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kiimo posted:I'm not saying he'd be a Jedi Knight without training I'm saying if Ben Kenobi tried to train Chewbacca as a Jedi Knight he'd get nowhere. Because Luke is special. I can't believe anybody would disagree with that, is this some kind of EU nonsense? You are racist.
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Jan 11, 2014 01:34
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^^^ Were there any Wookiee Jedi shown? I remember really, really wanting to see that happen.kiimo posted:I'm not saying he'd be a Jedi Knight without training I'm saying if Ben Kenobi tried to train Chewbacca as a Jedi Knight he'd get nowhere. Because Luke is special. I can't believe anybody would disagree with that, is this some kind of EU nonsense? I think it's an extension of the "Jedi by the time of the prequels were, by and large, as indolent and misguided as the Republic" mindset. As much as I'm currently enjoying rewatching the series from this viewpoint I still think Luke's a fairly Cool Dude who is in a unique position to make a difference in galactic politics. And how he goes about it speaks to the way he doesn't really adhere to either old Jedi or Sith mindsets.
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Jan 11, 2014 01:36
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Hbomberguy posted:You are racist. Carpet lover.
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Jan 11, 2014 01:40
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They better keep those backpack lizards that cancel Force powers as canon.
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Jan 11, 2014 01:44
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I posit the following heresy, in defiance of the canon: Luke and Leia have no genetic relationship whatsoever. At the end of Return of the Jedi, Luke declares Leia a Sister In Christ, and inducts her into the community of believers. References to 'My Family' and 'Our Mother' are likewise metaphorical. "Our Father, who art in heaven..."
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Jan 11, 2014 02:43
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Hey goons, shut up about death of the author film major subtext interpretation bullshit for a second. Todd from Breaking Bad is "the favorite" for a lead role in Episode VII.
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Jan 11, 2014 03:28
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UGH.
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Jan 11, 2014 03:38
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Gotta Wear Shades posted:^^^ Were there any Wookiee Jedi shown? I remember really, really wanting to see that happen. I'd need someone else to confirm it, but I actually remember reading Lucas made a declaration of sorts about there being no wookiee jedi. I really wanted to make one in SWG and always thought it was a cool idea, especially given how intelligent wookiees were supposed to be. But yeah, I tried looking up info on the subject and I think there was one (in a comic?) but after that Lucas was like "NOPE!".
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Jan 11, 2014 04:03
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Gotta Wear Shades posted:^^^ Were there any Wookiee Jedi shown? I remember really, really wanting to see that happen. In Young Jedi Knights, a series of YA novels, Chewbacca's nephew Lowbacca was a Jedi trainee and friend of Han and Leia's twin children.
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Jan 11, 2014 04:15
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Kingtheninja posted:I'd need someone else to confirm it, but I actually remember reading Lucas made a declaration of sorts about there being no wookiee jedi. I really wanted to make one in SWG and always thought it was a cool idea, especially given how intelligent wookiees were supposed to be. But yeah, I tried looking up info on the subject and I think there was one (in a comic?) but after that Lucas was like "NOPE!". Chewie's nephew Lowbacca is in the Young Jedi Knights books, attending the Jedi Academy with Jacen and Jaina. There's also a Wookie padawan in Season 5 of Clone Wars, and that series had pretty much everything personally vetted by Lucas. Edit: gently caress, half-beaten.
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Jan 11, 2014 04:17
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Moose King posted:Hey goons, shut up about death of the author film major subtext interpretation bullshit for a second. Haha...I love that guy. He was entertaining in Friday Night Lights. Not sure if he could be an action hero, but hey why not?
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Jan 11, 2014 04:24
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euphronius posted:Also Leia was not "force sensative" or related to Luke until ROTJ. Nah dog she senses Luke calling to her in the end of Empire.
