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WickedHate posted:Nope, though pretty much all the other anime I'm into is well liked, except for maybe Kyokai no Kanata. I guess Mahouka is too though, outside of this subforum. Funny, Mahouka is one of the few anime that's been panned everywhere I've seen it discussed, not just here. Even /a/, which is usually tolerant of incest garbage, seems to lack anything good to say about it. There's even a good parody involving Tatsuya explaining how money works to a cashier kicking around. I should probably go back and look for it, I think it deserves to be posted here. Ytlaya posted:Part of the reason why the response in this thread is both universally negative and interested enough to sustain a thread this long is that most of us remember liking horrendous anime when we were younger, but realize that even then we wouldn't have liked this. I feel like I would have watched this when I was ten or eleven because all the really repulsive traits (incest, nationalism, lack of any tension) would have gone over my head and it would seem like a "smart" and "adult" show. As a dumb kid even the false sense of something being "mature" would have been pretty overpowering - I mean they talk so much, it must be a show for adults, not children, and I'm not a child anymore. That being said, as far as faint praise goes, "my ten year old self was really dumb and might have watched this" is pretty damning. Also, when you claim this show has good or interesting characters I can only ask you to please be less obvious in your trolling. fake edit: In the time it took me to write this post you jumped off the deep end. You sound like how I was when, as a young teen, I "discovered" anime for the first time and everything I watched was amazing, even if it was poo poo. Anything can seem good when you have nothing to compare it to. I have my problems with Evangelion but comparing the nuanced characters in eva to the cardboard cutouts in Mahouka is a complete farce.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:33
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You can make Evangelion sound bad too if you reduce characters to superficial ideas like that. It's like if I said Rei was flat and uninteresting despite the deep and complex issues surrounding her and why she doesn't express emotion. Same with Tatsuya.Desuwa posted:fake edit: In the time it took me to write this post you jumped off the deep end. You sound like how I was when, as a young teen, I "discovered" anime for the first time and everything I watched was amazing, even if it was poo poo. Anything can seem good when you have nothing to compare it to. I have my problems with Evangelion but comparing the nuanced characters in eva to the cardboard cutouts in Mahouka is a complete farce. There's plenty of anime I don't like.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:36
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Perhaps you could put your money where your mouth is and talk about the depth of Tatsuya's character then? I mean, there's a hell of a big difference in how Rei's character is treated compared to Tatsuya.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:37
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Desuwa posted:Funny, Mahouka is one of the few anime that's been panned everywhere I've seen it discussed, not just here. Even /a/, which is usually tolerant of incest garbage, seems to lack anything good to say about it. There's even a good parody involving Tatsuya explaining how money works to a cashier kicking around. I should probably go back and look for it, I think it deserves to be posted here. Seriously I have seen it criticized in /a/, reddit and other places. Hell /a/ seems to lose its poo poo every time a new episode is out due to how loving terrible each episode seems to get
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Jun 9, 2014 18:39
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Srice posted:Perhaps you could put your money where your mouth is and talk about the depth of Tatsuya's character then? It's still early on in the series, but right now a lot of his character arc is focused on how he deals with living with his lack of emotion and all the responsibility that's been thrust on him since he was born, while dealing with his sister's affections and trying to balance keeping her safe and making her happy without giving into the desires she has, which is harder when basically the only emotion he feels is sibling love. At the same time he still manages to be heroic and isn't amoral in things not having to do with Miyuki.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:42
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WickedHate posted:You can make Evangelion sound bad too if you reduce characters to superficial ideas like that. It's like if I said Rei was flat and uninteresting despite the deep and complex issues surrounding her and why she doesn't express emotion. Same with Tatsuya. The difference is if you did it with Rei you would, as you said, be doing it despite the issues surrounding her. I can do it to any of the characters in Mahouka without having to unfairly dumb them down or ignore any issues. If I were given a skeleton of Mahouka without Miyuki and asked to "write her back in" without any description more than "obsessed with her brother," the result - after following common anime cliches - would be relatively similar to Mahouka. Miyuki reads like someone went down a checklist of imouto-fetish cliches. If you did the same thing with Shinji, Rei, or Asuka after boiling them down to one sentence (like "is a wimp" for Shinji or "passive and uninteresting" for Rei) you'd end up with something wildly different in tone. WickedHate posted:There's plenty of anime I don't like. There's at least one too few.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:46
