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I know it's just a byproduct of the art-style but I love how characters are stuck in whatever pose they last made until they have dialogue again. I like to imagine each person is really hung-up on whatever they last said, or that a guy like Gundam wanted to stand in a crazy ninja pose until he feels like talking again.
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Mar 14, 2013 18:32
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Kytrarewn posted:That's the thing, I don't think that the culprit was aiming for anyone in particular, but rather whoever happened to end up in the right (wrong) place. But that's such a bad plan. The location of the stabbing makes it apparent that the killer was aiming for someone who was going to retrieve the knife. If no one sees the knife during the blackout, then the whole thing falls apart. Hell, what if multiple people see it? If you only kill one, your plan becomes more apparent. I don't think they intended to kill Togami, but the killer had to know someone was going to go there.
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Mar 14, 2013 18:43
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Request: HelloWinter, is it possible to sub the speaker tag when the person speaking isn't on-screen? I'm still learning the voices so I had to go and check the screenshots at one point, and anyone deaf/hard of hearing would be completely lost. The portraits make it so it isn't usually an issue, though. "That reasoning is flawed!" was great, but Hinata's hair wiggling is just completely goofy. They really should have toned it down a bit...
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Mar 14, 2013 19:28
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slowbeef posted:But that's such a bad plan. The location of the stabbing makes it apparent that the killer was aiming for someone who was going to retrieve the knife. If no one sees the knife during the blackout, then the whole thing falls apart. Hell, what if multiple people see it? If you only kill one, your plan becomes more apparent. Yeah, that's why I figure the DayGlo tape was there. There's the minor problem of the tablecloth being long enough to cover where the knife (probably) was, so the tape might be of limited effectiveness. And how well can you really judge that something is a weapon from a slight bit of green glow on a piece of wood on the ground (that happens to be attached, itself, to a piece of metal). The bigger problem, though, is the letter. If Togami wasn't the intended target, why send him the letter to make him super-vigilant? Just to reduce his chances of being group leader after his little plan to prevent deaths failed, even when he was warned ahead of time of a threat? But either you die because you're executed by Monobear, or everyone else dies because you succeeded, so the motivation for sending the letter is weak. I don't like the letter at all.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:31
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Wow, great update! Koizumi's interjection was such a pleasant surprise. I'm pretty much reiterating what everyone else has been saying, but I'm so glad the rest of the cast is contributing just as much as Nagito, even the comic relief types. Also, I get the feeling Nanami has like 90% of the case figured out already since she immediately suggested that Togami saw somebody going for the knife. So far I'm loving this cast overall a lot more than the first game's. I'm still in favor of Nagito planning one murder and Hanamura executing another. It feels like Nagito's starting to come to terms with the fact that he's gonna have to be outed for the truth to be found, and that's why he's being mostly quiet and dodgy so far. At the very least, I think he was the one initially going for the knife during the blackout. Since the tablecloth was down before the blackout, he had to know that it was there beforehand. There's no way that stuff glows bright enough to be seen through a thick white tablecloth. The only other possibility is that he somehow tripped and uncovered the tablecloth somehow, but if he tripped bad enough to do that, he'd almost certainly knock the lamp over in the process. So really there's no other way anybody would've exposed the knife unless they were going to use it. The actual killer would've been waiting in the crawlspace at this point, so they're pretty much out of the equation.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:36
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Hopefully there will be counter-argument sections with more than two people involved. Seeing all of those crosscuts happen at once would be pretty funny.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:41
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Kytrarewn posted:The bigger problem, though, is the letter. If Togami wasn't the intended target, why send him the letter to make him super-vigilant? Just to reduce his chances of being group leader after his little plan to prevent deaths failed, even when he was warned ahead of time of a threat? But either you die because you're executed by Monobear, or everyone else dies because you succeeded, so the motivation for sending the letter is weak. One possibility is that Mikan wanted the knife and Togami pushed her down, then went under the table to retrieve it. That'd explain how Embarassing Pose is an evidence bullet, at least. ...But that's kinda all it explains. As for the letter, my only theory is the traitor was being forced to kill someone by Monobear and wanted Togami to stop it. It just sorta happens that the party actually gave someone else the opportunity. But that's all I've really got. It's not as if whoever wrote it knew that it would cause a party to be thrown in the lodge.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:45
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Here's an in progress doodle of Sonia. Just going to throw it under a link since it's not really done, and Instagram filters because I'm a disgusting hipster. I haven't really sat down and tried to make art in like half a decade, so don't expect too much from me. I really love that they've added the new interjection mini-game to the trial, I was wondering how they would switch it up from the first game. Nagito needs to stop acting like it's not possible that one of the students in the group committed the murder, I'm getting annoyed at him at this point. I think he's becoming my main suspect because of this, he just won't let it go.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:48
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PurplieNurplie posted:Hopefully there will be counter-argument sections with more than two people involved. Seeing all of those crosscuts happen at once would be pretty funny. Obviously the next step is for someone to counter a counter-argument. The very last example of this will involve everyone still alive in one giant argument chain.
