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Dominic White posted:This seems a pretty good time to reboot the thread, huh? This new update seems to have brought the game a LOT closer to being a finished, coherent product. Sure hope so, 13 months between 0.6 and 0.65. If that keeps up we'll see 1.0 somewhere early next decade.
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Oct 21, 2014 12:39
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Fewd posted:Sure hope so, 13 months between 0.6 and 0.65. If that keeps up we'll see 1.0 somewhere early next decade. Just imagine that it dropped as 1.0 right at the beginning - I would probably have stopped playing this as of now.
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Oct 21, 2014 12:55
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I thought I had only been playing for an hour, but it has been 3.  Just to repeat word for word everyone else, this update is amazing and like a totally new game.
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Oct 21, 2014 13:05
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I... i dont know if i can play this without Blackrock.  I have a weakness and the only solution is gigantic single shot siege weapons. 
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Oct 21, 2014 13:17
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Ok so in the new patch I run around trying to chase pirates who I can't catch and then proceed to get murdered by anyone I can fight. What am I doing wrong?
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Oct 21, 2014 13:18
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So which Factions don't screw you over? I'm going to ditch the Hegemony, as that tariff is insane, but what are my alternatives, gouge-wise? Is it profitable to go pirate, assuming you can make do with (D) ships and nothing else?
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Oct 21, 2014 13:28
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I bought this game like three years ago and haven't followed its development since aside the name change. How are things going? A post in this page mentions it's still not close to finished and the last patch before this one was a year ago?
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Oct 21, 2014 13:37
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Thyrork posted:I... i dont know if i can play this without Blackrock. Don't even know where to start with updating it for the new version, so it will probably be at least a week until I can update.
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Oct 21, 2014 13:43
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occipitallobe posted:Ok so in the new patch I run around trying to chase pirates who I can't catch and then proceed to get murdered by anyone I can fight. What am I doing wrong? Unfortunately the skill trees are still bad, so pretty much your only choice when you want to do combat is to spend your first points on the burn speed skill. While that's not so bad because the Blue Skills are all great, it's also terrible because the Blue Skills are all great. There's very little choice for skills unless you're playing some weird gimmick that'll just end up being Hard Mode. So get Burn Speed - then you can catch pirates you want to kill and run away from the ones you can't. Also the .5 Logistic 50 Cargo Shuttle is a great investment if you want some extra cargo space.
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Oct 21, 2014 13:53
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McGiggins posted:So which Factions don't screw you over? I haven't been playing long enough to get a great handle on the new trade systems and such. But I do recall in a dev post that mixing illegal goods to sell on the blackmarket along with legitimate trade on the open market allows you to maintain a decent reputation and still get some of that sweet tariff free pie. Maybe give it a try? 
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Oct 21, 2014 13:53
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Saoshyant posted:I bought this game like three years ago and haven't followed its development since aside the name change. How are things going? A post in this page mentions it's still not close to finished and the last patch before this one was a year ago? there was a massive patch that basically completely changed the game up released on the previous page
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Oct 21, 2014 13:56
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Also if you ever have a surplus of cash it pays to buy goods cheap and store them. Especially food. I managed to grab 100k+ on some food runs within the Corvus system when a shortage broke out because I had the food in storage just waiting for a shortage.
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Oct 21, 2014 13:58
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SHAOLIN FUCKFIEND posted:Don't even know where to start with updating it for the new version, so it will probably be at least a week until I can update. No rush boss, i'm just bemoaning my crippling Space Napoleon Complex. If the gun assembly doesn't run down the length of the hull and shatter lesser ships in a single shot, its no gun for me. 
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Oct 21, 2014 14:06
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Milky Moor posted:there was a massive patch that basically completely changed the game up released on the previous page I gathered that. I meant how close (after this patch) is the game to being finished?
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Oct 21, 2014 14:11
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Who knows? I'll estimate 2-3 years more until Starsector 1.0. This patch marked a point where most of the big, important systems the game uses as cogs are in place though.
