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Secretly hiring assassins is one of the great things about liberal democracies. Not to kill the guy you're at war with, of course, but to off the heads of allied and non-aligned states so they can absorbed? Now that's freedom. Byzantine fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Jan 13, 2015 |
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Jan 13, 2015 17:08
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To be fair the NCR knows House is planning to backstab them and getting you to kill him is just a pro-active defense strategy.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:13
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Byzantine posted:Not to kill the guy you're at war with, of course, but to off the heads of allied and non-aligned states so they can absorbed? Now that's freedom. Because Moore thinks House's securitrons are about to backstab them. Given how the House ending plays out, that's quite a reasonable thought to have. Given how House's network is set up, it seems like that's the only practical way to prevent it happening, too.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:15
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Calling House a "Head of State" is pretty laughable too, given that the "state" he rules is the wasteland equivalent of a failed state a la modern-day North Korea
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Jan 13, 2015 17:18
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A state he started to build 10 years ago. Theres a few locations that even give you the impression that stuffs still being built. Of course if you can't build a bustling city and fix world hunger in 5 years you're obviously poo poo at it and should be beaten to death with a golf club.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:22
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Sheen Sheen posted:Calling House a "Head of State" is pretty laughable too, given that the "state" he rules is the wasteland equivalent of a failed state a la modern-day North Korea not to mention he forcibly seized control himself.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:27
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You know, I just realized that I'm probably ruining the 225-year-long factory automation test going on in Las Vegas Steel by smashing all the robots.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:40
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You can try to claim House could be a positive guiding force but you can't argue he isn't a shitlord. Theres only room for one giant shitlord in Vegas and its me ok.
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Jan 13, 2015 17:48
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Eh, I always found House to be one of the more tolerable options. Yeah he's a tyrant but the thing is he admits it and his attitude toward anyone that doesn't get in the way of his plans is "meh, whatever do what you want." If you work with him he'll take pretty good care of you and really, I'd say an immortal technocrat that doesn't give a poo poo what people do is way better than, you know, Rape Legion.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:11
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Zeron posted:Why wouldn't you want to live in a place where the only penalty for any crime is death by robot? We actually see a few instances of them not doing this is in-game; when they worn the drunk ladies to leave the fountain, when they arrest Heck Gunderson when you frame him for murdering his son and you even ask House about having his securitrons arrest Benny. Still way harsher than the NCR what with the whole gate setup, but the 'they kill you for any crime, ever' thing is more a system limitation than actual plot point, though. Pwnstar posted:You can try to claim House could be a positive guiding force but you can't argue he isn't a shitlord. This is true, but a benevolent courier can bring the best out of him 
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Jan 13, 2015 18:27
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JawKnee posted:not to mention he forcibly seized control himself. Yeah but he didn't seize it from anyone in particular, it as just a bunch of gangs.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:28
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2house2fly posted:Yeah but he didn't seize it from anyone in particular, it as just a bunch of gangs. and installed... a bunch of gangs.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:30
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Eh, I always found House to be one of the more tolerable options. Yeah he's a tyrant but the thing is he admits it and his attitude toward anyone that doesn't get in the way of his plans is "meh, whatever do what you want." If you work with him he'll take pretty good care of you and really, I'd say an immortal technocrat that doesn't give a poo poo what people do is way better than, you know, Rape Legion. Yeah, but his definition of "doesn't get in his way" excludes a Primm which when overrun by bandits and in desperate straits chose to accept NCR protection. I like that bit of the ending, because as much as House wants to portray himself as logical and unfeeling, it shows that ultimately he's altogether too human.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:32
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look, this argument is pointless. We all know Mr. Fantastic and Fisto would be the best president/vice president combo in New Vegas.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:33
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JawKnee posted:not to mention he forcibly seized control himself.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:33
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Raygereio posted:And why is that different then the NCR, Legion, or the Courier forcibly seizing control of territory? Because he's a huge meanie.
