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I think it's hilarious to look at the leadership of SD. Everyone beneath Åkesson is seriously insane, yet Åkesson (I think) is this brilliantly stoic Reinfeldt-esque  character. I actually think he's a very good leader, even if I despise everything about the party.
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Sep 4, 2014 05:46
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So stoic  
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Sep 4, 2014 06:04
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widunder posted:I think it's hilarious to look at the leadership of SD. Everyone beneath Åkesson is seriously insane, yet Åkesson (I think) is this brilliantly stoic Reinfeldt-esque One thing is for sure, they wouldn't have gotten this far without him. He's as central to SD as Anders Borg and Reinfeldt are to Nya M.
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Sep 4, 2014 06:15
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Hevo posted:Is it discrimination to prioritize integration over immigration? Is it discrimination to cut down immigration? Please, I am genuinely curious, feel free to enlighten me. Nooooooooo, not really. This is not what SD want's off course. But that is the whole point of the SD's party's whole "new image" kinda thing. First, let's have a history lesson. This is reccomended reading and it's full of all kinds of fun stuff: http://expo.se/www/download/sds_vitbok_Expo_2_2014.pdf 1993: Outside of Gudrun schymans first of May speech the leader of the SD youth organisation is found and arrested with a live hand grenade. 1997: Lars Emanuelsson, then parti organiser is convicted of extortion of a fellow party member. Said pushed him into a car using a baseball bat and forced him to sign a debt letter for 10,000 kr. The then party chairman commented "This a nothing that should'nt affect Lars political future". 1999. The party looked over it's rules and decided that kicking out anyone who came to Sweden after 1970 is a bad idea. 1999: Franz Schönhuber,ex Waffen SS visits the party Also a lot of connections to different white power movements both within Sweden and outside, Front national and anti semites. Nope, not racist. Off course SD reformed! And now they are just "against multiculturalism and "what about the cost of the Swedish tax payer?" and "They are all religious extremists/terrorists/wife beaters" etc etc... You know, relatively clean arguments. Compared to hand grenades and down with race mixing at least. Reminds me of the southern strategy for the Republicans: Lee Atwater: posted:"You start out in 1954 by saying, "friend of the family, friend of the family, friend of the family." By 1968 you can't say "friend of the family" — that hurts you. Backfires. So you say stuff like forced busing, states' rights and all that stuff. You're getting so abstract now [that] you're talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you're talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is [that] blacks get hurt worse than whites. And subconsciously maybe that is part of it. I'm not saying that. But I'm saying that if it is getting that abstract, and that coded, that we are doing away with the racial problem one way or the other. You follow me — because obviously sitting around saying, "We want to cut this," is much more abstract than even the busing thing, and a hell of a lot more abstract than "friend of the family, friend of the family." quote:I do not see the racist part in wanting to help these people in a more efficient manner. To shorten the queues to quicken the asylum process. To integrate those who have already arrived, and who are living under utterly poor conditions in ghettos and suburbs around the country. quote:To actually help them where they need our help the most: in their own countries. quote:I am frankly disgusted when I hear serious and intelligent seasoned politicians such as Löfvén, Hägglund, and Reinfeldt refer to their, the current, immigration policy as humane. quote:but can we please drop this ridiculous notion that the Sweden Democrats is a racist party, and that all – every single one – of its party members are racists? To retort, no, not every single person in who votes for SD is a racist, neither 100% party top or supporters. This is however a useless thing to say, i can just as well say "Not everyone in Moderaterna are for selling our welfare" and it would be equally true, i have no "proof" that this is true for EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE PARTY. However, just looking at what the party does tells you a lot what they and their supporters stand for. SD's new image is a smoke screen. It's nothing more then a thin facade that is digestible enough that we can't easily swat it away by pointing at their SS symbols. They want to be accepted and taken seriously, as the racist party that doesn't poo poo on the carpet, and it that they have been pretty successful. SD IS STILL A RACIST PARTY. It origins are connected to the white power movement. SD's politicians horrendous racist opinions