|
The White Dragon posted:Isn't it all by that bad motherfucker who did Actraiser? Or was it the Secret of Mana guy? The music of Etrian Odyssey is by the legendary Yuzo Koshiro, famous for his work on Ys, Actraiser, Shinobi, Streets of Rage, and many other games. I am a HUGE fan of his. He still loving uses his PC-88 to make music to this day, even though he's been making PC-88 music since the 1980s. quote:Siliconera: Do you have a long history of creating songs with the PC-88 computer? http://www.siliconera.com/2008/10/19/extra-2008-yuzo-koshiro-on-etrian-odyssey/ Some of my favorite Yuzo Koshiro-made bits of music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxTTRPSRHHA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cne-6D2mjk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC-B3Q0cRrY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_0TeykT5NA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEsgRhIhHf8 sandpiper fucked around with this message at 10:38 on Nov 9, 2012 |
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 10:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 15:01 |
|
|
It looks like Assassins and Mystics are going to be best buds.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 11:04
|
|
|
You forgot to mention that 4 has a brand new casual mode for idiot children and Grade-A pointdexters that gives you infinite warp wires and sends you back to town when you die. It's the perfect thing for people who are incapable of making good decisions like saving when you can and checking your inventory on occasion, or have been coddled by modern games like Dark Souls.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 11:23
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:Isn't it all by that bad motherfucker who did Actraiser? Or was it the Secret of Mana guy? The music for all the EO games is by Yuzo Koshiro, whose credits include Actraiser, Streets of Rage, Revenge of Shinobi and a ton of other stuff. The first three games were all composed/arranged by Koshiro, but EO4's music was composed by Koshiro and arranged by Norihiko Hibino, the guy who's best known for his work on Metal Gear Solid.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 11:36
|
|
|
Adam Bowen posted:That's crazy talk, EO is infinitely more tedious and hateful than The Dark Spire. Granted, TDS starts off a lot more difficult and has some archaic poo poo like not telling you specifically the stats on your items. But it doesn't require anywhere near the same amount of grinding, there are no stupid, unfun, bullshit brick wall fights every other floor, and you can actually finish the game without looking up the perfect party setup first. Once past the second floor it's actually not very difficult at all. Instead you can't finish the game without looking up where a bunch of arbitrary event triggers are that involve doing things like say, going to a specific out of the way square you already went to with the game giving you absolutely no indication of needing to do such, other than the fact that you just can't progress forward. And a handful of other really retarded examples like that along the way. I agree about the less grindy part, but then the classes are also boring (and unbalanced) as hell and there really aren't any interesting fights, at all. In fact the combat on the last two floors so often becomes so retardedly all-or-nothing that the game just loses pretty much all fun factor at that point. Also you don't have to look up anything at all for EO3 and it doesn't even remotely require a perfect party setup to beat.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 15:17
|
|
|
Is there any releasedate/announcement for EO IV yet for an US release? If this comes out I will import an US 3ds for fire emblem/rune factory/this.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 15:52
|
|
|
Gwyrgyn Blood posted:Also you don't have to look up anything at all for EO3 and it doesn't even remotely require a perfect party setup to beat. FrickenMoron posted:Is there any releasedate/announcement for EO IV yet for an US release? If this comes out I will import an US 3ds for fire emblem/rune factory/this.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 15:57
|
|
|
I own all the EO games but have only beaten the first one. I always get to the point where I start freaking out over ruining my characters by making bad talent point decisions since I hate grinding levels to fix them then get distracted by some other game and then never get back to them.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 16:07
|
|
|
I really, really love these games. But I'm not at all sure I can justify buying a 3DS for it. I really barely play any other DS games at all. But then again, I literally bought my DS to play the first Etrian Odyssey, so... ughhhhh....