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Now, granted, I am a few episodes behind. But I didn't see any of that in his character in that first arc! Well, outside of the incest part that is. And uh I heavily, heavily disagree on the "heroic" part for lots of reasons I've already gone over during the course of this thread. e: Like, has there ever been a single scene yet in the anime where having no emotions (except for the emotions he does have) has been a real flaw? I can't think of a scene where it has been a detriment to him. Srice fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 18:47
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Desuwa posted:Funny, Mahouka is one of the few anime that's been panned everywhere I've seen it discussed, not just here. Even /a/, which is usually tolerant of incest garbage, seems to lack anything good to say about it. There's even a good parody involving Tatsuya explaining how money works to a cashier kicking around. I should probably go back and look for it, I think it deserves to be posted here. Except in Japan. Which is all that really matters. No one in this thread has spent a penny on any of the light novels, manga, or the anime. His Japanese readers have been buying his stuff in droves for years, why would he change anything if his stuff is insanely popular? My opinion is that the show isn't very good, but I'm not gonna criticize someone who likes it. The fact that this thread is currently as big as the Ping Pong, Mushi-shi, and the Haikyuu and Baby Steps threads combined is shameful.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:48
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korrandark posted:Except in Japan. Which is all that really matters. No one in this thread has spent a penny on any of the light novels, manga, or the anime. His Japanese readers have been buying his stuff in droves for years, why would he change anything if his stuff is insanely popular? Amusingly I've seen translated posts of 2ch going. "wait this poo poo is popular why?" and "okay someone explain why the hell this was even popular" so even people there are baffled. I honestly think the sales of this show won't be that great.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:54
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Desuwa posted:
How? Srice posted:e: Like, has there ever been a single scene yet in the anime where having no emotions (except for the emotions he does have) has been a real flaw? I can't think of a scene where it has been a detriment to him. It's more about how it makes being a person harder for him. He can connect with others but it's more difficult for things to affect him emotionally.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:54
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That would be a flaw, but has that actually happened at any point? It sounds like the sort of thing that is briefly mentioned in one of the many, many infodumps but is never actually shown. He connects with people easily, because literally the only people who do not unconditionally like him are made out to be evil jackasses, or terrorists. He feels like an alien to me because in his first day of school, apropos of nothing there are at least a half a dozen people that walk up to him and introduce themselves and suddenly they like him so much that they'd be willing to do anything for him after he introduces himself. He also has shown emotions because hey, disgust is an emotion! e: Boiling down Shinji to "is a wimp" is doing a disservice to him because dude has hella depression and finds it difficult to connect with people (See: The Hedgehog's Dilemma episode). Tatsuya's sister can be easily boiled down to "wants her brother to bang her" because as far as I could tell there hasn't been a single moment where her actions have not been controlled by that single desire. Srice fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 18:58
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Srice posted:e: Boiling down Shinji to "is a wimp" is doing a disservice to him because dude has hella depression and finds it difficult to connect with people (See: The Hedgehog's Dilemma episode). Well, yeah, that's the point. Shinji's not just a wimp and it's a vast oversimplification and generalization to sum his character up like that.
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Jun 9, 2014 19:18
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Yeah, that's because Shinji actually has characterization that can't be summed up in one sentence. Blando doesn't. He's worse than post-mindwipe Touma. I didn't think that was possible, but once again Mahouka proves that it can do anything another LN does and do it worse.
