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Didn't HarperDC say the good racing would start to lure drivers, tracks, fans and sponsors back? #JVISBACK  quote:I guess it started when they started going back to road racing, going back to a mix of tracks, going back to the IndyCar that I knew basically. They saw it was time to react, and they did. http://prnmag.com/news/motorsport/2375-q-a-with-jacques-villeneuve-and-schmidt-peterson-motosports-co-owners http://www.spmindycar.com/jvisback/
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Feb 27, 2014 00:13
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LOL Jacques basically shits on the old IRL.
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Feb 27, 2014 00:31
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gret posted:LOL everyone basically shits on the old IRL.
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Feb 27, 2014 00:35
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it's kind of funny because JV was kind of disliked by the Indy contingent back in the day- I remember stories where he was at the victory banquet after he had won the 500, where he clearly didn't really give a poo poo about the Honor of Indy or whatever- it was just another race to him (on his way to F1)
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Feb 27, 2014 00:38
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Fag Boy Jim posted:it's kind of funny because JV was kind of disliked by the Indy contingent back in the day- I remember stories where he was at the victory banquet after he had won the 500, where he clearly didn't really give a poo poo about the Honor of Indy or whatever- it was just another race to him (on his way to F1) Things change over time. Reading through what JV has to say about it, it seems 100% genuine. About him wanting his kids to see his father actually driving instead of talking about it, for example. I'm excited.
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Feb 27, 2014 00:40
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I'lll laugh when JV finishes 20th at the 500...
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Feb 27, 2014 00:51
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IceAgeComing posted:I'lll laugh when JV finishes 29th at the 500...
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Feb 27, 2014 00:52
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IceAgeComing posted:I'll laugh when JV gets bumped before the 500...
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Feb 27, 2014 00:54
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PP won this one, sorry guys.
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Feb 27, 2014 01:06
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I mean, that implies we will have bumping...
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Feb 27, 2014 01:07
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gently caress, didn't even consider that.
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Feb 27, 2014 01:08
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Fag Boy Jim posted:it's kind of funny because JV was kind of disliked by the Indy contingent back in the day- I remember stories where he was at the victory banquet after he had won the 500, where he clearly didn't really give a poo poo about the Honor of Indy or whatever- it was just another race to him (on his way to F1) Dario said he didn't give a poo poo about it, and it never really got to him until he won it in 2007. Donald Davidson said something about him just wanting to look at the speedway one last time during the banquet before he left for NASCAR. (of course he came back). JV would be one of the guys I'd focus on, if there was indeed a "30 for 30" series on "The Split". He was kind of the poster child for guys Tony George really disliked. gret posted:LOL Jacques basically shits on the old IRL. Jacques and Montoya pretty much were not big fans of the IRL. Nor was Paul Tracy, The Andretti's, and such. Even Hinch pretty much hated the IRL. Things change, and time heals all wounds. (unless you're a crapwagon/smacked forum troll). I think outside of maybe Gerry Forsythe, everyone has seemed to have gotten over "The Split".
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Feb 27, 2014 01:26
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Is it a case of "time heals all wounds" or "whelp, the IRL is the only choice"?
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Feb 27, 2014 16:32
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Bhester posted:"whelp, the IRL is the only choice"? Probably this one. If IndyCar didn't exist then the only open wheel you'd see in the US is the F1 race at COTA
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Feb 27, 2014 16:36
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FuzzySkinner posted:I think outside of maybe Gerry Forsythe, everyone has seemed to have gotten over "The Split". You're forgetting Mark Plourde.
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Feb 27, 2014 17:40
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quote:"We have a Formula 1 V6 design, we have an IndyCar design, and our real issue is not so much our ability to build it as IndyCar's ability to come to terms with a manufacturer," said Kalkhoven. "It's the commercial terms that IndyCar wants which would be the determining factor. And I'm not talking about the commercial terms between Cosworth and the series, but between a manufacturer and the series." http://www.racer.com/index.php/indycar/item/101466-indycar-cosworth-seeking-partner-support-for-new-engine-design One half of Cosworth's ownership (And current KV Racing co-owner) said that it's very likely that Cosworth come back...IF...they can find a manufacturer. So, it's in Derrick Walker's hands.
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Feb 27, 2014 19:19
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FuzzySkinner posted:http://www.racer.com/index.php/indycar/item/101466-indycar-cosworth-seeking-partner-support-for-new-engine-design A 3 Horse Race in terms of engine manufacturers is the perfect situation. But I'm sure I'm in the minority when I say that I don't want aero kits/different looking cars. When all the cars are the same design, then success is determined by 3 things: The Driver, The Engine, and tuning/race setup. What makes IndyCar great is that small teams have just as good of a chance of winning as the big teams, and aero kits upsets that balance.
