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AlphaDog posted:A friend of mine has been mocking me for buying a $110 keyboard since I got mine a year ago. I showed him this thread, and all the people saying something very much like what you said, and his opinion was that it was all in our heads and a keyboard's a keyboard. If you're going to spend big on a part, it may as well be the one you're touching all the time.
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Jul 5, 2013 22:22
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Agreed posted:I know, right? Mechanical keyboards are the SSDs of physical user interface improvement. 2 of the best things I have done to my PC after the 3rd monitor/ergotron stand was getting a 256GB SSD (for booting/smaller programs) and CM Storm Trigger with cherry Blues, I will never turn back.
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Jul 6, 2013 01:20
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Typing this on a cheap wireless keyboard I got for my htpc. Splashed tea into my Black Widow. God how I miss it.
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Jul 6, 2013 02:08
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So my Unicomp gave up the ghost a day or two ago (half the keys don't work anymore) and I figured it would be as good of a time as any to look into a new keyboard. For the most part, I quite like the Model M/Unicomp, however I ended up having two problems with it: 1. The keys were just too big. Going from my Unicomp to some piece of crap Logitech I had as a backup, I discovered that my hands could reach more keys than on the Unicomp. Big difference. 2. Key travel time was just a touch on the side of being too big. Fine while typing, but playing games got really annoying. I was looking at the Das Keyboard, but do you guys have any other suggestions?
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Jul 6, 2013 22:00
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My experience is admittedly not very broad, but I love the linear actuation and great sensitivity (plus normal key size, nothing outlandish here) of the Corsair K60 (which I guess would be a K70 now with some extra features like all mechanical keys and backlit keys, features which Dogen notes are all improvements, not distractions). If key travel or insensitivity is a problem for you, these MX Cherry Red switches are a perfect antidote. I've tried them both with red o-rings and without, and I like them either way; they fit the larger o-rings if you really want to reduce travel and make bottoming out the key impossible. It doesn't have anything fancy apart from a swank media center control group and of course the fact that it's entirely mechanical, but it is one hell of a keyboard, great for anyone who likes a sensitive touch without totally losing the tactile feel in the bargain. Red o-rings reduce the travel slightly but noticeable and soften the impact moderately, but I am keeping mine stock from here on out because it is not difficult to just adjust to the straightforward, linear actuation, 45gram force requirement. After spending a little time with it, I absolutely refuse to go back to non-mechanical keyboards and I think I would be disappointed with any keys that were less sensitive to type on than the MX Cherry Reds. They feel perfect under my fingers. The K60/K70's unique selling point is a focus on first-person gaming, with special textured keys that also have a specific incline per-key for WASD and 1-6, making it extremely easy to know exactly what key you're on and making for very precise movement. However, I replaced them with the standard keycaps (which Corsair provides, along with an easy to use key puller) because I found them somewhat distracting when typing and haven't ever had an issue finding WASD when gaming anyway. Neat idea, though. The K95 is aimed at more generalist, perhaps more RTS-oriented gameplay and has some extra special features to bring that capability out in a really fantastic way. Some have been looking for Corsair to come out with a K95 with MX Browns, but I genuinely can't imagine going back from the ease of use and lightning sensitivity of the Cherry Reds. They're perfect for a good typist to type quickly or for use in games, and they lack a "click" while still feeling very distinctly mechanical, not like dome switches. If you are looking for a more clacky or definite springy feeling experience, then the Cherry Reds probably aren't for you.
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Jul 6, 2013 22:53
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I'm guessing you're also just interested in getting something new? Because I think Unicomp will do repairs on them by just switching out the main board for $30-40 if you ask them. That said, I don't think the Model M keys are actually any different from the more common Cherry ones used in the Das in terms of overall dimensions, though I'll have to go check sometime. It sounds like your cheap keyboard might have non-standard sized keys or else one of those funky flat layouts. I think the official specs for key travel are 2.3 mm to actuation on the model M buckling spring vs. 2mm on all Cherry switches. Though the feel will vary based on how stiff the spring inside is. There's a lot of brands for Cherry switch keyboards right now, and most are pretty good, so I were you I'd look at what offers the layout, switch types, and overall look you prefer. Supposedly Cherry Blue switches were meant to be close to Model M, but they're much less stiff and the sound is pretty different, too, to the point where I preferred the Brown, which is the same but without the clicking noise. I hear that there's a new type, the Cherry Green, that offers stiffness similar to the old buckling springs but I haven't gotten around to actually seeing one in person yet.
