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Rygar201 posted:Giving laptops full of classified data to Glenn Greenwald isn't whistle blowing though But giving laptops full of classified data to your mistress is only worth probation and a fine.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:01
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Zeitgueist posted:sure it is, but it is also treason, that's how we treat whistleblowers What? We have the world's most profitable jails, they must be doing something right!
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Mar 3, 2015 20:01
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Talmonis posted:And yet, here we are. Talking about it. Which we do consistantly, right here in these monthly threads. Regardless of Zeitgeist's eye rolling hyperbole, he's drat lucky he wasn't Russian. He'd be dead by now, like anyone who criticizes Putin and makes too much noise. The "Don't criticize. It is worse in other countries" argument.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:02
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If Snowden isn't an idiot that honestly thought Russia was freer than the US this is just trying to get some more attention for whatever reason.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:02
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Deadulus posted:The "Don't criticize. It is worse in other countries" argument. We are criticizing. But It's rediculous to say things like "He'd be better off in Russia". Because that's bullshit.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:03
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hobbesmaster posted:But giving laptops full of classified data to your mistress is only worth probation and a fine. Trading classified info for sex is a longstanding Washington tradition. Trading classified info for personal publicity is treason.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:04
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I would rather live in Russia than live in American prison.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:05
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hobbesmaster posted:But giving laptops full of classified data to your mistress is only worth probation and a fine. It was worse than laptops, really. Petraeus provided his mistress with access to his handwritten notes that he took while in high-level meetings with the president and other senior officials. They contained things like DoD code words, the identities of secret agents, real crown jewels sorts of stuff.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:06
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hobbesmaster posted:If Snowden isn't an idiot that honestly thought Russia was freer than the US this is just trying to get some more attention for whatever reason. Actually he was on his way to Cuba then Ecuador when they cancelled his passport. The State department then pressured half of Europe to deny Evo Morales' plane permission to fly over their airspace when they thought Snowden was on his plane and searched it despite a sitting head of state being on board. At the time it was Russia or Leavenworth. Now it's Russia without food or Leavenworth.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:07
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zoux posted:I would rather live in Russia than live in American prison. Do you really think they're going to send him to a Supermax? It'd make more sense for him to be sent to a minimum security Federal prison.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:07
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Zeroisanumber posted:It was worse than laptops, really. Petraeus provided his mistress with access to his handwritten notes that he took while in high-level meetings with the president and other senior officials. They contained things like DoD code words, the identities of secret agents, real crown jewels sorts of stuff. And yet the Obama admin has gotten people that leaked far, far less in prison for decades. Talmonis posted:Do you really think they're going to send him to a Supermax? It'd make more sense for him to be sent to a minimum security Federal prison. National security related = ADX Florence.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:07
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hobbesmaster posted:But giving laptops full of classified data to your mistress is only worth probation and a fine. Let's be fair, he didn't give them to his mistress, he gave them to a reporter to get her to be his mistress. Like chocolates or flowers, but for spies and journalists. After that there were no laptops, it was just pillow talk hobbesmaster posted:If Snowden isn't an idiot that honestly thought Russia was freer than the US this is just trying to get some more attention for whatever reason. There is a movie about him being made and he will be speaking (remotely) at SXSW in a few weeks, I think he is set for attention. I expect it is he wants to get the hell out of dodge before Putin really screws him over.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:07
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Talmonis posted:We are criticizing. But It's rediculous to say things like "He'd be better off in Russia". Because that's bullshit. I think you misunderstand. As an American whistle-blower, he's better off in Russia. Even if only so Putin can be smug about it. Though somehow I doubt that's where he wants to be.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:08
