|
Jacobey000 posted:Yeah, i saw that afterward. Could be mildly overkill... What isn't in most of the homebrew systems? 
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 14:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 01:33 |
|
|
Cointelprofessional posted:Lacto might survive, but it won't be around for much longer. To quote Wild Brews, page 112, "Even though the microorganism produces lactic acid, Lactobacillus will ceased to reproduce at a ph of around 3.8." That's an interesting fun fact. That book has been on my reading list for a long time. What's the ratio of practical information for home brewers vs general information on existing commercial products? Also, ph measured by TMF on some of his sours: http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2011/11/measuring-sour-beer-ph.html?m=1
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 14:29
|
|
|
Cointelprofessional posted:Lacto might survive, but it won't be around for much longer. To quote Wild Brews, page 112, "Even though the microorganism produces lactic acid, Lactobacillus will ceased to reproduce at a ph of around 3.8." I finished reading it but fermentation wise I only really remember it talking alot about using wooden barrels, for someone without a wooden barrel is there any way around it because I remember on HomebrewTV they used glass carboys. When I brew the lambic, pitch and leave for 2years or so in the same glass carboy is any good? Is there anything I should do other then this? Fluo fucked around with this message at 15:12 on Jan 21, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:08
|
|
|
Fluo posted:I finished reading it but fermentation wise I only really remember it talking alot about using wooden barrels, for someone without a wooden barrel is there any way around it because I remember on HomebrewTV they used glass carboys. When I brew the lambic, pitch and leave for 2years or so in the same glass carboy is any good? Is there anything I should do other then this? Some people say to seal your carboy with an oak dowel instead of a rubber stopper/airlock to get a slow trickle of oxygen. I've never done it though, I think my bad habit of pulling samples gets me enough O2 in my sours.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:16
|
|
|
Glottis posted:Post #1: Today I brewed (mixed?) a new cider primarily for my wife. 5 gallons of Tree Top and 1 lb of Turbinado sugar putting the OG around 1.06. My plan is to ferment all of that out, then add a combination of apple juice concentrate, maple syrup, and more Turbinado sugar to bring the SG back up to around 1.04, bottle it, then pasteurize the bottles in a week or so after I've confirmed it got some carbonation. I used the Belgian Strong Ale yeast in hopes it'd add some interesting flavor but I don't expect much. Like Jacobey said, a week is way too long with that much sugar, and it'll probably be more like a day before it gets up to proper carbonation levels. Just open a bottle every 12 hours or so to check the carb, or you can fill a couple of little plastic soda bottles and use their firmness as a pressure gauge. That takes a bit of practice to get right, and I like to keep one still full of soda as a reference. Definitely err on the side of caution with the carbonation though(a not-quite-fully-carbed batch is a lot better than losing half of the batch to glass grenades). I pasteurize in a big canning pot on the stove, and while I have never had any bottles violently explode with shrapnel and terror like a lot of people seem to expect, I have had a few pop in the pot like little depth charges. If you have a big rectangular cooler, that method sounds safer. Just make sure all of the bottles can sit upright without being too crammed in there. It also might be good to first warm them up in hot tap water to reduce the temperature shock to the glass before putting them into the 150f cooler. Also, I'd probably go up to 160-170f just to be sure. I don't remember exactly what internal temps you're looking to hit(135-140, maybe?), but putting all of those bottles into the water is going to bring the temp pretty far down. Oh, and put a towel down wherever the bottles will be going after you're done. I can't say for sure that putting them on a cold marble counter would cause them to break, but I also can't say for sure that it wouldn't! And to address question B- Yeah, 1.04 is probably going to be too sweet. My apple pie cider ended up at about that fg, and it is still crazy sweet in spite of the 16% alcohol. Although, I used a lot of brown sugar and apple pie spice, both of which impart a lot of flavor, so you may have a different experience with the turbinado(I've never used it). I'd probably go around 1.03 though. That's still going to be pretty sweet, but hopefully without being completely overwhelming.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:30
|
|
|