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Jan 11, 2014 05:55
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If Vader were to have any offspring, their existence would disprove the lie that kept him loyal to the Emperor: that he had killed Padme before she gave birth, that nothing in the galaxy remains of her, that he is alone except for his master. Indeed, once he discovers Luke exists, he immediately begins plotting to turn on Palpatine. When he discovers Leia exists, he announces his intention to try again with her. In the films, only the Skywalkers have the kind of connection to Vader that could make them want to join him, or perhaps he's just not interested in anybody who's not the living legacy of his wife. (In the EU, his experience with Starkiller likely is relevant to this.) So that's why Luke is special to Vader. Palpatine can literally see the future, which is how he knew Luke would be a big deal. Though apparently he couldn't see why he would be. Yoda didn't think Luke was special, and indeed it's possible that the "another" hope he spoke of was not the one Obi-Wan thought he meant. He just happened to be the only partly-trained apprentice who showed up with the ghost of Obi-Wan Kenobi to vouch for him. Obi-Wan watched over Luke from a young age because he believed in midichlorians, and expected that the Skywalker twins would inherit their father's strength in the Force. He was right, of course. Was this nothing more than a self-fulfilling prophecy, or is there something to this midichlorian count malarkey? The beauty of it is that because the Jedi Order were wrong about lots of poo poo, you can choose for yourself whether they were wrong about that too. Yaws posted:Jedi are the only cool and fun thing about Star Wars. Um excuse me you have forgotten about how sweet chariot races are. Bongo Bill fucked around with this message at 09:25 on Jan 11, 2014 |
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Jan 11, 2014 09:01
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Jesse Plemons was hilarious and awesome in Breaking Bad where he played a smarmy, smug rear end in a top hat, but I don't know how he'd do as a lead in a Star Wars movie. I guess it remains to be seen!
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Jan 11, 2014 09:02
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DFu4ever posted:Haha...I love that guy. He was entertaining in Friday Night Lights. It's just a ploy to get Taylor Kitsch the real lead role.
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Jan 11, 2014 09:20
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Is it too much to hope for a person of color in a lead role?
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Jan 11, 2014 09:36
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MixMasterMalaria posted:Is it too much to hope for a person of color in a lead role? Well, Star Wars is probably a guaranteed first weekend draw regardless of who the leads are. But while they could be a little less Hollywood in their casting as a result it'll likely be the opposite and the studio will go as conservative as they can to try and guarantee a maximum return. The most we can hope for is probably someone like Jaden Smith as Lando Jr.
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Jan 11, 2014 10:19
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MixMasterMalaria posted:Is it too much to hope for a person of color in a lead role? If it's about Luke's kids then probably unless they retcon it so Luke marries a black woman (would would be hilarious and great).
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Jan 11, 2014 17:52
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computer parts posted:If it's about Luke's kids then probably unless they retcon it so Luke marries a black woman (would would be hilarious and great). Why would this be hilarious?
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Jan 11, 2014 17:54
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Kingtheninja posted:I'd need someone else to confirm it, but I actually remember reading Lucas made a declaration of sorts about there being no wookiee jedi. I really wanted to make one in SWG and always thought it was a cool idea, especially given how intelligent wookiees were supposed to be. But yeah, I tried looking up info on the subject and I think there was one (in a comic?) but after that Lucas was like "NOPE!". Hbomberguy posted:Lucas is racist. Fixed.
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Jan 11, 2014 18:02
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sassassin posted:Why would this be hilarious? The reactions from people who claim that that's not
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Jan 11, 2014 18:08
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computer parts posted:The reactions from people who claim that that's not As a P-Canon advocate, they can do that so long as they also avoid the woman-in-refrigerator syndrome as is with all of Luke's other relationships to date.
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Jan 11, 2014 18:50
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If there's any proof Lucas was not a creator worth listening to, it's the way he's flip-flopped on who can be a Jedi and the nature of the force. Any living being can be a Jedi, all they need is the right mindset and teacher, except Wookies. The Force is in everything and everyone, and entirely beyond the physical - but now we can measure it, scientifically! The latter is more interesting because it's not what Lucas thinks, it's what the old Jedi think. E: The biggest refrigerator of all is the one you have to put your dick in when you realise she's your sister.
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Jan 11, 2014 18:54
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Corek posted:Female pilots edited out of Return of the Jedi (and not restored in any special editions or even release of deleted scenes): Huh yeah I always thought that guy looked like David Bowie.