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Oct 21, 2014 14:16
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Saoshyant posted:I gathered that. I meant how close (after this patch) is the game to being finished? How long is a piece of string? No one including the developer can answer this question. Just try it and see if you have fun, it's a great game regardless of the 0.65a and it has changed a lot in 3 years.
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Oct 21, 2014 14:17
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Strumpie posted:it's a great game regardless of the 0.65a
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Oct 21, 2014 14:40
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Nektu posted:This is the important bit - the game in its current state does not feel like an alpha or beta at all. Thanks guys. That's what I wanted to hear.
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Oct 21, 2014 14:41
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Saoshyant posted:Thanks guys. That's what I wanted to hear. 
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Oct 21, 2014 14:42
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Tariffs don't seem to be limited to specific factions. Independents have tariffs, even pirates have tariffs on the open-market side. Trade balance is not exactly working as intended. It would help a lot the tariffs varied in size, rather than all being an insane 30%.
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Oct 21, 2014 15:32
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Why would you say trade balance isn't working? A good trade seems to about equivalent to a good run of bounties in money output. The one general gameplay issue I can see is that there's not enough factions. Especially the independents being all lumped together is really hurting the viable playstyles. Can't intercept a Smuggler without making every mercenary band and every Indie Station in the entire sector angry at your for example. DatonKallandor fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Oct 21, 2014 |
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Oct 21, 2014 16:16
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Welp gently caress that conference paper then time to download 
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Oct 21, 2014 16:40
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DatonKallandor posted:Why would you say trade balance isn't working? A good trade seems to about equivalent to a good run of bounties in money output. Thats because the smuggler ~~looks~~ like a perfectly legal trader. When they're near pirate stations they show up as pirates, and sometimes if you sit on their rear end long enough they'll reflag as Pirate. They got upset because it looked like you blew up a merchant =P
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Oct 21, 2014 16:56
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Nektu posted:Well maybe apart form that one bug that appeared with the update that makes your map dissapear until you restart the game If it's the one I'm thinking up where map/character/etc won't open after a fight I was able to open either fleet or cargo and everything else would open again.
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Oct 21, 2014 16:59
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DatonKallandor posted:Why would you say trade balance isn't working? A good trade seems to about equivalent to a good run of bounties in money output. I meant the balance between smuggling and open-market trade. Especially when you're first starting out, tariffs are so high that legitimate trade isn't profitable at all. You can still make some pretty good money when responding to severe shortages, but it kinda hurts ~*my immersion*~ that a milk run is not really a thing that exists in Starsector right now. Due to tariffs, trading between the highest and lowest of non-shortage prices will break even at best. Speaking of smuggling, I'm finding that steep and fickle faction relationship changes make for a very binary choice as to which side of the law you're on. Smuggling is fun and extremely profitable, especially when selling stuff off at pirate bases, but I can't figure out if there's any way of mitigating the severe faction penalties you get from it. Do smuggling penalties get worse the more you smuggle in one area? I can't tell. In general, the penalties for pissing people off are so much higher than the gain from helping people that it's very hard to maintain well-balanced relations; I find myself quickly forced into one extreme or the other. This is really loving with my Han Solo dreams and I don't like it at all. Meanwhile, bounties are fantastically profitable and headache-free compared to touching the trade system at all. Don't get me wrong, I'm thrilled at all the new stuff in this update, but it feels like the current balance kicks you in the teeth for attempting any playstyle other than the same old 'rove around and blow stuff up' deal that has been the only way to play the game up 'till now.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:02
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Brainbread posted:Thats because the smuggler ~~looks~~ like a perfectly legal trader. When they're near pirate stations they show up as pirates, and sometimes if you sit on their rear end long enough they'll reflag as Pirate. Really? That's fuckin cool.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:03
