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I'd usually agree about the awkward usage of a word in a translation, but "despair" and "hope" are important enough keywords that I'm keeping them unless there's a very good reason not to. As said, "despair-inducing" (or sometimes simple "despairing") is my regular translation for "zetsubou-teki", which is how you turn despair into an adjective in Japanese. Also, for whoever said Japanese simply didn't have as large a vocabulary for describing emotion, I'd have to doubt that -- there are certainly plenty of other words to describe a sense of helplessness, and the game uses a lot of them elsewhere in the dialogue. I'm not a native speaker, but I often have a feeling the usage of 'zetsubou' (and especially "zetsubou-teki", which is not a very natural word) is awkward there too and designed to draw attention to itself. orenronen fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Feb 25, 2013 |
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Feb 25, 2013 04:35
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I think we talked about fujoshi in the DR1 thread some specifically because it's a distinctly Japanese thing with no real direct meanings in English. Basically, it's someone who becomes a hermit, rarely if ever leaving their room, as a response to the immense and pervasive societal pressures of succeeding that Japanese culture instills, if I recall.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:36
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Fighting-Fefnir posted:I think we talked about fujoshi in the DR1 thread some specifically because it's a distinctly Japanese thing with no real direct meanings in English. Basically, it's someone who becomes a hermit, rarely if ever leaving their room, as a response to the immense and pervasive societal pressures of succeeding that Japanese culture instills, if I recall. That's hikikomori, Kyle.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:39
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alcharagia posted:That's hikikomori, Kyle. That's right; a fujoshi's a woman who is most commonly seen as a fan of guy-on-guy relationships and their trappings. I was just wondering if there was a better definition than 'sad fangirl'.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:42
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Fighting-Fefnir posted:I think we talked about fujoshi in the DR1 thread some specifically because it's a distinctly Japanese thing with no real direct meanings in English. Basically, it's someone who becomes a hermit, rarely if ever leaving their room, as a response to the immense and pervasive societal pressures of succeeding that Japanese culture instills, if I recall. You're thinking of hikikomori. Fujoshi is something completely different. It relates to yaoi fandom. Loathe as I am to know this, in brief, it's a self-deprecating term for said fans that tends to imply shipping. It's also a pun in Japanese.   orenronen posted:I'd usually agree about the awkward usage of a word in a translation, but "despair" and "hope" are important enough keywords that I'm keeping them unless there's a very good reason not to. As said, "despair-inducing" (or sometimes simple "despairing") is my regular translation for "zetsubou-teki", which is how you turn despair into an adjective in Japanese. Speaking personally, I never heard anyone actually use the term in Japan, just like I don't think I've ever heard someone use the word 'despair' to describe their mood in Canada so I'd agree that it's probably on purpose. Cuntellectual fucked around with this message at 04:45 on Feb 25, 2013 |
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Feb 25, 2013 04:42
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alcharagia posted:That's hikikomori, Kyle. ...do I know you from somewhere? Also, yeah, my bad. It's all Greek to me. 
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Feb 25, 2013 04:47
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I thought a fujoshi was one of those loincloth-diaper things samurai wore instead of underpants.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:52
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Crowetron posted:I thought a fujoshi was one of those loincloth-diaper things samurai wore instead of underpants. No, that`s a fundoshi. You can tell because anyone that wears one is clearly having fun.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:54
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Crowetron posted:I thought a fujoshi was one of those loincloth-diaper things samurai wore instead of underpants. That's a fundoshi, actually Dangan Ronpa 2: Let's Learn About Japan Through Murder
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Feb 25, 2013 04:54
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This first case seems a hell of a lot more complicated than the first case of the previous game. I pretty much knew who it was instantly. Here? Not a clue. Souda and Hanamura are higher up on the list for me, they're just too excitable, and whoever did this had to be a bit spastic. Eight times is a lot. Also Dead End is a fantastic track 
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Feb 25, 2013 04:55
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If I remember correctly from the previous thread, "fujoshi" literally translates to something along the lines of "rotten woman". The "fu" in "fujoshi" is also the same "fu" used in Fukawa's name.
