|
Cake Attack posted:if you couldn't already see the link between liking final fantasy and learning disabilities i don't know what to tell you well i have a learning disability so...
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 22:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 23:57 |
|
|
Attitude Indicator posted:well i have a learning disability so...
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 22:58
|
|
|
Endorph posted:do you like final fantasy he's posting in this thread so no
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 22:59
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Yes there is. You literally punch him in the face in LR. You mean the guy who's name starts with a B, right? But that's not "God." The cutscene with Cid says this: quote:Raines So, I dunno about you, but my reading of this was: God > fal'Cie/humans And Cocoon fal'cie wanted to bring back God. Now the real mythology of XIII is: B's mom B Etro>Humans Lindsei>Cocoon fal'Cie Pulse>Pulse fal'Cie And the Cocoon fal'Cie were trying to bring back Lindsei who is two steps below from being God. Also God did not make both humans and fal'Cie, they were made by two separate subordinates of God. This is why I didn't understand XIII at all. And once I learned all this, I said "gently caress if I care enough to understand if the game doesn't bother to tell me any of this BS." Maybe this is a translation problem. If so, I couldn't say. I'm just going off of what my impressions were from beating XIII a couple years ago.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:04
|
|
|
Cake Attack posted:Keep in mind this was the same guy who stopped playing FFIX because of goku so... I beat ff9 before but on my completion run, I stopped when I realized it was about goku. FF13's story was more bland than the hallway simulator it was.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:07
|
|
|
NikkolasKing posted:You mean the guy who's name starts with a B, right? "God" created the Fal'cie who created the other races. It's really not complex. The entire point is basically that the Fal'cie are also basically giant robotic l'cie who are themselves at the whim of an even higher lovely god who is itself at the whim of an even higher lovely god.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:17
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:All l'cie are not targeted. It is just that any l'cie who is out in the open instead of working for the government is a l'cie from Pulse who universally have missions which involve doing nasty poo poo to Cocoon. This is also explained onscreen. ImpAtom, you're confusing "explained onscreen" as "not unnecessarily obtuse." It's also a "where there's smoke, there's fire" situation because even once you get past the unintuitive vocabulary, which by the nature of how unintuitive they are makes them harder to remember and connect to in a basic way (oh hey there psycholinguistics class, you were good for something), you have a really shorty story with lovely boring characters.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:19
|
|
|
bloodychill posted:ImpAtom, you're confusing "explained onscreen" as "not unnecessarily obtuse." It's also a "where there's smoke, there's fire" situation because even once you get past the unintuitive vocabulary, which by the nature of how unintuitive they are makes them harder to remember and connect to in a basic way (oh hey there psycholinguistics class, you were good for something), you have a really shorty story with lovely boring characters. FFXIII's plot is not really obtuse though. I mean the core plot is really simple with the only real bullshit being the Etro stuff at the end which is complete nonsense. The idea that the words are 'unintuitive' doesn't actually make sense. People don't have trouble remembering made-up fantasy words in any other form of fiction.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:20
|
|
|
Yeah, XIII's plot is easy to follow and I was never really confused by anything except the ending which was explained in the sequel, so whatever. It's not like it's the most confusing ending an FF game has had. The story's not necessarily good or complex, but hard to follow it is not.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:21
|
|
|
I still am amazed that, he-who-shall-remain-nameless tried to defend that bullshit, with poo poo like "Well, if you read the ciphered latin on Odin's shield  how can none of you know that the oval thing behind Orphan that looks like background decoration is Etro's literal gate blah blah".