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It'll probably just take some balancing. Luckily some of this should be doable with modding.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:04
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Cathair posted:I meant the balance between smuggling and open-market trade. Especially when you're first starting out, tariffs are so high that legitimate trade isn't profitable at all. You can still make some pretty good money when responding to severe shortages, but it kinda hurts ~*my immersion*~ that a milk run is not really a thing that exists in Starsector right now. Due to tariffs, trading between the highest and lowest of non-shortage prices will break even at best. If you read the blog posts, this was exactly what they were going for. The big traders have special dispensations that let them be profitable, but a nobody like you can only make money doing risky trade runs, because a consistent, boring trade run between two or three locations is, well, boring. That's not to say I really agree with them. I definitely think it needs a couple balancing patches, like the boom-or-bust loot-splosions of early v.6. Unreal_One fucked around with this message at 17:18 on Oct 21, 2014 |
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Oct 21, 2014 17:10
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Cathair posted:I meant the balance between smuggling and open-market trade. Especially when you're first starting out, tariffs are so high that legitimate trade isn't profitable at all. You can still make some pretty good money when responding to severe shortages, but it kinda hurts ~*my immersion*~ that a milk run is not really a thing that exists in Starsector right now. Due to tariffs, trading between the highest and lowest of non-shortage prices will break even at best. That's intended. All the blogs have talked about it. There's not supposed to be a milk run, because the player is a tiny fly in a giant pond - the big freight lines have far more influence and capacity than you do. In effect they don't pay taxes because they're the default person the governments go to when they need something. The only way to make a profit is to exploit short term shortages (by being fast or preparing and then creating the shortage yourself) - that's working as intended.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:18
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Bounties are where it's at. This isn't "Starsector: Space Trucker 2d". It's Starsector: Flux You and Your Little Frigate Too". The entire game is combat, and so the design decision to make combat the only viable moneymaker, especially early in the game, is perfectly reasonable. That said, I think the supply system still overly punishes larger fleets. Keeping a lean fleet with a few frigates and maybe a destroyer flagship is still the only viable playstyle until the very end game because of your travel speed. Even with tugs. Right now my fleet is my wolf flagship, one of those frigates with fast missile racks and a medium LRM for support, plus one combat freighter to haul cargo (that never goes into combat). I need to bump it up and start flying a destroyer, but I've been shopping around and ship types are sadly lacking in vanilla. I think the completely blank industry skill will probably address your trading needs, though - maybe by allowing you to accept short-term shipping contracts or the 'construct your own base' minigame, or maybe allowing you to buy factories on the different worlds which slowly produce goods. Bhodi fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 21, 2014 |
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Oct 21, 2014 17:32
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Bhodi posted:I think the completely blank industry skill will probably address your trading needs, though - maybe by allowing you to accept short-term shipping contracts or the 'construct your own base' minigame, or maybe allowing you to buy factories on the different worlds which slowly produce goods. I will be very happy on the day when I can build a space logistics empire in this game.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:43
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I've been working at getting my faction reputation up with Tri-Tachyon. Run into two problems: 1. I've killed most of the small pirate fleets and they don't seem to regenerate fast enough, so mostly I have to just do specific (rather than general) bounties 2. It's really hard to find the good Tri-Tachyon ships! I have fairly good reputation (good enough to buy frigates and destroyers from their military) but can't even find a Tri-Tachyon station or planet that has very many (or any of their fighter craft) So I'm running around now with a Wolf as my flagship, a Vigilance, the phase-cloak Tri-Tach frigate with the EMP, and a Venture cruiser with somewhat crappy armament. Can't wait to see Blackrock hooked up to this, and I wonder if now there will be some big non-fleet mods that simply add systems and markets and events.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:46
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SHAOLIN FUCKFIEND posted:Really? That's fuckin cool. Even better, if you run out of fuel in between systems and start drifting you can get randomly attacked by passing independent merchants who instantly turn into pirates!