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 16:12
|
|
|
I got to the true last boss of 3, but then I realized my party wouldn't cut it so I respecced them all, then I realized I wasn't up for the grind. Oh well, I still had a lot of fun with it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 16:26
|
|
|
The Moon Monster posted:I got to the true last boss of 3, but then I realized my party wouldn't cut it so I respecced them all, then I realized I wasn't up for the grind. Oh well, I still had a lot of fun with it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 16:30
|
|
|
theshim posted:Progenitor or Abyssal God? After some googling I'm pretty sure it was the former which I guess wasn't really the true final boss. How bout that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 17:00
|
|
|
Dinky Duck Race posted:You forgot to mention that 4 has a brand new casual mode for idiot children and Grade-A pointdexters that gives you infinite warp wires and sends you back to town when you die. It's the perfect thing for people who are incapable of making good decisions like saving when you can and checking your inventory on occasion, or have been coddled by modern games like Dark Souls. Thank loving god, video games need to make dying part of the game. Dying is fun.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 17:03
|
|
|
The Moon Monster posted:After some googling I'm pretty sure it was the former which I guess wasn't really the true final boss. How bout that. Well at the top of this page I linked the 'true final boss' theme as one of my favorite Yuzo Koshiro songs of all time second from bottom. I guess you have that to look forward to.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 17:08
|
|
|
I'm actually kind of bummed that the enemies will no longer be awesome illustrations, but I guess it will make battle animations more interesting.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 17:36
|
|
|
The Moon Monster posted:After some googling I'm pretty sure it was the former which I guess wasn't really the true final boss. How bout that.  That said, the first time I beat the former, I checked up some guides and posts on it and kept seeing "your party should be at minimum level 55, 60 is much better." My group? 46.  I have to say that this is one of the things I absolutely love about the series, especially by far EO3 - the sheer amount of customizability and funky combinations you can put together to pull off things you really have no right at all trying. It's awesome. Also, Calling That Detestable Name is snazzy as hell, but Hoist the Sword is still the best battle theme in the first three games. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 18:05
|
|
|
I bought the first EO and have never beaten the first strata--I got to, like, the first major storyline boss I guess, on the 5th floor? As far as I got. I just couldn't find a way to grind and retain health and resources and kept getting overwhelmed and either dying or barely limping out to the town, spending every cent on healing, and then struggling to get enough cash to finish the job. It was just really frustrating. Are the later entries a little more forgiving--or at least, a little more user-friendly? For contrast's sake, I loved SMT: Strange Journey
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 18:06
|
|
|
Lazy Programming posted:Thank loving god, video games need to make dying part of the game. Dying is fun. It's not even a Dragon Quest thing where you lose money, though; you just go back.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 18:16
|
|
|
Gwyrgyn Blood posted:Instead you can't finish the game without looking up where a bunch of arbitrary event triggers are that involve doing things like say, going to a specific out of the way square you already went to with the game giving you absolutely no indication of needing to do such, other than the fact that you just can't progress forward. And a handful of other really retarded examples like that along the way. Weird, I beat TDS without ever consulting a FAQ or map, I don't remember having to return anywhere without any indication. But I've played enough of these games to be insanely thorough, so I check every square and wall without fail. And maybe I've just got some strange form of mental retardation that only affects my ability to play EO games properly, but I've never been able to get past the second strata of an EO title before hitting a brick wall. When I asked for advice when I reached that point in EO3, I was told that there was basically no way I could advance with the classes/skills I'd chosen, and I wasn't willing to give up hours of progress and start the entire game over again while following a guide to make sure I didn't choose the wrong skills.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 18:42