come out daily(Oh, and the fact that they then "leave" SD does not make up for this) SD supporters threatens anyone who criticizes them by doxxing them and threatening them with gang rape. Their politics focus almost solely on getting rid of immigrants (NOT integration: stopping immigration, grants for returning home, stop them wasting OUR money etc etc). So can we please stop pretending that SD is nothing more then a racist party? Here, read this site, just read one full page and come back and tell me that SD is not a racist party: http://www.interasistmen.se/ Hey, just to be clear, i think that integration is an important issue to. SD is not the party to deal with this. Fixing integration will probably end up costing more money in the short term then it currently does, something SD is 100% against. Their very presence is killing any debate and willingness to deal with the issue, everyone is too afraid to be associated with their terrible terrible politics. On another note: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmfdB1qL1QA&t=204s
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Sep 4, 2014 08:22
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SD is a horrible joke of a political party but they appear to be the only ones talking about immigration at all. Tearing down the SD platform is easy. We need some other parties to take immigration issues seriously without being stupid dumbfuck racists, or else the issue will always be falsely classified as an unimportant issue that only unenlightened racist proles care about. I'm moving to Malmö from Texas so I get a lot of chuckles from what passes for "crisis" in Sweden. Have kids attending integrated schools, provide resources and job training for adult immigrants in their native languages (this is easy when 80% of your immigrants speak the same native tongue), try organizing "a day in the life of ___" cultural exchange festivals. Most importantly, build housing for The city college I attend in Dallas has a higher percentage of Hispanics than the city's population does as a whole and they all speak fluent English and enjoy all the same cultural influences as any other member of Western/American society. In Texas that means that yes, they love guns and they go to church alot, along with watching stupid YouTube clips and Lil Wayne and Metallica and Miley Cyrus. Worries about integration are usually highly overexaggerated, but for God's sake don't ignore them. Aside from all that, I said I get a chuckle from the Swedish "immigration crisis" because having spent some time in Malmö, I think it's an incredible city and the influx of new people and ideas will only serve to catapult economic and cultural growth there in the coming decades. I drunkenly wandered around Rosengård at night. It is not scary. Not at all. American slums put Rosengård to shame. Sweden's problems are miniscule and easily tackled if the people are willing to talk earnestly about them. It's just a bit dumbfounding for me to see race relations are better in "infamously racist" Texas than they are in Sweden. If nobody but SD will admit that there are challenges, then a productive dialogue can't happen. Sweden's a big country and an intelligent one, we'll figure it out. Randandal fucked around with this message at 09:53 on Sep 4, 2014 |
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Sep 4, 2014 09:33
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http://www.di.se/artiklar/2014/9/4/kontroversiell-miljopartist-avgar/ guys, it's the banking conspiracy too
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Sep 4, 2014 14:03
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Saw that FI might just make it into the Riksdag, accordingly the DI comment field is a suitably entertaining read: http://www.di.se/artiklar/2014/9/4/matning-fi-kommer-in/?allakommentarer=&flik=senaste quote:Skrämmande att så många hyllar marxismen, de flesta partier tycks hylla folkmord så länge de sker i någon av sina egna hyllade ideologiers namn; socialism, marxism, kommunism och islamism. http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svenskarnas_parti <--SvP quote:Hellre skånepartiet quote:Sovjetunionen ville ha alltmer kvinnor som jobbade som männen. Vad hände? Inte särskilt framgångsrikt. Sovjetunionen gick under quote:Gudrun har aktivt gett sitt stöd för Che Guevara aka Slaktaren från La Cabaña, som under sin tid på Kuba ansvarade för utrotning av 100.000 oliktänkande, främst anitkommunister och HBTQ personer. Varför får hon inte förklara det i dag? quote:Känslomänniskor utan förmåga till logiskt tänkande röstar så gott som alltid på ett vänsterparti. Fi är ett extremt parti utan förmåga att leda landet. De består av kvinnor med välsmorda munläder och kommunistiska idéer om hur samhället skall utformas.  - True Entrepreneur / "Småföretagare" (possibly the most obnoxious opinion-havers)To be fair there's a surprisingly large amount of positive comments too, for an open and anonymous internet comment field. Pimpmust fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Sep 4, 2014 |