I'm doing a bunch of thinking and research on how I want to convert a mini-mash version of a Dry Irish stout to an all grain recipe. The mini mash version used 5 lb of liquid "Dark Malt Extract". I've found some decent articles online for doing conversions (see links below), but I guess what I'm looking for is if anyone has already done this and has an answer in their hat. I think I've found some good ideas of what malts to use, it's more question of ratios of those malts to replace the dark LME. I'm starting from the AHS Budget Stout Mini Mash recipie that I've made several times http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?products_id=13520. http://byo.com/stories/item/616-extract-to-all-grain-and-back Very detailed info converting that takes into account color and flavors. http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/help-converting-extract-recipe-all-grain-128206/ Suggests 2# of Munich Malt, Crystal 60L, and Black Malt(divided equally) - in place of the 1# DME. http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/malt-extract-all-grain-conversion-added-ingredients-208087/ Talks about what malts to use in place of dark malt extract. Suggests a mix of 2-row, Munich, crystal 60 and black malt. http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/what-dark-malt-extract-192362/ Some more ideas on what malts to use in place of dark malt extract. Similarly talks of Base Malt [I assume some kind of 2 row], Caramel Malt 60L, Munich Malt, Black Malt.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:47
|
|
|
Man, I'm constantly amazed at how insane of a yeast 3787 is. My quad is puking its guts out non-stop. Chest freezer gets delivered today! No more swamp cooler management for me.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:56
|
|
|
internet celebrity posted:Some people say to seal your carboy with an oak dowel instead of a rubber stopper/airlock to get a slow trickle of oxygen. I've never done it though, I think my bad habit of pulling samples gets me enough O2 in my sours. Ok cool thanks  , think this would be good enough if I drilled a hole for an airlock? http://www.hopshopuk.com/products/view/1491/general/airlocks-bungs-and-corks/tail-cork-no4-1-5-8-x-1-7-8
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 15:59
|
|
|
crazyfish posted:Chest freezer gets delivered today! No more swamp cooler management for me. Welcome. So, as I said, my goal for 2014 is to lock down some stable main recipes. I think I'm going to try my hoppy pale ale with some golden candi sugar instead of dextrose haha. I wonder how much of a difference that will make on the final product.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 16:01
|
|
|
fullroundaction posted:That's an interesting fun fact. That book has been on my reading list for a long time. What's the ratio of practical information for home brewers vs general information on existing commercial products? All of the techniques come with caveats and changes for home brewers. The biggest problem is its starting to grow whiskers on the American sour side which is of most interest to a home brewer trying to make sours. Not a huge deal, just keep in mind the newer info in blogs or more recent discussions can trump what's in the book.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 16:08
|
|
|
fullroundaction posted:That's an interesting fun fact. That book has been on my reading list for a long time. What's the ratio of practical information for home brewers vs general information on existing commercial products? Ratio, hmm. I would say that's it's fairly even. It does give you lots of background, discussing the history of the big players, the effect of WW2, etc. It also gives you lots of practical information, from tasting descriptors, recipes, great info on the microorganisms and their habits and growing conditions. It gives you lots of information on each step in the process of brewing sour beers, from brewing, to the bugs, maturing vessels, bottling, and even blending. I'd highly recommend this book. Home brewing has too much contradictory word of mouth advice and sour beers has its share too. This book settles many matters. Read another review: http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2009/02/book-review-wild-brews.html Fluo posted:When I brew the lambic, pitch and leave for 2years or so in the same glass carboy is any good? Is there anything I should do other then this? I usually toss in .5 - 1 oz of oak chips that I've either microwaved in water for boiled on the stove. Discard the water because you really don't want to taste much barrel at all in your sour. Barrels can let you create a house culture when the critters inoculate themselves into the wood, but they aren't required. You can make a beer that's "close enough". I have a few sours in glass carboys, but most of them are in plastic better bottles. internet celebrity posted:Some people say to seal your carboy with an oak dowel... If you have a glass carboy, the oak dowel will likely expand when it soaks up your beer and then it'll crack your carboy.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 16:27
|
|
|
Cointelprofessional posted:I usually toss in .5 - 1 oz of oak chips that I've either microwaved in water for boiled on the stove. Discard the water because you really don't want to taste much barrel at all in your sour. Barrels can let you create a house culture when the critters inoculate themselves into the wood, but they aren't required. You can make a beer that's "close enough". I have a few sours in glass carboys, but most of them are in plastic better bottles. Okie dokie, will add 1oz of oak chips, since doing sours are so special do you think I should buy plastic carboys/demijhons instead of glass if I plan on in future putting future beers ontop of the cake at the bottom?
