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WAFFLEHOUND posted:George R R Martin is not your bitch. and I can thoroughly enjoy what he's made while understanding fully that it's his right to just say "gently caress all of you" and stop writing if he wants to. I'm astounded how loving whiney this thread is. WAFFLEHOUND posted:So, as someone who marathoned the series all at once, So, as someone who marathoned the series all at once, you have no idea what you're talking about and should stay out of this thread until you've waited for six years between books multiple times.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:38
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:George R R Martin is not your bitch. and I can thoroughly enjoy what he's made while understanding fully that it's his right to just say "gently caress all of you" and stop writing if he wants to. I'm astounded how loving whiney this thread is. Did I get black-out drunk and wake up in a Goodreads discussion thread?
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Jun 11, 2013 18:48
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SammyWhereAreYou posted:So, as someone who marathoned the series all at once, you have no idea what you're talking about and should stay out of this thread until you've waited for six years between books multiple times. Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Seriously, it seems like 90% of the people in this thread hate the books and are angry that they aren't being published faster and this is a dichotomy I just can't fathom.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:52
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:George R R Martin is not your bitch. and I can thoroughly enjoy what he's made while understanding fully that it's his right to just say "gently caress all of you" and stop writing if he wants to. I'm astounded how loving whiney this thread is. The point is that he keeps jerking us around saying that he's writing when he clearly isn't. I don't think you understand why we hate the absolute fucker at all.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:52
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Holy poo poo. I totally did.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:53
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Seriously, it seems like 90% of the people in this thread hate the books and are angry that they aren't being published faster and this is a dichotomy I just can't fathom. Both AFFC and ADWD were pretty disappointing after five and six year waits. It's not that complicated.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:57
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Seriously, it seems like 90% of the people in this thread hate the books and are angry that they aren't being published faster and this is a dichotomy I just can't fathom. You're posting in a thread that has existed for years that you apparently just found last week. The last two books were 5+ year waits each for dreadful writing.
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Jun 11, 2013 18:59
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AFFC is a pretty good book aside from myrish swamp and fat pink mast.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:02
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IRQ posted:The point is that he keeps jerking us around saying that he's writing when he clearly isn't. I don't think you understand why we hate the absolute fucker at all. Yep. And I like Neil Gaiman, but I really disagree with him on this point, specifically because it's a multi-book series. When you start reading something that says "Part I" or "Book I" in the title, there's a two-way understanding: You're not going to get all butthurt when the main story isn't resolved at the end of the physical book you're holding, and that the author will fulfill the implied contract by writing a Book 2, 3, 4, etc. If an author never goes back and finishes, he's not holding up his end of the bargain. I understand how health issues can come up, and how stories can get out of control: See Robert Jordan. Even on his deathbed, Jordan was talking with Sanderson, leaving notes on what was to happen, and at least trying to make sure the Wheel of Time was eventually finished. Other authors have gone for years between releasing books in a series, but (as far as I know) they've never gotten snotty and told readers "It'll be done when it's done." The problem with Martin is his utter disdain and disrespect for those who have been waiting patiently (and not so patiently) for the new books, and any time someone brings up the wait he rolls his eyes, Livejournals about football, and tells us patience is a virtue.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:04
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Have fun defending the pear shaped guy who wrote "The Pear Shaped Man". I thought GRRM hate was all fun and games until that gem.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:12
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Don't worry, you'll get there sometime between now and when the next (half) book comes out in 2017. You have to have a little patience is all.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:14
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Seriously, it seems like 90% of the people in this thread hate the books and are angry that they aren't being published faster and this is a dichotomy I just can't fathom. It doesn't take long, You'll find it in your heart and soon you'll have the ADWD making GBS threads brown water quote ingrained in your mind.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:18
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Simon Draskovic posted:Yep. And I like Neil Gaiman, but I really disagree with him on this point, specifically because it's a multi-book series. It was all fun and games, until he started breaching the implied contract.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:19
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GRRM, first of his name, subverter of tropes, breacher of contracts.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:20
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emanresu tnuocca posted:AFFC is a pretty good book aside from myrish swamp and fat pink mast. Ayup. I'm rereading the series right now and Feast is what I'm looking forward to. First time I read it I was all "WHAT THE gently caress GORGE WHY IS NOTHING HAPPENING" but now I think I'm ready for several hundred pages of slow-burning plotting and Everything Is poo poo. The first time it's all about your Ned Starks and your Red Weddings but after that's all old news you can really get into your sand snakes in the myrish swamp.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:28
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emanresu tnuocca posted:GRRM, first of his name, subverter of tropes, breacher of contracts. His sigil is quartered between a bloated marten in the upper right and lower left quarters, and a half-devoured lemoncake in the other two. Chicken bones being angrily thrown at a television featuring the New York Giants by the Seven border the entire design.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:35
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canuckanese posted:His sigil is quartered between a bloated marten in the upper right and lower left quarters, and a half-devoured lemoncake in the other two. Chicken bones being angrily thrown at a television featuring the New York Giants by the Seven border the entire design. A Song of Ice and Fire has made me want to get a grant of arms from the national Herald so badly. It's stupid expensive though. They're hereditary though and the books seem to be having a similar effect on my father though so 
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Jun 11, 2013 19:42
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The Unsatiable, The Unkempt, Lord Paramount of Dungcock.
