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That's an easier assessment to make when you're already in the middle of Diamond where you've hit your plateau, but for people climbing out of Bronze/Silver/Gold/Platinum who usually play much better than their average MMR, all the factors in a single game + bad luck in a promo series can set a player back a whole lot. It was easier for me to say "Oh, just calm down and don't play on tilt" when I started the season in Bronze III because of really dumb placements, and carry myself all the way up to Silver III before I even had to start paying attention to what was going on. When you start to hit your plateau games become much more stressful because you know you are just a little better than where you are, especially when you're sitting right in division 1 and you keep bouncing between 50 LP and a promo series over and over without fighting people any better or worse in-between it all. When I was on my hot streak between Silver III and Silver 1 I ended up winning 12 out of 15 games and shot through the promos really easily, to the point my MMR was high enough I was playing against middle gold players, and I felt like that was right about where I should have been at; I was still doing really well in lane as Support or Mid and could break even top or jungle as long as my team were doing well too. I waited about three weeks to finish my promos because I got really busy with work, and they had announced end of season rewards. It ended up causing the mad rush to Gold, where players are Already on tilt (Like I am) and not playing the best because: --There are more smurfs who are powering through and skewing games. --There are much more players already the division above who aren't going to drop down, and aren't going to advance forward so they can AFK, rage, throw games, ect and it doesn't matter to them --Actual trolls who will watch for players in a promo series and intentionally ruin a game because it's fun to them. It's legitimately happened to me two promo series in a row handicapping me further --More server/ISP/DDoS issues than ever before causing lots of games to be ruined by AFK/Disconnected players completely out of your control that has a 50/50 chance of happening to either team, sometimes affecting players who have never had issues before for only one game at a whim Sitting at the higher end of Division 1 near the end of a season is the most torturous, miserable thing about playing ranked. I don't rage at teams and take each game as its own isolated game, but it's hard not to tilt from all the stress of trying to get a dumb shiny border and a free skin. The average skill and attitude in the games I've been playing recently remind me more of Bronze I than Silver I. People are quicker to rage, troll, feed, and AFK than ever before and I'm sure it's like that in every Div 1 right now. This is a lot of stress over something that wouldn't have mattered in Season 1 or Season 2 because I would have qualified for Gold a long time ago instead of being forced to play a promotion series 4 times and tanking my hidden MMR. So many things are out of your control that if you're right at your skill level and you don't play hard carry champions that advancing is almost entirely luck based and out of your hands. There's no difference between how well a Division I and a Division V of the next level plays, it's all arbitrary. It's luck.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:00
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Ultimate skins take quite some work, mostly because they use new tech to make them so fancy. If they want to release one in 2014 then they're not still undecided, because they locked that poo poo in ages ago.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:02
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Libertine posted:Most people who get frustrated with the system of games do so because they become frustrated with their own play on a certain day. When you are pulling your hair out going "drat THIS CORRUPT SYSTEM HOLDING ME DOWN" you need to just take a step away and not play ranked for awhile. How many times do we have to say, "we know it evens out over time," before you understand that we aren't blaming the system for holding us down? We are complaining about the frustration that the arbitrary nature of the system adds, without a corresponding benefit. Also, the leagues system does nothing to "square off millions of people into fairly balanced matches 24/7." NOTHING. You are not matched based on the goddamn league system. All it is is a bunch of arbitrary window dressing, but then they base rewards off that arbitrary window dressing, so yes, it's a legitimate complaint.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:03
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Libertine posted:Lots of people get real anxiety about risking points in a pure MMR system. Steeping it in a bunch of random bullshit like metal-coated League 1/2/3/4/5 system is a psychological trick to disarm those people of their anxiety and increase the overall number of ranked games that get played. Increased player pool means better match-making, means even the players who don't have any ladder anxiety benefit from better matches. They could just hide your rank if you aren't near the top tier of players if they want to get people to play ranked more often without worrying about their rank. Ive always heard most people have a higher normal elo than ranked elo anyhow so this would work to increase player participation and get more people to play ranked. Or take out unranked play. That would work also.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:04