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Feb 25, 2013 04:55
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Sensorium139 posted:Hanamura also looks very distressed, seemingly more than everyone else. Either he's acting or something's up... I just find Hanamura extremely suspicious. I really feel like Nagito is the killer, but it's mostly for meta reasons. It just makes too much sense to knock out both Togami and "Naegi" in the tutorial case, so the rest of the game is spent with the new cast. Also, his adamance toward proving that nobody killed Togami... that would include proving he didn't kill Togami, wouldn't it? He says he wants to prove nobody among them is the killer, but "proving it" doesn't mean it's true. He could very easily just be deceiving everyone from discovering who the killer was. Miss Kalle posted:Man I'd kinda like to nab that one with Ibuki and Souda in glasses, but I won't have funds for a week yet
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Feb 25, 2013 04:56
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RiffRaff1138 posted:I think Hanamura's a douche, but even when taking into account DR's penchant for subverting expectations, I just can't see him as a killer. Also remember that the murder was exceedingly brutal yet devious; while I do believe Hanamura could just snap and go hog-stickin' wild on someone, the latter bit requires that he actively plan to go under the cabin and get stabbing. That second part is what I don't think Hanamura is capable of right now. Besides, the guy's a SHSL chef, probably with knowledge of all kinds of ingredients. If he wanted to, he could probably kill them with amazingly good food and/or poison rendered undetectable by such food.
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Feb 25, 2013 05:01
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I wouldn't mind all the Japanese terminology if the people saying it stopped for a minute and realized it's not always clear and that there are people enjoying this thread who want to contribute to the discussion who don't know a tsundere from a Yandere and that it only takes a minute to add a link like I just did, or explain it in the post. Alternatively: I wouldn't mind all the Japanese terminology if the people saying it stopped for a minute and realized it's not always clear and that there are people enjoying this thread who want to contribute to the discussion who don't know a tsundere (an archetype of a character who's usually cold to someone before warming up to them) from a yandere (someone who seems loving and warm to start with, but ends up being a stalker, sometimes violent).
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Feb 25, 2013 05:04
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Miss Kalle posted:Also, cute sprite arts, Zyxyz! I forget if it's been asked or not, but have you considered selling those on Etsy or someplace similar? I'd love to have a couple for myself. I hadn’t thought about it before, but I really enjoy making them and could make some for others by request. I could even make just about anything small (up to 58x58 pixels) that can be reasonably rendered in the Perler color palette, not just DR/DR2 sprites. I would probably just take orders by email and accept a small payment by PayPal.
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Feb 25, 2013 05:08
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orenronen posted:I'd usually agree about the awkward usage of a word in a translation, but "despair" and "hope" are important enough keywords that I'm keeping them unless there's a very good reason not to. As said, "despair-inducing" (or sometimes simple "despairing") is my regular translation for "zetsubou-teki", which is how you turn despair into an adjective in Japanese. Yeah, as a Japanese speaker, I have to agree with this choice. In what videos I've seen from both games and what I've read of the light novel (nothing that goes beyond what's in the thread but enough that I have a pretty good sense of how the Japanese 'feels'), the repeated use of "zetsubou" and "kibou" is very noticeable and quite clearly deliberate. Changing those might make the translation less awkward, but it would also be taking far too many liberties with the text, IMO. quote:No, that`s a fundoshi. You can tell because anyone that wears one is clearly having fun. Except during Naked Man, perhaps... although the guys I know who have gone to it swear it is fun, somehow. zetsubous fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Feb 25, 2013 |
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Feb 25, 2013 05:59
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Slightly late to the "I got spoiled!" discussion but I got a slightly funny story about that. A somewhat dickish friend and I used to pass notes in the "dancing men" code from Sherlock back in high school because we were some twisted version of hipsters, and he went "Hey bet you don't remember the code by heart anymore." He sent me a link to a website to refresh my memory, I read it/memorized it and went "Test me." He did. Halfway through the message, I realized it was a coded DR2 spoiler he had made it just to be a dick and immediately stopped decoding it. For the rest of the day he tried to get me to read it in...admittedly increasingly creative ways until I decoded it out of reflex. The spoiler I was so terrified of? Yeah, it translated to this: quote:Fun twist, Nagito is actually Irish and the same person as as I'm just loving with you I haven't played DR2 yet. You couldn't stop yourself from mentally translating this could you This is the code if anybody's really, really bored. That was far funnier to me than it had any right to. I'm still spoiler free for the game though!