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Jun 9, 2014 19:26
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boredsatellite posted:I honestly think the sales of this show won't be that great. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2014-06-03/top-selling-light-novels-in-japan-by-series-2014-first-half/.75184
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Jun 9, 2014 20:22
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darkgray posted:This thread has way too many unmarked spoilers. I realize it's a silly, silly show, with a ridiculous plot, but some of us are watching the anime episode by episode, and we'd like to be able to read the thread without knowing every single thing that happens six seasons from now. Stop assuming everyone else read the stupid books, please. Ha ha, no. Here is another unmarked spoiler straight from the books- this poo poo only gets worse.
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Jun 9, 2014 20:23
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aers posted:http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2014-06-03/top-selling-light-novels-in-japan-by-series-2014-first-half/.75184 You should also compare Twilight sales records if you're going to pull that up, since they're about equal in literary quality by my opinion.
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Jun 9, 2014 20:30
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When talking sales it is important to note that the linked article is about the series overall. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2014-06-03/top-selling-light-novels-in-japan-by-volume-2014-first-half/.75185 This one has individual volume sales so when you consider that light novels release several volumes a year it does tell a different story. I've no idea about the book industry in Japan overall, but for comparison last year Haruki Murakami (one of the top selling authors in Japan) released a new book and the sales were so high that they printed over a million copies for the first week of release.
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Jun 9, 2014 20:35
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jwang posted:You should also compare Twilight sales records if you're going to pull that up, since they're about equal in literary quality by my opinion. ??? I never said it was good, but claiming it will sell poorly is hilarious.
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Jun 9, 2014 20:46
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Srice posted:When talking sales it is important to note that the linked article is about the series overall. Man, The Devil is a Part-Timer didn't even crack the top 20. The one light novel series I kinda want to see a second season of.  Also, hopefully this is the year when the Monogatari series finally ends.
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Jun 9, 2014 20:49
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aers posted:http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2014-06-03/top-selling-light-novels-in-japan-by-series-2014-first-half/.75184 Well yeah the LN sold well, thats why it got adapted Im talking about the sales of the show. I just dont think it will do that well let alone break even. Maybe its a forlorn hope but thats how i feel
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Jun 9, 2014 20:56
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Its tracking to sell more than fine. Sorry!
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Jun 9, 2014 20:58
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WickedHate posted:It's still early on in the series, but right now a lot of his character arc is focused on how he deals with living with his lack of emotion and all the responsibility that's been thrust on him since he was born, while dealing with his sister's affections and trying to balance keeping her safe and making her happy without giving into the desires she has, which is harder when basically the only emotion he feels is sibling love. At the same time he still manages to be heroic and isn't amoral in things not having to do with Miyuki. Nothing about Tatsuya's characterization is consistent unless you view it as always pushing towards "he's awesome, everything he does and says is awesome, the end." He displays irritation, boredom, a sense of humor, sadism--all emotionally derived behavior. To be honest it's almost impossible to imagine what a being "without emotions" would be like. To make the obvious comparison, Data was programmed by his father to possess something like curiosity and desire to learn and experience, otherwise he would never have entered starfleet to begin with, or wondered what it was like to experience emotion. Tatsuya on the other hand, has no programming other than protecting his sister. He should be almost completely inert, not the driven and manipulative mastermind portrayed in the show.
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Jun 9, 2014 21:02
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aers posted:Its tracking to sell more than fine. Sorry! Reality is a cruel mistress
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Jun 9, 2014 21:04
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Cao Ni Ma posted:The thing is, if you want a show that has competent female characters (actually over represented as a whole compared to male characters), cool magical powers, interesting setting, great animation/music and above all else fantastic characters in general you can always watch Yozakura. ...So why pick Mahouka unless you want the incest, rampant nationalism, ill founded adoration for the rich or blatantly overpowered characters Never heard of Yozakura though. I'll check it out.