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Sep 4, 2014 17:50
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I'd be the happiest camper ever if we could somehow avoid having MP in a new government, but that's not gonna happen. I really despise them, those loving strange watermelons. Green on the outside, blue on the inside. Striking deals with the blues that fucks over workers rights, also helping them push through friskolereformen. Gonna vote V either way. Nidhg00670000 fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Sep 6, 2014 |
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Sep 5, 2014 20:57
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Hevo posted:For the record I should have made it clear that I in near unto no way sympathize with SD (due to there being questions other than immigration), or regard it highly. It is simply the terms racism and racist that has been gnawing at the back of my mind for quite some time, and the fact that they may be used wrongly. Islamophobic/douchebaggy may be the better word to use for those discriminating Muslims, seeing as though Muslims in no way could be branded a race. European post-fascist parties in the wake of Front national substitute ethnicity and religious affiliation for race, but still peddle the same kind of prejudice. I agree that islamophobia is a more accurate description, but islamophobes argue that a certain set of very negative, unchangeable traits apply to a group of people from a wildly different set of countries and backgrounds, and I don't see how that's so different from claiming that people from africa are fundamentally flawed. Chuck N. Awe fucked around with this message at 08:02 on Sep 6, 2014 |
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Sep 6, 2014 07:58
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Nidhg00670000 posted:I'd be the happiest camper ever if we could somehow avoid having MP in a new government, but that's not gonna happen. If Femenist Initiative stand close to getting into parliament come election weekend my vote goes to them. It will be the only way to secure a majority government led by the Social Democrats. And besides what you may think of them the party is run by a former V leader who would never let Reinfeldt continue to lead.
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Sep 6, 2014 13:35
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Pimpmust posted:
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Sep 6, 2014 17:40
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Bostadsbristen – en kassako värd miljarderquote:Samtidigt har ansvaret för att lösa bostadsbristen förskjutits från en statlig/kommunal fråga till något marknaden förväntas lösa. Att byggandet ändå går trögt skylls på krångliga regler och långsam administration. Men är det så enkelt? This feels like a good summary on why the housing situation won't get solved anytime soon. It's specifically about Gothenburg but surely it applies to most of Sweden, no?
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Sep 7, 2014 15:19
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basbas posted:Bostadsbristen – en kassako värd miljarder It sure does, any municipality that has a college facility (or other big growth enablers) are facing the exact same problems when it comes to housing. Our municipality is slightly better prepared due to having a well managed and fairly large housing company owned by the municipality but even that doesn't do more than put a dent into the issue. The main problem is that renting out isn't profitable enough in comparison to condos which skews the market away from long term investments.
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Sep 7, 2014 16:31
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The housing/construction bubble is pretty drat scary, but I'm not sure if there's much to compare to (and unlike what many hopefuls think, that's NOT a good thing). Usually these bubbles don't have the construction part be so... restrained, do they? We aren't building millions of Mac Mansions here, real demand be damned, but rather the opposite. The result being that all of society ends up paying the Bubble-Fee yearly with wildly inflating prices, and a loan/banking sector that's all out of whack. No bubble lasts forever and prices can't keep going up way beyond inflation either, so question is what's gonna break first and if it's gonna be Super Bad or Mega Bad. Way too many people have millions in loans are entirely dependent on low-low interest rates, yet people are more distracted by the immigration issue (which is more of a red herring in comparison). Politicians either don't dare touch it, or have no clue at all for how to unravel the mess without causing an implosion. It's like watching a balloon grow, but you don't know if it's filling up with harmless Nitrogen or highly flammable Helium gas 
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Sep 7, 2014 18:07