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Feb 25, 2013 06:07
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Was this the same guy who spoiled DR1 for you? If so, it's good to see him using his dickishness for good 
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Feb 25, 2013 06:22
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There are multiple reasons as to why this was a fantastic read through, but there's too may to comment on, so I'll just say, thanks guys. This murder is really perplexing right now. Not only was the kill relatively silent (as far as we know) but there's still several important parts. Things aren't looking good for Pekoyama's case. Our SHSL Coach probably scrammed for the crapper when it was available. Pekopeko appeared before then if I recall correctly. The Victim died from stab wounds, carried out in a manner that was apparently silent, in which the victim didn't make any sounds of pain, indicating instant, death or an otherwise silencing stab into the throat which can assume would be part of her SHSL talents. She also dissapeared from the scene at a convenient time and was sent to where the breakers for cottage were. However, I cant't resign myself to this just yet, there's still plenty of wiggle room. Togami could've been Gagged as he was being skewere, which theoretically anyone could do. someone would've had to prepare some form of cover for themselves, otherwise we can assume that whoever's soaking wet from a quick shower is our culprit. I'm surprised other people noticed that green substance which could be some form of illuminant. Also, I do not think its possible to effectively stage an "under the floorboard assault" given how in the world can one see from under the floor? Do we assume there's a knothole conveniently stationed at every plank? There's enough space for a person to hide there sure, but is that enough space to merely crawl on hands and knees or is there almost walking space? Oh, and in case DR2 feels like repeating what happaned in DR1, I might as well throw it out there that we could've been introduced to a fake Togami the whole time, and the real one is, for whatever reason, the mastermind. We shouldn't underestimate the Togami Group after all, though I myself doubt it.
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Feb 25, 2013 06:43
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Joenen posted:Our SHSL Coach probably scrammed for the crapper when it was available. Pekopeko appeared before then if I recall correctly. The Victim died from stab wounds, carried out in a manner that was apparently silent, in which the victim didn't make any sounds of pain, indicating instant, death or an otherwise silencing stab into the throat which can assume would be part of her SHSL talents. She also dissapeared from the scene at a convenient time and was sent to where the breakers for cottage were. As for stabbing under the floor, it has been established that the floors are old with gaps between the planks, which would be enough for a skewer to go through. Besides, there is a chance that the knife is a trap for luring Togami, or prepared by a second murderer for his/her own use, either of which case would mean somebody will go under the table and get stabbed.
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Feb 25, 2013 06:58
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W.T. Fits posted:If I remember correctly from the previous thread, "fujoshi" literally translates to something along the lines of "rotten woman". The "fu" in "fujoshi" is also the same "fu" used in Fukawa's name. "Rotten girl" was the term used, in my recollection. It was also said that a "fujoshi" is the female form of the more familiar "otaku," which apparently literally translates to "person who never leaves his house" or something along those lines. Pittsburgh Lambic fucked around with this message at 07:27 on Feb 25, 2013 |
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Feb 25, 2013 07:18
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 Nagito is really pale and he is also SHSL Luck which makes the theory of him being Irish a legitimate. 
LateToTheParty fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Feb 25, 2013 |
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Feb 25, 2013 07:22
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I double checked what Orenonen described it as for completness' sake, so here we are.Orenonen in DR1's second trial part 2 posted:Syo is a self-proclaimed fujoshi. That's the female version of the otaku, usually literally translated as "rotten girl". Fujoshi like obsessing over male anime characters and read and draw manga involving them loving each other. Syo also strives to become a Kifujin. That's the term used for fujoshi who remain fangirls even as they grow older. Kifujin is a pun on a word that sounds the same and means "a noblewoman", but written with the "fu" character that means "rotten" - the same one as in "fujoshi" itself.
