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thrawn527 posted:Well now people are just outright lying. That way just isn't as fun as letting the guy's misguided impressions carry himself away.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:20
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Turns out I can do a pretty good Sutekh impression. Along with my impression of Soldeed from The Horns of Nimon I reckon I have all I need to put together a travelling show Turns out the Soldeed one can only be done at high volume otherwise I get the pitch all wrong
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Nov 11, 2014 22:22
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Turns out the Soldeed one can only be done at high volume otherwise I get the pitch all wrong Your DREAMS of CON-QUEST!
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Nov 11, 2014 22:23
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DoctorWhat posted:Your DREAMS of CON-QUEST! KNEEL BEFORE THE MIGHT OF SUTEKH
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Nov 11, 2014 22:27
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CobiWann posted:If you can get Occ's to listen to a Colin Baker Big Finish audio, I will not only review The Twin Dilemma and Timelash, I will BUY them on DVD and put them in my collection. Partly quoted for Toxx Clause, but also to mention that everyone should own the DVD of Lameshit because it has the most wonderful audio commentary of Colin Baker and Paul Darrow gently mocking themselves through the whole thing. Few say it's a classic, but that doesn't seem to matter.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:29
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Jerusalem posted:Instead we get.... albino lady and a couple of space-rhinos. Then they pretty much disappear from the series entirely and the closest thing we've seen to them since then is the Church of the Papal Mainframe. I liked the idea of the universe stitching itself back together in the wake of the Time War and the "higher races" being shaken enough to agree to such a radical step as putting themselves all under the authority of some detached and all-encompassing concept, a kind of Space-UN with an undeniable mandate. It was supposed to feature (and I think this was in The Writer's Tale) representatives of every alien species from the past four seasons and more. The ones I most distinctly remember hearing it was going to have were Margaret Blaine / Blon Fel Fotch as an infant with her new family, and a fully-grown ten-foot tall Adipose. Either the budget wasn't there for it or they just didn't have the time or space, though, so none of that made it in.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:30
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Turns out the Soldeed one can only be done at high volume otherwise I get the pitch all wrong Not exactly a limitation given the performance. Irony Be My Shield posted:IMO this review is the most tense sci-fi cliffhanger The review-cliffhanger is on track to have a better resolution than the one on the show.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:31
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Doctor Spaceman posted:Not exactly a limitation given the performance. It is if I want to record it in a flat with thin walls after 9pm without annoying the neighbours
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Nov 11, 2014 22:32
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thrawn527 posted:Well now people are just outright lying. I'm one of those people who gets mad at people at people for talking about future episodes (though at one time I did it myself, then reformed), but sometimes that guy makes logic leaps off cliffs. And when he does, I can't help but pull his parachute away.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:33
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Well you're the one who tipped the thread over into getting locked for the next day or so, so nice going, dipshit. For the record, shutting it down was Occ's decision, not mine. He'll probably keep it locked til his writeup is posted.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:34
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Craptacular! posted:I'm one of those people who gets mad at people at people for talking about future episodes (though at one time I did it myself, then reformed), but sometimes that guy makes logic leaps off cliffs. And when he does, I can't help but pull his parachute away. You're one of those people who think they're a lot cleverer than they are you mean
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Nov 11, 2014 22:38
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Big Mean Jerk posted:I liked the long green coat he wore, but I don't remember it being in very many episodes. I think in the end it was probably in as many episodes as the tweed one.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:39
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Arivia posted:Moffat's run in general has been great - 5, 6, and 8 were all amazing, and 7 was 2/3rds wonderful with a couple really really bad episodes (the Time of the Doctor, Angels In Manhattan.) What? They did come back. They are cybermen now. Duh.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:41
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Metal Loaf posted:It was supposed to feature (and I think this was in The Writer's Tale) representatives of every alien species from the past four seasons and more. The ones I most distinctly remember hearing it was going to have were Margaret Blaine / Blon Fel Fotch as an infant with her new family, and a fully-grown ten-foot tall Adipose. This is a result of RTD wanting to throw everything in, I guess. When it became apparent that he couldn't do it justice he should have just dropped them entirely and had the Doctor and Donna figure out about the missing planets/the bees by themselves in the TARDIS. He could always have jumped back to the Shadow Proclamation in one of the specials, but this was last regular season finale and he wanted EVERYTHING in there.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:46
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MrL_JaKiri posted:It is if I want to record it in a flat with thin walls after 9pm without annoying the neighbours Are you challenging me to a Soldeed-off? Because it sounds to me, by way of the power of wishful thinking, that you're challenging me to a Soldeed-off. What I'm saying is: MrL_JaKiri, I hereby challenge you to a Soldeed-off.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:47
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thrawn527 posted:Didn't the Doctor even have a line that was something like, "Great Intelligence, something familiar about that...hmmm...oh well." You shouldn't be expected to remember GI because even the Doctor doesn't.
