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Illinois' deadline for their marriage equality bill has been extended, allowing the bill to be considered through May 31, the scheduled last day of Assembly. The House plans to vote in these last 7 days, and it looks like we might have state 14. In other news, a new Gallup poll says 59% of Americans think gay unions are "morally acceptable", and 47% believe being gay or lesbian is an orientation people are born with, not a choice.
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May 25, 2013 16:18
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Sweeney Tom posted:In other news, a new Gallup poll says 59% of Americans think gay unions are "morally acceptable", and 47% believe being gay or lesbian is an orientation people are born with, not a choice. Got a link to this? I'd like to know the margin of error and whether these figures come from a single group of respondents who got asked these two questions in the same survey. I guess it just seems very odd to me that one in eight Americans simultaneously thinks "gay unions are OK" and "being gay is a choice".
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May 25, 2013 17:16
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Here you go.
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May 25, 2013 17:20
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Weird, from the PDF they say the literal wording of their question is "gay and lesbian relations", before that "homosexual relations", and before that "homosexual behavior". It looks like the "is being gay a choice" question is from a different survey 
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May 25, 2013 17:37
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Lutha Mahtin posted:Got a link to this? I'd like to know the margin of error and whether these figures come from a single group of respondents who got asked these two questions in the same survey. I guess it just seems very odd to me that one in eight Americans simultaneously thinks "gay unions are OK" and "being gay is a choice".
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May 25, 2013 17:42
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Thesoro posted:Even if being gay was a choice, would it be wrong? Maybe these people are morally forward but scientifically backward. Whether it's a choice or not is completely irrelevant to the fight for equal rights. You can choose which religion to follow, but nobody uses that fact to argue against protecting freedom of religion.
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May 25, 2013 19:30
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Thesoro posted:Even if being gay was a choice, would it be wrong? Maybe these people are morally forward but scientifically backward. This is definitely more of the approach that needs to be used when arguing over marriage equality. I believe it was mentioned earlier in the thread, but arguing whether or not it's a choice is implicitly agreeing to the idea that homosexual relationships are somehow lesser than heterosexual ones. Often when people support marriage equality because "being gay is not a choice" they're using that reasoning as a way to rationalize supporting behavior that they still see as unnatural, immoral or gross. A lot of that comes from the moral baggage built around homosexuality over the past few centuries, and that's the underlying issue that should be challenged in discussions about marriage equality.
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May 25, 2013 20:01
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Thesoro posted:Even if being gay was a choice, would it be wrong? Maybe these people are morally forward but scientifically backward. Actually, it makes sense that some of those people probably have a philosophical objection to homosexuality, but also believe the state shouldn't enforce their philosophy. I.e. old-school liberalism 
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May 25, 2013 20:19
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I remember when Boehner once opposed hate crime protections for LGBT folk because it's not an immutable characteristic, whilst simultaneously supporting hate crime protections for religious hate crime, which, although I support those protections, aren't as immutable as sexuality or gender identity.
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May 25, 2013 22:34
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Thesoro posted:Even if being gay was a choice, would it be wrong? Maybe these people are morally forward but scientifically backward. I'm not saying it's not a choice (it isn't) but from the mindset of the people that think it is, it's equivalent to asking if BDSM enthusiasts should be allowed to put Master/slave as registered positions on their tax forms and their ability to walk around with a collar and leash be protected.
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May 25, 2013 23:38
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Party Plane Jones posted:
And if you really wanted to keep the boys safe, you'd have the leadership be made up entirely of lesbians.
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May 26, 2013 00:59
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RagnarokAngel posted:I'm not saying it's not a choice (it isn't) but from the mindset of the people that think it is, it's equivalent to asking if BDSM enthusiasts should be allowed to put Master/slave as registered positions on their tax forms and their ability to walk around with a collar and leash be protected. In the bedroom vs. Public space decorum. You might as well ask about married couples that go bang in library bathrooms getting protected too if the myopic mindset is "a sexual interest protected = all sexual interests are protected".