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:23
|
|
|
Pesky Splinter posted:I still am amazed that, he-who-shall-remain-nameless tried to defend that bullshit, with poo poo like "Well, if you read the ciphered latin on Odin's shield Let us not drudge up old demons, they're dead for a reason.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:25
|
|
|
The story itself isn't hard to follow, but it's the constant scene changing that makes it hard to really immerse before the scene editor decides he's bored and switches, but that's probably an entirely different issue. Also, save points almost every 5 minutes. Why.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:25
|
|
|
ZenMasterBullshit posted:Let us not drudge up old demons, they're dead for a reason. As always, old villains must return for the sequel.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:26
|
|
|
Pesky Splinter posted:I still am amazed that, he-who-shall-remain-nameless tried to defend that bullshit, with poo poo like "Well, if you read the ciphered latin on Odin's shield Yeah, no that is all bullshit. There's no excusing the ending which is straight-up bad but would probably be boring-but-coherent if you removed the Etro bullshit and just went with THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP or whatever. Tae posted:Also, save points almost every 5 minutes. Why. Because they hadn't yet realized that save-anywhere was an option, basically.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:26
|
|
|
Thankfully My Hands is the ending credits theme so everything was redeemed thanks to Leona Lewis.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:27
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Yeah, no that is all bullshit. There's no excusing the ending which is straight-up bad but would probably be boring-but-coherent if you removed the Etro bullshit and just went with THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP or whatever. That's actually what I thought it was, first time through. Which is why I was confused when everyone started talking about Etro this and that in the thread. Beef Waifu posted:As always, old villains must return for the sequel.  Beef Waifu posted:Thankfully My Hands is the ending credits theme so everything was redeemed thanks to Leona Lewis. Stop it Beef Waifu, you're hurting me. I'd almost forgotten that song too 
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:30
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:FFXIII's plot is not really obtuse though. I mean the core plot is really simple with the only real bullshit being the Etro stuff at the end which is complete nonsense. If you didn't catch what someone earlier was getting at with the "Firebolt" thing and the thematic vocabulary used in FF8 and other games, I don't know what to tell you except you are being purposely obtuse to defend a crappy game.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:35
|
|
|
bloodychill posted:If you didn't catch what someone earlier was getting at with the "Firebolt" thing and the thematic vocabulary used in FF8 and other games, I don't know what to tell you except you are being purposely obtuse to defend a crappy game. I did catch what they said. It's a pretty poor example. There are countless works of fiction which use words which are either completely made up or semi-obscure words which are not going to conjure images to specific people. (How many people who played FF really had a clear image of what an Eidolon was outside of the context of "summon monster.") The idea that literally the only way you can introduce concepts is by using generic words in generic ways is one which seems to exist only for people who want to complain about FFXIII and how utterly confusing and incomprehensible its three fictional made-up words are. Somehow people can read and watch Game of Thrones and hear khaleesi and not go "why didn't you just say queen?!" I mean the Firebolt example is used for a sport called Quidditch, which is played with Quaffles and Bludgers. Somehow people can remember what those things are after they're explained. It's a bad story, but it is a bad story because it is poorly told, has bad dialogue and terrible cutscene direction, among other things. Trying to stretch it to "I am unable to remember three fictional terms" comes across as trying to find more to complain about when FFXIII already has plenty as-is. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Oct 10, 2014 |
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:39
|
|
|
bloodychill posted:If you didn't catch what someone earlier was getting at with the "Firebolt" thing and the thematic vocabulary used in FF8 and other games, I don't know what to tell you except you are being purposely obtuse to defend a crappy game. When Graces F story is better then your game, something went wrong. It is worth the $10-$15 though either way, just to tool around with it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:41
|
|
|
The ending song should have been Quarter to Three.
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:51
|
|
|
Tenzarin posted:I beat ff9 before but on my completion run, I stopped when I realized it was about goku. FF13's story was more bland than the hallway simulator it was. 
|
|
#
?
Oct 10, 2014 23:56
|
|
|
Nihilarian posted:Goku is cool and I enjoyed playing as him in a Final Fantasy game. This was years before the meme thing on the forum, so suck it. Final Fantasy Z was a stupid twist.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:00
|
|
|
Tenzarin posted:This was years before the meme thing on the forum, so suck it. Final Fantasy Z was a stupid twist. edit: also it would have been more acceptable if squeenix's writers had based their plot on a meme on the something awful forums?
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:01
|
|
|
Kefka being a bad final boss is a worse twist, actually.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:02
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:I did catch what they said. It's a pretty poor example. There are countless works of fiction which use words which are either completely made up or semi-obscure words which are not going to conjure images to specific people. (How many people who played FF really had a clear image of what an Eidolon was outside of the context of "summon monster.") I'm not going to defend Harry Potter but it does use a lot of weird language. Meanwhile 13 uses 3 particularly strange terms in a world where many other locations, characters, and concepts do use familiar and thematic names. Those three terms are important and get repeated a lot so they stand out. Beyond that, the underlying story is pretty simple so those unintuitive phrases which could easily been replaced with "chosen," "demi-gods/machine gods/celestials", and just plain "monsters" come off as forced, to mask how simplistic, silly, and badly written the story is. I get your point: "cie" isn't the problem with 13. I just think it's a symptom of the more serious underlying problems it has.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:02
|
|
|
bloodychill posted:I'm not going to defend Harry Potter but it does use a lot of weird language. Meanwhile 13 uses 3 particularly strange terms in a world where many other locations, characters, and concepts do use familiar and thematic names. Those three terms are important and get repeated a lot so they stand out.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:03
|
|
|
Literally every FF final boss since Kefka has been awful, coincidence? Yes, yes it is. EDIT: Actually now that I think about it the only good final boss in FF is Chaos.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:05
|
|
|
Beef Waifu posted:Kefka being a bad final boss is a worse twist, actually. Kefka was a loving sweet final boss. Every game since 6 has been righting down the slope!
