|
drat, the 290 for $400 it's really enticing. Kind of a shame about the stock cooler being a bit obnoxious. I'm very seriously considering dropping the $$ on one one the custom cooled version become available, but I wish EVGA made AMD hardware. I was looking at the Sapphire version of the 290, are they a recommended AMD card manufacturer? I'm also really tempted on waiting to see what Maxwell offers, just so I could snag an EVGA card. I recently upgraded to 2560 x 1440 and my 570 is barely cutting it.
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 22:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 08:42 |
|
|
SourKraut posted:Well the game package ends on November 26th and so far we don't know of a replacement. I'm not sure the "features" are really worth an extra $100 - the main things are Shadowplay (which can also be done by 3rd party apps with low overhead) and Physx ( I don't know, the only reason I was worried about upgrading my CPU was for 1080p Fraps, and Shadowplay makes that a non-issue for me so that's quite a bit of value right there. G-Sync is really appealing to a lot of people too, AMD doesn't have their own version of that yet and it can make any GPU appear smoother than it actually is. Even if you don't care about the bundle, you can still pitch it on eBay or SAmart for $60-ish like I'm doing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 22:23
|
|
). In that vein someone could make the same argument for TrueAudio and Mantle in the near future.
|
Agreed posted:They'd need to restructure their entire lineup. Maybe they well, I'm not predicting the future, just stating my take on things. Though I do think that a production proven thing like Shadowplay is actually a Good Feature vs. True Audio and Mantle being kind of nebulous, in-the-future-these-may-be-cool? things for AMD card owners. The nVidia Experience software is imo considerably better than AMD's raptr software, but that could be subjective. quote:This month we're supposed to find out a great deal more about Mantle, including announcements about other games in development using it, so that could be a significant factor that alters the value proposition once again (or not, just a big unknown at the moment). I love the idea of TrueAudio, but it's something that is pretty easily countered if necessary, like when AMD waaaay back when put audio over HDMI on their cards and nVidia just did that too, and thus could end up just kinda fragmenting the market unnecessarily. AMD isn't alone though in terms of technologies that didn't really go anywhere. nVidia's whole 3D Vision concept didn't really get going that well (I know it's still "used", but that's like saying some crazy people still use pagers). So we'll just have to see how it is handled, and what, if anything, nVidia can truly counter it with. Possibly a resurgent NVAPI API, but we'll see. Without any nVidia in the console space they're potentially at a huge disadvantage. quote:Meanwhile, AMD is still in the position of engaging in price pressure at all tiers rather than being able to unequivocally claim performance superiority. Yes, I know that the cards are apparently good overclockers, which probably means they've got a GHz edition refresh lined up for some appropriate time, but if the 780Ti is a fully enabled GK110 for videogames, it's going to have better performance than an R9 290x, and given how few people actually use the very expensive cards, all that matters there is they can say they have the fastest card, not that they are selling a shitload of the fastest card. Otherwise, what one side might view as "price pressure", the other side could equally say is just price correction due to nVidia's price gouging during the 700 series of cards. Because a $650 GTX 780 was definitely price gouging to a lot of people. Ultimately I'm just tired of all of the back-and-forth right now: I want a card for my 1440p monitor, and I had myself essentially convinced on the MSI Lighting 780, but the possibility of a custom cooled 290 non-X for quite a bit cheaper has caused me to once again second-guess my choice. I'm still leaning toward the 780, but hoping we might see some type of additional price cut.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 23:44
|
|
|
Michymech posted:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3Vi8gPsCbk Honest to god, I must be deaf. I could not hear any coil whine in that video. So ya.. Anyhoo, I am returning my 290x and I ordered 2 XFX 290s and 2 EK water blocks  Will have 1 waterblock Thursday for sure, but not sure how long before the 2nd one comes in as they only had 1 left in stock.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 23:45
|
|
|
So is the R9 290(x) really that loud and hot? Or was it just a case of how it was configured during the benchmarks?
