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Supercar Gautier posted:But their policy has been to keep a lot of games under wraps until close to release, which is why we only just found out about Tropical Freeze and 3D World. I mean if people are only made aware of what's imminently available, they have nothing to get excited about the future. They won't even officially announce a new Zelda for Wii U yet, because it's too far off. Who cares? Announce it. Get people excited about it even if it comes in 2015. People don't know it exists right now. There are people that don't know about the Link to the Past side-quel for 3DS still. The "close to the chest" marketing strategy is clearly a bust.
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Aug 3, 2013 20:56
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bloodysabbath posted:I just bought a used Wii U with NSMBU for 200 bucks. To me, that makes it okay knowing I'm going to get maybe 10 or 15 games for the thing across the generation. Nintendo hardware is never going to be anything more than a tax you pay to play Nintendo games and a small handful of niche titles. The real game to get right now, is Lego City Undercover. The ending.  Quest For Glory II posted:This policy hasn't really worked out so great for them, has it? That's a terrible idea by the way, as announcing anything too early in advance causes the opposite of hype, there a lot of games out there which have been announced way too early. Syfe fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Aug 3, 2013 |
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Aug 3, 2013 21:00
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Quest For Glory II posted:This policy hasn't really worked out so great for them, has it? Counterpoints: Many successful Wii games (most notably NSMBWii) were announced very shortly before release, and a lot of Gamecube games were announced far, far in advance to no particular advantage. There was a time when games were announced so far in advance that they'd be shown off for one console, and then scrapped and overhauled for the next generation. It was far from ideal. There are obviously many issues with decisions Nintendo has been making, but I'd say this isn't one of them. It's very easy to point to every little thing and say "this is Part Of The Problem", but in this case I don't think it's true. Supercar Gautier fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Aug 3, 2013 |
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Aug 3, 2013 21:05
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Syfe posted:That's a terrible idea by the way, as announcing anything too early in advance causes the opposite of hype, there a lot of games out there which have been announced way too early. These days I think a lot of publishers have figured out the best timelines for hyping their games, which often isn't to keep them a mystery until shortly before release. Of course, learning lessons from others apparently isn't something Nintendo's into.
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Aug 3, 2013 21:09
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Louisgod posted:They really, really missed the boat by not releasing Wii Sports U on day one. I'm just not seeing this. I've seen it said by multiple posters, and I just don't see it. Not because I think Wii Sports sucked or anything (I think you'd have to be going out of your way to actively dislike it), I just don't think a Wii Sports on the Wii U would have been the same hit. Mostly due to the GamePad not having the same inherent 'otherness' that Motion Controls had on day one. The Wii U isn't pushing motion controls as a thing quite like the Wii did, so a Wii Sports title wouldn't quite have the same effect. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that Nintendoland WAS supposed to be the Wii Sports of the console. It's a showcase of the different things you can do with the GamePad, which doesn't have that same draw in a party setting as a bunch of folks on their feet waving their arms around. I don't know if I'm communicating my point well though.
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Aug 3, 2013 21:09
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fivegears4reverse posted:I'm just not seeing this. I've seen it said by multiple posters, and I just don't see it. Not because I think Wii Sports sucked or anything (I think you'd have to be going out of your way to actively dislike it), I just don't think a Wii Sports on the Wii U would have been the same hit. Mostly due to the GamePad not having the same inherent 'otherness' that Motion Controls had on day one. The Wii U isn't pushing motion controls as a thing quite like the Wii did, so a Wii Sports title wouldn't quite have the same effect. I agree, there's no way Nintendo would have been able to capture the same market they did with the Wii on its release. Not without the hype around motion controls, and certainly not with the console's price tag.