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 17:02
|
|
|
Cointelprofessional posted:If you have a glass carboy, the oak dowel will likely expand when it soaks up your beer and then it'll crack your carboy. I think the compromise/trick is you drill out a stopper to fit your dowel and the stopper absorbs the expansion.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 17:27
|
|
|
fullroundaction posted:You can feed your guys a half gallon or so of fresh wort a couple weeks before you plan on bottling to see if they're still up for the job and to get them ready to do work (this is what I do). Fluo posted:Okie dokie, will add 1oz of oak chips, since doing sours are so special do you think I should buy plastic carboys/demijhons instead of glass if I plan on in future putting future beers ontop of the cake at the bottom?
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 17:29
|
|
|
The general wisdom is that you can reuse glass for non-sour after being used with sour, but the same is not true for plastic because plastic is prone to scratches which can make it hard to sanitize. Personally, I just use dedicated sour better bottles and don't worry about it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 17:43
|
|
|
crazyfish posted:The general wisdom is that you can reuse glass for non-sour after being used with sour, but the same is not true for plastic because plastic is prone to scratches which can make it hard to sanitize. Personally, I just use dedicated sour better bottles and don't worry about it. The glass carboys would be dedicated for sours anyway so you think it'd best for me to save the glass carboys for other stuff and just buy 2 of these for my sours if I'm going to be putting future sours on top of it anyway? By the way Stonedog I love your Critics avatar. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 18:02
|
|
|
Fluo posted:Okie dokie, will add 1oz of oak chips, since doing sours are so special do you think I should buy plastic carboys/demijhons instead of glass if I plan on in future putting future beers ontop of the cake at the bottom? You can use either, but I find plastic to be cheaper and I don't have to worry about it breaking. Stonedog posted:Wondering the same, except with plastic buckets vs PET Better Bottle-type carboys. If buckets let in more oxygen, would buckets be good for "fast" sours and PET Bottles be better for 1+ years? Oxygen actually inhibits "sour" flavors. The two bugs that produce lactic acid, Lactobacillus and Pediococcus, hate oxygen and it will stunt their growth/reproduction. The bacteria acetobacter uses oxygen will produce acetic/vinegar flavors, of which you only want a little. There are methods of doing "fast" sours, but the storage vessel doesn't really matter in that regard.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 18:08
|
|
|
Cointelprofessional posted:You can use either, but I find plastic to be cheaper and I don't have to worry about it breaking.  Think I'll dedicate my Better Bottles to sours. They take less space anyway, so that's perfect for long-term storage. Fluo posted:By the way Stonedog I love your Critics avatar. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 18:18
|
|
|
I used some Turbinado sugar in my IPA this weekend. I wonder if it actually does anything that regular sugar doesn't. I know on Barclay Perkins they're super into the idea that its way different if you use "good" sugar over "plain."
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 22:16
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:I used some Turbinado sugar in my IPA this weekend. I wonder if it actually does anything that regular sugar doesn't. I know on Barclay Perkins they're super into the idea that its way different if you use "good" sugar over "plain." turbinado sugar has some impurities that plain sugar doesn't have. It will present marginal differences in taste since these impurities are unfermentable.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 22:26
|
|
|
GrAviTy84 posted:turbinado sugar has some impurities that plain sugar doesn't have. It will present marginal differences in taste since these impurities are unfermentable. That's the idea, but I tend to doubt that I will actually be able to taste the difference.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 22:31
|
|
|
Turbinado can add a rum note depending on the quantity and the beer. I definitely taste it in a Tripel when I use it for the sugar portion. IPA? Not sure. I used 1 lb. of piloncillo sugar in an IPA and it was lost.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 22:35
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:That's the idea, but I tend to doubt that I will actually be able to taste the difference. yeah, you'd really have to be pretty heavy handed with it. As mentioned, other sugars with more impurities would probably present stronger than turbinado would. Especially in such a bold beer as an IPA.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 22:37
|
|
|
GrAviTy84 posted:yeah, you'd really have to be pretty heavy handed with it. As mentioned, other sugars with more impurities would probably present stronger than turbinado would. Especially in such a bold beer as an IPA. I didn't have the guts to put muscovado in there, because that would be just too wrong. Sometimes I do put blackstrap molasses even in very pale beers just for a little color, though. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:11
|
|
|