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[Edit:] Good job on the OP, too!Postorder Trollet89 posted:If Femenist Initiative stand close to getting into parliament come election weekend my vote goes to them. It will be the only way to secure a majority government led by the Social Democrats. And besides what you may think of them the party is run by a former V leader who would never let Reinfeldt continue to lead. I'm one of those people who voted for Fi in the EU election and am now on the fence between V and Fi. Isn't there also a risk that more small parties make it more difficult to negotiate a working government? I also have a friend who is more into party politics than me (actually reads party programmes), and he says Fi, a part from Gudrun obviously, is quite liberal on a lot of issues. Basically identity politics with liberal economic policies for the middle class, as I interpreted it. But I was at one of those house partys with Schyman and she was pretty clear about class being a top issue for them. Then there's that latest Sifo poll, even though it may not be that certain, showing the gap between the blocks as halved and giving me flashbacks from last election.  Pimpmust posted:The housing/construction bubble is pretty drat scary, but I'm not sure if there's much to compare to (and unlike what many hopefuls think, that's NOT a good thing). Usually these bubbles don't have the construction part be so... restrained, do they? We aren't building millions of Mac Mansions here, real demand be damned, but rather the opposite. The result being that all of society ends up paying the Bubble-Fee yearly with wildly inflating prices, and a loan/banking sector that's all out of whack. What's the deal with Alliansen saying "as many people as possible should own their housing" anyway? What is the ideological reasoning behind that? I could get wanting to sell Allmännyttan to private property owners for renting, but actively working towards getting more people indebted? Captain Scandinaiva fucked around with this message at 19:02 on Sep 7, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 18:58
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White Rock posted:Nooooooooo, not really. This is not what SD want's off course. But that is the whole point of the SD's party's whole "new image" kinda thing. Cause EXPO is a completely impartial agency that don't consist of crazy left-wing extremists? Also financed by LO. Google Tobias Hubinette as one example? Also, you can apply the exact same approach on V. The same party that consistently have had party members advocating violence as a tool in politics. Sofar this year they have been forced to expel a number of party members. White Rock posted:SD's new image is a smoke screen. It's nothing more then a thin facade that is digestible enough that we can't easily swat it away by pointing at their SS symbols. They want to be accepted and taken seriously, as the racist party that doesn't poo poo on the carpet, and it that they have been pretty successful. You believe in space lizards as well? It is almost like you think that SD will start wearing uniforms and saying heil hitler if they become the majority? The hardcore racists in SvP and Nationaldemokraterna. White Rock posted:Here, read this site, just read one full page and come back and tell me that SD is not a racist party: Kawa Zolfagary is hardly an impartial observer. White Rock posted:Hey, just to be clear, i think that integration is an important issue to. SD is not the party to deal with this. Fixing integration will probably end up costing more money in the short term then it currently does, something SD is 100% against. Their very presence is killing any debate and willingness to deal with the issue, everyone is too afraid to be associated with their terrible terrible politics. Pretty much, yes. Hilariously, SD integration fixes are pretty bad and are heavily reliant on wishful thinking and severely decreasing the amount of immigrants. But, yeah, SD is locking down the whole immigration/integration debate since no party dares to approach that area. I personally blame M for the whole situation, since they should have made a deal with S 4 years ago about about sensible immigration politics and effectively locked out SD and MP. Also, this was refused as a commercial for SD in DN and multiple other newspapers. Please tell me where the racism is here? 
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Sep 7, 2014 19:10
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Cardiac posted:You believe in space lizards as well? It is almost like you think that SD will start wearing uniforms and saying heil hitler if they become the majority? Softcore racism is bad enough.
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Sep 7, 2014 19:49
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Cardiac posted:
Considering that SD was part of the ye olde skinhead brigade about twenty/twentyfive years ago I wouldn't put it past them to obfuscate their true reasons. Besides, they've already shown themselves a loving pack of incompetent racist dipshits (not ALL of them obviously, just the people who are actual racist dipshits) already so do you REALLY want people like that in the government pulling strings?