|
|
|
RentCavalier posted:It was just really frustrating. Are the later entries a little more forgiving--or at least, a little more user-friendly? For contrast's sake, I loved SMT: Strange Journey Your experience mirrors the problem I had with the second game. Reviving characters costs money, whether you take them to the hospital or prop their body up against the door of the item shop while you buy more Nectar. If you find yourself dying too often early on, it's possible to find yourself stuck in a death spiral with no easy way of climbing out. When I realized what was happening, I just walked away. "Just not my kind of game, etc." It wasn't until recently that I worked up the enthusiasm to give it another try. Apparently the secret is being too poor to afford new games to distract you! But to actually address your question... Yes, the second and third games are more user friendly if you're willing to take some basic advice on early party setups and strategy. Playing EO 'blind' means not looking up floor maps on GameFAQs. Trying to go into one of these games cold, with no previous experience will not end well because the game and manual are incredibly opaque about the best way to develop your characters. Overall the games have made the early floors easier as the series goes on, but it hasn't stopped them from finding ways to kick my teeth in during the post-game. ...this sort of stuff seems like another good thing to add to the second post.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 18:50
|
|
|
Dinky Duck Race posted:You forgot to mention that 4 has a brand new casual mode for idiot children and Grade-A pointdexters that gives you infinite warp wires and sends you back to town when you die. It's the perfect thing for people who are incapable of making good decisions like saving when you can and checking your inventory on occasion, or have been coddled by modern games like Dark Souls. Justin_Brett posted:It's not even a Dragon Quest thing where you lose money, though; you just go back. It's a video game, there's no such thing as little children who are bad at it. There are just people who are willing to play through the harder modes, but there's absolutely no merit to it. What, are you gonna put it on your resumé? It's a "I beat this superboss and all I got was this crappy t-shirt" case. There is no glory in playing difficult video games; only masturbation.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:06
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:I can't understand this viewpoint. I mean, I won't use it myself since I'm already familiarized with the EO structure, but it's not like I think less of folks if they wanna use this mode. I am also familiar with the EO structure, and I may use this mode anyway. For me, having to trek all the way back to the boss and do the fight over again is punishment enough. Count Uvula posted:e: VVVVVVV Aw man, they removed the common skills! If true, then just as well. I never leveled up any of my main guys' gathering skills more than one point — why sacrifice their combat capability just so they can mine for a couple more fish per dungeon trip, when I can raise up a team of farmers to do all the mining I need?
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:18
|
|
|
Just FYI I started updating the second post with general strategies for approaching the games. Post your own in the thread/explain how my advice is terrible and will kill you all as you see fit, I'm not picky.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:43
|
|
|
Ya know, I have no idea why I love these games so much. I'm completely, 100% terrible at them. 3 was especially bad since they removed all the guys I had a good idea how to use, and then threw in no truly amazing healing class. I beat the game once, taking the Yggdroid route, and got far enough to see the Shogun in NG+, but when it hit the 'time to grind' point again, I gave up. Never beaten all the quests, never beaten any of the dragons, never beat any true final boss. I think I at least got to the true final boss of at least 1, maybe even 2, I can't recall. But at that point the game basically requires one single party makeup with one single moveset that it just isn't fun anymore. You essentially have to make an entirely new party and grind the night away to succeed, along with following a guide so you know the one god drat way to use your skills in order to win. I dunno if 3's was the same, I never looked up a FAQ for the true final boss on that one. It's dumb, though. Lemme beat the game with the party I've got, dammit. If my party makeup is strong, I should at least have a chance at winning...