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Talmonis posted:Do you really think they're going to send him to a Supermax? It'd make more sense for him to be sent to a minimum security Federal prison. Is your only exposure to Russia the gbs russia.jpg thread or something.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:08
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Zeitgueist posted:sure it is, but it is also treason, that's how we treat whistleblowers Whistle blowing is a defined thing though, you can just leak classified information to journalists and declare yourself a whistle blower, like Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:09
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Aurubin posted:Actually he was on his way to Cuba then Ecuador when they cancelled his passport. The State department then pressured half of Europe to deny Evo Morales' plane permission to fly over their airspace when they thought Snowden was on his plane and searched it despite a sitting head of state being on board. At the time it was Russia or Leavenworth. Now it's Russia without food or Leavenworth.  ADX Florence. Leavenworth is for military gently caress-ups.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:09
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Talmonis posted:Do you really think they're going to send him to a Supermax? Absolutely.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:10
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zoux posted:I would rather live in Russia than live in American prison. Talmonis posted:Do you really think they're going to send him to a Supermax? It'd make more sense for him to be sent to a minimum security Federal prison. Our minimum security Federal prisons are nightmares so that isn't much comfort.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:10
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As far as I'm concerned Snowdens little claim to morality and righteousness ran out the minute he decided to shill for Putin on Russian TV.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:17
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Rexicon1 posted:I can't believe Snowden went over there thinking that's what it was gonna be like. Well he also thought Hong Kong was a libertarian paradise of free speech, so he wasn't exactly geopolitically aware in general.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:18
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Most libertarians are idiots. As are the people who found his "leaks" to be news, more at 11.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:19
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Rygar201 posted:Whistle blowing is a defined thing though, you can just leak classified information to journalists and declare yourself a whistle blower, like Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy. Whistle-blowing is rigidly defined to the detriment of the whistle blower, you say? 
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Mar 3, 2015 20:19
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Politico posted:Rush Limbaugh said Monday that President Obama has been treating Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu like “a white policeman from Ferguson, Missouri.”
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Mar 3, 2015 20:19
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Smart chill goon: NSA guy was a retard, politician people are retards, heh.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:20
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Rygar201 posted:Whistle blowing is a defined thing though, you can just leak classified information to journalists and declare yourself a whistle blower, like Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy. "I'M BLOWING THIS WHISTLE" *toot*--Edward Snowden
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Mar 3, 2015 20:22
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Anyone who found any of the NSA leaks in the past decade surprising are retards. Congress passed the patriot act in loving 2001, something you could find the contents of with google. The government....is watching people? Wire tapping? This is sure surprising to me because I have the political memory of a gold fish and still believe in santa!
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Mar 3, 2015 20:23
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zoux posted:Is your only exposure to Russia the gbs russia.jpg thread or something. Nope, just laughing considering the recent article.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:23
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Rygar201 posted:Whistle blowing is a defined thing though, you can just leak classified information to journalists and declare yourself a whistle blower, like Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy. From what I remember Snowden doesn't qualify for "whistleblower" protections because he was working for a private contractor, not directly for the federal government. And "private contractor" exceptions to employee protection laws are bullshit that needs to be abolished across the board. The proper remedy for Snowden would be a presidential pardon but that will never happen. He's smart to stay foreign and coming back would be a mistake. The only reason he was ever able to tell his side of the story is that he skedaddled.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:24
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Venom Snake posted:Most libertarians are idiots. As are the people who found his "leaks" to be news, more at 11. It saddens me whenever I hear something described as "exposed only because of Snowden" that I knew about for years. I'm not that well connected, I shouldn't be more informed than the media reporting on national security. Uh, AT&T's secret room, hello?