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Jan 11, 2014 21:13
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Hbomberguy posted:If there's any proof Lucas was not a creator worth listening to, it's the way he's flip-flopped on who can be a Jedi and the nature of the force. Any living being can be a Jedi, all they need is the right mindset and teacher, except Wookies. The Force is in everything and everyone, and entirely beyond the physical - but now we can measure it, scientifically! The latter is more interesting because it's not what Lucas thinks, it's what the old Jedi think. It's funny-sad the lengths canon-fans will go to to argue Han Solo isn't 'force-sensitive' when he shoots accurately while physically blinded, saying "It's alright. Trust me." Billy Idle's error is in getting the causality mixed up: the force isn't caused by (biological) familial ties. Rather, connection to the force creates solidarity that cuts across all aspects of society. That's the same error Vader makes when he tries to keep his family alive with blunt genetic engineering, inadvertently crushing his wife's 'soul.'
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Jan 11, 2014 22:55
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R2D2 too. The New Republic better get on the task of ending droid slavery soon in these new films.
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Jan 11, 2014 23:26
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:It's funny-sad the lengths canon-fans will go to to argue Han Solo isn't 'force-sensitive' when he shoots accurately while physically blinded, saying "It's alright. Trust me." Are you forgetting that his vision had been getting steadily better over the course of the preceding scenes?
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Jan 12, 2014 00:53
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jivjov posted:Are you forgetting that his vision had been getting steadily better over the course of the preceding scenes? "Boba Fett? Where?" *Kills Boba Fett without looking* Han Solo: Not A Force User At All, No Sirree E: Also, according to the special editions, he can dodge lazers.
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Jan 12, 2014 01:08
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Han solo is clearly force sensitive according to deciphers star wars ccg.
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Jan 12, 2014 01:41
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jivjov posted:Are you forgetting that his vision had been getting steadily better over the course of the preceding scenes? Are you forgetting that the entire gag in that scene is that Lando doesn't trust Han's ability with a gun - or that Trust is a repeatedly underlined theme in the films, directly related to the light side? It's a fairly direct callback to Luke shutting off his targeting computer. Also, to R2D2 trusting a strange computer and thereby saving the day at the end of Empire. Genuine honesty and trust, as opposed to deception and naïveté, is the light side. It's the basis of Luke's 'family'. Han is Luke's Brother, not just a brother-in-law - and the force is strong in his family.
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Jan 12, 2014 01:57
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So for those who believe the story's universe still operates under the notion that anyone can use the force, where does that leave the ability for Force-users to sense potential candidates? In the past recruitment always seemed rather low given the population of the galaxy. In this setting midichlorians still are probably correlated to Force sensitivity, but if anyone can theoretically use the Force why does no one seem to recognize this? I guess I'm not really looking for a biological answer. Regardless of what an in-universe answer would be it strikes me as a way to talk about a corrupted religion owning a monopoly on the peace and capacity that any individual can potentially claim. Although it doesn't seem like the Jedi try to keep the Force from the public at large; it seems like they as well don't know how widespread its influence can be. I'm also mostly thinking this out as I type while I wait for a football game to start.