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Feb 25, 2013 07:49
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[redacted]
Skunkrocker fucked around with this message at 09:04 on Feb 18, 2014 |
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Feb 25, 2013 08:29
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I think the larger circle in the Monobear File may well indicate that it was caused by a different weapon from the others; most likely, the small circles were caused by the skewer, and the large one by the knife. The wording in the File also doesn't specify that the stabbings were all caused by one weapon, only that "The cause of death was stabbing with a sharp object" and "The victim was stabbed multiple times in the region between the abdomen and the throat." Here's my partial theory: As has been said before, Nagito probably taped the knife under the table; if so, it's likely that he somehow tripped the breaker as well, maybe by setting up some appliances in the storage room to all turn on at once (not much evidence for this, although the murder happening close to the half-hour might be indicative). He went to recover the knife in the darkness, but Togami had already opened his box and put on the NV goggles that were inside. He attempted to stop Nagito, they struggled under the table, and Nagito stabbed him... but not fatally. It was only afterwards that another attacker stabbed him with the skewer through the floorboards several times and killed him. This explains why Nagito was so insistent that none of the students killed Togami, and that they shouldn't bother trying forensics; he thought that he had to draw attention from himself, not realising that someone else was the actual culprit. It'll be interesting to see whether he continues on this tack, given that if he did only stab Togami once, the Monobear File has now shown him that there was a second attacker. Unfortunately, this theory doesn't really give any clues as to who the actual killer is, just that we may well get a lot of clues pointing to Nagito.
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Feb 25, 2013 08:38
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TKMobile posted:I just noticed that Peko said she doesn't do well with crowded places. While it's not EXACTLY the same as being claustrophobic... It's not "not EXACTLY", it's completely different. People aren't walls.
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Feb 25, 2013 09:27
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Jeek posted:The wounds are all between the throat and the stomach, so whatever the reason Togami didn't scream, it is not from an attack on the throat. Also, if Peko wants to murder somebody, it is unwise of her to choose stabbing as she is the one most proficient of doing so. On the diagram though, it sure looks like he got one stab right in the throat:  So I think "between the abdomen and the throat" is inclusive. But anyway, my main question is, what's Pekoyama doing just waltzing in like nothing happened? "Oh, is that Togami?" How about "hey, who knocked me out and turned off the power?" "Why'd I wake up in the bathroom?" or something along those lines to explain why she went completely AWOL from guard duty? She better get some more interrogation from people in the next update.
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Feb 25, 2013 09:54
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slowbeef posted:tsundere (an archetype of a character who's usually cold to someone before warming up to them) No, that's a kuudere. A tsundere pretends to actively dislike someone they're in love with.
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Feb 25, 2013 11:37
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Well, I'm sure glad we've cleared that up.
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Feb 25, 2013 11:45
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Runaway Bro posted:Well, I'm sure glad we've cleared that up. For further information, let me post this TvTropes link that Bifauxnen posted:But anyway, my main question is, what's Pekoyama doing just waltzing in like nothing happened? "Oh, is that Togami?" How about "hey, who knocked me out and turned off the power?" "Why'd I wake up in the bathroom?" or something along those lines to explain why she went completely AWOL from guard duty? She better get some more interrogation from people in the next update. It is indeed suspicious, but it can be ruled out if she has a phobia of the dark, or just have a bad sense of direction in low light levels- hell, I once got lost in my own neighbourhood when the place experienced a power cut, so why can't Peko? Besides, if she is an adept swordswoman, why would she get so stabby with Togami? Look at the poor guy- stabbed eight times, once each in the throat and gut, and then six more times for good measure. That speaks more of frantic stabbing rather than the cool, composed exterior Peko's been showing. Mind you, she could be hiding a Syo-like mentality beneath, but we might as well speculate that she's a space alien for all the proof we have. Either that, or she took the opportunity to have some snogging time with the gangster, which is again explained by the following TvTropes link that
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Feb 25, 2013 12:00
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Has anyone mentioned yet that the stab-wound in the middle of the abdomen has a larger radius? Two murder weapons? Two suspects?!