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Mierenneuker posted:Ultimate skins take quite some work, mostly because they use new tech to make them so fancy. If they want to release one in 2014 then they're not still undecided, because they locked that poo poo in ages ago. There are skins are in development for months, sometimes years (Apparently the Udyr skin was being worked on before Pulsefire was out) so they could have 2 ultimate skins in development right now and one almost finished, for all we know.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:07
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I think you wrote the words stress/tilt like 6 or 7 times in that write-up. If ranked games are excessively stressing you out, you will never do well in them. You have to stay calm the whole time and just focus on doing everything you possibly can to win the aspects you can control and not get mad about the other things. Queuing up in the right mindset is one of the biggest parts of playing ranked correctly in my opinion. I don't ever play ranked when I'm tired from work (which is often lately because I've taken on a few new projects at work), I don't ever play ranked when there's anything else going on that can distract me, and I don't ever play ranked when I'm in a bad mood (and if it puts me in a bad mood, I stop playing). Subsequently, I've played very few ranked games this season relative to other people, but I've found ranked to be a largely enjoyable experience the majority of the time I do play.SuccinctAndPunchy posted:Don't see how that solves anything when it just replaces anxiety over losing your MMR with losing your LP and even greater anxiety over promo games which place arbitrary increased importance on specific games for zero reason or reward. I explained what it does, there's lots of Riot posts you can google that explain how it benefits players broadly, and quantity and quality of ranked play has gone up a lot because of it. I'm sorry you don't like it. I don't think there's any further need to defend it beyond what's already been written, and I think it is probably here to stay with only minor modifications for the rest of the life of the game, so I don't know, deal with it I guess.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:09
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Che Delilas posted:How many times do we have to say, "we know it evens out over time," before you understand that we aren't blaming the system for holding us down? We are complaining about the frustration that the arbitrary nature of the system adds, without a corresponding benefit. I don't think they're great, but they balance pretty well in satisfaction if you win them and frustration if you lose them.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:09
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theflyingorc posted:Actually it makes people who hit a new tier incredibly, incredibly happy, and players in general are much happier to say "I'm gold" than they are to say "My ELO is 1550". All my happiness from hitting a new division comes from finally winning the arbitrarily chosen correct games.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:16
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I just stopped playing totally and it's going pretty well for me tbh
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Oct 17, 2014 18:18
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Libertine posted:I think you wrote the words stress/tilt like 6 or 7 times in that write-up. If ranked games are excessively stressing you out, you will never do well in them. You have to stay calm the whole time and just focus on doing everything you possibly can to win the aspects you can control and not get mad about the other things. Queuing up in the right mindset is one of the biggest parts of playing ranked correctly in my opinion. I don't ever play ranked when I'm tired from work (which is often lately because I've taken on a few new projects at work), I don't ever play ranked when there's anything else going on that can distract me, and I don't ever play ranked when I'm in a bad mood (and if it puts me in a bad mood, I stop playing). Subsequently, I've played very few ranked games this season relative to other people, but I've found ranked to be a largely enjoyable experience the majority of the time I do play. Just because you're in Platinum II doesn't mean you're playing against Platinum II players. You can find people two divisions above or below you in any given game based on their/your hidden mmr. quote:I explained what it does, there's lots of Riot posts you can google that explain how it benefits players broadly, and quantity and quality of ranked play has gone up a lot because of it. I'm sorry you don't like it. I don't think there's any further need to defend it beyond what's already been written, and I think it is probably here to stay with only minor modifications for the rest of the life of the game, so I don't know, deal with it I guess.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:18
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theflyingorc posted:Actually it makes people who hit a new tier incredibly, incredibly happy, and players in general are much happier to say "I'm gold" than they are to say "My ELO is 1550". They could have made things so much simpler and stress-free than they have. The only plus that divisions have now is that it's harder to drop tiers when you're losing with 0 LP
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Oct 17, 2014 18:21
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as a toxic rager I like calling people bronze buttheads and it's much easier than finding the an alliterative insult with whatever poo poo elo i'm playing in. I don't belong there because my team loses me 45% of my games. Duh. I think the league system is fine I just don't care for the bo3 between divisions PLUS the bo5 to move to the next rank. I think they should scrap the bo3 altogether and leave bo5.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:22