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Jun 11, 2013 19:43
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Under the Gurm's rulership, the crowds cried and moaned, waiting for the next release of the books. And lo and behold, after centuries of dread and misery, the seventh book was released indeed, but the people's plight saw no end. "He cannot handle such a grand undertaking!", cried some, "These metaphors for genitals are causing me shame!", wailed others. They were enraged how, after all these years, no, decades, the Gurm had seen it fit to cast them down. Finally, the most broken among them yelled: "This was a bad series! It was not worth the thirty years of waiting!" But then the Gurm himself descended from his throne, his visage eclipsing the sun. And he spoke: "But you still waited, hmmmmm?"
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Jun 11, 2013 19:51
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Who just said gurm on npr???
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Jun 11, 2013 20:10
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Sorry I'm not a bitter unfunny bitter burnout capable of posting only Daenerys scat memes. Seriously, it seems like 90% of the people in this thread hate the books and are angry that they aren't being published faster and this is a dichotomy I just can't fathom. Okay...let me see if I can explain this. Let's put aside all of GRRM's supposed issues on the basis none of us have ever met him, or those who have have not had extended conversations with him, served as his psychiatrist, or read his mind. Let's put aside disturbing stuff like 'The Pear Shaped Man' because in the end we have no idea exactly what it comes from and he's far from the first fantastical author to write disturbing stuff in that vein. Let's put aside the accusations of pedophilia because as far as we know he's never touched a child (unless someone can produce evidence to the contrary). Let's put aside the immense overstimulation aspects of his writing and how it honestly interferes with the pure narrative. The man wrote three books totaling nearly 2500 US hardback pages over the course of...let's say six years if he started writing the first one in 1994. Let's put aside the Seinfeld effect that he managed to tap into certain things that hadn't yet been seized on and ridden into the ground, mainly fantasy stuff grounded in 'realism'. The first two books were more or less setup for the third, but even then plenty of poo poo happened: even the considered weakest A Clash of Kings had the Blackwater battle. The third basically managed to get just about everything right, paying off nearly all the setoff (even though a chunk of it indicates the problems to come when you examine it in hindsight: The Red Wedding, as is, is less an organic conclusion with a bitter ending than a spiteful throwing of expectations into reader's faces with arrogant nasal laughter without any thought of long term narrative consequences) and setting up a whole new row of dominoes to fall with the supposed promise that it was only going to go further up. For a lot of people, Storms was a Moment. It was a product that seemingly went beyond being good fiction and became a sublime experience. They didn't read it, they FELT it. And then GRRM went dormant. Two books emerged in the next thirteen years. If one dug and examined, they had their merits, but you had to dig to find them. In the end though, they were setup, the bad parts of Books 1 and 2 without any of the other merits those books had. Setup that took 11 years to do, with no idea of this setup ever being paid off. Does he owe us anything? No. Is the fact that he originally planned a five year time skip in his plot, wrote a while under that framework, then decided it wasn't going to work and had to go back and start all over a factor that needs to be taken into account? Yes. Is the fact that Moments are basically like the first drug highs of drug addicts and the fact that we'll end up in a metaphorical same place chasing them a big part of why Feast and Dance get so poo poo on? Yes. Is it true that once the genie was out of the bottle and a whole bunch of people started copying GRRM's cynical, nasty 'low