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Jan 12, 2014 02:07
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computer parts posted:If it's about Luke's kids then probably unless they retcon it so Luke marries a black woman (would would be hilarious and great). Once you go black, you never go back: 
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Jan 12, 2014 02:09
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Gotta Wear Shades posted:So for those who believe the story's universe still operates under the notion that anyone can use the force, where does that leave the ability for Force-users to sense potential candidates? In the past recruitment always seemed rather low given the population of the galaxy. In this setting midichlorians still are probably correlated to Force sensitivity, but if anyone can theoretically use the Force why does no one seem to recognize this? I guess I'm not really looking for a biological answer. Regardless of what an in-universe answer would be it strikes me as a way to talk about a corrupted religion owning a monopoly on the peace and capacity that any individual can potentially claim. Although it doesn't seem like the Jedi try to keep the Force from the public at large; it seems like they as well don't know how widespread its influence can be. I'm also mostly thinking this out as I type while I wait for a football game to start. Potential is something some people are born with over others, yes, but not in a magical, 'some people are just more blessed than others' way. If I gave you a puzzle with a thousand pieces, within twenty minutes you would have solved some, but not all of it. In the same time frame, if someone else managed to fit more pieces together, they are a better 'potential candidate' for my Puzzle Club than you, but the reason they fared better would be because they were already a fan of games, or intuited a strategy on the fly, or just happened to get really lucky, or were raised with a worldview that makes them more conducive to finding a solution more quickly. It is easy to confuse this with simply being 'just better' at something than others. Extrapolating outwards: Real social, political or economic movers existed because of a combination of all these factors. Steve Jobs wasn't born smart. Luke wasn't born a great Jedi - Han Solo wasn't a born Force-atheist. 'Doing the math' to find the most potential candidate or measuring their midi-chlorians is putting the proverbial cart before the horse. In the words of John B. Watson: "Give me a dozen healthy infants, well-formed, and my own specified world to bring them up in and I'll guarantee to take any one at random and train him to become any type of specialist I might select – doctor, lawyer, artist, merchant-chief and, yes, even beggar-man and thief, regardless of his talents, penchants, tendencies, abilities, vocations, and race of his ancestors. I am going beyond my facts and I admit it, but so have the advocates of the contrary and they have been doing it for many thousands of years."
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Jan 12, 2014 02:35
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To make sure I'm understanding you, you're going with a 100 to 0 nurture over nature split?
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Jan 12, 2014 02:43
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Closer to 50/50, but with the caveat that both influence each other pretty much directly.
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Jan 12, 2014 02:53
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http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-rumors-who-is-669997quote:The project has changed significantly since Oscar winner Michael Arndt split as writer on Episode VII in the fall, with duties taken up by Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan, who co-wrote Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back and Raiders of the Lost Ark. "Gee, why are you shooting all my scenes first JJ?" 
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Jan 12, 2014 04:44
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Gotta Wear Shades posted:So for those who believe the story's universe still operates under the notion that anyone can use the force, where does that leave the ability for Force-users to sense potential candidates? In the past recruitment always seemed rather low given the population of the galaxy. In this setting midichlorians still are probably correlated to Force sensitivity, but if anyone can theoretically use the Force why does no one seem to recognize this? As pointed out, this is the logic of the dark side: If people are 'weak', it is because they are of inferior stock. Only those genetically predisposed to it can be Jedi, and even they must be indoctrinated at an early age so that the institution can keep them in line. In the prequels, both the Jedi and Sith share this type of racist thought, tied to their love of power. The Republic's multiculturalism has an undercurrent of white supremacism - note Padme's smirk as she manipulates the stupid Gungans. Again, you can't put the cart before the horse; what is the force? What is its light side? If the light side is read as the Holy Spirit, as it must be, then 'force sensitivity' is just a nonsensical term for trustworthiness, honesty, and all the other qualities that make one a good Christian revolutionary. When fans cannot understand 'trust' except as a videogame mechanism, it's like that comic where Patrick Stewart bemoans the fact that Trekkies cannot understand empathy except as a racial superpower.
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Jan 12, 2014 05:06
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:As pointed out, this is the logic of the dark side: If people are 'weak', it is because they are of inferior stock. Only those genetically predisposed to it can be Jedi, and even they must be indoctrinated at an early age so that the institution can keep them in line. Also, in the EU, this is every Yuuzhan Vong. Seriously, while every other living being exists in EU-Force, the Yuuzhan Vong are completely absent. Not even voids in the force, there's just nothing there. Ain't never been a Yuuzhan Vong Jedi. They are empirically and quantifiably inferior. (There was one Vong who was in the Force, but he was the most evil one of them all. He is defeated by Jacen Solo literally going deeper into the Force than anyone ever had before and killing him.)
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Jan 12, 2014 05:19
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Griff Lee posted:http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-rumors-who-is-669997 So basically Tron Legacy but the sequels are guaranteed. I can live with it.
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Jan 12, 2014 05:20
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Griff Lee posted:http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-rumors-who-is-669997 Ahh holy crap. If this is true then they're planning on making a $200 million tentpole about a bunch of senior citizens going on a space adventure. Harrison Ford looks like a goblin now.
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Jan 12, 2014 05:35
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