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Would you rather teeter back and forth on 1500 LP with every single game single-handedly deciding whether or not you get end of season rewards? I'm sure that would be less stressful. It doesn't matter what divisions of players you get matched up with, the composite Team MMR of 5-player Group A and 5-player Group B is almost never more than +/- 20 ELO in every single ranked tier. If you use any of the common websites to scout your games, you should be able to see that every single time.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:23
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Libertine posted:Would you rather teeter back and forth on 1500 LP with every single game single-handedly deciding whether or not you get end of season rewards? I'm sure that would be less stressful. "Rewards are based on your highest rating achieved this season/in the last month/3 months/whatever time period." That was hard.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:31
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Hey Methanar, how do you play Akali jungle? I've been looking for more junglers recently and you've been posting about her a bit.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:33
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Libertine posted:Would you rather teeter back and forth on 1500 LP with every single game single-handedly deciding whether or not you get end of season rewards? I'm sure that would be less stressful. Just combine ELO and ladders and it should be fine. Grant people who hit arbitrary Gold ELO their rewards as long as they stay within a reasonable Elo by the end of the season. The ladders in themselves are stupid and pointless, unless you have a ton of friends in the same league as you are when the season starts it just ends up being 50 strangers that you're never even guaranteed to ever be matched with all season. When they introduced people assumed these were people you'd be matched with and you'd gain rivals, and it would be fun. But until Diamond 1 50LP you're probably never going to see anyone you know and finding the same player twice is astronomical luck outside of seeing them twice in a row. RealFoxy fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Oct 17, 2014 |
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Oct 17, 2014 18:33
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I think we can quit pretending like every player in league is currently sitting in silver 1 with 80 LP and has an actual ELO of 1600. The number of people being affected isn't that high, and there's going to be an equal number of people on fairly lucky streaks who got to gold 5 and if they played enough games their ELO would be 1400. Also, this is about a skin.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:38
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theflyingorc posted:I think we can quit pretending like every player in league is currently sitting in silver 1 with 80 LP and has an actual ELO of 1600. The number of people being affected isn't that high, and there's going to be an equal number of people on fairly lucky streaks who got to gold 5 and if they played enough games their ELO would be 1400. 
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Oct 17, 2014 18:41
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I had some all star 2015 skin ideas. Here's the pitch:  Let players from the regions represented at all stars do voices to be packaged with skins for the champions they played at that tournament. Flameingblack posted:I've failed to reach Gold every single season by less than 5 games. guess you're not gold then
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Oct 17, 2014 18:43
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Lovechop posted:the Lux ultimate skin is just her default one but the laugh is global I would accept this.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:43
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Servaetes posted:Well that and let us truly be honest we lost our clout with Brackhar peacing out. All we can do is post a bazillion posts nobody in Riot will see. But kudos I almost spat out my drink in my cubicle at work you loving jerk imaging Kog maw with a bow Blue bird is best bird. Step 1 is ban out zed ahead of time. Step 2 is go cdr boots first item no matter what, followed by nashors and zhonyas. Step 3 is for the love of god avoid people who can ignore your wall and kill you anyway. He can actually properly dash the same way that j4 can now which is really nice. Your mid-late game damage is off the wall if you can properly protect yourself with your ult during a fight. Works best in jungle fights.
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Oct 17, 2014 18:43
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Flameingblack posted:iirc if you had ended up hitting 1550 in Season 2 at any point during the last 30 days you were guaranteed Gold rewards. Season 3 was broken as hell, because players would get boosted to Gold/Platinum and maintain bronze MMR because it was impossible to drop out of a league. Season 4 is less broken, but still arbitrary and stupid. They're improving their arbitrary and stupid league system, but at a rate so slowly that by the time it's perfected people are going to stop playing long before it's finished. Basically all my thoughts on it right here. theflyingorc posted:I think we can quit pretending like every player in league is currently sitting in silver 1 with 80 LP and has an actual ELO of 1600. The number of people being affected isn't that high, and there's going to be an equal number of people on fairly lucky streaks who got to gold 5 and if they played enough games their ELO would be 1400. Eh. It's a dumb system that fucks up the general thing they wanted to do and they don't really acknowledge that in whole. Your MRR is only lose tied to what your league ranking is and its kind of opaque to figure out, especially if you're not looking at stuff like lolnexus or whatever. "Oh hey, my MMR is Silver III-ish but I am silver V? well huh."