Jacobey000 posted:a) I think home-pasteurization of homebrew is loving insane and way too dangerous to attempt, but I also would never, ever buy glass carboys. I'm not as worried about bottles exploding. I'll take precautions to prevent injury / mess and it's not a big deal if I lose some. And yeah the apple juice is 1.05 out of the bottle so I don't think it'll be gross sweet if I get up there. As for carbonation, what I meant to say was that I'd be opening bottles on a daily basis until it was fermented, max a week - but it sounds like I should be opening bottles every several hours or so or at least using a plastic bottle as well. For the record, my house is pretty much constantly ~65 degrees and takes a decently long time for other beers to bottle carbonate. BLARGHLE posted:Like Jacobey said, a week is way too long with that much sugar, and it'll probably be more like a day before it gets up to proper carbonation levels. Just open a bottle every 12 hours or so to check the carb, or you can fill a couple of little plastic soda bottles and use their firmness as a pressure gauge. That takes a bit of practice to get right, and I like to keep one still full of soda as a reference. Definitely err on the side of caution with the carbonation though(a not-quite-fully-carbed batch is a lot better than losing half of the batch to glass grenades). I pasteurize in a big canning pot on the stove, and while I have never had any bottles violently explode with shrapnel and terror like a lot of people seem to expect, I have had a few pop in the pot like little depth charges. Yeah, my plan was to do the cooler thing and attempt to account for the temperature lost into the bottles, i.e. putting ~170 degree water in there and hoping it only drops 20 degrees. Maybe I'll put ~120 degree water in first for a while, drain, then put the hot stuff in to reduce the shock and temperature loss when the temperature is key.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:31
|
|
|
24 hours into my first sour mash. Smells pretty good, idk why people say it stinks. Smells like really fresh yogurt with honey. I dig. Details: Grain bill: American 2-Row 10 lbs Flaked Wheat 2 lbs Crystal 120L .5 lb Special B .5 lb Brought 2.5 gallons of water up to 170 F dropped in 6 lbs of the combined grain bill which dropped it to 155 ish. Single temp infusion mash held in oven set to warm at 155. It hovered around 153ish for the majority of one hour. Pulled it from oven to cool to 120 F when I inoculated with a big handful of unmashed cracked grain from the grain bill. Put it back into the oven with the light on. Checked this morning and it was at about 95 F, so I turned the warmer on again until the mash was at 118 F. So far so good. I'm thinking about letting it go for 48 hours. Questions: When I mash the remainder of the grain bill, should I combine the sour mash with the unmashed grains? Should I mash them separately? What about for the boil? I know I should pasteurize the sour mash before combining in the fermenter, but I'm wondering if I should just bring the sour mash to a boil quickly, then chill it quickly so as to preserve as much of the wild ferment character as possible and only do a full 60 minute boil+hops for the remainder of the grain bill. Any opinions?
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 01:28
|
|
|
GrAviTy84 posted:Sour Mash 
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
GrAviTy84 posted:24 hours into my first sour mash. Smells pretty good, idk why people say it stinks. Smells like really fresh yogurt with honey. I dig. Both of my sour mashes smelled like over-ripe pineapple. It's my understanding (I sour my entire mash), that you to mash separately (due to pH?) and then add the soured mash when doing the mash-out. I usually boil because I don't want to have puckering lemonade-beer, and to help nix DMS. I boil for 5-10 minutes and toss in hops for giggles.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 04:15
|
|
|
Glottis posted:I'm not as worried about bottles exploding. I'll take precautions to prevent injury / mess and it's not a big deal if I lose some. And yeah the apple juice is 1.05 out of the bottle so I don't think it'll be gross sweet if I get up there. As for carbonation, what I meant to say was that I'd be opening bottles on a daily basis until it was fermented, max a week - but it sounds like I should be opening bottles every several hours or so or at least using a plastic bottle as well. For the record, my house is pretty much constantly ~65 degrees and takes a decently long time for other beers to bottle carbonate. I'd like to know how the cooler works, because doing it on the stove is kind of a pain in the rear end, and also very time consuming. I know some goon(maybe Josh Wow?) had asked before if I was getting a complete kill or just knocking the yeast population way down, and it seems to me that I'm not getting any additional carbonation in my older batches, even after 6+ months of sitting. I don't have a terribly scientific way to measure this, except to say that they're not foaming up like crazy... Beer4theBeerGod- have you had a chance to try any of my brews yet? The honey wheat and Guinness have done a decent job of carbing up, and I'd like to get opinions from people other than my friends. I think the honey wheat smells exactly like it is supposed to, but is almost completely without flavor(at least compared to the old extract recipe I was trying to replicate). The Guinness clone is still a little sweet to really be called a clone, at least in my opinion. And, as far as the ESB and brown ale are concerned, I found that they did a pretty poor job of carbonating, but both are decent, if not particularly noteworthy as far as taste goes. I haven't had any of yours yet, because I stuck them in the back of everything to let the one age and keep forgetting about the other two varieties in there...
