
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LaserShark posted:So what's the 'good' path as far as the main quest goes? I would've thought staying true to House was the way, but he's kind of a jerk and also makes you murder factions apparently? I'm only up to House Wins III and wondering if I shouldn't go golfing. The good path is the one that you decide is the good path. I like House the best, but each faction has arguements for and against it. It's worth playing them all at least once. And it's only the Brotherhood you have to wipe out for House, everyone else can be reasoned with.
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Jul 27, 2012 03:32
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LaserShark posted:So what's the 'good' path as far as the main quest goes? I would've thought staying true to House was the way, but he's kind of a jerk and also makes you murder factions apparently? I'm only up to House Wins III and wondering if I shouldn't go golfing. All of the factions have both good and bad pints. Yes, even the Legion if you look hard enough. They just don't have many. What it comes down to is which faction you think would do the best job.
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Jul 27, 2012 03:44
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LaserShark posted:So what's the 'good' path as far as the main quest goes? I would've thought staying true to House was the way, but he's kind of a jerk and also makes you murder factions apparently? I'm only up to House Wins III and wondering if I shouldn't go golfing. David Foleybot Yes Man is Best Man.
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Jul 27, 2012 03:48
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Cream-of-Plenty posted:Not to diminish your point, but I think the Legion reward is that you get your face on a coin. E: In the case of a Legion victory in which Caesar survives, I wanted the Boulder Memorial to be smashed to pieces with a Fallout-appropriate sculpture in its place of Caesar after Augustus of Prima Porta. rope kid fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 03:52
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rope kid posted:Yes. One of the things I wanted for post-Hoover play (that never happened, obviously) was an actual double aureus coin in the game with General Oliver's face on one side and something symbolizing the Courier on the back, in the spirit of the conquered Vercingetorix coins minted to celebrate Julius Caesar's victories in Gaul. So completely would've owned. Stroth posted:All of the factions have both good and bad pints. Yes, even the Legion if you look hard enough. They just don't have many. What it comes down to is which faction you think would do the best job. I think the idea is that you're taking a lot of what will happen on faith, but House is the one that you require the least "faith" in. In order for a Legion victory to bear fruit, they have to transform their brainwashed hordes into a standing, peaceful army that gets away from what many of the grunts consider the Legion's ideals. This boils down to an old man with cancer living long enough to set it in motion, and somehow making it such a great society that it doesn't just still fall apart when he dies in a few years. In order for the NCR to stop stretching themselves too thin, wasting resources on expansionism and slowly dying because of it, they'd have to get new leadership more akin to that old ranger and less inefficient power-hungry bureaucrats. Without the courier sticking around to literally fix everything all the time, this seems even less likely than Caesar's goals, especially when all the incompetent assholes like Kimball will be riding high on their Hoover Dam victory. In order for House's plans to succeed, he has to...stay the course and do exactly what he's been doing, pretty much. The idea that he's going to become some corrupt fascist is not evidenced by anything in the game, he's seemed pretty content to be a creepy recluse who steers humanity's future towards a greater good. The only questionable bit is that he still allows what is basically sexual slavery to go on at Gomorrah, but (1)he seems disgusted by the Omertas and seems ready to eliminate them the moment he gets his securitron army in place, (2)the NCR seems to condone it as well, and (3)the Legion is pro-regular slavery. Basically he's not a perfect choice, but better than everyone else.
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Jul 27, 2012 04:12
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Wolfsheim posted:So completely would've owned. Except yes-man, which is the choose your own adventure ending.
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Jul 27, 2012 04:16
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Wolfsheim posted:In order for House's plans to succeed, he has to...stay the course and do exactly what he's been doing, pretty much. The idea that he's going to become some corrupt fascist is not evidenced by anything in the game, he's seemed pretty content to be a creepy recluse who steers humanity's future towards a greater good. I think describing House's long term plan as humanity's 'greater good' is a pretty insane stretch. The problem, by and large, with each of the three 'main' end-game option is that Caesar, the NCR and House are all far, far too preoccupied and obsessed with the particular piece of Pre-War history they've decided to recreate that they can't fully address the problems of the here and now.
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Jul 27, 2012 04:19
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Wolfsheim posted:In order for a Legion victory to bear fruit, they have to transform their brainwashed hordes into a standing, peaceful army that gets away from what many of the grunts consider the Legion's ideals. This boils down to an old man with cancer living long enough to set it in motion, and somehow making it such a great society that it doesn't just still fall apart when he dies in a few years. One thing to remember here is that, as I understand it at least, it was Augustus Caesar who made sure the Empire would continue on without a strong executive figure at the helm. So if the Legion takes Hoover Dam and gets their own President Tandi or Mr. House, they have a good shot of uniting the Wasteland. (Until some jagoff inevitably nukes it again.)
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Jul 27, 2012 04:23
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I bought 28,000 rounds of 5mm surplus ammo from Contreras. Gotta be ready in case Kimball gets reelected you see 
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Jul 27, 2012 05:06
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Upmarket Mango posted:Well I completely misread all of that then. I thought House was the younger sibling and his older brother screwed him out of everything. Then House became a self-made billionaire, started buying people out, and that's when his brother went insanely paranoid. Reading those email messages, I got the impression that Robert House was the favored son while Anthony got the left-overs. In one of his rambling messages, Anthony is railing at their father for forsaking him. This would make R. H. being a spoilt, entitled rear end in a top hat since the beginning and if you look at his attitude and manner of speech (barely-concealed standover man tactic with veiled threats if the courier doesn't do as he asks) then it all falls into place. His insufferable smugness always spells the doom for him in my playthroughs.
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Jul 27, 2012 05:08
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It's incredibly difficult for me to justify killing Rene Auberjonois. Not impossible, mind you, I mean, I did sit through The Patriot, after all.
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Jul 27, 2012 05:14
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Dan Didio posted:It's incredibly difficult for me to justify killing Rene Auberjonois. I.. Have no idea what any of this means. The patriot was a good movie though. edit: OH, house/odo
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Jul 27, 2012 05:17
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Kharmakazy posted:I.. Have no idea what any of this means. The patriot was a good movie though. Rene Auberjonois is the actor who played Mr. House and The Patriot is a bad movie. Happy I could clear that up for you.
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Jul 27, 2012 05:20
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Dan Didio posted:Rene Auberjonois is the actor who played Mr. House and The Patriot is a bad movie. Happy I could clear that up for you. Oh, I see. You are from the streets where they use the word "bad" to mean awesome. Hell, the new assassin's creed game is basically patriot the game.
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Jul 27, 2012 05:39
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Didn't The Patriot begin as a parody of a Mel Gibson movie on that Simpsons episode where Mel Gibson was the special guest? You know, the one where Mel Gibson throws the flag like a spear and impales someone.
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Jul 27, 2012 05:47
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