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:06
|
|
|
Kefka is actually very bad because only one part of the boss fights is good and unfortunately you need to go through four other parts before you get to it and there is an insanely boring boss song playing until you get to Kefka where it becomes Tarkus and good.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:08
|
|
|
Beef Waifu posted:Literally every FF final boss since Kefka has been awful, coincidence? Jecht was sick as hell and I liked trance kuja
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:09
|
|
|
Endorph posted:out of curiosity: how do you feel about the words esper, and magitek in final fantasy 6 when they could have used the words 'spirits, and 'things what we made using those magic rocks' "summons" and "robots" are way better. a spirit could be alot of things!!!!
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:09
|
|
|
I like the Ultimecia fight a lot except for the gimmick where you start with random party members because I only have 3 characters junctioned with good magic
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:10
|
|
|
bloodychill posted:Beyond that, the underlying story is pretty simple so those unintuitive phrases which could easily been replaced with "chosen," "demi-gods/machine gods/celestials", and just plain "monsters" come off as forced, to mask how simplistic, silly, and badly written the story is. Yes, and you can do that with anything. It doesn't make it a necessary thing to do. For one, fictional terms are marketable and even something you can trademark. If you use "chosen", it isn't distinctly belonging to your chosen IP. This is something almost all fiction does. It is why you have Titans, Mobile Suits, Mechs, Mechanicals, Battroids, Walkers and countless other terms for giant robots. It is why they're called Jedi instead of Space Wizards. It helps define your things, even if they are derivative of or connected to another thing. I mean Zombies are Zombies, but none the less you'll have Walkers and Infected and Ghouls and whatever. And the fact that only certain words are fictional doesn't really matter. You can have fictional terms or concepts alongside straightforward words and will do so on a regular basis, especially in fiction. Game of Thrones to go back to an earlier example is a currently very popular piece of fiction and does that on a regular basis without people getting confused. In some cases those terms can become popular lexicon because of their connection to a fiction that is popular or liked. Calling everything but the simplest and most generic name is not how anyone creates fiction. Well, for the most part. If you do it that way you get... well, Destiny. Which is the story of The Light fighting The Darkness because of The Traveller thanks to The Guardians while fighting The Fallen and The Hive. Fiction creates words. Sometimes (often) they are goofy, stupid or made-up words. It is just how it works. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Oct 11, 2014 |
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:10
|
|
|
fronz posted:Jecht was sick as hell and I liked trance kuja Oh right I forgot, Trance Kuja is actually good and since Necron is just one fight it is better than most despite showing up out of nowhere. Jecht is cool too, unfortunately he is followed up by Yu Yevon who may be the worst final boss in an FF game ever. Help Im Alive posted:I like the Ultimecia fight a lot except for the gimmick where you start with random party members because I only have 3 characters junctioned with good magic I don't particularly care for that fight too much, but it does a super cool thing where it integrates gameplay and story into one very well with Griever and is actually a super cool thematic thing when the story. Then Maybe I'm A Lion starts playing and I'm like "Yeahhhhh" even though the boss still isn't great.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:11
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Yes, and you can do that with anything. It doesn't make it a necessary thing to do. What if all final fantasy are actually taking place in the world of bioshock infinite??!?!
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:12
|
|
|
Yu Yevon is not a boss, he is part of the ending cutscene.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:15
|
|
|
That is one stupidly long ending cutscene then, especially if you got all of the Aeons.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:18
|
|
|
fronz posted:Yu Yevon is not a boss, he is part of the ending cutscene. You can't even die while fighting Yu Yevon, because every character has perma Auto-Life during that fight. In fact, it's a special Auto-Life with a different animation that gives that character a turn immediately instead of after a big delay. The only way to get a game over is if you deliberately petrify your whole party. It's like that Sephiroth in 7 who comes after Safer Sephiroth, where he has 1 HP and Cloud gets a free Omnislash.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:20
|
|
|
Beef Waifu posted:That is one stupidly long ending cutscene then, especially if you got all of the Aeons. It was a symbolic ending, like shirtless Sephiroth in VII. Not the final challenge, but in a fight scene all the same. And yes, FF games have long endings. EDIT: I had to spell this out  Cake Attack might have a point here.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 26, 2024 23:57 |
|
|
Necron kind of comes out of nowhere but I've always thought he was a really fun fight.
|
|
#
?
Oct 11, 2014 00:24
|
|