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Feb 25, 2013 13:19
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I think the larger one is the initial stab wound and the smaller punctures were just the murderer venting whatever feeling that led them to attack Togami.
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Feb 25, 2013 13:56
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Suzuki Method posted:Hate to ask, but anyone reading this who's already played DR2, can someone perhaps go looking for (worksafe noncreepy) fan art of Owari for me? She's my favourite character and I'd like to probably change my avatar to her. Here you go!
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Feb 25, 2013 13:59
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Oxygen Deficiency posted:Has anyone mentioned yet that the stab-wound in the middle of the abdomen has a larger radius? Two murder weapons? Two suspects?! Read the several posts above you right in this page, dude. That said, how would Monobear judge if it turns out that there were two murderers trying to get Togami at the same time and neither would have succeeded without the other's attempt?
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Feb 25, 2013 14:07
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Stroth posted:
It sounds pretty similar to the declaration the protagonist makes in Umineko: When They Cry when faced with the existence of witches. Of course, such phrases aren't exactly a rarity in murder mysteries, but it may just be a reference and not meant to belie his guilt. tiistai posted:It's not "not EXACTLY", it's completely different. People aren't walls. In fact it's generally a case of the opposite, agoraphobia - the fear can be driven by wide open spaces (and some people mistakenly think that's all there is to it), crowds or even the concept of leaving a designated 'safe zone' that you otherwise stay in. It's only in the extreme cases that you get the kind of reclusive person who never leaves their house (or room). Pekoyama's most likely suffering from a mild case of that.
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Feb 25, 2013 15:56
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But... I still won't believe it. I won't believe one of us killed Togami-kun...
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Monobear's line about 'Dying for someone else's ego' really interests me, actually. It could just be about the killing, I get that, but that fact that it's about Togami specifically, and he's changed so much from the previous game, it might be about this Togami being a body double, as has been brought up before. In which case, this begs the question as to where the actual Togami is, if he's on the island at all.
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Feb 25, 2013 16:28
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I think, to help narrow down the suspects, we can go by their immediate reactions to see whether or not they had anything to do with this. Total nonchalance?  Innocent as it gets. Immediately making GBS threads yourself?  No worries, he's legit. Rabies?  Guilty or no, she needs to be quarantined for everyone's safety. ...   Nervous and sweaty?  Yeah, I'd buy that if you didn't already act that way all the drat time. You're on the watchlist, nurse. 
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Feb 25, 2013 17:56
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Speaking of reactions, I noticed that we haven't seen any reactions from Gundam or Akane yet. Now Gundam, sure, that fits with what we've seen from him thus far. But Akane...? 
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Feb 25, 2013 18:06
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DaveWoo posted:Speaking of reactions, I noticed that we haven't seen any reactions from Gundam or Akane yet. She hasn't noticed yet. She'll realize what's going on when the food's gone.
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Feb 25, 2013 18:15
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orenronen posted:
F...Fedule! C...could I make a suggestion? I...I think maybe you should c...consider...t...toning...t...this...d...down. Unless one of the twists involves everyone having a stutter.
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Feb 25, 2013 18:34
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N...No...
...W...Why?!
N...No way...!
I...It can't be...
M...Murder...?
W...Wait! So, you mean...!
W...What... is this?!
W...Wait! What are you saying?!
W...What?! Did this happen because of the boots?! This is howibble!
U...Um... You mustn't doubt each other... You should all be friends...
I...I hate it too! I hate it and I’m scared!
D...Destroy evidence...?
U...UOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!
K...Koizumi-san...
U...Um... um...!
I...I'll do my best too! I'll do my best not to stand in anyone's way!
I...I don't believe any of it... I don't believe that Togami died...
I...I get it... I'll do what I can...