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:48
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:And? Was I saying people are scrubs for using the mode? Huh, I don't remember typing that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:53
|
|
|
Justin_Brett posted:Was I saying people are scrubs for using the mode? Huh, I don't remember typing that. Sorry dogg, I interpreted it as "Oh you poor baby, you don't even lose half your gold, stop crying." v Oh, I saw sarcasm like a motherfucker in that "what games need more of is dying." Fur20 fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Nov 9, 2012 |
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 19:56
|
|
|
I've mostly seen 'dying is fun!' used in conjunction with Dwarf Fortress, so I figured he wasn't aware of that. Probably not though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:01
|
|
|
Justin_Brett posted:I've mostly seen 'dying is fun!' used in conjunction with Dwarf Fortress, so I figured he wasn't aware of that. Probably not though. Honestly, I don't care how harsh or light the punishment for dying is, so long as it isn't revert to last save.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:04
|
|
|
I HOPE THAT EVERYONE THAT PLAYS CASUAL MODE IS FIRED INTO THE SUN actually I don't mind at all and hey have fun with it
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:08
|
|
|
I bought EO2 awhile ago, made it to the second stratum, and just kept getting repeatedly owned there and put it down. I'm still kind of disappointed I didn't get further, because I really want to get into these games. Do I just need to grind more? I seem to recall I was around level 15-17 with a Landsknecht, Ronin, Hexer, Medic, and Gunner. My main problem was that my back row kept getting killed by the special abilities of the enemies on 6F and there didn't seem to be much I could do about it. I also have a side party of four Survivalists and another Medic for item points. Is that something that's possible to keep going as you get into the higher floors? The side party can barely handle 3F at this point, but I'm getting to the point where the gathered items from the early floors aren't that valuable anymore. EDIT: Lansknecht, not protector 
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:09
|
|
|
I desperately want someone to do a western style game like this, shorn of the anime children, a little more user friendly. Like Legend of Grimrock, but a real return to the Might and Magic, Wizardry style gameplay. I love Etrian Odyssey, but I have to admit that to some extent that's simply because its the only oasis in the windswept desert of old school turn based RPGs. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:30
|
|
|
Fintilgin posted:I desperately want someone to do a western style game like this, shorn of the anime children, a little more user friendly. Like Legend of Grimrock, but a real return to the Might and Magic, Wizardry style gameplay. Shoot, is there really a demand for a western, possibly cartoony, gameplay-transparent FP dungeon crawl? I thought I was among a very small demographic.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:36
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:Shoot, is there really a demand for a western, possibly cartoony, gameplay-transparent FP dungeon crawl? I thought I was among a very small demographic. I could see one selling well on steam. I for one would love a new, super polished wizardry knock-off in the vein of grimrock. [e]I think I might use casual mode since doesn't seem to do more than letting you keep your levels when you die.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:47
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:Shoot, is there really a demand for a western, possibly cartoony, gameplay-transparent FP dungeon crawl? I thought I was among a very small demographic. It would probably be successful as a $15 indie title on Steam. That said, I'm not sure I'd call EO gameplay-transparent -- what's your definition of that?
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:47
|
|
|
Speaking of anime wizardry knock-offs, what ever happened to class of heroes 2? It was supposed to come out in this fall but I haven't seen any news on it for months.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 20:50
|
|
|
TheOneAndOnlyT posted:I bought EO2 awhile ago, made it to the second stratum, and just kept getting repeatedly owned there and put it down. I'm still kind of disappointed I didn't get further, because I really want to get into these games. Do I just need to grind more? I seem to recall I was around level 15-17 with a Landsknecht, Ronin, Hexer, Medic, and Gunner. My main problem was that my back row kept getting killed by the special abilities of the enemies on 6F and there didn't seem to be much I could do about it. If I'm remembering my stratum 2 correctly you may be running into those gargoyle statue enemies who, unlike pretty much everything else in the game, prioritize the back row for picking targets. You need to turtle up your back row with defend until they're killed. If you're just dying to regular enemies then I think it just comes down to killing them quicker. Does your Hexer have poison? Give your Hexer poison. I have no idea how I would have made it anywhere in that game past stratum 1 without it. As for survivalists, you're basically doing the right thing but one of them should be ignoring the gathering skills until stalker is level 7 or 8. What I did was make 5 Survivalists, and cycle them with a Medic on the first few floors until they're level 10 or so. Once you have stalker to level 8 or so you will basically be able to turn random encounters off entirely and visit all the gathering points across the whole game with 5 survivalists at level 10-15. Once you're into stratum 2 and onwards you can get ambushed WHILE you're gathering stuff, but those fights will wipe your farming party no matter what level they are, and you just have to save frequently and work around it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 21:11