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Nov 11, 2014 22:59
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DoctorWhat posted:What I'm saying is that the Christmas special can't come soon enough?
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Nov 11, 2014 23:03
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Jerusalem posted:that the Christmas special can't come soon enough? No one has ever said that.
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Nov 11, 2014 23:06
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Oxxidation posted:Let's Kill Hitler was pretty good and so was Series 6 in general. I genuinely adore Let's Kill Hitler. My opinion on it is much like Occ's on the Christmas Invasion - it is loving ludicrous idiocy and I love its every idiotic, campy, stupid moment.
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Nov 11, 2014 23:06
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DoctorWhat posted:Are you challenging me to a Soldeed-off? Because it sounds to me, by way of the power of wishful thinking, that you're challenging me to a Soldeed-off. You meddlesome hussy 
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Nov 11, 2014 23:07
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Angela Christine posted:What? They did come back. They are cybermen now. Duh. Is that the version that waved at their younger selves? "Shiny clothes must be fashionable in the future. Weird."
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Nov 11, 2014 23:08
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Jerusalem posted:This is a result of RTD wanting to throw everything in, I guess. When it became apparent that he couldn't do it justice he should have just dropped them entirely and had the Doctor and Donna figure out about the missing planets/the bees by themselves in the TARDIS. He could always have jumped back to the Shadow Proclamation in one of the specials, but this was last regular season finale and he wanted EVERYTHING in there. The Shadow Proclamation certainly seems like one of those concepts where, if you can't do it justice, you probably shouldn't try to do it. The Time War in "The Day of the Doctor" is somewhat similar, but it's easier to wangle an "in-universe" explanation for why it's all Daleks dive bombing Gallifrey with lasers and not the Cthulu stuff (i.e. it's the very last day and everything else has been used up; it's a bit disappointing, but it's easier to justify than "the Shadow Proclamation was an old lady and the Judoon in a disused space station" - there's probably a very interesting story you could spin with the latter idea, but "Journey's End" didn't). Heck, to some degree, it can be said of the return of the Time Lords in "The End of Time" as well. I mean, Timothy Dalton was great as Rassilon (I would've liked Don Warrington to play him, but he'd already been the President of Britain in Pete's world), but in the end, when you get down to it, all he really did was stand on a platorm eating the scenery and shooting people with his Nintendo Power Glove.
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Nov 11, 2014 23:18
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I love how in The Invisible Enemy and The Invasion of Time, they've gone 'We have big ideas that we simply don't have the budget to portray', like RTD did with the Shadow Proclamation, but they decided to film it anyway.
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Nov 12, 2014 00:17
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They still probably could've tried harder to make it work. Maybe have anonymous silhouetted aliens (shadow proclamation  ) speaking via monitors or something.