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Mar 14, 2013 19:49
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quote:
Oh Ibuki. Never change. I'm really finally starting to get the Hanamura suspicions and I'm not sure what changed, exactly.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:20
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Ha ha! Ibuki said "infer"! A clever word that doesn't fit her at all!
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slowbeef posted:As for the letter, my only theory is the traitor was being forced to kill someone by Monobear and wanted Togami to stop it. It just sorta happens that the party actually gave someone else the opportunity. But that's all I've really got. It's not as if whoever wrote it knew that it would cause a party to be thrown in the lodge. Can't remember the stance on DR1 spoilers in this thread, so I'm gonna cover this up in case someone's reading this one and haven't gotten far in DR1 for some reason. Honestly, Monobear faked Sakura's suicide note, so I wouldn't be too surprised if Monobear wrote the note.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:24
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Maybe it's just the counterargument taking me by surprise, but Koizumi jumped up on my suspect list. It's almost as if she knows what she's doing and she brought up the argument to make herself look oblivious. I think the pictures she took and the map she drew are more of a "Look I'm being super helpful! There's no way I could be the killer!." I really do like the videos of the trial this time around; it brings the game to life. Ibuki's voice really doesn't seem to fit her personality. Also, given Kuzuryuu's voice, I'm hoping the cross-dresser theory on him is wrong. I have played MGR pretty recently also and the slashing minigame definitely reminded me of it: the 'cut in the right direction or be punished' mechanic.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:25
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Regarding Ibuki's voice, since it's been brought up a couple times now -- I should probably feel ashamed for admitting I know this, but Ami Koshimizu (Ibuki's voice actress) played the lead role in Suite Precure, which was essentially a magical girl series with music as an overarching theme. Koshimizu's character is a lazy, argumentative tomboy that turns into a puffy, frilly pink asskicker, and her voice there is pretty much the same as how she plays Ibuki here. So I don't think it's too far off that those roles would be connected (considering Ibuki's other music-related character choices.) If anything, I feel like Souda's voice doesn't quite match his personality, but that's a matter of opinion.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:32
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orenronen posted:
THIS IS MY LAST RETORT!  Kytrarewn posted:I don't like the letter at all. Personally, I suspect that was planted by Nagito. He really went out of his way to show it to Hinata.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:43
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Ratoslov posted:THIS IS MY LAST RETORT! Never mind, that phrasing is perfect now.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:46
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I haven't been paying much attention to the speculation so far, so this has probably come up before, but I'd be very surprised if Togami himself hadn't somehow been planning to murder someone at the party. That's probably why he insisted on confiscating potential weapons. His behavior in general was just too suspicious. The location of his body would seem to confirm it, too.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:47
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Edit: Size limitations; sorry.
ThisIsACoolGuy fucked around with this message at 02:48 on Mar 15, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 20:52
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John Dyne posted:Man, people are just stretching in here for any loving thing. It's a thread of Mr. Fantastics trying to capture the Junkos flame. They've been saying that there's something suspicious about the whole thing numerous times. Chill the hell out dude, it's just a theory.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:54
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Hinata's hair has a life of its own in that gif. Look at that strand wobble. Guess I'll echo all the pleasant surprises at seeing new content and smarter discussion. I'm not exactly sure where the Hanamura suspicion is coming from, but I guess he is acting a bit shifty towards some of the evidence points. I just really want to know what exactly happened under that table already. They really did spruce up this first mystery.