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Jan 13, 2015 18:44
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Psion posted:look, this argument is pointless. We all know Mr. Fantastic and Fisto would be the best president/vice president combo in New Vegas. with Yes man as secretary of state
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Jan 13, 2015 18:44
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Raygereio posted:And why is that different then the NCR, Legion, or the Courier forcibly seizing control of territory? Because: NCR are imperialists so any lovely action they do can be excused by the fact the other side deserved it and/or its for their own good. Legion have rape camps your argument is invalid. Courier is a special snowflake so everything he does will turn out to be the right action. Iretep fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Jan 13, 2015 |
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Jan 13, 2015 18:47
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Gyshall posted:with Yes man as secretary of state Primm Slim can be Secretary of Defense.
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Jan 13, 2015 20:11
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JawKnee posted:and installed... a bunch of gangs.
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Jan 13, 2015 23:03
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Wolfsheim posted:This is true, but a benevolent courier can bring the best out of him There are dozens of examples of a benevolent courier bringing out the best of the NCR in the game. How often does a benevolent courier bring out the best of House? \/\/\/\/ Well, that would certainly be my answer, but I wanted to see what a Houseophile said. Sheen Sheen fucked around with this message at 23:19 on Jan 13, 2015 |
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Jan 13, 2015 23:13
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Sheen Sheen posted:There are dozens of examples of a benevolent courier bringing out the best of the NCR in the game. How often does a benevolent courier bring out the best of House? When the courier takes a chainsaw to House' beef jerky body?
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Jan 13, 2015 23:16
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Seashell Salesman posted:What gear, perks, etc. should I aim for on a melee run? I've tried a few times in the past but always got bored of getting shredded by ranged weapons and just quit partway through. At the start of the game, grab a shovel and a stealth boy from Goodsprings and go rob Chance's Grave. You're set for the entire game now.
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Jan 13, 2015 23:37
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Excelzior posted:At the start of the game, grab a shovel and a stealth boy from Goodsprings and go rob Chance's Grave. I've done this and also grabbed a bowie knife from TLR at the start of the game, I've tried going straight into DM and OWB. All of these provide good damage weapons, none of them really address the problem of people shooting and blowing you up as you close distance to them, usually without any available cover.
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Jan 14, 2015 00:00
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Seashell Salesman posted:I've done this and also grabbed a bowie knife from TLR at the start of the game, I've tried going straight into DM and OWB. All of these provide good damage weapons, none of them really address the problem of people shooting and blowing you up as you close distance to them, usually without any available cover. Unfortunately I don't think there really is a good answer to that, unless you get a mod that adjusts your speed with your agility like the stat says it's supposed to. Cranked up endurance and heavy armor. Running to grab Veronica and then sprinting through the BoS questline to get the power armor, I guess. OWB not only has a couple good melee weapons but the implants/modification or whatever they're called to reduce the crippleability of your limbs is nice too. Lots of Med-X.
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Jan 14, 2015 00:14
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Seashell Salesman posted:I've done this and also grabbed a bowie knife from TLR at the start of the game, I've tried going straight into DM and OWB. All of these provide good damage weapons, none of them really address the problem of people shooting and blowing you up as you close distance to them, usually without any available cover. Light armor with the running perk has kept me going for an entire game, no drugs either. Survival let's you heal so fast, you can face tank. Having Ed-E helps a lot though.
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Jan 14, 2015 00:18
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Sheen Sheen posted:There are dozens of examples of a benevolent courier bringing out the best of the NCR in the game. How often does a benevolent courier bring out the best of House? A benevolent courier gets the best ending with House, where you basically continue living in his home and he takes you under his wing. A malevolent courier gets the same accommodations but mostly just out of fear. The implication is that while he's a creepy rear end in a top hat, House still identifies most closely with a person who works towards the common good. If you're asking if you can talk him out if any of his plans or whatever, no, but that's only because they're all already the best course of action to take in his current situation 
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Jan 14, 2015 00:27
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Wolfsheim posted:A benevolent courier gets the best ending with House, where you basically continue living in his home and he takes you under his wing. A malevolent courier gets the same accommodations but mostly just out of fear. The implication is that while he's a creepy rear end in a top hat, House still identifies most closely with a person who works towards the common good. The eternal struggle. House vs. NCR. All you want or ever need vs. the actual attempt to bring decency and order to New Vegas. The benevolent courier will do better with NCR, because the benevolent courier is not in it for themselves but for the good of the many (yes the good old Star Trek II axiom applies here). Benevolence with House is just a word to be used in place of the true word which is selfishness.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:07
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Raygereio posted:And why is that different then the NCR, Legion, or the Courier forcibly seizing control of territory? why does it have to be?