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Jul 6, 2013 23:01
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Agreed posted:My experience is admittedly not very broad, but I love the linear actuation and great sensitivity (plus normal key size, nothing outlandish here) of the Corsair K60 (which I guess would be a K70 now with some extra features like all mechanical keys and backlit keys, features which Dogen notes are all improvements, not distractions). If key travel or insensitivity is a problem for you, these MX Cherry Red switches are a perfect antidote. I've tried them both with red o-rings and without, and I like them either way; they fit the larger o-rings if you really want to reduce travel and make bottoming out the key impossible. It doesn't have anything fancy apart from a swank media center control group and of course the fact that it's entirely mechanical, but it is one hell of a keyboard, great for anyone who likes a sensitive touch without totally losing the tactile feel in the bargain. And if you do need macro keys, they have the K90/95 for $20 more than their respective non-macro versions (90 being the K60+macros, 95 the 70+macros.) Aphrodite fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Jul 6, 2013 |
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Jul 6, 2013 23:12
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Cream_Filling posted:I'm guessing you're also just interested in getting something new? Because I think Unicomp will do repairs on them by just switching out the main board for $30-40 if you ask them. I've also had n-key rollover issues with the Unicomp, which is something I didn't expect out of a keyboard that expensive. Cream_Filling posted:That said, I don't think the Model M keys are actually any different from the more common Cherry ones used in the Das in terms of overall dimensions, though I'll have to go check sometime. It sounds like your cheap keyboard might have non-standard sized keys or else one of those funky flat layouts. The stand-in is one of these, if it helps to have a reference. I also use an modern apple keyboard at work, and in both cases it feels like it's less effort to reach certain keys.
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Jul 7, 2013 03:11
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Meow Tse-tung posted:I've been waiting for like a week for my K70. So I imagine I'll join the chorus of praises soon. Where's the drat brown key version 
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Jul 8, 2013 16:59
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Man looking at the OP of this thread, it could really use an update. Things have changed since 2009.
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Jul 8, 2013 17:09
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So here's something weird I found Needs a keycap replaced; probably why it was so cheap. Says "Model M" on the back, and it certainly feels and sounds like it's using the buckling spring switches. I don't remember my granddad's IBM Model M having 24 function keys though and I sure as hell don't remember it having any "dup", "field", "setup" or "erlnp" keys. Seems to work okay in windows, though I still haven't figured out what if anything "erlnp" does.
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Jul 9, 2013 06:29
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What you have there is a 122 key terminal emulator keyboard. The fact that it works in Windows and looks new means it's probably similar to or actually a Unicomp which go for $99 new, so that's a steal. Depending on exactly which version you have, the extra keys might send Shift+F1 ect. or strange scancodes Windows doesn't understand.
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Jul 9, 2013 07:06
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If case anyone else is waiting for the Roccat Ryos, I just got this from their support:quote:Right now the Ryos MK Series is in the beta test. As soon as we have eliminated all bugs it will be released. Probably the Ryos MK and MK Glow will be released in August, the Ryos MK Pro a bit later. But I don’t have an exact release date for you yet. We will announce the release dates as soon as we know them via Twitter / Facebook and our Newsletter.
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Jul 9, 2013 14:09
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Just got my KBC Poker II in the mail last night (MX Blues). It's an absolutely phenomenal keyboard.
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Jul 9, 2013 17:22
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Woah. I told myself I was going to give it a week like I did with the logitech board that ended up being so disappointing to me, but after only a few hours, I'm completely in love with my corsair K70. The backlighting is pretty much exactly what I wanted, and looks perfect without being obnoxiously bright. It's like typing on a cloud, and now that I've tried every type of key except for a few of the rare ones, I can definitely say that cherry reds are my favorite thing ever.