|
|
|
Heavy neutrino posted:It would probably be successful as a $15 indie title on Steam. That said, I'm not sure I'd call EO gameplay-transparent -- what's your definition of that? I honestly think EO is really pretty gameplay-transparent. It's not necessary to know the precise percentages of buffs or the attack strength of a skill, but knowing how good armor or weapons are relative to other pieces of equipment certainly is. Its bar quests (usually) give you a good estimation of where you should be looking to complete them, it's forthcoming with combat information as far as you'd expect any RPG to be (it's not unfair to keep players blind to enemies' elemental resistances), and it's both very clear with its skill descriptions and (somewhat) forgiving with respeccing in case you screw up or have to make a situational switch. Gameplay-wise, I'd like to see maybe two or three things dumped from the system such as 100% ambush mobs, forced class setups (Salamox, for example, basically required you to use Hexer/Troubadour/Protector/Alchemist, and any situations that didn't demand this composition saw you way too strong to get any reward from the fight), and skill taxes (FOE and damage floor abilities). Oh, inversely useful skills, too, where you learn it, it's reasonably strong and executes at like 112% speed, but then you level it up and it gets stronger but it slowly approaches a 1% execute speed at 5/5 or 10/10. Aside from a few gently caress-yous like those, EO is really pretty fair and forthcoming, the genre considered.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 21:40
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:I honestly think EO is really pretty gameplay-transparent. It's not necessary to know the precise percentages of buffs or the attack strength of a skill, but knowing how good armor or weapons are relative to other pieces of equipment certainly is. Its bar quests (usually) give you a good estimation of where you should be looking to complete them, it's forthcoming with combat information as far as you'd expect any RPG to be (it's not unfair to keep players blind to enemies' elemental resistances), and it's both very clear with its skill descriptions and (somewhat) forgiving with respeccing in case you screw up or have to make a situational switch. I honestly thought the opposite. Let me fire up my EO3 cart and look up my Arbalist's skills: "Empowers you when enemies have notably higher HP." How? By how much? What do you mean by "Notably higher HP?" Higher than what? How much higher than what? My Arbalist's HP or generic enemy HP? Do you mean current or max HP? If it's current HP, is the bonus linear or is there some threshold after which it activates? "Increases all skills' accuracy." By how much? How is accuracy calculated? This is sort of important! Why would I invest in a skill that increases accuracy instead of investing in something else that increases damage when I can't know the effect of either? quote:It's not necessary to know the precise percentages of buffs or the attack strength of a skill See, I totally disagree with this because the game expects you to make choices as to which skills you want to learn, which skills you want to improve and which skills you want to pass on. This still wouldn't be so bad... if it didn't penalize you harshly for making poor choices with 1) high difficulty and 2) you want to respec? Well you lose five levels because gently caress you, that's why! This is sort of what I meant with the Arbalist's accuracy skill quip. How can I make a meaningful, mathematical choice between "Increases accuracy," "Increases damage when Enemies have noticeably higher HP," "Increases crossbow damage," or simply putting an additional point into an active skill when I have only the most vague clue of what difference that point will make? edit: Oh, and let's not even get into status effects and stacking resistance to them and special FOE resistance and all that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 22:11
|
|
|
I remember playing through (most) of the first game, It was frustrating as can be, but it was incredibly rewarding to defeat FOEs that where giving me trouble. I am considering going back and re-playing it, because I forget where most of the secret passages are. I have the 2nt and 3ed games just sitting on my shelf waiting to be played, but where terribly neglected because I refused to play them until I beat the first.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 22:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 15:01 |
|
|
DrManiac posted:Speaking of anime wizardry knock-offs, what ever happened to class of heroes 2? It was supposed to come out in this fall but I haven't seen any news on it for months. Well the person in charge of that game is right up there alongside that Cave Story publisher for being really bad at actually getting games to the store. I really ought to play more EO3, completely forgot where I was at though, going off sailing to discovery was too distracting.
|
|
#
?
Nov 9, 2012 23:00
|
|