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Aug 3, 2013 21:12
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fivegears4reverse posted:In fact, I'd go so far as to say that Nintendoland WAS supposed to be the Wii Sports of the console. It's a showcase of the different things you can do with the GamePad, which doesn't have that same draw in a party setting as a bunch of folks on their feet waving their arms around. I don't know if I'm communicating my point well though. Nintendoland was the 'Wii Sports' of the Wii U in that it's a showcase for the gamepad concept, but I think we can all agree it's been pretty limp as far as generating excitement and sales goes. Wii Sports was the runaway biggest seller for the Wii (obviously aided by being a pack in), and to this day the game most consumers think of when they think 'Wii', so there's no reason to not put it out there. It's the same reason they're putting Wii Fit U out, even though the gamepad doesn't really offer anything fitness related. It sold 20 million copies and drew in casual gamers, so there's no point to not put it on Wii U. (Not to say I think Wii Fit U will have sales anywhere near the original, or do much to turn around the Wii U's fortunes)
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Aug 3, 2013 21:23
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Yeah, Wii Sports is to the Wii what Super Mario Bros was to the NES. If the U had been called the Wii 2, had half way competent marketing, and was launched with Sports U as a pack-in or even as a separate game, well we'd probably be looking at a much different picture now. That's not to say that the U would have been the runaway success of the Wii, which was at the right place at the right time. But they would have sold a lot more than 3 million consoles to date. In the above scenario, assuming the focus of the U is the tablet, there's still room for NintendoLand and a sequel to Wii Sports, with a few more games, showcasing the tablet, and using motion-plus to refine existing games like Bowling and Tennis.
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Aug 3, 2013 21:31
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Syfe posted:That's a terrible idea by the way, as announcing anything too early in advance causes the opposite of hype, there a lot of games out there which have been announced way too early. GUYS BUY A WII U! WE CAN'T TELL YOU WHY YET BUT IT'S GONNA BE SO COOL, YOU'RE REALLY GONNA LOVE IT. JUST BUY IT NOW AND WE'LL TELL YOU SOME OTHER TIME
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Aug 3, 2013 22:22
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Quest For Glory II posted:Not sure which gaming industry you're talking about. Hype sells. Announce the games early and give people a reason to want to buy a Wii U. I've seen stuff from both camps. Some people will complain when Nintendo only shows things coming out for the year, and nothing to look forward too after that. Other people will complain when they do show things coming out maybe in a year or two that there's nothing to play now.
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Aug 3, 2013 22:29
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Pixeltendo posted:I've seen stuff from both camps. In this case, there are somehow complaints from both camps at the same time right now. There are people unhappy that they found out about this year's releases too late I guess, and there are also people unhappy that Nintendo has been announcing next year's biggest releases this far in advance. At this point, it just turns into a weird excuse to rant. "We don't know what's coming this year! We don't know what's coming next year!" . And then when it's pointed out that we do know these things, it's handwaved away because apparently the games coming monthly for the rest of this year don't count, or because one particular game on the wishlist (Zelda) hasn't yet been revealed as a 2014 title. Supercar Gautier fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Aug 3, 2013 |
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Aug 3, 2013 22:33
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The reason there's nothing to play is more because Nintendo is focused on 3DS software. The eShop on 3DS has a lot of little titles from Nintendo and it's clear that the Wii U could as well but for whatever reason Nintendo has decided to completely disregard it. The 3DS has Pushmo, Crashmo, Sakura Samurai, Picross-e, Dillon's Rolling Western, Freakyforms, Ketzal's Corridors, Mario vs DK... but Wii U eShop has nothing like that by Nintendo. Not one. thing. And that kind of software holds people's interest between the big releases. There's no reason why Nintendo couldn't make or commission games like this for Wii U from their studios like Intelligent Systems. There's no reason at all. Except for one: Nintendo, like third-party developers, know that they won't sell.