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Jul 9, 2013 19:29
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Meow Tse-tung posted:Woah. I told myself I was going to give it a week like I did with the logitech board that ended up being so disappointing to me, but after only a few hours, I'm completely in love with my corsair K70. The backlighting is pretty much exactly what I wanted, and looks perfect without being obnoxiously bright. It's like typing on a cloud, and now that I've tried every type of key except for a few of the rare ones, I can definitely say that cherry reds are my favorite thing ever. I don't have broad experience, but do you need to have it? This is love at first sight. Cherry reds are awesome. I didn't really care for the spring/buckle thing that the Model M did, though maybe that's heresy, I dunno. But these things are lightning fast and ultra-precise, it is going to suck going back to the crappy failing Logitech Wave dome kind while waiting for my RMA to process with Corsair.
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Jul 9, 2013 19:34
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Yeah that's one of the reasons I didn't take the K90 for free for the keycap fading issue (besides preferring the K60/not wanting macro keys) - they don't cross ship so I didn't want to have to go back to the admittedly decent logitech illuminated (scissor switch) for a week or whatever. I can't imagine how lovely it'll be going back to rubber dome. You must really want that one support leg (and maybe less cat hair in your keyboard, even though I did clean it recently)Meow Tse-tung posted:Woah. I told myself I was going to give it a week like I did with the logitech board that ended up being so disappointing to me, but after only a few hours, I'm completely in love with my corsair K70. The backlighting is pretty much exactly what I wanted, and looks perfect without being obnoxiously bright. It's like typing on a cloud, and now that I've tried every type of key except for a few of the rare ones, I can definitely say that cherry reds are my favorite thing ever. Haha I don't know about the brightness, I am tolerant of it on the lowest setting, the rest of them are like looking into the sun. Still love it though obviously. Dogen fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Jul 9, 2013 |
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Jul 9, 2013 19:49
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Agreed posted:But these things are lightning fast and ultra-precise, it is going to suck going back to the crappy failing Logitech Wave dome kind while waiting for my RMA to process with Corsair. There's an obvious solution to this- MORE KEYBOARDS! I've got a classic white alps board, model M terminal board, and 2 Filco majestouch boards, with browns and blues. I may have a problem. One of my coworkers just got a miniature 88 key board with Cherry greens as well, which are pretty unique and a nice middle point between blues and browns. Gwaihir fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Jul 9, 2013 |
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Jul 9, 2013 20:20
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Gwaihir posted:There's an obvious solution to this- MORE KEYBOARDS! Just FYI, Cherry Greens are supposed to be a super-stiff Cherry blue. code:
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Jul 9, 2013 20:46
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Hm, I must be thinking of a different switch type then. These have a more muted sound than blues, but definitely require less force than buckling springs. Clears, maybe?
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Jul 9, 2013 20:50
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Cream_Filling posted:Just FYI, Cherry Greens are supposed to be a super-stiff Cherry blue. Being that Blues are already stiffer than reds and browns, it seems like greens would be typing fatigue hell.
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Jul 9, 2013 21:21
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isomerc posted:Being that Blues are already stiffer than reds and browns, it seems like greens would be typing fatigue hell. Do you actually think Cherry Blues are stiff, though? I personally like my buckling spring but I'm used to it.
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Jul 9, 2013 21:35
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Dogen posted:Yeah that's one of the reasons I didn't take the K90 for free for the keycap fading issue (besides preferring the K60/not wanting macro keys) - they don't cross ship so I didn't want to have to go back to the admittedly decent logitech illuminated (scissor switch) for a week or whatever. I can't imagine how lovely it'll be going back to rubber dome. You must really want that one support leg (and maybe less cat hair in your keyboard, even though I did clean it recently) Weeeell, the thing there is it looks like they'll be upgrading me to a K70, since they won't be replacing it with a refurbished unit. If I just get a new-old-stock K60 back with a leg replaced I'm, well, gonna be kind of bummed that I went to the trouble but hey restart on that 50 million per key thing, and a functional back leg!  Also, I can testify, this keyboard is free of cat hair! While removing the red o-rings on each key, I ensured that your white-haired cat's DNA will never be used by me or anyone else for cloning purposes. You're welcome! 