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Oct 17, 2014 18:43
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Flameingblack posted:That's an easier assessment to make when you're already in the middle of Diamond where you've hit your plateau, but for people climbing out of Bronze/Silver/Gold/Platinum who usually play much better than their average MMR, all the factors in a single game + bad luck in a promo series can set a player back a whole lot. I'm in the same boat as you here. I can't play all that often, and I'm hovering in Silver 1 trying to push into Gold 5. (87 LP, naysayer!) I won eight out of ten games leading up to my promo series, and then went 2:2, losing the final game (despite doing well) because some gold 3 disconnected for ten minutes. I was really looking forward to not playing ranked anymore for the rest of the season and not having to worry about it, but now I need to play at least 4-6 games because arbitrary funtime league system isn't convinced I deserve rewards. That last game was enormously frustrating to say the least. Poulpe fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Oct 17, 2014 |
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Oct 17, 2014 18:52
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The ranked system should be that if you get a kill on someone you take their rank if it's higher and they become your rank
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Oct 17, 2014 18:55
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I think this is going to be my last ranked match for the season: http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1581544939/33455785stiknork posted:The ranked system should be that if you get a kill on someone you take their rank if it's higher and they become your rank Like IRL? *plots*
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Oct 17, 2014 18:57
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Flameingblack posted:That's an easier assessment to make when you're already in the middle of Diamond where you've hit your plateau, but for people climbing out of Bronze/Silver/Gold/Platinum who usually play much better than their average MMR, all the factors in a single game + bad luck in a promo series can set a player back a whole lot. I don't want to be rude, but unless you're on OCE or something, this poo poo is actually really rare. I get that it's incredibly frustrating to try and get through that last series at the end of a season, I had the same thing last season, but it's not because everyone is trolling. The "free stuff for Gold+" makes it a mad dash, but it's still doable. It sounds like you need to chill out and maybe play some ARAMs or something for a while. You have plenty of time to hit Gold, there's like 3 more weeks of the season. I don't even use my victorious Elise skin, because if I feed with it people will yell at me more  I wholeheartedly agree that the "win 4 out of 6 games" thing is a completely artificial barrier that really doesn't judge skill particularly well, but the feeling of accomplishment when you make it is pretty obviously why Riot implemented it over just showing your MMR.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:05
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my pog boyfriend posted:Hey Methanar, how do you play Akali jungle? I've been looking for more junglers recently and you've been posting about her a bit. Hope you're not fighting lee. Go wraith stone > t1 boots > gunblade > t2 boots > zhonyas. If you somehow lose a 1v1 just press W and wait 8 seconds for your laner to (not) show up. You win almost every 1v1 except for lee post 6 if you do it right though. Clear the jungle until you have 3 stacks and then go gank someone. Get the cutlass half of gunblade first. When 1v1ing you can smite a jungle creep for a 600 instant heal, which is how you never lose 1v1s. You can initate fights super easily and safely once you get zhonyas. Example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvZbsMPE1q4 full replay https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B57W-Dq1KiiXM1ljY2xpb3BxVHM/view?usp=sharing Also, libertine, this was against a challenger enemy jungler.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:07
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Methanar posted:Hope you're not fighting lee. Holy poo poo I am so trying this tonight. What do you do for runes/masteries?
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Oct 17, 2014 19:10
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Well, LoL just poo poo out on me, can't reconnect to a ranked game. GG rito.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:11
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Libertine posted:I explained what it does, there's lots of Riot posts you can google that explain how it benefits players broadly, and quantity and quality of ranked play has gone up a lot because of it. I'm sorry you don't like it. I don't think there's any further need to defend it beyond what's already been written, and I think it is probably here to stay with only minor modifications for the rest of the life of the game, so I don't know, deal with it I guess. Your post doesn't actually explain how it does this, just that it does which is useless. You say it's a psychological trick, but what does that even mean? Link a Riot post explaining this then, because googling isn't actually turning up anything readable, just forum threads bitching about ranked. Quality being improved makes no sense when the system matchmakes in the exact same way as the old one, there's no improvement there. It probably is here to stay but it's still poo poo and actively deters me from playing ranked so gently caress it, gonna complain about it anyway. I don't think it needs to revert to the old system but the current system is really obviously flawed in a lot of ways and could do with further examination.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:13