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Nov 12, 2014 00:23
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DoctorWhat posted:Are you challenging me to a Soldeed-off? Because it sounds to me, by way of the power of wishful thinking, that you're challenging me to a Soldeed-off. YOU FOOOOOOLLLSSS!!! wait I'm not even part of this game, poo poo
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Nov 12, 2014 00:23
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 What a tremendous disappointment The Council of Nicaea is as a story. It drops the 5th Doctor, Erimem and Peri into an utterly fascinating and pivotal moment in the history of the world and then almost completely squanders its potential with a thoroughly less engaging story about Erimem throwing a giant tantrum. The politics, the people, the enormous historical consequences etc get paid lipservice but are mostly relegated to the background, while Erimem acts ridiculously and jumps to wild conclusions that are completely out of character for her, and require the Doctor and Peri to be either silent or nonsensically inarticulate in order for her to continue to think and feel the way she does. In 325 AD, the Roman Emperor Constantine has called the first Council of Nicaea, a pivotal moment in the history of the world that still has ramifications into the present day, a Council which set out to define the canonical beliefs of the Christian Church. The Doctor brings Erimem and Peri to see it all unfold firsthand and, of course, walks them straight into a riot between followers of two sets of believers. The story does a good job of bringing both Erimem and Peri (who SHOULD know better) up to speed on the controversy while also informing the viewer should they too be ignorant. To put it in overly simplistic terms, at this point in time the Church was divided over the exact nature of Jesus Christ - were Jesus and God one and the same being who had always existed, or was Jesus a creation of God's and thus "lesser" than God? Peri laughs off the ridiculousness of such a small thing being such a big deal, but the Doctor and Erimem both know that religion is serious business. What makes it so dangerous is that most if not all of the people on both sides were adamant believers in their causes, utterly convinced that they were right which therefore meant that not only was the other side wrong... but that it was blasphemous. To claim Jesus was lesser than God was to insult God, or to claim that Jesus and God were equal was to insult God. Doctor Who doesn't (and shouldn't) often touch on religion, but the Council of Nicaea was such a huge moment in history that it is no shock at all to see Big Finish do a story about it.... it's just unfortunate that the story ended up not really being about it at all. There is nothing wrong with making a story about a companion and their personal development/deepening of their characterization, and in fact a quality story will be one that uses the background setting to good effect to enhance that story or in some way parallel it. Sadly that is not the case here, Erimem's latching on to the cause of Arianism and her immediate distaste for Constantine just blurt out onto the story out of nowhere, and serve mostly to make her look like a grumpy child acting out against her "dad" as she tries to establish her own personal identity. There's a place for that type of story, especially given Erimem's recent revelations about her own father and questioning of the validity of her own identity, but I can't help but feel they blew it with this story. Erimem and Peri are saved from the riot and meet Arius, who Arianism was named for even though he's not necessarily the originator of the idea of God as Supreme and Jesus as God's "lesser" creation. Arius and his follower explain their situation to Erimem who just immediately takes it all completely at face value, immediately declaring herself in opposition to Emperor Constantine leaving Peri rather startled as a result. They rejoin the Doctor - who, being the Doctor, managed to turn being arrested into meeting the Emperor and getting assigned a job by him - and manage to get into attendance on the first day of the Council, where Erimem immediately steps forward to denounce Constantine (the Emperor of Rome!) and demand that Arius be allowed to attend the Council or at least have his views heard. What makes it worse is that her stupid and reckless actions are done in complete defiance of the Doctor's extremely reasonable request that she actually listen to BOTH sides of the argument before making her conclusion, and that she treats every moment of the Doctor or Peri timidly suggesting,"Maybe you're getting a little overexcited?" with a furious denouncement of them both as somehow betraying her. It's pretty obvious that the reason for Erimem's aggressive attitude is because Arius' situation reminds her of her own background - despite being in line to become Pharoah she rarely got a chance to have her own views heard, while others sought to manipulate or maneuver events and use her like a pawn to be discarded when no longer necessary. Constantine is, in effect, her father.... as is the Doctor - it's all about Daddy Issues, but I don't mean that to come across as in any way dismissive or belittling of her motivations. Erimem is a character who is seeking to define who she is, and as a result she goes overboard because she's had it up to here with being overlooked or dismissed as irrelevant. Sadly this means that she comes across as petulant and overly aggressive throughout the story, and I can only think what might have been if the story had been handled with a little more finesse. Because sometimes it works, like when Erimem gathers up the people and leads them in a march on Constantine, or the way she works as a proto-Ghandi