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May 26, 2013 02:08
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Wait so if scouting allows gay minors but not gay adults does that mean the openly gay kids have to turn in their badges or something when they hit 18?
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May 26, 2013 05:04
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paragon1 posted:Wait so if scouting allows gay minors but not gay adults does that mean the openly gay kids have to turn in their badges or something when they hit 18? I think so yeah.
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May 26, 2013 05:05
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e: nevermind
Cactus Ghost fucked around with this message at 06:16 on May 26, 2013 |
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May 26, 2013 05:30
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paragon1 posted:Wait so if scouting allows gay minors but not gay adults does that mean the openly gay kids have to turn in their badges or something when they hit 18? Scouting only goes up to your 18th birthday, they would have accomplished their Eagle and any other achievements by then.
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May 26, 2013 06:00
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Pretty odd how the boy scouts thing which doesn't even have anything to do with marriage gets three pages of discussion, but one of the largest and most populous countries in the world achieving marriage equality gets two posts.Sweeney Tom posted:Brazil's National Council of Justice voted 14-1 to force the country's notary publics to register same-sex civil unions as marriages if the couple requests it. The decision could be appealed by their Supreme Court, but this move effectively paves the way for full marriage equality in Brazil,
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May 26, 2013 17:09
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BrBa posted:Pretty odd how the boy scouts thing which doesn't even have anything to do with marriage gets three pages of discussion, but one of the largest and most populous countries in the world achieving marriage equality gets two posts. Populations of SSM Countries 501.8m total or 7% of the world. 196.7 Brazil 65.4 France 50.6 South Africa 47.3 Spain 40.8 Argentina 34.5 Canada 16.7 Netherlands 11.0 Belgium 10.6 Portugal 9.5 Sweden 5.6 Denmark 5.0 Norway 4.4 New Zealand 3.4 Uruguay 0.3 Iceland The USA, by state 53.8m total, or 17% of the country 19.6 New York 6.9 Washington 6.6 Massachusetts 5.9 Maryland 5.4 Minnesota 3.6 Connecticut 3.1 Iowa 1.3 Maine 1.3 New Hampshire 1.1 Rhode Island 0.9 Delaware 0.6 Vermont 0.6 DC (numbers just pulled from Google, from between 2011-2013)
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May 26, 2013 23:57
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platzapS posted:Yeah, they're the biggest country yet by far to legalize it. If the Supreme Court goes full Loving v Virginia for SSM, then the total increase of population (~262) would be greater than Brazil, and a major symbolic victory for gay rights across the world, perhaps even in that MLK/Ghandi/Mandela sphere of human rights. Hopefully we can keep the dominos falling!
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May 27, 2013 02:39
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Gerund posted:If the Supreme Court goes full Loving v Virginia for SSM, then the total increase of population (~262) would be greater than Brazil, and a major symbolic victory for gay rights across the world, perhaps even in that MLK/Ghandi/Mandela sphere of human rights. And if that doesn't happen, just prop 8 being overturned will move the US into second place with 91.8m of it's population with marriage equality. Sadly even if every single state with domestic partnership laws to made them into full marriage equality laws it still wouldn't be enough to overtake Brazil in that regard.
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May 27, 2013 09:02
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You're forgetting about Mexico City with 8.8m and Quintana Roo with 1.4m.
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May 27, 2013 13:15
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Did Brazil have a huge anti-same sex marriage movement like in France?
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May 27, 2013 14:41
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Kurtofan posted:Did Brazil have a huge anti-same sex marriage movement like in France? I think there's a reasonable Mormon population there, but then again I also think Brazil was the reason last time that the Mormons reformed who was blasphemous or not.
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May 27, 2013 14:55
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Kurtofan posted:Did Brazil have a huge anti-same sex marriage movement like in France? People against it managed to put on a pretty large protest http://www.nst.com.my/latest/evangelicals-protest-gay-marriage-in-brazil-1.286770 France is a special case I think though, the French have a proud history of protesting everything from every political side, and Hollande has low approval ratings, so the anti gay marriage protests have been a focal point of all kinds of right wing dissatisfaction.