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Oct 21, 2014 18:31
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Bhodi posted:Bounties are where it's at. Only viable moneymaker? Pfft. Even running purely legal trades allows you to reap rich, easy profits as long as you're quick on the ball. As a trader, you're basically an ambulance chaser - keeping your ears open for news of trade disruptions and shortages and then rushing to be the first to the party with the necessary goods from the cheapest available source. I've only been playing for about four hours and I haven't had a chance to compare and contrast with a combat-oriented playstyle, but in those four hours, even after spending the first hour or two loving around trying to figure out trade, I've managed to save up 170,000 credits and can usually make at least 20K in profit per run. That may or may not be amazing compared to bounties - like I said, I haven't really tried combat yet - but it's pretty respectable and almost risk-free. You're not even gimped on experience, since you get XP for shrewd trades. That being said, I'd like it if there was a system in place to allow you to cozy up to the various governments as you become larger and more important, to the point where regular bulk runs become actually viable. Make a few relationships, cut a few under-the-table deals, eventually work your way closer to the tax-free status of the big conglomerates. The goods that you trade in tend to be the same, too - shortages affect mostly food, supplies, and fuel, and you only rarely see disruptions of of volatiles, luxury items or whatnot. Still, for an early build of the economy, I'm pretty satisfied. It does give you a real sense of operating in the cracks of the economy, using your superior speed to carve out a buck here and there beneath the feet of the lumbering trade armadas, and that's something I don't remember a lot of games offering.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:02
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That sounds pretty similar to bounty profits as well, just sounds like you're doing it really smart. Keep in mind for those of you starting out that you should usually be looking for the general star system pirate bounties rather than specific ones. If you can get a specific bounty in a system where there is also a general bounty, even better: you'll get paid twice. As for the trade tariffs, I'd be pretty willing to bet that one of the industry skills will end up being a tariff reduction, or perhaps something that gives you a tariff reduction based on your standing with who you're trading with. I'm really excited at what will be coming: officers and industry. I think Officers will have a really fun influence on the game, not so differently from what the introduction a while back of skills and character development did.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:11
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In about 4 hours I've managed to accumulate 500,000 credits from mostly bounty hunting. Also it seems that over time the individual bounty missions increase in value so you can start earning 50,000 for destroying a smallish destroyer fleet which seems very generous. I think the highlight for me so far though is having loaded up on just 120 units of drugs, hoping to sell them for a nice profit somewhere, I arrived on a planet that had just spiralled out of control causing the price to skyrocket. I quadrupled my profit and made over 100,000 credits from just 120 cargo, it was great and totally serendipitous. 
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Oct 21, 2014 19:13
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Strumpie posted:In about 4 hours I've managed to accumulate 500,000 credits from mostly bounty hunting. Also it seems that over time the individual bounty missions increase in value so you can start earning 50,000 for destroying a smallish destroyer fleet which seems very generous. I know the feeling. I was doing massive food runs when a planet in the Luddic Church system (Eos, I think) had a 10,000 unit food shortage. Bought a freighter just to run it! When I got to the planet, I offloaded about half in the market and half in the black market, and found they had about ~~30 Harvested Organs. For 400 each (they sell for about 900-1100 elsewhere). So it was a nice, free 15k to get on my return trip. I'm really enjoying the trade aspect. Its actually really engaging for me, and I'm almost up to enough money to buy a cruiser. I'm excited.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:19
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I suspect that you should always keep an eye out on trade even if you're running a combat fleet, incidentally - if you have spare cargo space and you receive word of a recent shortage in a place you were going to anyways, you'd be leaving money on the table if you don't top up your holds with the requisite goods.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:20
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Tomn posted:I suspect that you should always keep an eye out on trade even if you're running a combat fleet, incidentally - if you have spare cargo space and you receive word of a recent shortage in a place you were going to anyways, you'd be leaving money on the table if you don't top up your holds with the requisite goods. Basically why I bought the Venture. It's a hardy cruiser with 500 cargo space and a flight deck, so I can easily carry all the loot I get from fighting, and can haul lots of valuable cargo in a pinch.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:24
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Biggest problem I've found for trade starting off is that you don't really know what the prices for the goods normally are nor what they are in other systems. An idea of what the baseline is (Or a reminder of what I bought it for) would be great.
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Oct 21, 2014 19:31
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