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Sep 7, 2014 20:16
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Surprise surprise, 1/3 of SD candidates this election who have an open Facebook page are openly supporting pages that are openly nazi or racist, and officially "blacklisted" by SD leadership in the latest white-washing of the party's racist history. But who am I to say that SD is a racist party? That would be so unfair of me, to judge a party by its candidates. http://mobil.dn.se/valet-2014/manga-sd-kandidater-gillar-rasistsidor/
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Sep 7, 2014 21:32
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Cardiac posted:Things  You're obviously not though, don't worry.Who would be an impartial observer? What happens when any SD member, from the lowest rank to member of parliament, get a hold of alcohol or a twitter account have been widely publicized by all major blue papers, not just EXPO. And interasistmen have most of their posts directly sourced to statements and photos, it's not like it's thinly veiled stuff. Cardiac posted:I personally blame M for the whole situation, since they should have made a deal with S 4 years ago about about sensible immigration politics and effectively locked out SD and MP. What would be more sensible immigration policies? I also blame M, but for different reasons. Cardiac posted:Also, this was refused as a commercial for SD in DN and multiple other newspapers. Please tell me where the racism is here? GIS of that only gives me links to Avpixlat and I can't find any statements by the newspapers there, so I have no idea why they refused this. Maybe they, as liberal and socialist-leaning papers see SD as a neo-fascist party and don't want to publish any ads related to SD's strongest card, immigration? It's not like they have an obligation to give everyone equal space. Joke answer: The racism is that our neighbours, along with the rest of Europe, barely accept any asylum seekers at all, while millions are fleeing Syria and Iraq, many of them christians even.
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Sep 7, 2014 21:46
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Cardiac posted:
Cardiac posted:You believe in space lizards as well? It is almost like you think that SD will start wearing uniforms and saying heil hitler if they become the majority? Cardiac posted:Also, you can apply the exact same approach on V. The same party that consistently have had party members advocating violence as a tool in politics. So far this year they have been forced to expel a number of party members. Cardiac posted:Also, this was refused as a commercial for SD in DN and multiple other newspapers. Please tell me where the racism is here? Seems pretty tame compared to most SD ads that got banned... Would like to see any kind of independent source that it isn't totally fabricated story? Maybe don't believe everything(read: nothing) you read on avpixlat, a racist site in cahoots with SD (And you think expo is impartial). Anyway for one thing that graph is only showing the number of applicants, not the number of accepted while the title is "Asyl Mottagning". Kinda misleading / poorly designed. Why are you so hellbent on defending a party full of xenophobic racists? Again, SD is a party with a party line full of racists, with a support base full of racists, and with political suggestions that are xenophobic and that doesn't actually work. Their presence inside the parliament is a loving disgrace. Why are you defending any of it? Is immigration just so loving important no matter the cost? White Rock fucked around with this message at 08:44 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 7, 2014 22:02
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Linus Bylund is one of the four top dudes in SD, and sometimes described as the right hand man of Åkesson. This was his first thought in response to Utøya, before it became known that the assailant was, in fact, not a muslim (or "immigrant" at all).quote:Nästa jävel som ojar sig om hur synd det är om alla snälla muslimer när det ligger blödande norrmän på gatan kommer avföljas Jonas Åkerlund, (still) deputy leader of SD, had this to say concerning immigrants back in 2002: quote:Skicka hem åtminstone en halv miljon av de värsta parasiterna Mattias Karlsson is one of the minds behind the SD election manifesto in 2006 and engineer of the principal program that SD still follows concering PR. From his FB page, after the election to the european parlament and the success of among others Front national in France. quote:Den politiska huvudkonflikten står inte längre mellan höger och vänster [...] utan mellan värdekonservativa patrioter och kosmopolitiska kulturradikaler. Den stora avgörande striden om vår civilisations, våra kulturers och våra nationers överlevnad har gått in i en ny, mer intensiv och mer avgörande fas I don't like to invoke  , but that is straight up nazi rethoric what with the "fight for the survival of our culture and civilisation". The use of "kosmopolitiska" is especially troubling, since nazi ideology frequently claimed that [the jews] blurred concrete identities, tore down established boundaries and eliminated cultural and racial distinctions by espousing a universal cosmopolitanism.Hello, Space Lizards!
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Sep 7, 2014 22:19
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I'm not a racist and the only outspoken not-racist party is SD. I should vote for them, right?