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May 27, 2013 17:56
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Amused to Death posted:People against it managed to put on a pretty large protest Didn't Spain's right-wing party also win the last election? I thought I had heard they were going to try to repeal the marriage equality law there (which they've had since 2005).
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May 27, 2013 22:19
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katium posted:Didn't Spain's right-wing party also win the last election? I thought I had heard they were going to try to repeal the marriage equality law there (which they've had since 2005). They never attempted a true repeal. The regressives did make a challenge as the ruling party to their supreme court, and it was upheld 8-3 in '11.
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May 28, 2013 06:02
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A new Franklin & Marshall College poll shows that a majority of PA voters (54%) support legalized gay marriage, and 53% support a constitutional amendment letting same-sex couples marry in the state. Pennsylvanians also support civil unions by a 2-1 margin. Also, Scotland's marriage equality bill will be introduced in Parliament next month. Chris James 2 fucked around with this message at 17:44 on May 28, 2013 |
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May 28, 2013 17:16
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I heard on the radio that Ingham County (where much of Michigan's Capitol, Lansing, inhabits as well as a Big 10 Univeristy) is going to recognize out of state same sex marriage with regards to property issues and emergency situations (for example bereavement leave). I fully expect the GOP to fight it tooth and nail but small steps, Ellie.
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May 28, 2013 22:49
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Illinois Representative LaShawn Ford said today that he will vote for same-sex marriage when the bill comes to vote this week. He was undecided up to this point.
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May 29, 2013 00:30
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Has there actually been a date set for when the Illinois legislature will vote?
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May 29, 2013 13:13
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RZApublican posted:Has there actually been a date set for when the Illinois legislature will vote? I don't think it's scheduled yet, but they have until May 31 when the session expires. Having tracked a bill through the legislative process in Illinois before (an unsuccessful attempt to repeal the 10-years for recording the cops beating someone law before the seventh circuit did it for them) the scheduling is really chaotic. The leaders in each house can basically call a vote when they feel like it -- or not at all.
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May 29, 2013 13:51
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This is from way back, but:Thanatosian posted:The LDS Church sponsors about a third of all Boy Scout troops. The Catholic Church sponsors another ten percent. So yeah, between the two of them, they control almost half of the organization, and if they were to withdraw, it would completely gently caress BSA. Scouting itself is fine and has the potential to be a modern, progressive force. It's the exclusive bigoted jerkwads that give the impression that the whole organization is bad. (It isn't.)
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May 29, 2013 14:23
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Click here to watch the first same-sex marriage to be celebrated in France, LIVE!
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May 29, 2013 16:48
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More Later posted:Click here to watch the first same-sex marriage to be celebrated in France, LIVE!
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May 29, 2013 16:53
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Kegluneq posted:Loving the huge framed photo of Francois Hollande there. So subtle. The most awkward photo.
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May 29, 2013 16:58
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Kegluneq posted:Loving the huge framed photo of Francois Hollande there. So subtle. HOLLANDE WIN, HOLLANDE GOOD
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May 29, 2013 17:00
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So far civilization hasn't crumbled. I'm anxiously waiting.
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May 29, 2013 17:05
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Kegluneq posted:Loving the huge framed photo of Francois Hollande there. So subtle. I think there's supposed to be a portrait of the current president during marriages. More Later posted:The most awkward photo. Yeah it is pretty awkward  Edit:Gay couple is happy, noooooooooo
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May 29, 2013 17:05
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More Later posted:So far civilization hasn't crumbled. I'm anxiously waiting. If there's a chance of French civilization crumbling, I would have thought American conservatives would get behind it.
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May 29, 2013 17:07
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More Later posted:So far civilization hasn't crumbled. I'm anxiously waiting. Here in Delaware things are looking grim. I just got my week's ration (a can of beans) from SorosCorp and am being sent down to work in the contraceptive mines again next week. Oh and I was forcibly gay married to a goat yesterday. France don't suffer the same fate as us, run while you still can!
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May 29, 2013 17:17
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