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 06:46
|
|
|
Okay santees, let's audit and make sure everything went off okay. If you have not received your beer, PM me or email michael.r.board@gmail.com
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 09:05
|
|
|
Paladine_PSoT posted:Okay santees, let's audit and make sure everything went off okay. If you have not received your beer, PM me or email michael.r.board@gmail.com I've received mine (which I'll post about in a couple of days with photo), but I've not sent mine yet. I explain it in PM but long story short somehow the woman at the post office said I have to have 1liter or less otherwise they'd have to be in separate boxes which has thrown me off as I've never had that before. Going to try a different post office and if that fails just going to have to send two boxes. Whoever my secret santa is I'm hugely sorry for the delay. A friend also had this problem sending nail polish.  Anyway I'm doing everything I can to send it ASAP. Fluo fucked around with this message at 11:07 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 10:50
|
|
|
Fluo posted:I've received mine (which I'll post about in a couple of days with photo), but I've not sent mine yet. I explain it in PM but long story short somehow the woman at the post office said I have to have 1liter or less otherwise they'd have to be in separate boxes which has thrown me off as I've never had that before. Going to try a different post office and if that fails just going to have to send two boxes. Maybe just deliver it personally? I suppose this assume that you have a car and don't live too far away from your santee...
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 11:42
|
|
|
BLARGHLE posted:Maybe just deliver it personally? I suppose this assume that you have a car and don't live too far away from your santee... I would if I had a car.. (which I don't :<) 386 mi / 6 hour drive which I would go that far to drop it off if I had a car but by train and bus it'd be getting pretty silly  . If the santee can wait like, 2 weeks max this poo poo will be sorted. Going to straight away just rebox it into two different boxes, because of the weight of it too I think I'd have trouble at the other post office even if it wasn't liquids. Bottles are all vacuum sealed anyway so isn't going to be too much trouble.It was just one of those things where one of my beers were going to be ready to drink around the 28th december so though I'd send it then and dodge the christmas post but been having problems. If need be I'll pay extra and get a private courier. Fluo fucked around with this message at 12:21 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 12:15
|
|
|
Josh Wow posted:Do a beta glucan rest for 20-30 minutes around 110*F to break up some of those gummy proteins and run off pretty slow. Honestly though I'd throw at least 5-10% of something else in there. Even with the huge OG I'd be worried about the beer being too thin and one dimensional. Is that different than a protein rest at ~120? Paladine_PSoT posted:Okay santees, let's audit and make sure everything went off okay. If you have not received your beer, PM me or email Jacobey000 fucked around with this message at 14:10 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 14:00
|
|
|
Jacobey000 posted:Is that different than a protein rest at ~120? I couldn't tell ya, I've seen people online talk about doing both. I've had better results at 110 as far as runoff goes so I stick with that.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 15:13
|
|
|
Phew, last night I finally bottled the last portion (except 1 gal set aside for future blends) of my first homebrew sour. I'd been sort of messing around with it over the course of the last 15 months. Some of the nasty off flavor that I've been picking up in my bottles was present, and it was most present in the portion of the lambic that had the most recent fruit additions (coincidentally done at the time I bottled the currently nasty bottles). Last night I blended 1 gal on sour cherries + 1 gal on sour cherry juice (from the same harvest) + 1.5 gal on sweet cherries and mixed berries and primed it with a bottle of sour cherry juice (also same harvest). I also sampled the framboise and the rye sour that are aging - the framboise is beautiful and complex, while the rye sour is currently 'rip your face off sour' with a strong undercurrent of funk. I think I will smell like lacto for days now.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 15:51
|
|
|
BLARGHLE posted:I'd like to know how the cooler works, because doing it on the stove is kind of a pain in the rear end, and also very time consuming.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 16:12
|
|
|
Paladine_PSoT posted:Okay santees, let's audit and make sure everything went off okay. If you have not received your beer, PM me or email michael.r.board@gmail.com Mine is ready to go out, it just hasn't since work has been kind of crazy the last week. In fairness, I haven't received anything either.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 18:16
|
|
|
I don't know if this has been posted here, but
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 01:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 01:33 |
|
|
Sorry but I only use charts that break "European" flavor and aroma into no less than 3 tiers 
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 01:46
|
|