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Aug 3, 2013 22:37
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I waited seven years for that sequel to Kirby Super Star, and it was every bit as amazing as I thought it would be. Kirby games always get released near the end of a console's life, so at least I have those to look forward to. I'd like to see some actual surprises from Nintendo. The only new IPs that they've got for the Wii U are from Monolith Soft and Platinum. Everything else is just a prettier version of something I've played before. The Gamecube was amazing with new games like Pikmin, Luigi's Mansion and Animal Crossing, but just releasing sequels to those doesn't have the same impact. E: Nintendo won't devote their smaller developers to Wii U e-shop games because they could be making full retail 3DS games instead. The same game would sell much more on the 3DS due to the exposure that being sold at retail gives them. That Fucking Sned fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Aug 3, 2013 |
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Aug 3, 2013 22:40
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JesusLovesRonwell posted:In the above scenario, assuming the focus of the U is the tablet, there's still room for NintendoLand and a sequel to Wii Sports, with a few more games, showcasing the tablet, and using motion-plus to refine existing games like Bowling and Tennis. I'm watching the Wii U reveal trailer from E3 2011. The "games" they show off are as follows: - New Super Mario Brothers Wii U (to show that you could continue playing without the TV) - Drawing Link with colours - Othello - Wii Sports Baseball (Use Gamepad to pitch and Gamepad to catch) - Wii Sports Golf (Gamepad on floor, for golf ball) - Wii Fit U - Wii Fit Stalker Shooting Game with Gamepad and Zapper - Takamaru's Ninja Castle Demo - CYCLING THAT SOUNDS AWESOME! (worst couple ever using the chat) - Wii U Internet Browser - Zelda Wii U Demo So out of that you'd at least get the idea that Nintendo had been working on, even just in demo form: - New Super Mario Bros. Wii U (came out at launch) - Art Academy (Announced at E3 2013 with no date) - Wii Party U (Announced at E3 for October. I believe that's where Othello will come from as they announced table top minigames for it. Shooting neighbours game is in it as well) - Wii Sports U (not announced despite Golf and Baseball demos) - Wii Fit U (Delayed until December) - Nintendo Land (Takamaru's Ninja Castle) - Zelda Wii U (Probably won't get done until like 2015) Point being they were totally thinking about how to use the Gamepad for Wii Sports but there's no loving Wii Sports U game.
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Aug 3, 2013 22:41
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fivegears4reverse posted:I'm just not seeing this. I've seen it said by multiple posters, and I just don't see it. Not because I think Wii Sports sucked or anything (I think you'd have to be going out of your way to actively dislike it), I just don't think a Wii Sports on the Wii U would have been the same hit. Mostly due to the GamePad not having the same inherent 'otherness' that Motion Controls had on day one. The Wii U isn't pushing motion controls as a thing quite like the Wii did, so a Wii Sports title wouldn't quite have the same effect. I never once said that Wii Sports U would've been a saving grace but I more or less agree with you on all points. I think the console would be in a bit better shape if they released both Nintendoland and Sports U on launch but as I've noted before, the console has a LOT more problems than not having that "magic game". It's pretty obvious Nintendoland was supposed to replace Sports U.
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Aug 3, 2013 22:46
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Chaltab posted:What ImpAtom said. Also they flat out said that they underestimated the requirements of HD development. Most companies have been making HD games for 8+ years. It's kinda hosed up that they didn't even have people experimenting with HD development for them for the past couple of years. I mean, both the PS2 and Xbox had some minimal levels of HD game development on them years before the 360 and PS3 came out. Specifically, the PS2 had Gran Turismo 4 with 1080i resolution available in 2004 in Japan (2005 in the US); and the Xbox had Atari Anthology (2004), Enter the Matrix (2003), and MX Unleashed (2004) with 1080i resolution. Additionally, on the Xbox there were 18 more games with 720p resolution, including games like Amped 2 (2003), NBA 2K3 (2002), Sonic Heroes (2003), Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 4 (2002) and True Crime: LA (2003). On top of that the PS2 had a few games with 1080i released after the PS3, and the Xbox had 6 or 7 games with 720p released after the Xbox 360 launched.
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Aug 3, 2013 23:34
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Yeah the draw of the Wii to the "casual" crowd was that you could have this arcade motion game right at home that's super fun at parties and easy to pick up. Even if the Wii U had a fantastic HD upgrade to this game with all sorts of improvements, how many people are going to drop 350+ dollars for it? The wii at 250, offering something completely unique and new (to most) was an impulse buy. If the Wii U offered a sequel for 100 dollars more..I don't think it would have had half the effect.