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 23:48
|
|
|
AT 60% or more fan speed it's loud.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2013 23:54
|
|
|
fookolt posted:So is the R9 290(x) really that loud and hot? Or was it just a case of how it was configured during the benchmarks? I don't think its bad at all if you keep it in quiet mode. Uber mode starts to get pretty loud and if you hack the fan to max out at 100% then it becomes a jet engine.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 00:05
|
|
|
veedubfreak posted:Honest to god, I must be deaf. I could not hear any coil whine in that video. I don't think coil whine is a noise that records very well. Cell phone microphones don't exactly have a great frequency range.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 00:10
|
|
|
All this talk about Mantle and how the current Nvidia cards aren't "next gen" and whatnot is making me not as eager to buy a 770. Thing is I doubt the hypthetical 870 will be as cheap as the current 770 card. At least not for a while. But it is a new architecture so I guess there will be a much bigger difference compared to the 600 and 700 series and apparently Mantle might work with "other gpu brands" in the future? Why is my gpu failing now god drat it. I really want to hop over to Nvidia and see what that is like but then it isn't "next gen" and other buzzwords. But isn't Mantle just an API? Meaning that it won't be dependent on hardware? So older cards could in theory support it as well. I doubt it will happen though since both Nvidia and AMD love to put in arbitrary barriers. And apparently Star Citizen will use Mantle. Being able to run that as good as possible would be great. Sucks that we still have no idea how well Mantle will actually perform. Boar It fucked around with this message at 00:45 on Nov 6, 2013 |
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 00:40
|
|
|
Torabi posted:All this talk about Mantle and how the current Nvidia cards aren't "next gen" and whatnot is making me not as eager to buy a 770. Thing is I doubt the hypthetical 870 will be as cheap as the current 770 card. At least not for a while. But it is a new architecture so I guess there will be a much bigger difference compared to the 600 and 700 series and apparently Mantle might work with "other gpu brands" in the future? Why is my gpu failing now god drat it. I really want to hop over to Nvidia and see what that is like but then it isn't "next gen" and other buzzwords. Mantle is tied to AMD's GCN architecture. If you want to use Mantle, you'll have to have a GCN 1.x card. The reason that Mantle will deliver better performance is that it is designed around AMD's GCN. If you get a 770, you won't be able to use. It's not like the 770 will become unable to play Star Citizen anyway.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 01:22
|
|
|
I'm bootcamping Windows 8 on an iMac, which has an AMD mobility GPU. Just wondering if it's possible and safe to run a regular non-mobility beta driver on an 'M' card.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 02:33
|
|
|
I'd be surprised if it actually lets you use it. Normally it'll say that there's no valid card in the system.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 03:17
|
|
|
Any good reviews of the AMD 240/250 cards? I got an APU right now I work off of, it's okay but drat does it suck with KSP/DX:HR/CS:go at 1920x1080 Hoping to pick http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127764 up friday Dilbert As FUCK fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Nov 6, 2013 |
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 03:19
|
|
|
I wouldn't worry to much about Mantle, it's not going to go anywhere and will basically end up as another Physx. There'll be a few developers that produce AAA games that take advantage of Mantle (like Batman and Phsyx), but it's not going to be accepted very widely. The last thing developers and publishers want to do is fracture their potential audience, and that's exactly what would happen if you started producing games where people in one video-card camp are getting a vastly superior game. That is to say, if Mantle ends up as purely an AMD only option. If it ends up being able to be used by both AMD and Nvidia, I could see wider adoption, but honestly, even in that case I don't see it becoming "the next big thing".
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 03:20
|
|
|
dog nougat posted:drat, the 290 for $400 it's really enticing. Kind of a shame about the stock cooler being a bit obnoxious. I'm very seriously considering dropping the $$ on one one the custom cooled version become available, but I wish EVGA made AMD hardware. I was looking at the Sapphire version of the 290, are they a recommended AMD card manufacturer? I'm also really tempted on waiting to see what Maxwell offers, just so I could snag an EVGA card. I recently upgraded to 2560 x 1440 and my 570 is barely cutting it. AMD has quite a few different companies that use their cards - Sapphire seems to be a big one, but Gigabyte, MSI, Powercolor, Asus and a few others all have variants of AMD cards. I have a Sapphire HD 6970 with the dual fan/heatpipe cooler and it's actually a LOT quieter than the reference design, and cooler to boot. I haven't seen it get above low 70s when I game and usually keep the fan speed around 60-65% tops, usually around 40% for everyday use.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 03:28
|
|
|
Dilbert As gently caress posted:Any good reviews of the AMD 240/250 cards? I got an APU right now I work off of, it's okay but drat does it suck with KSP/DX:HR/CS:go at 1920x1080 Hardware Heaven is the only site to review one of those cards. Here. The R7 250 should be around a Radeon HD 7730 in performance (between the GT 640 and Radeon HD 7750), so it may be adequate for what you want. I'd get a 7750 instead. I'll find a nice analogue for the R7 240. I don't think it is has had any reviews.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 03:41
|
|
|
Anyone have a preferred program, preferably free, that can edit ShadowPlay videos? I tried the default windows movie maker program, but it can't read them. They play just fine in VLC with k-lite media codec pack.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 05:26
|
|
|
GrizzlyCow posted:Hardware Heaven is the only site to review one of those cards. Here. The R7 250 should be around a Radeon HD 7730 in performance (between the GT 640 and Radeon HD 7750), so it may be adequate for what you want. I'd get a 7750 instead. Really wonder how much of that is driver related vs developed driver for a card. Ahh the 250 doesn't require a 6 pin...