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Sep 7, 2014 22:32
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Surprise surprise, SD is not a racist party, which is why their #1 candidate for Stockholm writes anonymously on avpixlat that Arabs are genetically more violent and so on. http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/expressen-avslojar/har-ar-sd-toppens-inlagg-pa-hatsajten/ He also cooperated with racist homepages while he worked for the SD headquarters, to plant propaganda articles in media to suit the party's needs and to incite hate speech against immigrants. But noooo, let's not talk about SD as a structurally racist party, because of some bullshit reason. lilljonas fucked around with this message at 07:34 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 07:26
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I'm still torn, MP is the party that talks environment, which could lead to it actually being a policy issue that's given priority, but at the same time they really want to shut down nuclear reactors, which I'm really against. S is most likely pro-nuclear but too afraid to say so openly. If Fp wasn't alliansen and they stopped talking about grades for one second they might be of interest, but as it stands now, I can't vote for them. V is also very anti-nuclear, and apparently so is Fi. I guess it's Sossarna for me? Anyone got any ideas? And yeah, SD is a very racist party, it's a hypocritical party, it's a party run by one clever man and a bunch of morons that time and time again gently caress up, yet they still get 10% of the vote. Immigration in itself isn't a problem, but integration or just general globalization/neo-liberalism/capitalism is loving up somewhat, or is it all just framing and then people (including me, I supposed) buying into it like good little simpletons?
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Sep 8, 2014 09:39
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I don't get why people think Åkesson is clever? He's a politician doing politician stuff, mediocrely. That is, when he's not downright stupid, last segment on BBC Hardtalk: "Immigrants are, in general, a little bit more criminal than Swedes and that's a fact. You can see it specially in violence and rape and so on."
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Sep 8, 2014 10:21
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nagel posted:And yeah, SD is a very racist party, it's a hypocritical party, it's a party run by one clever man and a bunch of morons that time and time again gently caress up, yet they still get 10% of the vote. Immigration in itself isn't a problem, but integration or just general globalization/neo-liberalism/capitalism is loving up somewhat, or is it all just framing and then people (including me, I supposed) buying into it like good little simpletons? By pretending to be outside the system (yet voting for Alliansen 80% of the time) you can frame yourself as the outsider that challenges the status quo and traditional politics. SD combines that with giving very simple answers ("if we stop immigration everyone will get tons of money for everything, and everybody wins!") which will never be tried and thereby they will never have to be questioned when their simple idea fails to deliver. That alone is enough to earn a lot of votes from generally low-educated low-information voters who think that they have good ideas that those gosh darned intellectuals in the cities just are too pompous to listen to. It doesn't get better when the last decades of market economy (both under S and Alliansen) more clearly divided our society into winners and losers, with increasing income divide, decreasing support for the financially and socially weakest etc. It is simple (and more self-flattering) to imagine that the reason why you are being shat upon by society as a low-income, low-educated rural voter is because of those immigrants taking your jobs and resources. It is harder to face the truth that what you have to offer is being valued less and less on the competative international market, and there are fewer and fewer mechanisms to prop you up if you are in this group. Add the gender issues of a rural Sweden where young women are increasingly leaving the villages to move into the cities for education and careers, while young men are more often staying, and you get all kinds of backlash against the modern international society. There are off course a ton of other issues going on as well, but it's not a mystery that a value-conservative xenophobic party like SD are most successful among rural young men, and that there is a clear misogynist and anti-intellectual undertone below the more obvious racist agenda. Rural boys love that poo poo, and SD's got their vote. lilljonas fucked around with this message at 10:27 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 10:25
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On the other hand, in 2010 the highest rates for SD came from Skåne-Blekinge-Malmö. Not exactly the most rural parts of the country. It's a bit too easy to sit back and blame contry bumpkins for the rise of the
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Sep 8, 2014 11:09
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nagel posted:I'm still torn, MP is the party that talks environment, which could lead to it actually being a policy issue that's given priority, but at the same time they really want to shut down nuclear reactors, which I'm really against. S is most likely pro-nuclear but too afraid to say so openly. If Fp wasn't alliansen and they stopped talking about grades for one second they might be of interest, but as it stands now, I can't vote for them. V is also very anti-nuclear, and apparently so is Fi. That and praying basically. As long as C and MP stay relevant nuclear power is going nowhere in this country.