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Mar 3, 2015 20:26
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Americans are more concerned that the government may have an email of theirs in a database somewhere, while 500,000 people in Iraq died because of entirely falsified evidence. As far as I'm concerned Snowden is just a idiot blinded by self righteousness who bought into the same myth most modern day Russiboo's do of Putin being some great leader for responsibility and capitalism.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:29
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Venom Snake posted:Americans are more concerned that the government may have an email of theirs in a database somewhere, while 500,000 people in Iraq died because of entirely falsified evidence. As far as I'm concerned Snowden is just a idiot blinded by self righteousness who bought into the same myth most modern day Russiboo's do of Putin being some great leader for responsibility and capitalism. Yeah but those were brown people and America is really racist.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:30
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Venom Snake posted:Americans are more concerned that the government may have an email of theirs in a database somewhere, while 500,000 people in Iraq died because of entirely falsified evidence. As far as I'm concerned Snowden is just a idiot blinded by self righteousness who bought into the same myth most modern day Russiboo's do of Putin being some great leader for responsibility and capitalism. I am concerned about both things, and many others, as well.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:31
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Trabisnikof posted:It saddens me whenever I hear something described as "exposed only because of Snowden" that I knew about for years. I'm not that well connected, I shouldn't be more informed than the media reporting on national security. Uh, AT&T's secret room, hello? No poo poo. I mean, you had Colbert mocking Bush about it at his Correspondents dinner speech. It was in the NYT in 2005. It was the cover of Wired. But nope, it was Snowden who exposed all this was going on! Not that it was widely acknowledged and just not really discussed. We got some specifics out of it, like the keywords list and project names and the like, but the core bits people get upset about were well known, just ignored.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:31
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Venom Snake posted:Americans are more concerned that the government may have an email of theirs in a database somewhere, while 500,000 people in Iraq died because of entirely falsified evidence. As far as I'm concerned Snowden is just a idiot blinded by self righteousness who bought into the same myth most modern day Russiboo's do of Putin being some great leader for responsibility and capitalism. Not trying to quibble but the total is well over a million. It's important to not round down this number.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:33
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Venom Snake posted:Americans are more concerned that the government may have an email of theirs in a database somewhere, while 500,000 people in Iraq died because of entirely falsified evidence. As far as I'm concerned Snowden is just a idiot blinded by self righteousness who bought into the same myth most modern day Russiboo's do of Putin being some great leader for responsibility and capitalism. You keep saying stuff like this, but if you were Snowden why would you scuttle your pretty much only lifeline in Russia by speaking out against putin? I dont really get where you are coming from
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Mar 3, 2015 20:34
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Trabisnikof posted:It saddens me whenever I hear something described as "exposed only because of Snowden" that I knew about for years. I'm not that well connected, I shouldn't be more informed than the media reporting on national security. Uh, AT&T's secret room, hello? I remember back when Snowden leaked poo poo how many people on this forum swore his leaks wouldn't be forgotten the way say the AT&T room revelation or any of the other spying leaks of the past decades have been forgotten by the general populace. That was good for a laugh.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:34
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zoux posted:I am concerned about both things, and many others, as well. Yeah because the government having the power to look at a email is the same as falsifying evidence that lead to a war that cost over a trillion dollars and killed thousands of American soldiers.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:35
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Venom Snake posted:Yeah because the government having the power to look at a email is the same as falsifying evidence that lead to a war that cost over a trillion dollars and killed thousands of American soldiers. It's not but we also don't have a linear queue of things we need to be worried about in order and can only talk about the top thing on the list. If you think that government espionage against its citizens isn't a concern, you need to have a better argument than "heck, it's not the worst thing they are doing".
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Mar 3, 2015 20:37
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Feral Integral posted:You keep saying stuff like this, but if you were Snowden why would you scuttle your pretty much only lifeline in Russia by speaking out against putin? I dont really get where you are coming from If I were Snowden I wouldn't have thrown my life away for literally nothing, so there's that. He's an idiot, and if was him right now I would just flee to a banana republican and enjoy the rest of my days on a beach before the CIA inevitably takes me and hooks a car battery up to my sack.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:37
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zoux posted:It's not but we also don't have a linear queue of things we need to be worried about in order and can only talk about the top thing on the list. If you think that government espionage against its citizens isn't a concern, you need to have a better argument than "heck, it's not the worst thing they are doing". The point is less that spying on your own citizens is okay, and more that the NSA isn't really any more evil than the CIA being a thing.
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Mar 3, 2015 20:39
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