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Mar 14, 2013 20:56
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Twiddy posted:EDIT: Also, I find it amusing that Hiyoko called out Hanamura for making a double-entendre. Why? Because I honestly thought he was just thinking about food. He didn't seem to say it in a way that sounded lewd or like it had double meaning (of course, this is me trying to read intonations in a language I don't speak), he was just contemplating how weirdly calm he was in this situation.  In long, the word for hors d'oeuvre is also slang for spank-bait. If you read a lot of fan-translated stuff, "side dish" seems to be the popular rendering. It's not clear if Hanamura is pondering the menu, or what imagery to tenderize himself to tonight. Either way, he's pretty calm all things considered 
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Mar 14, 2013 21:00
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Epoxy Bulletin posted:In long, the word for hors d'oeuvre is also slang for spank-bait. If you read a lot of fan-translated stuff, "side dish" seems to be the popular rendering. It's not clear if Hanamura is pondering the menu, or what imagery to tenderize himself to tonight. Either way, he's pretty calm all things considered ...And I humbly admit I had no clue about this slang meaning of "okazu", it didn't occur to me to check the slang dictionary, and that the joke makes much more sense right now. I guess I am not reading the right material. Or maybe I am. Edit: I'd also like to say that had I realized this slang meaning existed, we probably would've found a different way to translate this. I don't like leaving obscure Japanese double-meanings in the English translation, and would much rather find a better solution. orenronen fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Mar 14, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 21:10
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Edit: Size limitations; sorry
ThisIsACoolGuy fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Mar 15, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 21:11
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miscellaneous14 posted:They've been saying that there's something suspicious about the whole thing numerous times. Being given amnesia and transported to a remote tropical island where a stuffed bear controls giant mechs and where, in a room full of people, someone died to stab wounds while under a table due to a freak power outage is pretty well the defition of 'something suspicious is going on,' but there is a difference in 'don't' and 'can't' and would be one of those translation things I'd hope Fedule would catch. The two contractions completely change the context of the message. Either way, the killer is one of the current cast members. Realize, this is something that just pops up for a moment in the game before it goes on to the next line, not something people have days to mull over and tear apart. Introducing a new character that could have done it in what's pretty well the tutorial level is bad writing and bad gameplay design, and since DR1 didn't have any trip ups like that, I'd have faith DR2 would do just as well. e: Also those gifs own.
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Mar 14, 2013 21:12
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John Dyne posted:Introducing a new character that could have done it in what's pretty well the tutorial level is bad writing and bad gameplay design, and since DR1 didn't have any trip ups like that, I'd have faith DR2 would do just as well. I'm not saying they'd introduce a new character right away, just that way later on they might do the "surprise! you got the wrong person killed" routine. DR1 loved throwing players curveballs all the time just so they never knew what to expect. I can only imagine that this one is going to top it in some way.
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Mar 14, 2013 21:23
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I think the only thing that compared to the "there's an extra person X who did it" idea was Mukuro-Junko, who was used more as a way of revealing the mastermind being a student and no one ever realizing they were around. I think Hinata's constant thoughts of "is it really one of us" comes from his uncertainty at wanting to accept someone killed Togami and it wasn't just Monobear. It's a very understandable thought to have, considering the killer is even now trying to trick everyone and get away with killing all the others to escape.
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Mar 14, 2013 21:30
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Except the game has explicitly stated that if they get the wrong person fingered in the trial, everyone BUT that person dies. So an external party that no one has any idea about would not get fingered AT ALL unless the game introduced them suddenly, and they'd get out scot-free. Meaning that sort of thing would gently caress the player over and ruin the narrative of 'Monobear always sticks to his rules' that they've already laid out. So a fake-out 'we made you kill off the wrong person' thing wouldn't work, and if it DID work, it just makes Monobear a chaotic threat that no one has any way of defending themselves from, since he doesn't even stick to his own rules. The whole point is Monobear wants structure to how things are done, and wants them to suffer. It doesn't make sense and is still bad writing. e: In the case of Mukuro and Junko, Mukuro was killed BY Monobear for breaking a rule. Which isn't exactly the same as this scenario. But yeah, what Lotus Circle said is right about how Hinata is reacting.