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Sep 8, 2014 11:23
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Åkesson had all of 0 listeners when he went to rural Sweden up north, so ruralness has less to do with it short of cases where the municipalities decide to dump all asylum seekers in a few backwater villages to get them out of the way/collect money from the state for their "trouble". Education and income levels (both connected to the sort of job markets most exposed to competition with immigrants/the EU) is the primary drivers of SD support and why its mostly poorly educated white men who support SD.
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Sep 8, 2014 12:05
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nagel posted:I'm still torn, MP is the party that talks environment, which could lead to it actually being a policy issue that's given priority, but at the same time they really want to shut down nuclear reactors, which I'm really against. S is most likely pro-nuclear but too afraid to say so openly. If Fp wasn't alliansen and they stopped talking about grades for one second they might be of interest, but as it stands now, I can't vote for them. V is also very anti-nuclear, and apparently so is Fi. S are not very good at all the other environmental issues, which I assume also matter to you? Why is the question of nuclear energy so important to you?  IDK, join MP or FP and work from the inside to influence the party in a different direction? Folkrörelse and all that. lilljonas posted:It doesn't get better when the last decades of market economy (both under S and Alliansen) more clearly divided our society into winners and losers, with increasing income divide, decreasing support for the financially and socially weakest etc. It is simple (and more self-flattering) to imagine that the reason why you are being shat upon by society as a low-income, low-educated rural voter is because of those immigrants taking your jobs and resources. It is harder to face the truth that what you have to offer is being valued less and less on the competative international market, and there are fewer and fewer mechanisms to prop you up if you are in this group. Nidhg00670000 posted:On the other hand, in 2010 the highest rates for SD came from Skåne-Blekinge-Malmö. Not exactly the most rural parts of the country. It's a bit too easy to sit back and blame contry bumpkins for the rise of the Yes, and like someone else said, most of Norrland is very left-leaning. Still, the average SD voters are young men living outside the major cities, has no higher education and they are unemployed or on sick leave to higher degree than the average voter. They seem to be concentrated to smaller towns, but not so much the countryside, in the south. Talk about integration problem. It worries me, because while it's easy to laugh at their general incompetence, they are not going away. The various scandals SD has been involved in don't decrease their support in the short term. If anything, it increases it. These people need to somehow be made to feel like they are a part of society again. But no party has managed to do that yet. Sometimes it feels like the situation is hosed beyond repair. The divide in incomes and possibilities between different groups in society increases> More people become apathetic and ignorant of politics> People become more susceptible to populist arguments> Less votes for parties like V, who want to change economic policy> More votes for parties like SD, who work to uphold said economic policy.
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Sep 8, 2014 12:15
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I don't think this portraying rural people as racist and uneducated is really helping tbh. Seems more like ones own prejudices/dislikes against "the other" bleeding trough and it's more likely to alienate and drive said people to where you don't want them to go. "Hey you stupid redneck gently caress, don't vote SD like your kind tends to ok?"