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Aug 3, 2013 23:34
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Didn't the Wii get featured on Oprah or some other popular talk show as THE toy of that chrismas? IIRC it was a Tickle Me Elmo situation.
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Aug 3, 2013 23:38
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Shinku ABOOKEN posted:Didn't the Wii get featured on Oprah or some other popular talk show as THE toy of that chrismas? This, for multiple years across all demographics.
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Aug 3, 2013 23:44
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Bobnumerotres posted:The lack of third party titles is entirely due to the sales. It's substantially stronger than the 360 if utilized correctly. I mean just look at Pikmin 3 gameplay or MK8 gameplay, things are running at 60FPS in true 1080p. It's going to be outclassed by the xbone and PS4 by miles for sure, but the PS2 was very behind the Xbox in terms of specs. The Ps2 was an immediate runaway success and got third parties on board with it literally from day one. It became the standard console for third parties, and rendered the Xbox excessive. The WiiU was not, did not, could not, and will not. Its sales are gonna need to be extremely impressive in order to get a port, given that, in addition to the gap between the WiiU and the Ps4 being so big, the gap between the Ps4, Xbone and the PC is now tiny, so it will be a major investment that devs won't have to make for any other console. Quest For Glory II posted:Not sure which gaming industry you're talking about. Hype sells. Announce the games early and give people a reason to want to buy a Wii U. Discussion > Games > Is the Wii U the next Mitt Romney?
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Aug 3, 2013 23:45
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Install Windows posted:It's kinda hosed up that they didn't even have people experimenting with HD development for them for the past couple of years. I mean, both the PS2 and Xbox had some minimal levels of HD game development on them years before the 360 and PS3 came out. Only two PS2 games supported anything above 480p, and they were Gran Turismo 4, and Tourist Trophy, which was GT4 with motorbikes. They didn't run at 1080i, they just rendered at 512x448 like most PS2 games, and upscaled this to 640x540, then tripled each pixel horizontally. If you captured the output, then you could see that each pixel is stretched to about a 3x2 rectangle. It's like saying that games on the 360 and Wii U all run at 1080p, when they're actually 720p games being stretched to cover more pixels. Even though some Xbox games ran at 720p, HD development is more having a level of detail that requires a high resolution to see. PCs could render Half-Life at very high resolutions in the early 2000s, but above a certain resolution the blurry textures and low-poly models don't have any more detail to offer. I don't think Nintendo is unprepared for HD development, because Super Mario Galaxy was one of the most graphically stunning games of the generation, even at 480p. Dolphin just reveals how much detail the game still has at 1080p. My slight disappointment with 3D World was because it didn't provide the generational leap that it should have, especially considering what Galaxy was able to achieve compared to Sunshine, with slightly improved hardware and at double the frame rate. 3D World looks exactly like Galaxy, but at a higher resolution, three more characters on screen, and without the planetoids and gravity fun. Nintendo have already got artists capable of making beautiful games, they just haven't been able to utilise the Wii U hardware for anything besides higher-resolution Wii games with touchpad stuff.
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Aug 4, 2013 02:17
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That loving Sned posted:
I think not making the touch pad as a major thing and leaving it as just a horn button might be the best decision they may have made. If Mario Kart can just provide a solid Mario kart racing experience without needing controller gimmicks we could be set. The game looks good from when they carted it around, but the controller gimmicks have marred nearly every single release from the Wii onward. Yes you have some titles like Wii sports that benefitted from them, but then you had Skyward Sword, Donkey kong Country Returns, and Mario kart Wii that really did not handle them all that well. Also Other M had the worst motion controls for anything on the entire system.