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Mar 14, 2013 21:38
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Wow, that trial was pretty amazing. The interjection part really took me by surprise... I wonder if Koizumi will do that a lot, she does seem to have the right personality to be one of the more frequent counter-argument people. Nice seeing other characters be sharp enough to put their own theories or interjections together. So...it had to be someone out of the room, gangster guy couldn't have got the knife in...skewer as the weapon pretty quickly points at the chef, but the fact that he was heard during the blackout...ugh, I think I need to go back over the events, something seems odd. orenronen posted:I'd also like to say that had I realized this slang meaning existed, we probably would've found a different way to translate this. I don't like leaving obscure Japanese double-meanings in the English translation, and would much rather find a better solution. FFKonoko fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Mar 14, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 21:44
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Gundam's and Kuzuryuu's are a lot deeper than I would expect. I actually mistook Gundam for Nidai at first, and I'd figure Kuzuryuu to be higher pitched to go with his baby face. At least we can finally toss out the "Kuzuryuu's a crossdresser" theory, though. While still on voices, I like how Nagito, while still recognizably having the same voice actress as Naegi, actually sounds different. His voice is noticeably lower-pitched and less upbeat/energetic. It also kind of sounds like he tends to mutter, but that might just be the problem Miss Kalle mentioned with the music drowning out the voices. Oh, and I didn't notice at first, since I just watched the videos first go-around, but I appreciate that orenronen's changing Hinata's portraits to match his trial poses this time around. CandyCrazy fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Mar 14, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 21:45
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In the previous game, all blood was made pink to skirt under a harder rating that would make the game difficult to sell, but the "this person is dead" photo with the memorial ribbons at the trial had regular red dried blood-colored Xs scrawled over them. It seemed clear to me that "I X'ed this person's face out with their own blood" was the intended conclusion from that, but that it wasn't pink made me shrug and give up on that idea. Now the X is pink. Vindication?!
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Mar 14, 2013 21:47
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Phlegmish posted:I haven't been paying much attention to the speculation so far, so this has probably come up before, but I'd be very surprised if Togami himself hadn't somehow been planning to murder someone at the party. That's probably why he insisted on confiscating potential weapons. His behavior in general was just too suspicious. The location of his body would seem to confirm it, too. Unlikely - Togami made sure to place the box of confiscated weapons in another room entirely, and the stuff in Togami's own personal box (tear gas, baton) was the sort of equipment you'd use to subdue someone in a non-lethal fashion. FFKonoko posted:Wow, that trial was pretty amazing. The interjection part really took me by surprise... I wonder if Koizumi will do that a lot, she does seem to have the right personality to be one of the more frequent counter-argument people. Yeah, I could see Mahiru being one of the more frequent interjectors, based on her personality. (Also, count me among those who were completely taken by surprise when she popped up in the video.) DaveWoo fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Mar 14, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 21:52
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Krinkle posted:In the previous game, all blood was made pink to skirt under a harder rating that would make the game difficult to sell, but the "this person is dead" photo with the memorial ribbons at the trial had regular red dried blood-colored Xs scrawled over them. It seemed clear to me that "I X'ed this person's face out with their own blood" was the intended conclusion from that, but that it wasn't pink made me shrug and give up on that idea. Now the X is pink. Vindication?! Monobear is metal as gently caress, if that's the case.
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Mar 14, 2013 22:05
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CandyCrazy posted:Gundam's and Kuzuryuu's are a lot deeper than I would expect. I actually mistook Gundam for Nidai at first, and I'd figure Kuzuryuu to be higher pitched to go with his baby face. At least we can finally toss out the "Kuzuryuu's a crossdresser" theory, though. I knew that the second he spoke back in update 6 which was his first vocal clip.
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Mar 14, 2013 22:08
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FFKonoko posted:Sounds like a double entendre based on "tasty dish" might be a good alternative. "At a time like this all I can think about is going to bed and enjoying a tasty dish..." ? Not to step on Fedules toes though. "Food for thought", with the quotes to suggest the double entendre.
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Mar 14, 2013 22:24
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FFKonoko posted:Sounds like a double entendre based on "tasty dish" might be a good alternative. "At a time like this all I can think about is going to bed and enjoying a tasty dish..." ? Not to step on Fedules toes though. Yeah, that's better than anything I can think of.