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Jul 9, 2013 21:40
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Cream_Filling posted:Do you actually think Cherry Blues are stiff, though? I personally like my buckling spring but I'm used to it. I don't think they're stiff, but they're 5g stiffer than reds, I mean. Basically GREEN:BLUE::BLACK:RED. Since Blacks are super stiff, and blues are slightly stiffer than reds, I would imagine that greens would be SUPER stiff.
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Jul 9, 2013 21:44
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Greens have a similar (maybe the same?) spring as cherry blacks, which I've used on on my small Deck keyboard and enjoy. I've used a unicomp buckling spring and a model m for about 11 years and I don't find the blacks very stiff at all. I like the blues I have but I wish they were a little harder so I've been considering greens, though it seems like a lot of effort to swap switches on a whole board. There's a CM Storm quickfire with greens but I think it's only from their shop so it's a full $99 or something (unless some resellers have gotten it lately). With regard to the weight of the keys, I think that there's no right answer, it's really just what you're used to. In the 90s I started with a typewriter, then the apple extended II (linear alps) and moved to an omnikey ultra (clicky white alps). I got a unicomp in '01 and enjoyed the buckling springs since then. So, I'm very used to typing a bit harder than some folks are probably used to typing but it's normal to me and you'd have to get really heavy or mushy keys for me to get tired typing. It's also hard to compare key weights to rubber domes because they're all over the place. I've had some domes that are just fine for a secondary machine and some (one cheap logitech specifically) that were awful to type on and did almost make me feel fatigued from using it.
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Jul 9, 2013 21:52
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I have a sweet rear end idea. I'll just buy a K95, do the RMA then, and when the K60 replacement (whatever it shall be) arrives, I'll pull a Dogen and pass it on to a fellow friend who MUST KNOW the BEAUTY of these things. In not-me-world chat, Cherry Blacks look interesting. Significantly higher actuation force, but linear. Huh. Weird. Maybe one day I'll get into keyboards like I got into headphones and guitar gear and audio equipment and just totally nerd out, put together a color-coordinated collection. If my wife doesn't punch me in the face as hard as she can (haha she can't throw a punch, I'm golden!).
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Jul 9, 2013 22:01
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Agreed posted:I have a sweet rear end idea. I'll just buy a K95, do the RMA then, and when the K60 replacement (whatever it shall be) arrives, I'll pull a Dogen and pass it on to a fellow friend who MUST KNOW the BEAUTY of these things. I'll sign up for that! I've been waiting on the K70 with browns to come out, but I need to find some local neckbeard who has a mechanical keyboard so I can try out some kind of switch before I commit to anything. I'm guessing that I'd like browns, but I'd rather not blow a couple hundred on a keyboard without having any kind of idea.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:20
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Kumquat posted:I'll sign up for that! I've been waiting on the K70 with browns to come out, but I need to find some local neckbeard who has a mechanical keyboard so I can try out some kind of switch before I commit to anything. I'm guessing that I'd like browns, but I'd rather not blow a couple hundred on a keyboard without having any kind of idea. I already had someone in mind, poo poo, that came out completely wrong. Sorry. But I promise said person is deserving, and will know the light.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:21
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Agreed posted:I already had someone in mind, poo poo, that came out completely wrong. Sorry. But I promise said person is deserving, and will know the light. I was actually joking. I had no expectation that you would be sending me a keyboard.  I have a friend who will be around in a few months and I think he's a fan of blues, so I'll at least get to try those out.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:23
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Agreed posted:I have a sweet rear end idea. I'll just buy a K95, do the RMA then, and when the K60 replacement (whatever it shall be) arrives, I'll pull a Dogen and pass it on to a fellow friend who MUST KNOW the BEAUTY of these things. Have you ever had a keyboard with macro keys before? If not, and you just think they'll be useful, they probably won't be. They're out of the way and with a few exceptions there's just not a whole lot in games you'll need to use them for.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:53
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Aphrodite posted:Have you ever had a keyboard with macro keys before? I disagree there. Once I got macros I used them so much that I felt cripplingly bound to them and it's why I spent so long using my G15. I had to compensate for getting my k70 by buying a macro mouse. This worked out great, because it feels much better on the mouse. I hate how unwieldy the g15 was, but drat if those macros aren't the greatest thing, especially in MMOs.