and forces her followers to restrain themselves when they come under attack. She is a natural leader and not just somebody who happened to be born into the role, which makes her fury at the way she has been or continues to be sidelined by male characters completely understandable. But it also raises questions about the fact she left with the Doctor in the first place rather than lead her own people, and it might have been nice to see some of her attitude revealed as misplaced guilt over "abandoning" her own people. The story goes to pains to paint particularly characters are complex, with the Doctor stressing to Erimem that Constantine is not simply a mad villain gnashing his teeth but a complicated human being (just like herself). She wants to see him as a tyrant and in some ways he certainly acts the part, but in others he demonstrates restraint and thoughtfulness, even humility in places, all this despite being arguably the most powerful man in the world at the time. In the end, the Doctor points out that despite eventually exiling Arius, he eventually recalled him... but he also murdered his own wife in a horrible way - in the end, you can't really nail him down as either good/bad. Even Fausta is shown as complex, sometimes it seems she is plotting or up to some Machiavellian evil, only for her to do something nice or just be completely true to her word. This makes the characters who aren't complex stands out, particular against the likes of Arius or Athanasius, who are so one-dimensional they're in danger of slipping between the cracks of the story. Given what an enormous impact Arius had on the history of the world, as well as the pivotal role he SHOULD play in this story, it is disappointing he is so passive and unremarkable a character, mostly given to following Erimem around doing what she says (which firmly puts him in the companion role to her "Doctor"). Peri might as well not even exist in this story, she seems completely superfluous other than to get involved in misunderstandings that cause Erimem to accuse her of betraying them, or a long scene that goes nowhere where Fausta gets her drunk to get information from her and then just lets her wander away. Both her and the Doctor are very out of character when it comes to Erimem, mostly due to the fact that if they spoke with her like they usually do they'd have gotten to the heart of the matter very quickly and the bulk of the story wouldn't have happening... so to keep the plot moving, they just awkwardly stand around saying nothing or clumsily blurting out easily misinterpreted things that makes Erimem lash out at them. The Council of Nicaea is an earnest attempt at developing Erimem's character, but it doesn't do so particularly well and it comes at the cost of squandering the enormous potential of the backdrop. I can only think about what might have been, the background politics alone of the setting could have made for a fascinating story in its own right, and a story that properly explored Erimem's personal issues and quest to establish her own identity/purpose would have been very welcome. Competent from a technical sense, this will always be the story that makes me think about what could have been rather than what was.
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Nov 12, 2014 00:42
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Yeah, after Eye of the Scorpion and The Church and the Crown, Erimem's stories have just fallen flat. She's a character with a lot of potential, but Nekromanteia and The Roof of the World do nothing with the concept except a bit of lip service and a lot of shouting. You're getting ahead of me, J-Ru, with these reviews! But I enjoy reading them and can't wait to dive back into the main range. I say again, and I apologize for pestering, you should consider putting them online somewhere, there's really insightful and let more people know about Big Finish!
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Nov 12, 2014 00:45
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I am legitimately bummed out by Osgood being killed. But as others have said, she may be back. Though i liked how Missy lied about her being scared.
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Nov 12, 2014 01:37
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Irony Be My Shield posted:They still probably could've tried harder to make it work. Maybe have anonymous silhouetted aliens (shadow proclamation Even better: cast all the living actors who have played the Doctor as them.
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Nov 12, 2014 01:56
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CobiWann posted:I say again, and I apologize for pestering, you should consider putting them online somewhere, there's really insightful and let more people know about Big Finish! Well thanks, but they are online somewhere... right here!  In regards to Big Finish, I am a little upset that they do so many 5/Peri stories. Part of what made Caves of Androzani so good was that the Doctor was so willing to sacrifice everything for a companion he barely knew who had also kind of been foisted upon him. To have their relationship expanded on so much in Big Finish feels like a bit of a misstep, especially considering there's a ready-made gap of unseen adventures experienced by Six/Peri between Revelation of the Daleks and The Mysterious Planet.
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Nov 12, 2014 02:20
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Jerusalem posted:Well thanks, but they are online somewhere... right here! They did all those Six-and-Peri stories in their Lost Stories range. Like, all of them, except I don't think they did Yellow Fever and How To Cure It. They even did some of the "alternate" stories that got passed over for the Trial.