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Mar 14, 2013 22:56
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John Dyne posted:Except the game has explicitly stated that if they get the wrong person fingered in the trial, everyone BUT that person dies. So an external party that no one has any idea about would not get fingered AT ALL unless the game introduced them suddenly, and they'd get out scot-free. Meaning that sort of thing would gently caress the player over and ruin the narrative of 'Monobear always sticks to his rules' that they've already laid out. I could only think that an unknown party being the killer would work if the students deduced that none of them killed the victim and just fingered "someone unknown". That said, there's no reason to suppose as-of-yet unseen characters yet. I think people are only doing so because of Nagito's declaration he wants to prove that no one is the culprit. For what it's worth, that's such a wild statement on Nagito's part that I can't help but do some conjecturing: there's a bunch of things that suggest Nagito planted the knife (he had the opportunity to do so, he was positioned next to it right before the lights-out, etc.), but also strong evidence that the knife wasn't the murder weapon (Togami's wounds, the crawlspace). If this is the case, it seems likely Togami pursued him under the table only to get skewered through the floor; since this happened in such close quarters, it'd be likely that he witnessed this. If he witnessed the killing in this way, but didn't see any killer, it suddenly becomes somewhat plausible that he'd say that no one killed Togami, because he could be thinking it was a Monobear spike-trap like the one that killed Mukuro. (I'm not saying he necessarily had any knowledge of that death, though.) I didn't have time to directly comment on the update earlier, but I really, really like how in-sync the characters' thought processes are with our thought processes. Even the incorrect ideas that Hinata has to shoot down sound like they came from the speculation in this thread.
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Mar 14, 2013 23:00
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Einander posted:Request: HelloWinter, is it possible to sub the speaker tag when the person speaking isn't on-screen? Will do! tiistai posted:I have to say that I preferred the old annotation subtitles. Both because the font was more consistent (here the subtitles randomly stretch and change size depending on the available space) and generally easier to look at (I'm just not a fan of Arial black as a subtitle typeface, or any other very bold face for that matter), and because it let me read the Japanese below if I bothered to. I recognize and thank for the effort, HelloWinter, but I hope you'd consider using a bit thinner font (even Arial bold would be great) and/or not stretching the text box in the future. Having it always in the same spot would be good too. The reason for the stretch is due to my incompetence in not knowing how to hide the underlying text properly, so until then...! Also, I'll try to choose a thinner font for next time, if that reads any better. HelloWinter fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Mar 14, 2013 |
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Mar 14, 2013 23:04
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God, Owari wanting to solve everything by just beating someone up never gets old for me.Phlegmish posted:I haven't been paying much attention to the speculation so far, so this has probably come up before, but I'd be very surprised if Togami himself hadn't somehow been planning to murder someone at the party. That's probably why he insisted on confiscating potential weapons. His behavior in general was just too suspicious. The location of his body would seem to confirm it, too. I think it only looked suspicious/excessive because it was unknown at the time that someone had sent him a threatening letter. As they say in the trial, him confiscating anything that could be used as a weapon was to prevent a murder. He seemed really genuine (to me at least) about wanting to protect everyone and make sure they didn't all start killing each other.
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Mar 14, 2013 23:07
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HelloWinter posted:The reason for the stretch is due to my incompetence in not knowing how to hide the underlying text properly, so until then...! Also, I'll try to choose a thinner font for next time, if that reads any better. If you need help with anything overlay-related, I might be able to lend a hand. Which subbing program are you using?
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Mar 14, 2013 23:16
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miscellaneous14 posted:If you need help with anything overlay-related, I might be able to lend a hand. Which subbing program are you using? I'm using Aegisub. Would you happen to know how I could extend the black box border underneath the font so that it covers a good portion of the screen without me having to manually resize the font itself? (which is a shame, too, cause I would rather have a consistent font size as well.)
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Mar 14, 2013 23:18
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HelloWinter posted:I'm using Aegisub. Would you happen to know how I could extend the black box border underneath the font so that it covers a good portion of the screen without me having to manually resize the font itself? (which is a shame, too, cause I would rather have a consistent font size as well.) I do, in fact. I'll move this to PMs.
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Mar 14, 2013 23:19
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