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 05:30
|
|
|
Teenage Fansub posted:I'm bootcamping Windows 8 on an iMac, which has an AMD mobility GPU. In the past, the mobility drivers worked for the AMD chips in the iMacs. From what I remember, the desktop versions won't even install. Don't stick with Apple's BootCamp drivers though because they tend to be very old.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 05:52
|
|
|
Bloody Hedgehog posted:I wouldn't worry to much about Mantle, it's not going to go anywhere and will basically end up as another Physx. There'll be a few developers that produce AAA games that take advantage of Mantle (like Batman and Phsyx), but it's not going to be accepted very widely. The last thing developers and publishers want to do is fracture their potential audience, and that's exactly what would happen if you started producing games where people in one video-card camp are getting a vastly superior game. Mantle isn't going to be used by Nvidia much like Physx isn't going to be used by AMD. What AMD are betting the farm on and what differentiates Mantle from Glide, Physx, etc. is that the Api would be implemented in the bigger engines to be closely compatable with the console paths, thus porting a multiplat to Mantle would have a low oportunity cost, since you've already written the code once. This rarely ends up as straightforward in practice, so well have wait and see, but I'd say Mantle has a far greater chance to stick than GPU accelerated Physx ever did. Edit: 20nm GPUs are at the very least 9 months off (expect a year), and 20nm planar itself looks somewhat underwhelming, so there's no reason to think that Maxwell/* Islands are going to obselete your shiny new GPU over night. Arzachel fucked around with this message at 08:36 on Nov 6, 2013 |
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 08:06
|
|
|
Regarding Mantle, I keep hearing rumors that it's apparently supposed to be open (meaning anyone can use it, including NVIDIA), but that's all they are at this point. Rumors. I'm honestly not expecting it to be open though, at least not initially. Just look at it from a business perspective. With "hot" titles like Battlefield 4 supporting it and touting "drastically" better performance with Mantle, it would be silly for AMD to allow NVIDIA to use it straight away because it would negate any sort of boost in sales they would have. Right now, AMD has made Mantle to only benefit themselves. I would personally love to see it go completely open at a later date though. Or at least usher in more low level access on APIs like OpenGL. When it comes to Mantle and G-Sync, I personally don't find them to be buying points just yet for either party. Give them both some time to mature, and we might have something. As for now, buying a GPU based on features we know very little about is just stupid and pointless.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 11:11
|
|
|
mayodreams posted:In the past, the mobility drivers worked for the AMD chips in the iMacs. From what I remember, the desktop versions won't even install. Don't stick with Apple's BootCamp drivers though because they tend to be very old. I was already using a beta mobility driver because the bootcamp one didn't come with Catalyst and the main mobility drivers disable most Catalyst features. Problem is I updated to Win8.1 and didn't disable driver updates, so now I have the latest regular mobility driver installed with barebones Catalyst. The new 64bit mobile beta has some hosed 0kb download, which is why I was wondering if I could just use the main driver. I remember back in the day with an old XP laptop I did something to fool the system into thinking my mobile GPU was a regular version so I access more features.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 11:39
|
|
|
Arzachel posted:Mantle isn't going to be used by Nvidia much like Physx isn't going to be used by AMD. What AMD are betting the farm on and what differentiates Mantle from Glide, Physx, etc. is that the Api would be implemented in the bigger engines to be closely compatable with the console paths, thus porting a multiplat to Mantle would have a low oportunity cost, since you've already written the code once. This rarely ends up as straightforward in practice, so well have wait and see, but I'd say Mantle has a far greater chance to stick than GPU accelerated Physx ever did. Except the consoles don't use Mantle or anything resembling it and probably never will. You have DX11 on the Xbone and the PS4 lets you use OpenGL and whatever Sony's proprietary API is. Right now, you have to write a Mantle render path strictly for AMD PCs.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 14:31
|
|
|