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Sep 8, 2014 12:25
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Nidhg00670000 posted:On the other hand, in 2010 the highest rates for SD came from Skåne-Blekinge-Malmö. Not exactly the most rural parts of the country. It's a bit too easy to sit back and blame contry bumpkins for the rise of the In Skåne, SD has clearly more voters in the countryside than in the larger cities, and in the larger cities they have more voters where there is a larger disenfranchised working class. Believe me, I work in a small town where every surrounding voting sector had a SD majority in the EU election. It doesn't explain everything, but it's not a coincidence that Landskrona has more SD voters than Lund. E: so to adjust my argument a little: I would say that SD is a party that appeals to those who feel that they are on the losing side of an international competitive free market and the redistribution of power from groups who have traditionally been priviledged (a.k.a white undereducated men), and lack a developed analysis that can explain to them why they feel they are on the losing side. The North can provide a competing analysis (i.e. acknowledging market forces rather than immigration as a driving force in society) for this phenomenon through its history of both strong parties on the left and unions, which is one reason why SD has made less progress there, along with the fact that SD was founded in Skåne and has most of its networks and logistics here, which affects the dynamics of recruitment. There. Nuanced enough? lilljonas fucked around with this message at 12:56 on Sep 8, 2014 |
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Sep 8, 2014 12:38
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His Divine Shadow posted:I don't think this portraying rural people as racist and uneducated is really helping tbh. Seems more like ones own prejudices/dislikes against "the other" bleeding trough and it's more likely to alienate and drive said people to where you don't want them to go. "Hey you stupid redneck gently caress, don't vote SD like your kind tends to ok?" The problem is that these people have no contact whatsoever with Immigrants or immigration communities. Prejudice is the expression of ignorance, nothing more. Rural communities have a tendancy to respond to cheap rethorical tricks like the ones SD pull all the time simply by being comfy in a situation where they never have to deal with the problems they claim are national.
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Sep 8, 2014 12:55
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I always jokingly assumed SD's stronghold and origin in the south was all that Danish influence. In reality I definitely agree with the posters saying that SD is effective with people who have been screwed by globalization and neoliberalism, but don't really have the political/media/academic mechanisms in place to see it from that perspective, as they've been distracted by the immigration into their areas being conflated directly with their decreased economic prosperity. Essentially it's more that they are seeing the symptoms rather than the causes of their problems.
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Sep 8, 2014 13:14
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Neeksy posted:I always jokingly assumed SD's stronghold and origin in the south was all that Danish influence. Exactly. And if you are a low income earner or have low income earners in your family, chances are that you have personally witnessed the result of the dismantling of the public support structures, be it worse compensation for people unable to work because of illness, lower unemployment benefits, healthcare and education aiming to provide services to those who can afford to pay for it themselves, and so on. So there is a grain of truth to their political agenda ("some things have gotten worse and we want to get those things back"), which makes it easy for people to agree to it. But the analysis of the reasons behind those developments are wrong on a fundamental level: it's not your fault, it's the immigrants. It's not market forces competing for your jobs, it's the immigrants. It's not the government selling out your welfare, it's the immigrants hogging it. Without understanding and adressing other forces involved in this development, they'll always be stuck with simplistic and inefficient ideas of how to change them.
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Sep 8, 2014 13:22
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I have a friend who is giving off strong vibes that she'll vote SD. When pressed on this, her prime motivator is "to prevent more gang rapes", because apparently that's just what immigrants do. She is half iranian. 
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Sep 8, 2014 15:56
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Nidhg00670000 posted:I have a friend who is giving off strong vibes that she'll vote SD. When pressed on this, her prime motivator is "to prevent more gang rapes", because apparently that's just what immigrants do. Iranians: Completely different from ARABS. Too bad the average white person can't tell the difference.  Unrelated, have some swedish culture while we wait for the next poll:    
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Sep 8, 2014 22:11
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The only immigrant group my semi-racist coworkers can't get right are "asians". We've got enough arabs and iranians that no one could get them wrong.
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Sep 8, 2014 23:04
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Postorder Trollet89 posted:The problem is that these people have no contact whatsoever with Immigrants or immigration communities. Prejudice is the expression of ignorance, nothing more. Rural communities have a tendancy to respond to cheap rethorical tricks like the ones SD pull all the time simply by being comfy in a situation where they never have to deal with the problems they claim are national. The data doesn't support it though. SD is getting votes in the most heavily populated areas except for Stockholm. In Denmark people really like to perpetuate the idea of the stupid hicks too - if not for the racists out west all us enlightened cosmopolitans could run this country the way it's supposed to. In reality the DPP is pretty drat popular in the Copenhagen suburbs while the rural west don't really care for whatever reason. Other rural areas particularly on the islands are very keen on the DPP but it's not a rural/urban divide at all. Basically urbanites have just decided that *we* are not the baddies - we can't possibly be - it must be some other idiots.
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Sep 9, 2014 09:10
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