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Jun 9, 2014 22:02
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Harime Nui posted:Nothing about Tatsuya's characterization is consistent unless you view it as always pushing towards "he's awesome, everything he does and says is awesome, the end." He displays irritation, boredom, a sense of humor, sadism--all emotionally derived behavior. To be honest it's almost impossible to imagine what a being "without emotions" would be like. To make the obvious comparison, Data was programmed by his father to possess something like curiosity and desire to learn and experience, otherwise he would never have entered starfleet to begin with, or wondered what it was like to experience emotion. Tatsuya on the other hand, has no programming other than protecting his sister. He should be almost completely inert, not the driven and manipulative mastermind portrayed in the show. Of course, while that might be an interesting premise here it's only used for two things: 1) To explain why he's a super unflappable badass who never loses his cool 2) To occasionally have Miyuki muse on how it's so tragic he can never love  except for her
Sindai fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Jun 10, 2014 |
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Jun 10, 2014 01:41
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I found some Mahouka wall scrolls. I'm gonna get one with Mayuki and Tatsuya. They also have one featuring Mayumi, one with Mizuki, and two inexplicably ecchi Miyukis.
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Jun 10, 2014 09:42
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I for one can't believe anyone would treat this show as some kind of fetishistic exercise.
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Jun 10, 2014 10:47
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Harime Nui posted:I for one can't believe anyone would treat this show as some kind of fetishistic exercise. Pssh, fans taking something that is supposed to be light-hearted and fun and being creepy about it. Just like touhou.
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Jun 10, 2014 14:40
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Serious Frolicking posted:Pssh, fans taking something that is supposed to be light-hearted and fun and being creepy about it. Just like touhou. It's not ecchi merchandise existing confusing me, it's that only two of the wall scrolls are and the rest are normal. WickedHate fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Jun 10, 2014 |
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Jun 10, 2014 14:46
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WickedHate posted:I found some Mahouka wall scrolls. I'm gonna get one with Mayuki and Tatsuya. They also have one featuring Mayumi, one with Mizuki, and two inexplicably ecchi Miyukis. Wow, I knew you liked this show but didn't know you liked it that much. Did you mean Mayumi or Miyuki in the second sentence? Couldn't you have at least gotten one with some of the more tolerable/okay characters, like Erika and that big dude who healed that terrorist's bloody stump*? I'm assuming the latter didn't exist but was there one with the former? *I think he's the only character so far to show anything resembling compassion. The president doesn't count, because she's more or less "whitesplaining" away the problems of the disenfranchised underclass and arguably even worse than the people who flat out use this show's version of racial slurs. Serious Frolicking posted:Pssh, fans taking something that is supposed to be light-hearted and fun and being creepy about it. Just like touhou. Is this show even supposed to be light-hearted and fun, though? It seems like the author is trying to make a bunch of political statements through his voice (Tatsuya) and that the show takes itself pretty seriously.
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Jun 10, 2014 17:10
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Ytlaya posted:Wow, I knew you liked this show but didn't know you liked it that much. Did you mean Mayumi or Miyuki in the second sentence? Couldn't you have at least gotten one with some of the more tolerable/okay characters, like Erika and that big dude who healed that terrorist's bloody stump*? I'm assuming the latter didn't exist but was there one with the former? The ones I mentioned were the only variations I saw, and collectively Tatsuya and Miyuki are my favorite characters, so the scroll with both of them was the natural pick. (Though Erika, Leo, Mizuki and Mikihiko are all really cool too and I'd love to get one that had a cast shot or something)
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Jun 10, 2014 17:23
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WickedHate posted:I found some Mahouka wall scrolls. I'm gonna get one with Mayuki and Tatsuya. They also have one featuring Mayumi, one with Mizuki, and two inexplicably ecchi Miyukis.