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Aug 4, 2013 02:27
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WendigoJohnson posted:I think not making the touch pad as a major thing and leaving it as just a horn button might be the best decision they may have made. If Mario Kart can just provide a solid Mario kart racing experience without needing controller gimmicks we could be set. There is not much you can do in a racing game on a second screen... Maps, rear view mirror,and maybe item selection. But I'd much rather have that stuff not on the game pad and push off screen play for Mario Kart. Or the Sonic Transformed options of 2 players without split screen. I can only hope they have something interesting planned with the game pad and battle mode. I also really enjoyed playing Super Luigi U WITHOUT the game pad and using the pro controller. The mirrored image right in front of you was driving me nuts because I'd tend to look down instead of my HDTV. I also hope we get track packs as DLC since they were so quick to do it with Super Luigi U. That loving Sned posted:I'd like to see some actual surprises from Nintendo. The only new IPs that they've got for the Wii U are from Monolith Soft and Platinum. Everything else is just a prettier version of something I've played before. The Gamecube was amazing with new games like Pikmin, Luigi's Mansion and Animal Crossing, but just releasing sequels to those doesn't have the same impact.
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Aug 4, 2013 04:36
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bloodysabbath posted:I'm firmly in the camp that would like to see Nintendo go third party on consoles and keep up the handheld business. They'll never do it, but New Super Mario Bros. U alone would have sold probably 10 times its amount if it didn't require a new console purchase. Nintendo going third-party would probably hurt them a lot more than it would help them. They probably make most of their money - money that R&D needs to make games - through console sales and licensing. Take that away and throw them into a situation where they have to compete with everyone else on Sony and Microsoft's consoles, and I don't see how the quality of their games would be able to stay the same.
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Aug 4, 2013 05:26
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Astro7x posted:I hope the Pushmo dude finds his way into Smash Bros though Oh god, that would be pretty fun. Up+B does a ladder teleport upwards, Forward+B pushes a block into people. I do wish Nintendo would cross their IPs over more. 
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Aug 4, 2013 05:29
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Astro7x posted:
Saying Nintendoland is a new IP is like saying a clip show is a new episode. The rides were all based of an existing IP, so its an IP made up of the pasted-together scraps of a bunch of other IPs.
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Aug 4, 2013 05:46
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Fulchrum posted:Saying Nintendoland is a new IP is like saying a clip show is a new episode. The rides were all based of an existing IP, so its an IP made up of the pasted-together scraps of a bunch of other IPs. By that logic Smash Brothers also wasn't a new IP either. Nintendoland used the IPs as the basis for a bunch of themed minigames but it isn't like they were Just Mario or Just Metroid or Just F-Zero. It's possible for IPs to exist as spinoffs of other IPs, even if that is bizarrely inbred. I don't know why Nintendo thought Nintendoland would be a system seller but it was basically their attempt to 'Smash Brothers' a minigame collection instead of a fighting game/racing game/whatever. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 05:51 on Aug 4, 2013 |
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Aug 4, 2013 05:49
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Eh. Each iteration of zelda/mario/etc. is completely different from the last in lots of ways. Activision can release the same game with new maps every year but god drat if Nintendo makes another game involving Mario! I really wish they had their own Halo kind of big first/third person shooter though, and they have the perfect franchises for it (Star Fox, Battalion Wars). extremebuff fucked around with this message at 06:27 on Aug 4, 2013 |
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Aug 4, 2013 06:24
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Bobnumerotres posted:Eh. Each iteration of zelda/mario/etc. is completely different from the last in lots of ways. Activision can release the same game with new maps every year but god drat if Nintendo makes another game involving Mario! They really don't have the people to make it. FPS are not big in Japan and there are no really good third-party FPS developers they can hire to do it. Anyone with any skill in that genre is snapped up quickly or has their own franchises to milk. They could take a chance on someone new but that can screw them pretty bad.
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Aug 4, 2013 06:37
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Fulchrum posted:Saying Nintendoland is a new IP is like saying a clip show is a new episode. The rides were all based of an existing IP, so its an IP made up of the pasted-together scraps of a bunch of other IPs. This is an extraordinarily stupid post, congrats. Despite your justification, Nintendoland is a new intellectual property. By your dumb logic, Wii Sports is nothing more than pasted-together scraps since it contains sports found in other games and in real life. Either post something worth discussing or just stop.