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Feb 27, 2014 19:47
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Cossie has had that design ready to go since 2011. I don't have a lot of hope, honestly. The perfect time to enter the series would be 2015, and if you are gonna enter in 2015, you better already have the engine and aerokit well into planning/development by now. So yeah, I'm not hopeful.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:04
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KingShibby posted:A 3 Horse Race in terms of engine manufacturers is the perfect situation. But I'm sure I'm in the minority when I say that I don't want aero kits/different looking cars. When all the cars are the same design, then success is determined by 3 things: The Driver, The Engine, and tuning/race setup. What makes IndyCar great is that small teams have just as good of a chance of winning as the big teams, and aero kits upsets that balance. Agreed. I don't get the people going gaga over aero kits. Although I wouldn't mind multiple chassis manufacturers.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:07
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Multiple chassis would be far more divisive than aerokits on a common chassis. I think Indycar needs to be doing everything it can to get a valid third manufacturer in the series - Chevy and Honda are both being more than generous but that money will eventually run out. Part of me wonders how much the series would really be compromised if they modified the DW12 to not use the engine as a stressed member and increased the room under the cowling a bit. 650hp-700hp is doable at vastly lower costs than the current engine package if the block doesn't also have to be strong enough to handle the entire rear suspension load.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:15
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FuzzySkinner posted:http://www.racer.com/index.php/indycar/item/101466-indycar-cosworth-seeking-partner-support-for-new-engine-design The cosworth engine in F1 is a piece of junk, they might be slightly better than the lotus engine.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:27
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Uncle Jam posted:The cosworth engine in F1 is a piece of junk, they might be slightly better than the lotus engine. When Caterham changed to the actual world championship engine it's not like they took a leap forward. I'm not sure the F1 engine was missing much.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:39
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How is their track record in Formula 1 relevant to Indy car in any way? Honda and Toyota have Indy 500 wins, and AOWR Championships to their credit. Did they do poo poo in Formula 1 (recently, so don't bring up Senna)? No. That's kind of irrelevant.
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Feb 27, 2014 20:45
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IOwnCalculus posted:Part of me wonders how much the series would really be compromised if they modified the DW12 to not use the engine as a stressed member and increased the room under the cowling a bit. 650hp-700hp is doable at vastly lower costs than the current engine package if the block doesn't also have to be strong enough to handle the entire rear suspension load. You could say 'why dont we drop all that and allow cheap engine options!', but the cheap engine options would immediately be blasted off the track by Honda/HPD and Chevy/Ilmor who are, quite simply, better at this and better funded. Even if you look at the world of set price performance balanced formulas, like LMP2 and DP, eventually one performance package gets an advantage and everyone else is run off. IndyCar's engines as it is now is essentially a cooperative between Chevy and Honda. They both agree to spend a set amount on promotion, a set amount on testing, a set amount on R&D, a set amount on team support. And in the end, the engine makes up about 20% of a team budget. Even if the engines were FREE, teams would still have to find $6+ million in their couch cushions, so it could get people closer but I don't think it would really drastically change things. And were only 3 cars under the realistic maximum number of full timers as it is.
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Feb 27, 2014 21:09
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KingShibby posted:Probably this one. If IndyCar didn't exist then the only open wheel you'd see in the US is the F1 race at COTA USAC and WoO would like to have a word with you  e- and if cheap engines that allowed ease of entry to the sport was a thing that mattered all the cars would be running small block V8's. Those can make 600-700hp in their sleep. Obviously price is a small component. Also let's stop wondering how we can make top level motorsports cheaper, it's never going to be no matter how hard you try. They could have the IROC guys build all the cars and the Red teams are just gonna spend that extra money hiring the best personnel. Indy racing has and always will be a sport for the 1%, even in the glory days. Smokey spent $40,000 on his pod car, in the mid 60's that's the price of four Ferrari's. Which isn't much cheaper than today, is it? Seizure Meat fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Feb 27, 2014 |
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Feb 27, 2014 22:51
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I'm not even looking at it from a team expense standpoint, just trying to keep the manufacturers themselves happy. The thing I worry about here is that if no other manufacturers are willing to stick their name on a Cosworth-developed engine, what's to say that Honda and Chevy will continue to see the value in spending the megabucks that they do to support the sport?
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Feb 27, 2014 23:03
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Ok, yeah that's a fair point. Chevy definitely I can see having that outlook, but I think Honda is content regardless. They spent how many years alone? Honestly, I think the best two makes to cater to would be Dodge or Ford. Both have worked with Cosworth before, both would be great to increase the American market share, and in Dodge's case they have Fiat, Alfa Romeo and Ferrari to work with, too. Now that I think about it, Alfa would probably be the best bet in a perfect world. The Fiat/Chrysler group is going to be relaunching Alfa in the US sometime soon, and making a big splash in the motorsport world in the US would only help their image here, which isn't exactly stellar.
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Feb 27, 2014 23:22
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Alfa would be a good choice. They could redeem their image in Indycar, last time it didn't go so well. I wonder if Toyota, Mazda, or Nissan would be interested.
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Feb 27, 2014 23:27
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Maybe they could get a Mercedes and have it driven by Schumacher's head in a jar.