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Jun 10, 2014 19:26
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Man I missed this thread. Don't have the time to start catching up on book criticism but here's some stuff you have to look forward to: Tatsuya and co win the magic olympics, because tatsuya has to hold back his full powers he actually struggles slightly at one point. Turns out the chinese and japanese are still technically at war. Tatsuya murders the chinese as predicted. What I didn't predict is that he is a really sadistic fucker about it. It's really gonna be great. A disclaimer that "the people places etc in these stories are not related to real life" Book 5 is short stories cause the guy wanted to write his own filler First up is the swimsuit episode. One of Miyuki's friends asks Miyuki if she's actually in love with Tatsuya as a man. Turns out he saved her life so she wants him to have her everything, but no she totes isn't in love with her. The other friend asks Tatsuya out so he tells her he's an automaton w/no emotions. She takes it well. Secondly we get the gripping story of one of the people in the public moral committee and how he is a bodyguard like the rest of his family. He protects some girl for the fun of it. Once she's safe the book then tells us that she's the new boss of the chinese criminals. This is because why use subtle hints when they crop up again when you can just blow your load in an earlier book. Third is a quickie about how the half british girl we meet for like two paragraphs will have to go to switzerland to study. I am not at all invested in this character Fourth is the slightly homoerotic story about George and the other guy from third high and how they really want to beat Tatsuya after he owned them in the magic olympic finals. The other guy is also in love with miyuki and his 10 year old sister is in love with george (unrequited of course, but there's still a lolicon joke at one point) These books are poo poo. When I read a particularly poo poo bit (usually revolving around Tatsuya lording it over mere mortals) I just get the goofiest grin on my face. The audience for this is loving stupid. E: Mods please change my username to "Inexplicably ecchi Miyuki" E2: I bet you anything this book series gets licensed
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Jun 10, 2014 22:30
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Namtab posted:Man I missed this thread. Ahaha, this reminds me of that objectivist reading of The Incredibles, but unlike that reading.....
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Jun 10, 2014 22:32
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Nationalist stuff: China and Japan are still legally at war. Chinatown is literally all chinese spies except for one building which is the japanese military monitoring the ocean.
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Jun 10, 2014 22:36
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Namtab posted:Nationalist stuff: China and Japan are still legally at war. Chinatown is literally all chinese spies except for one building which is the japanese military monitoring the ocean. So basically your answer to my "Is there a single Chinese person that isn't portrayed as either evil or stupid" is "No"? WickedHate - If it really turns out that there isn't a single decent Chinese character in this series, will you at least admit that it is really right-wing and nationalist? While in reality it would still be even if that weren't the case, I think that even you would concede the point if that were the case.
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Jun 11, 2014 01:26
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Ytlaya posted:WickedHate - If it really turns out that there isn't a single decent Chinese character in this series, will you at least admit that it is really right-wing and nationalist? While in reality it would still be even if that weren't the case, I think that even you would concede the point if that were the case. I think it'd be pretty racist and xenophobic of it, yeah.
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Jun 11, 2014 02:51
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So I was feeling uneasy because I hadn't watched the most recent 3 episodes, thinking to myself "maybe it becomes a little less dull/bad and I've been unfair." Nope, it pretty much stays just as dull. I would at least understand the appeal if this show had a lot of cool fight scenes, but there's been an average of like one every 3 episodes so far. I also like how sword dude was commenting on Tatsuya's "bloodthirstiness", serving as further evidence that Tatsuya is emotionless except for every single emotion that could possibly be construed as "badass*". I'm hoping that the scene at the end of episode 10 means that a romance is about to blossom between Tatsuya and Mikihiko. Is it possible that Tatsuya serves a sort of "shoujo love interest" role that helps give this series is appeal to women as well as men? It's obvious that it has the harem/imouto and Gary Stu stuff there to appeal to guys, but I've been trying to figure out why it has rated high among women as well. There's gotta be some reason. *That is, a 12 year old's idea of what "badass" is
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Jun 11, 2014 04:44
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Ytlaya posted:I'm hoping that the scene at the end of episode 10 means that a romance is about to blossom between Tatsuya and Mikihiko. I held off on saying so but I BOLed when Tatsuya steps out of the shadows opposite Mikihiko and romantic music started playing.
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Jun 11, 2014 04:49
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Ytlaya posted:Is it possible that Tatsuya serves a sort of "shoujo love interest" role that helps give this series is appeal to women as well as men? It's obvious that it has the harem/imouto and Gary Stu stuff there to appeal to guys, but I've been trying to figure out why it has rated high among women as well. There's gotta be some reason. It's a good show. Fans aren't necessarily just fans for a few carefully constructed appeal points.
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Jun 11, 2014 04:49
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