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Aug 4, 2013 06:39
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Fulchrum posted:Saying Nintendoland is a new IP is like saying a clip show is a new episode. The rides were all based of an existing IP, so its an IP made up of the pasted-together scraps of a bunch of other IPs. If they didn't have the attractions based on existing franchises people would have hated it. If f you slapped the Raving Rabbids IP onto Nintendo Land it definitely would have averaged lower in review scores overall. There is some sort of comforting familiarity of "I'm playing a Zelda mini game!" vs. "I'm playing this Zelda knock off" with a different IP in its place.
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Aug 4, 2013 06:50
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Astro7x posted:If they didn't have the attractions based on existing franchises people would have hated it. If f you slapped the Raving Rabbids IP onto Nintendo Land it definitely would have averaged lower in review scores overall. There is some sort of comforting familiarity of "I'm playing a Zelda mini game!" vs. "I'm playing this Zelda knock off" with a different IP in its place. That it would have been worse if it were using new IP's as the basis for its rides doesn't change the fact that they didn't. The argument isn't that individual WiiU games would be improved by being new IP's, its that Nintendo hasn't made a full, new, differentiating IP for the WiiU. Who are the new Nintendo characters people can point to as only being on the WiiU?
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Aug 4, 2013 07:40
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Bobnumerotres posted:Eh. Each iteration of zelda/mario/etc. is completely different from the last in lots of ways. Activision can release the same game with new maps every year but god drat if Nintendo makes another game involving Mario! The last Nintendo game I was excited for was Super Mario Galaxy because it felt so fresh, but I'm afraid nothing since has grabbed me. I don't think anyone here is entirely happy with Activision's games either.
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Aug 4, 2013 07:49
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Fulchrum posted:That it would have been worse if it were using new IP's as the basis for its rides doesn't change the fact that they didn't. The argument isn't that individual WiiU games would be improved by being new IP's, its that Nintendo hasn't made a full, new, differentiating IP for the WiiU. Who are the new Nintendo characters people can point to as only being on the WiiU? This is a fair point, actually. The system needs a draw, and a great game with a new IP would do it.
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Aug 4, 2013 08:19
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Fulchrum posted:Who are the new Nintendo characters people can point to as only being on the WiiU? X
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Aug 4, 2013 08:31
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I grew up with an NES Controller in my hands, and I'm a self admitted Nintendo fanboy until the end. I think the Wii U is having the same problem the 3DS did when it launched, there are just no games out for it. There's nothing that's big and exclusive and fantastic yet. NSMBU is a good game, but it's mostly a copy/paste of a game that has come out at least 3 times now. For example, looking at the Top Ten most popular Wii U games on GameFAQS right now, a whopping 4 of the ten games have actually been released worldwide. (Pikmin 3, NSMBU, Monster Hunter 3: Ultimate, and Lego City) Nintendo doesn't seem to grasp that you should release your big titles with the system.
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Aug 4, 2013 08:42
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You know, I would have expected a time traveler from the future to bring us new technology, or warn us of a disaster to come. Maybe save someone from dying tragically. Or, if they were more selfish, play the lottery. Talking about games on a forum seems like a real waste of your precious knowledge, man.
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Aug 4, 2013 08:45
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X doesn't count, Monolith made the game Nintendo is just going to publish it. Really the only new series we've gotten that isn't a Mario spinoff is Pikmin and that was on the Gamecube and just recently Wii-Sports. Metroid Zelda, Donkey Kong, Mario have all been going since the mid 80's, F Zero Showed up on the SNES as did Fire Emblem. I'm not even sure if Earthbound counts since we're missing 2 out of the three games in America. The Taint Reaper fucked around with this message at 08:54 on Aug 4, 2013 |
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Aug 4, 2013 08:50
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LordHippoman posted:Nintendo doesn't seem to grasp that you should release your big titles with the system. To be fair, their options were to rush the games they already have in development or delay the system for a while, leaving them with pretty much no home console on the market period. I'm no financial analyst but it seems to me that they picked the best choice out of two terrible ones.
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Aug 4, 2013 09:08
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Fulchrum posted:Who are the new Nintendo characters people can point to as only being on the WiiU? Who are the new Nintendo characters people can point to as only being on the Wii? 
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Aug 4, 2013 09:09
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