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Nov 12, 2014 02:22
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Oh were those the episodes that were planned for the next season that never got made due to the hiatus? Nightmare Fair and the like? Surely there was still room between those for more Peri/Six? The trouble with the 5/Peri stories is that it retroactively makes his heroics in Caves more about him desperately trying to save a close friend and confidant as opposed to a comparative stranger, and the latter I think was more compelling for the Doctor as a character.
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Nov 12, 2014 02:28
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Jerusalem posted:Oh were those the episodes that were planned for the next season that never got made due to the hiatus? Nightmare Fair and the like? Yeah. They made some other Six/Peri stuff, of course, but not a whole lot of it because the dynamic, frankly, doesn't work. The Twin Dilemma poisoned it. The Lost Stories seem to mostly have been made out of... obligation.
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Nov 12, 2014 02:39
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The only thing I knew about Peri for a long time was a YouTube video assembled from regeneration episodes where Five says something to the effect of, "I'm sorry about this, Peri; I'm afraid my curiosity got the best of me." Knowing what her tension with Six was like because it's the gold standard for toxic Doctor Who production, I had hoped she'd have been with Five long enough that Five fans could feel sorry for her, but nope. That character just got hosed all the way around, hm?
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Nov 12, 2014 02:54
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I honestly can't see how Peri's most famous assets come across over audio. Do they use some really awkward sound effects?
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Nov 12, 2014 03:04
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DoctorWhat posted:Yeah. They made some other Six/Peri stuff, of course, but not a whole lot of it because the dynamic, frankly, doesn't work. The Twin Dilemma poisoned it. The Lost Stories seem to mostly have been made out of... obligation. Colin Baker and Nicola Bryant did play off each other quite well in Zagreus, though.
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Nov 12, 2014 03:04
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Craptacular! posted:The only thing I knew about Peri for a long time was a YouTube video assembled from regeneration episodes where Five says something to the effect of, "I'm sorry about this, Peri; I'm afraid my curiosity got the best of me." Knowing what her tension with Six was like because it's the gold standard for toxic Doctor Who production, I had hoped she'd have been with Five long enough that Five fans could feel sorry for her, but nope. I think having tried out all kinds of different dynamics with Adric/Nyssa/Tegan/Turlough/Kamelion, by that point in the show the writers had a borderline hatred of the necessity for having a companion at all, so Peri gets treated with a fair bit of contempt. Then they cast Bonnie Langford.
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Nov 12, 2014 03:08
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One of the cruelest things I ever did to my fiance was to convince her that David Tennant's last episode was that one before the cliffhanger. I am glad we're perpetrating the same crime on our newby reviewer. Anyway, I had a day off from work and spent the day walking around doing some errands, so I got to hear the entirety of The Reaping and the beginning of The Gathering today. The Cyberman story was pretty normal and bog-standard for them, but the Peri stuff is the closest I've ever come to really liking her as a character, and Six is great in it. I love that in the start of The Gathering, Five listens to a news story from the era he's about to travel to and just kind of casually says "Oh, well, it seems I'm already there, guess I'll go to the second time instead!" The greatest joke is when Six is remarking upon why he likes a certain gravestone and says something like "There's nothing worse than being garish and ostentatious!" Big Finish really needs to pay an American five bucks to scan through their scripts and tell them "Actually, no, nobody says 'must have done' in America," though. Like the accents are funny enough without also having the dialogue written in British English.
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Nov 12, 2014 03:27
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Jerusalem posted:Well thanks, but they are online somewhere... right here! Just to be fair ... considering we change threads about as often as as underwear, saying they're right here is a meaningless statement until archives become searchable, which will happen sometime around the heat death of the universe. I've been thinking about giving the audios a shot again and have always largely liked your insights regarding the TV show and have often thought it would be great if you just had a blogspot or something for reference.
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Nov 12, 2014 03:35
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MrL_JaKiri posted:KNEEL BEFORE THE MIGHT OF SUTEKH Time Warrior is quite yelly too, Irongron going WINE, WINE I SAY! A FEW LOUD NOISES AND BAD SMELLS AND YOU SCATTER LIKE SHEEP! Also, MOCK ME NOT LITTLE TOADFACE!
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