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Libertine posted:Lots of people get real anxiety about risking points in a pure MMR system. Steeping it in a bunch of random bullshit like metal-coated League 1/2/3/4/5 system is a psychological trick to disarm those people of their anxiety and increase the overall number of ranked games that get played. Increased player pool means better match-making, means even the players who don't have any ladder anxiety benefit from better matches. Reducing "ranked stress" was certainly their design goal, but the League system completely fails to meet that goal. In fact not only does it fail to reduce stress, but it actually adds to it. League points are, to the user, effectively identical to the old Elo points. They're a number which go up when you win, go down when you lose, and you need to net enough of them to get season rewards and to lord over other nerds about how good you are at the vidcons. There's no compelling reason why anyone who stressed out over losing Elo won't stress out over losing LP. The attempt to reduce stress by "removing" Elo points failed, because the first thing they did in their new system is create new Elo points. Now you add to this stress by making the number of league points you gain dependent on a hidden variable. Elo points varied, but they varied due to factors you could see. Now you have people winning games for +2 LP, and losing a game for -20 LP, and they have no idea why. The League system goes out of its way to hide why this is happening, so now the user feels like they're playing a rigged game. The player now experiences additional pressure to win games which the league's own statistical system predicts they should be losing. In addition to this, you now have the added stress of promo games. Getting a discconect/afk/troll in ranked is annoying enough, now you need to worry about getting them in your super important ++ games you need a higher than normal number of wins in. When this happens, users feel cheated out of advancement. Creating a slick front-end for ranked was a good idea, because straight up Elo numbers don't mean much without context. Where they went horribly wrong was hiding all the important information from the user and simultaneously feeding them tons of new information which is by and large bullshit.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:15
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itsjustdrew posted:Well, LoL just poo poo out on me, can't reconnect to a ranked game. GG rito.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:15
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How Rude posted:Holy poo poo I am so trying this tonight. What do you do for runes/masteries? go to my op.gg page and its the ad runes and lovely ad jungler masteries
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Oct 17, 2014 19:15
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Methanar posted:Also, libertine, this was against a challenger enemy jungler. Nice. exethan posted:guess you're not gold then This is basically it. The highest rating you attained is your plateau until you prove to the system you deserve to be higher. I've never thought to myself that I deserved to be higher than where I currently am placed regardless of where that is, because it doesn't matter what I think about my rating, it is what I've made it. When professional or challenger-level players get dropped into neutral ELO accounts raw they end up winning like 97% of their matches up to high Diamond. Many of the players from Worlds who went into the Korean server with low Plat accounts provided by Riot blasted them up to near Master tier before losing a single game.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:16
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Libertine posted:This is basically it. The highest rating you attained is your plateau until you prove to the system you deserve to be higher. I've never thought to myself that I deserved to be higher than where I currently am placed regardless of where that is, because it doesn't matter what I think about my rating, it is what I've made it. I've gone so far as writing down every reason why I've lost a game out of the last two weeks. Recently it's being forced out of comfort picks (Playing ADC specifically) but I can't dodge 2-2 in a promo series to get support, can I?) and I can pinpoint specific games where I mis-played and cost us a victory but there's a lot more games where I get Lux support who misses every binding and takes CS because she didn't want to play support or ADC. There's games where someone on my team disconnects on my team and makes victory almost impossible. There were legitimately two games where someone saw I was in a promo series and started feeding down mid. Aren't you actually expected to win the next 4 out of 5 matches if you're right at the top of a division? You've got to win a match to put you into a Best of 5, so you've got to have an 80% win ratio towards the end of a series.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:30
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Flameingblack posted:This thing that doesn't matter was matching me with players two divisions higher than me in promo promo series twice in a row until it "evened itself out" and now I'm playing with tilting Silver I and Gold V players instead of tryhard Gold III players. This is something I'm seeing and experiencing and you're trying to tell me it doesn't exist or doesn't matter. It absolutely matters and it's absolutely happening. Out of curiosity black, what's your role and IGN? I've helped a fellow goon escape the Silver Zone before (and been helped in turn), and I don't mind doing that again. Games tend to be far more enjoyable with somebody you can trust, after all, and it takes off a little of the pressure to perform when you know somebody has your back.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:32
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Methanar posted:go to my op.gg page and its the ad runes and lovely ad jungler masteries Wait, so you're running all AD on Akali and it's working out? I know she's a hybrid but drat that seems so counterintuitive. Also, I don't have LS quints, will more AD or maybe AS ruin the effectiveness of this or not really?
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Oct 17, 2014 19:35
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Flameingblack posted:This thing that doesn't matter was matching me with players two divisions higher than me in promo promo series twice in a row until it "evened itself out" and now I'm playing with tilting Silver I and Gold V players instead of tryhard Gold III players. This is something I'm seeing and experiencing and you're trying to tell me it doesn't exist or doesn't matter. It absolutely matters and it's absolutely happening. e: echoing above goon post, you should duo with someone so you can have a person that will dodge the queue for you. Helps avoid the games you know will result in losses.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:36
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All Else Failed posted:Wait, so you're running all AD on Akali and it's working out? I know she's a hybrid but drat that seems so counterintuitive. Also, I don't have LS quints, will more AD or maybe AS ruin the effectiveness of this or not really? The reason all AD is used on akali is because she gets spellvamp off her bonus attack damage. It makes it considerably easier to survive in jungle when you're recovering big ol chunks of life with each spellcast.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:37
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How Rude posted:Holy poo poo I am so trying this tonight. What do you do for runes/masteries? I would also like to murder everyone with a jungler they do not expect.
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Oct 17, 2014 19:37
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