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Jul 9, 2013 23:05
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Aphrodite posted:Have you ever had a keyboard with macro keys before? I hadn't had macro keys before I got my G710+ (backlight is still working fine), but I really like them. I wouldn't even consider using in the games I play, but for general productivity, they can be pretty useful. Since I can record macros on the fly, whenever I find myself typing something or using some hotkeys repeatedly, I'll bind that to a macro key. Even if I don't remember what it is in a week, the ability to do that is really great.
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Jul 9, 2013 23:34
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Is the Corsair K65 actually out yet? Corsair's website says yes but everything else says no. When is it due if not? I'm hoping this may be the one for me considering I can't seem to find TKL that is no frills, Brown switches and is available to purchase/isn't a stupid price. Edit: and I just discovered the CM Storm Quickfire Stealth! Perfect, why had I not heard of this before? Red_Fred fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Jul 10, 2013 |
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Jul 10, 2013 01:39
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Red_Fred posted:Is the Corsair K65 actually out yet? Corsair's website says yes but everything else says no. When is it due if not? I think the K70 is the revamped K60, while the K95 is the revamped K90. You can buy it: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-Mechanical-Gaming-Keyboard/dp/B00CD1FC6G For a no frills TKL there's the CM Storm Quickfire Rapid (or if you want a numpad and don't want the arrow keys and Insert cluster there's the CM Storm Quickfire TK): http://www.amazon.com/CM-Storm-Quic...quickfire+rapid http://www.amazon.com/CM-Storm-Quic...quickfire+rapid
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Jul 10, 2013 01:54
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Just chiming in to say that any people reading this thread because their old keyboard gave out like mine did should listen to these people and try mechanical key switches. I don't know how I lived before this, but after trying a few different types of keys at the store I fell in love with the feel. Seeing as everyone loves the K70 I got one and I don't regret it one bit. Never going back to the old keyboards. Only thing I might do is eventually go over to brown switches, we'll see if I can't spend a semester teaching myself to not bottom out these reds when I'm typing. So do yourself a favor, and go down to a store and just try pressing a few mechanical keys.
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Jul 10, 2013 04:55
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Killer-of-Lawyers posted:Just chiming in to say that any people reading this thread because their old keyboard gave out like mine did should listen to these people and try mechanical key switches. I don't know how I lived before this, but after trying a few different types of keys at the store I fell in love with the feel. Seeing as everyone loves the K70 I got one and I don't regret it one bit. Never going back to the old keyboards. Only thing I might do is eventually go over to brown switches, we'll see if I can't spend a semester teaching myself to not bottom out these reds when I'm typing. The browns have the same actuation force, I guess the idea is to have the tactile feedback prevent you from bottoming out? On this K60, the aluminum top rings out a note very close to D, and as such I have a really nice aural feedback if I bottom them out - if it's singing to me, I'm typing too hard. It's made it much easier for me to not do that. Did take a bit of getting used to after how lovely and unpredictably stiff the Logitech Wave keyboard was, but I adjusted quickly enough. Now fingers completely fly and there is nothing in the way of typing (or gaming, presumably, which I can't do yet because of my surgical recovery period, but which I really look forward to when the time comes!) I would never want to type on keys with more actuation force than this. It's increased my precision substantially, because the low actuation force means that any incidental key-touches become keystrokes. A nice change. I could see how someone might not dig how they work if they really, really wanted tactile feedback or non-linear actuation, but these things fit my needs perfectly. Re: Aphrodite/Macro talk, I intend to use those for productivity within my DAW much moreso than in videogames. I don't play any games where macros would be especially useful, as far as I know (steam backlog... aheh), but being able to hit buttons to do complex functions instantly would be amazing when working with realtime audio.