The_Franz posted:Except the consoles don't use Mantle or anything resembling it and probably never will. You have DX11 on the Xbone and the PS4 lets you use OpenGL and whatever Sony's proprietary API is. Right now, you have to write a Mantle render path strictly for AMD PCs. Sure but the shader assembly itself I believe is going to be identical on all three. Also since AMD is surely supplying some of the toolchain for the Xbox one and the PS4 you don't think they have at least some idea at what level this stuff is abstracted? You don't think behind the DirectX and PS4 proprietary API it's all Mantle underneath and dev's that want to get as close "to the metal" as they can on all three platforms will use it? Here's hoping.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 14:39
|
|
|
roadhead posted:Sure but the shader assembly itself I believe is going to be identical on all three. Also since AMD is surely supplying some of the toolchain for the Xbox one and the PS4 you don't think they have at least some idea at what level this stuff is abstracted? I learned a valuable lesson about eating hats but if this turns out to be true I will be as upset as somebody who was forced to eat his own hat because it's absurd as poo poo and, what, the, heck, it does not work that way
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 15:10
|
|
|
Rahu X posted:Regarding Mantle, I keep hearing rumors that it's apparently supposed to be open (meaning anyone can use it, including NVIDIA), but that's all they are at this point. Rumors. Mantle is open, but it is tied to the GCN architecture. NVIDIA would not be able to benefit without altering their cards to be more like AMD's offerings. It's "open" but not really open.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 15:18
|
|
|
I was under the impression that Mantle exists not to make the GPU run faster, but to make the CPU more efficient in executing calls to the graphics architecture. If your graphics card is already maxed out you're not going to see much of a benefit. On the other hand, if your CPU is capping your FPS, you could render far more discrete objects on the screen or get the boost to hit the 120hz mark. If this is the case, only people with twinned+ high end cards are really going to see the difference.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 15:23
|
|
|
GrizzlyCow posted:Mantle is open, but it is tied to the GCN architecture. NVIDIA would not be able to benefit without altering their cards to be more like AMD's offerings. It's "open" but not really open. I hear conflicting reports even on this. While I believe it will always be tied to the GCN architecture, a lot of tech journalists like to spin in it a way that paints it as the next OpenGL. Not that I believe them. I'll believe what is shown during the AMD Developer Summit.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 15:35
|
|
|
Rahu X posted:I hear conflicting reports even on this. While I believe it will always be tied to the GCN architecture, a lot of tech journalists like to spin in it a way that paints it as the next OpenGL. This is the correct attitude to have at the moment. We don't know poo poo about Mantle except that they've stated it will reduce draw call overhead by 9x compared to D3D, which in and of itself isn't outright unreasonable given that it's a known bottleneck for GPU/CPU performance, but read Professor Science's excellent post on the topic. Which I will quote here in its entirety because it's short and to the point. What are they planning to do about WDDM? Professor Science posted:WDDM is designed for a really specific problem--3D accelerated desktop UIs--and all of its tradeoffs are built around that. This is why you can do things like "games generally don't crash when I alt-tab" and "I can see window previews when I alt-tab" and "badly behaved drivers don't cause BSODs." It's also why you get other things like "command buffer submission to the GPU takes forever" and "compute APIs are always going to be second-class citizens." WDDM was designed for NV40/G70 class hardware ten years ago, and it shows. If you remember back in the proverbial day, there was a proposal for WDDM 2.0 that was spectacularly unrealistic, like "all hardware must support instruction-level preemption" unrealistic (to my knowledge, no GPU supports instruction level preemption). MS finally added support for any sort of preemption in WDDM 1.2 (Win8), but they haven't done anything to address things like buffer queue overhead (not since they fixed something completely horrible in Vista with something less horrible in Win7), GPU page faulting, or shared memory machines. Proper mode right now is to be a little  and mainly agnostic (you're always allowed to hope for whatever, obviously, especially if you are an AMD card owner, but hope isn't knowledge) toward the whole thing 'til they get the details aired out. Everything stated so far is essentially just PR, and some of it quite misleading, especially by "analysts" pointing out some version of "they've already got Mantle on the consoles! It'll be an easy switch to PC!" when that's just not true based on what we actually know about the console development APIs.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 15:56
|
|
|