fantasy' style it became more appearent that his work wasn't as genre-shattering as we thought? Yes. Is it true that GRRM fully has the right to say he doesn't want to write any more if that's what he wanted? Yes. But he hasn't done it yet. He keeps claiming that he's going to finish the series. That he's going to at least TRY and pay off this setup. It's not a binding contract in the end, but despite the endless refrain that everyone in this thread 'knows' that GRRM has written nothing and will die and his notes will be burned and we'll have to get scraps of an ending from HBO, none of us really know if that's the case until he actually dies and his estate confirms that yes, no one is finishing his books. This thread is, ultimately, a refuge of optimists who refuse to give up, and are angry of the way GRRM has handled that optimism. If this thread had really given up on him, there would be no thread: it would have been locked sometime in 2012 and everyone would have gone on to do other things. In the end, this endless, bitter refrain of Dany's diarrhea, GRRM cursing, porn writing, and all that, is basically a big group of people who want to be proven wrong, and are doing their best to steel themselves from being disappointed if (and it's still an if) they turn out to be right. Latecomers to the party (like me, admittedly) really can't put themselves in their shoes, even IF GRRM kicks off and the series is never finished. It's the bad version of 'you had to be there'. Quite frankly, it's probably best we weren't. Cornwind Evil fucked around with this message at 21:06 on Jun 11, 2013 |
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Jun 11, 2013 20:23
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:So, as someone who marathoned the series all at once, I like ADWD. Y'all seem almost as spergy as the Worst Thread sometimes except you're way more bitter. Oh, my sweet summer child. What do you know of jorts?
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Jun 11, 2013 20:38
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All that fucker had to do was write one loving climax in A Dance With poo poo, out of like 3 main story lines. After 5 years, make something, ANYTHING happen, but no; making GBS threads in a desert is where we are, and is where we shall remain. e: Like a fool, I still believe the mummer's farce of TWOW coming out before the show catches it in 2017? Oberst fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Jun 11, 2013 |
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Jun 11, 2013 20:52
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Dead Man Posting posted:What do you know of jorts? Clearly I don't have your experience. 
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Jun 11, 2013 20:57
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The real rub is that even if GRRM manages to poo poo out TWOW before the show catches up, there's no way he's done with ADOS or whatever the gently caress is next before the show is well past him. And is he still doing a nine book thing or what? That dude needs to set a firm end point and just accept his losses by this point.
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Jun 11, 2013 20:58
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Nine? I thought it was seven. Winds of Winter-> Dream of Spring. What the hell would the other two books even be about?
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Jun 11, 2013 20:59
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Honestly, if he would just say "I'm done, I ran out of juice" and then effectively stop, I think I would have more respect for him. Saying how he's constantly "working on it" makes the lack of progress seem all the more galling.
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Jun 11, 2013 20:59
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Leave GRRM alone you guys. He gave me 5 great books about dark nipples and bowel movements to read in like a month. You just don't find quality like this and you should really be thankful for this unfinished story. Now here's a quote from some dude that wrote a Star Wars EU novel to summarize my feelings on me having to wait a whopping 7 days so far for the next book...