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Jul 10, 2013 13:29
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Agreed posted:Also, I can testify, this keyboard is free of cat hair! While removing the red o-rings on each key, I ensured that your white-haired cat's DNA will never be used by me or anyone else for cloning purposes. You're welcome! That drat cat, we've only had him a couple months and he is the hairiest drat thing. And it's got this texture that's like velcro. There are 3 other cats in the house but you wouldn't know it by the cat hair that comes out of the roomba/gets into other poo poo. Agreed posted:I have a sweet rear end idea. I'll just buy a K95, do the RMA then, and when the K60 replacement (whatever it shall be) arrives, I'll pull a Dogen and pass it on to a fellow friend who MUST KNOW the BEAUTY of these things. I like the idea of my old keyboard as some sort of weird modern nerd Johnny Appleseed. Jack Cherryswitch? Meow Tse-tung posted:I disagree there. Once I got macros I used them so much that I felt cripplingly bound to them and it's why I spent so long using my G15. I had to compensate for getting my k70 by buying a macro mouse. This worked out great, because it feels much better on the mouse. I hate how unwieldy the g15 was, but drat if those macros aren't the greatest thing, especially in MMOs. Why didn't you pick up a K95? If you got the 70 from amazon or somewhere you could probably return and buy a 95 if you really need the macro keys... Killer-of-Lawyers posted:Just chiming in to say that any people reading this thread because their old keyboard gave out like mine did should listen to these people and try mechanical key switches. I don't know how I lived before this, but after trying a few different types of keys at the store I fell in love with the feel. Seeing as everyone loves the K70 I got one and I don't regret it one bit. Never going back to the old keyboards. Only thing I might do is eventually go over to brown switches, we'll see if I can't spend a semester teaching myself to not bottom out these reds when I'm typing. You can try out some o rings if the bottoming out is getting to you. They sell packs of different dampening forces at WASDkeyboards.
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Jul 10, 2013 14:30
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Agreed posted:The browns have the same actuation force, I guess the idea is to have the tactile feedback prevent you from bottoming out? I don't think so. Once you push hard enough to get past the tactile bump, it's hard to stop from bottoming out because the resistance suddenly drops. For me the feedback is good because if I press a key lightly, I know if it activated without looking at the screen.
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Jul 10, 2013 14:31
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Agreed posted:I have a sweet rear end idea. I'll just buy a K95, do the RMA then, and when the K60 replacement (whatever it shall be) arrives, I'll pull a Dogen and pass it on to a fellow friend who MUST KNOW the BEAUTY of these things. I'd highly advise against a K95. I picked one up a few weeks ago, and I think there are just too many weak points on the board to justify the cost. It's fine for gaming, but the keycaps are almost rubberized and give that "nails on a chalkboard" feeling when you're typing. The board would probably be a lot better if you dropped some PBT keycaps on it, but then you wouldnt have the backlight effect. If you're looking for MX Reds, go with a Steelseries 6GV2 (Red) http://steelseries.com/us/products/keyboards/steelseries-6gv2-red-switch I've since stopped using all of my boards in lieu of my Poker II. It is the keyboard to end all keyboards, and I love it more than my family.
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Jul 10, 2013 14:37
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Kinda want to stick to what I know, and I know that this Corsair K60 is totally awesome. Are the keycaps on the K95 different? Or just new, and thus not much contact with skin oils yet? I can get a pretty good sense of how it might feel initially by just feeling the difference between the commonly used typing keys and the less commonly used function keys - the typing keys have Dogen's magical skin oils on them, which apparently makes for a great set of keycaps, while apprently he wasn't a big fan of the function keys and as a result they're still pretty unused and have a distinctly different feel to them. Given that I know I like this and I don't intend to use PS/2, this has 20-key rollover anti-ghosting while the keyboard you linked has 6-key tops via USB... And that I want the macro keys for productivity purposes, I think I'll go with the K95. If I find that it's horrible or something, I'll return it. Not a huge issue, yeah? Edit: And ordered, picked two-day shipping with rush processing (have to get this K60 boxed and sent in for RMA, don't want the prepaid label to croak on me). Agreed fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Jul 10, 2013 |
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Jul 10, 2013 15:11
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