Blorange posted:I was under the impression that Mantle exists not to make the GPU run faster, but to make the CPU more efficient in executing calls to the graphics architecture. If your graphics card is already maxed out you're not going to see much of a benefit. On the other hand, if your CPU is capping your FPS, you could render far more discrete objects on the screen or get the boost to hit the 120hz mark. If this is the case, only people with twinned+ high end cards are really going to see the difference. Their big claim is that it has significantly reduced draw call overhead vs Direct3D. I want to see a benchmark of Mantle vs a modern OpenGL pipeline as I suspect that the differences will be much smaller, if they exist at all.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:01
|
|
|
The_Franz posted:Except the consoles don't use Mantle or anything resembling it and probably never will. You have DX11 on the Xbone and the PS4 lets you use OpenGL and whatever Sony's proprietary API is. Right now, you have to write a Mantle render path strictly for AMD PCs. Mantle uses DirectX's HLSL language for shaders, so there's that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:06
|
|
|
Is there a way to set a global framerate cap with NVidia? Because I want to run Final Fantasy at 120hz, but the in-game menu only has framerate caps for 30 and 60 fps, and if I uncap it my GTX 770 goes right for infinity FPS and revs up like a vacuum cleaner.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:13
|
|
|
GrizzlyCow posted:If you want to use Mantle, you'll have to have a GCN 1.x card. I don't think AMD has said officially how long they plan on supporting Mantle but if history repeats itself a la their VLIW GPU's they probably have another 2-3 yr of GCN iterations in the works at a minimum. Possibly longer if you consider how the foundries have slowed releasing new processes plus how those new processes don't have the same level of advantages as previous years shrinks. AMD and nV both will be forced to put more work into designing their GPUs since now they can't rely on a die shrink in 6-8 months giving them another 30%+ performance with the same uarch like the "old days".
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:26
|
|
|
Zero VGS posted:Is there a way to set a global framerate cap with NVidia? Because I want to run Final Fantasy at 120hz, but the in-game menu only has framerate caps for 30 and 60 fps, and if I uncap it my GTX 770 goes right for infinity FPS and revs up like a vacuum cleaner. Not sure about nvidia drivers themselves, but usually video recording programs like DxTory have built in adjustable FPS caps. I know DXtory you can set it to whatever you want, maybe MSI afterburner and FRAPS will do the same thing?
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:44
|
|
|
nVidiaInspector and EVGA Precision both have FPS limiters. I'd guess MSI Afterburner does too just because it's the same guy who makes Precision so why would one have a feature and the other lack it? I haven't tested it in a while but it used to be great for making games play nice with my monitor's refresh rate with no tearing or input lag. Then for a while it sort of sucked and tended to over-throttle the card. But hopefully that's been fixed. Aside: anybody know what the newer NV Control Panel option "AA Fix" actually does?  Edit: For that matter, the recently added VSync Smooth AFR Behavior. I am going to read up and see what nVidia has been dicking around with lately, these options popped up without any real documentation and I'd like to know what they're for. Guessing AFR is mainly for SLI setups. But I don't like guessing unless I have to. Agreed fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Nov 6, 2013 |
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 16:58
|
|
|
Agreed posted:nVidiaInspector and EVGA Precision both have FPS limiters. Whoa thanks for that. Kinda just gave up before and let the game run up to 300fps for no good reason while pegging the GPU at maximum.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 22:31
|
|
|
Does Battlefield 4 support ShadowPlay?
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 22:35
|
|
|
Other way around. ShadowPlay supports basically everything.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2013 22:38
|
|
|
SlayVus posted:Anyone have a preferred program, preferably free, that can edit ShadowPlay videos? I tried the default windows movie maker program, but it can't read them. They play just fine in VLC with k-lite media codec pack. Seconding this question. I tried using Yamb to just change the "Pixels Aspect Ratio" so my videos don't look squashed (16:9->16:10 = bleh), but it isn't cutting it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2013 00:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 08:42 |
|
|
Factory Factory posted:Other way around. ShadowPlay supports basically everything. Hm, I can't seem to get it to show up or work when I'm playing Battlefield 4 
|
|
#
?
Nov 7, 2013 03:13
|
|