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Jan 14, 2015 01:31
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Look, what it boils down to for me is House saved my life, so I won't take his. And nothing he does in the game is bad enough to change that.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:47
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On the subject of the main quest givers (House, Caeasar, and that NCR guy whose name I don't remember) I was pleasantly surprised that they were all killable. I think outside of children and Yes-Man pretty much everyone in NV is murderable. It's not a super big thing, but I got tired of trying to kill some people in FO3 during a particularly violent run only to be foiled by them getting right back up Right up until I gave up when I learned that Harkness, along with I think a couple of the merchants in Rivet City, is essential for some ungodly reason. I don't even know why, I don't think he's part of any of the main quest line at all.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:47
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Byzantine posted:Look, what it boils down to for me is House saved my life, so I won't take his. And nothing he does in the game is bad enough to change that. p much. anytime i do another path i always feel like a scum bag for killing house. dude saved your life and didn't have to do it. i doubt he would of hunted you down if you had ran off back to the ncr or something.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:48
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Roobanguy posted:p much. anytime i do another path i always feel like a scum bag for killing house. dude saved your life and didn't have to do it. i doubt he would of hunted you down if you had ran off back to the ncr or something. Technically he's also the reason you were shot in the head in the first place. Also, Victor saved your life. At that distance I think it explicitly says that House only has minimal control of his securitrons. Victor was just programmed to get the chip to House and trying to keep you from dying was part of that.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:52
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Roobanguy posted:p much. anytime i do another path i always feel like a scum bag for killing house. dude saved your life and didn't have to do it. i doubt he would of hunted you down if you had ran off back to the ncr or something. The only time I ever really felt like a jerk was when I killed Doc Mitchell. I didn't feel bad the times I killed House because he was basically a lich anyway.
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Jan 14, 2015 01:54
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If you get to Vegas and didn't already track down who stole the chip, House just tells you it was Benny and sends you over there. I don't think he keeps you alive to figure out who stole the chip, but I think he probably did do it on the chance that you would return to him and he could send you off to get it back.
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Jan 14, 2015 02:07
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Garrand posted:Technically he's also the reason you were shot in the head in the first place. Also, Victor saved your life. At that distance I think it explicitly says that House only has minimal control of his securitrons. Victor was just programmed to get the chip to House and trying to keep you from dying was part of that. Victor doesn't have free will, he's just cowboy.exe running on the nearest securitron and following House's orders. House is the only person to actually trust you and help you before you've proven yourself to be a special snowflake. He looks after his employees quite well, in fact. You can't really blame him for you being ambushed either, considering 'transporting valuable things reliably' is literally the job description of a courier, and he even tried to minimize risk by hiring decoys.
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Jan 14, 2015 02:13
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It kind of saddens me that in the end Victor has no real free will and is just another pawn with an implanted personality. He seemed so nice...
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Jan 14, 2015 02:13
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House is just another cult of personality like Caesar. Yeah he says that he's immortal but he is incredibly self-aggrandizing (see: his obituary) and you can see that he's visibly withered and aged if you try and kill him, he may not be a ticking time-bomb like Caesar and his brain tumor but odds are that the even if he isn't assassinated the dude will kick the bucket sooner or later and given his inability and unwillingness to rely on anybody outside of his robots when he dies it's all going to fall apart.
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Jan 14, 2015 03:00
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Sleeveless posted:unwillingness to rely on anybody outside of his robots Yes, the courier should be very familiar with House's unwillingness to rely on non-robots.
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Jan 14, 2015 03:30
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xthetenth posted:Yes, the courier should be very familiar with House's unwillingness to rely on non-robots. Hey, by the end of Old World Blues I'm at least 50% robot...
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Jan 14, 2015 03:32
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