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Jun 11, 2013 21:08
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Oberst posted:All that fucker had to do was write one loving climax in A Dance With poo poo, out of like 3 main story lines. After 5 years, make something, ANYTHING happen, but no; making GBS threads in a desert is where we are, and is where we shall remain. Varys taking Kevan out of the game in favor of Aegon was actually pretty decent and effective as a climax (for the Crown- and Stormlands portion of the story, anyway) and cliffhanger (along with those in Victarion's and Jon's final chapters in the book). It was just one based in character motivations and allegiances; a social and political shakeup instead of a big action setpiece. It's not that different from the ending of ASOS (in particular Lysa and Tywin's murders), really.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:15
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At this point the series doesn't even need a conclusion that follows neatly from the current plotlines, because that's impossible. All that needs to happen is for Dany and the shitlizards to get to Westeros and start burning poo poo. Maybe Arya can end up killing Jon dead-dead somehow cause that'd be hilarious. The fat fucker can do it with a timeskip I don't even care. Just let big poo poo happen without a thousand pages more of meaningless buildup. Odds are Dany will drag her stupid rear end to Asshai because the prophecy or whatever, and have lots of lesbian sex that will be rendered faithfully on HBO. At some point Sam might have sex for the second time in his life. Because the details are what matters.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:16
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The Riddle of Feel posted:Nine? I thought it was seven. Winds of Winter-> Dream of Spring. What the hell would the other two books even be about? Sothoros.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:18
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Joramun posted:Varys taking Kevan out of the game in favor of Aegon was actually pretty decent and effective as a climax (for the Crown- and Stormlands portion of the story, anyway) and cliffhanger (along with those in Victarion's and Jon's final chapters in the book). It was just one based in character motivations and allegiances; a social and political shakeup instead of a big action setpiece. It's not that different from the ending of ASOS (in particular Lysa and Tywin's murders), really. Bullshit. We spend barely any time with Varys, Kevan, or any of the King's Landing factions aside from Cersei (who is locked up or focused on Maragery almost the entire time) throughout the entirety of AFFC and ADWD and then suddenly it's like "WHOA SHAKEUP TIME." It felt cheap, even if it was finally progression.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:20
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The seventh book being a 'meanwhile in sothoros' concurrent to the events of the AGOT could be the ultimate trope subversion.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:22
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The Riddle of Feel posted:Nine? I thought it was seven. Winds of Winter-> Dream of Spring. What the hell would the other two books even be about? Last I heard it was still to be 7 books, but if the next book or two are as inflated and unedited as AFFC and ADWD were, it seems unlikely that the story could be finished satisfactorily with "just" two more books. Unless 6 and 7 are like 1,800 pages each, and/or he goes nuts and kills like over half the POV characters in TWOW. I would be surprised if the series isn't lengthened to 8+ books, and I know we joke about GRRM dying before finishing the series (well some are joking), but at 8+ books it becomes about even money that he won't make it 
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Jun 11, 2013 21:31
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mind the walrus posted:Bullshit. We spend barely any time with Varys, Kevan, or any of the King's Landing factions aside from Cersei (who is locked up or focused on Maragery almost the entire time) throughout the entirety of AFFC and ADWD and then suddenly it's like "WHOA SHAKEUP TIME." It felt cheap, even if it was finally progression. You're overlooking that it's a climax for Tyrion's and Jon Connington's chapters (which show the buildup and battles on the other side) as well, not just Cersei's. Plotwise it actually ties together several different perspectives on the same storyline (the rise of Aegon V) quite neatly.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:31
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Fair enough, although Aegon V is still a poo poo plotline to introduce this late in the game as well.
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Jun 11, 2013 21:33
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mind the walrus posted:Fair enough, although Aegon V is still a poo poo plotline to introduce this late in the game as well. I would have liked some more foreshadowing but at the same time I liked that it made it possible fory Daenerys to horribly gently caress up/get murdered/etc in a more interesting way then "Oh jeeze she'll pull it together and save the day in Westeros."
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Jun 11, 2013 21:51
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I dunno why all of you are so bent out of shape; if GRRM kicks the bucket we can get a whole expanded universe for ASOIAF! 
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Jun 11, 2013 21:55
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mind the walrus posted:Fair enough, although Aegon V is still a poo poo plotline to introduce this late in the game as well. Truly the GRRM is mighty for he is subverting Chekhov's Gun and leaving the answer to the great mysteries entirely until the last chapter. Who amongst you could have seen it coming? Only the blessed bookshunners in their terrible ignorance will see the truth before the great reveal! Praise be to the Lord of Light and cast the
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Jun 11, 2013 21:57
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mind the walrus posted:The real rub is that even if GRRM manages to poo poo out TWOW before the show catches up, there's no way he's done with ADOS or whatever the gently caress is next before the show is well past him. Baseless optimism time, but if he can somehow manage to untangle all the knots by the end of Winds, and get everyone where they're meant to be for the finale that he has always, allegedly, had planned, then the final book might come easy. The quick release of Clash and Storm shows that he can bash 'em out when he's on form. I do think he'll need two books after Winds though.
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