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Feb 27, 2014 23:30
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Fiat/Alfa, VW/Audi, Lotus, Honda, and Chevy were the 5 that came up with the rule set they have now... although its since been edited to drop the I4 Turbo (that VW wanted) and V6 Single turbo options.
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Feb 27, 2014 23:31
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UPDATE: Apparently Cosworth and IndyCar are meeting on Tuesday.quote:Reisiger is currently in the US and plans to meet with IndyCar management on Tuesday, but says that his plans already have the support of the series. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/112691 Also, Apparently Dale Jr owns the wrecked cockpit of Will Power's Vegas car. It's currently hanging in a tree. https://twitter.com/DLand91/status/439160595154083840/photo/1/large
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Feb 27, 2014 23:32
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FuzzySkinner posted:Also, Apparently Dale Jr owns the wrecked cockpit of Will Power's Vegas car. It's currently hanging in a tree.  Good that Indycar is listening, at least.
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Feb 27, 2014 23:34
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IOwnCalculus posted:That's... kinda morbid. You got Derrick Walker (former costumer) in a high role within the company, alongside a former person associated with Ford Motorsports. Walker ran Ford Cosworth with his original race team in CART from 1992-1996, and then from 2004-2008 with ChampCar. Also, again, it helps when the co-owner of the company also happens to be a team owner. (Who's the defending Indy 500 champion). FuzzySkinner fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Feb 28, 2014 |
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Feb 27, 2014 23:41
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Dudley posted:When Caterham changed to the actual world championship engine it's not like they took a leap forward. I'm not sure the F1 engine was missing much. The Cosworth being bad doesn't preclude the Caterham team being bad as well. Besides, that thing has to be the cheapest offering yet you don't see anyone flocking to it. FuzzySkinner posted:How is their track record in Formula 1 relevant to Indy car in any way? Yeah, you're right, the barrier to entry in Indycar is magnitudes lower.
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Feb 28, 2014 00:44
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Worst thread is down the hall and to the left. just saying.
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Feb 28, 2014 01:07
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animeliker posted:Alfa would be a good choice. They could redeem their image in Indycar, last time it didn't go so well. Seeing an engine nick-named an Alfa-Cossie would be  as gently caress.Of the three, I see Mazda as the most interested due to their engining of most the feeder series. Once/If Mazda secures the rights for Indy Lights, watch for Zoom-Zoom stepping up to the big show not much later.
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Feb 28, 2014 01:17
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Uncle Jam posted:Yeah, you're right, the barrier to entry in Indycar is magnitudes lower. Only in F1 and baseball can blowing money for the sake of blowing money be seen as a positive thing.
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Feb 28, 2014 01:35
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VikingSkull posted:
I feel like I said that in like 2011, it really makes the most sense if Ford doesn't want back in. Ford-Cosworth is always a great match, but Cosworth making the lump for SRT or Alfa-Romeo would be a great second choice. As for Mazda, gently caress yes please. I agree with whoever said that three manufacturers of engines is the perfect number, but IF there was a fourth, I'd love to see Mazda. Otherwise I suppose they'd be there with Alfa on the "please pay Cossie for the naming rights" wish list. [Edit] and from yesterday re: Jacques Villeneuve, I did say that it would take time once the racing got good to see the interest return. It's rebuilding a reputation, and the interest (and money) comes as an echo once you've established that. It's real easy to be dismissive and say "wait a couple years" but I do mean it -- continuing on this path, with great racing, good young talent, and hopefully better sponsors will start building the reputation and virtuous cycle back up. It'll take time but we (AOW fans) have to enjoy what we have now with the knowledge that this is the right path. (Also NASCAR's reputation and contracts are winding down. They got that TV money, that's true, but it's hard not to see them being on the decline. Can other forms of motorsport in America capitalize? I hope open wheel can, but I'm biased). harperdc fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Feb 28, 2014 |
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Feb 28, 2014 02:26
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Uncle Jam posted:The Cosworth being bad doesn't preclude the Caterham team being bad as well. Besides, that thing has to be the cheapest offering yet you don't see anyone flocking to it. They didn't build an engine for this year.
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Feb 28, 2014 09:54
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harperdc posted:I feel like I said that in like 2011, it really makes the most sense if Ford doesn't want back in. Ford-Cosworth is always a great match, but Cosworth making the lump for SRT or Alfa-Romeo would be a great second choice. I'm actually keeping an eye on GRC, they just picked up Red Bull as a title sponsor and have 9/10 of their schedule on NBC (the 10/10 is at the X-Games, so ESPN) this season, mostly live--as many on broadcast as F1 and Indycar combined. And Andretti is spearheading a VW factory effort--rallycross Beetles!--though AA's strategy seems to be, outside of Indycars, throwing tomatoes at the wall and seeing what sticks. Still, I could see the tintop racing here shift in that direction if momentum keeps going the way it is. AceFace905 fucked around with this message at 14:06 on Feb 28, 2014 |
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Feb 28, 2014 14:02
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