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monster on a stick posted:We don't know where the money went, it was vague, so the money may very well be at HHM. Then Kim formalizes the deal and gets them to hand over the money. A DA who renegs on plea deals would get shitcanned really quickly, because then all their cases go to trial, wasting time and money. Oh poo poo, also the cash would not be admissable in a trial, due to the chain of evidence being broken.
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Mar 19, 2015 15:34
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wins.
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^^^^ someone should ask their lawyer about this. I would but not at his rate  No Wave posted:I guess I don't really understand how he was supposed to afford what looks like $7k/month offices with no business, or how he was supposed to match Kim's salary with no business, or how loving over Kim's career forever was supposed to make her like him more, especially because she already likes him. Keep in mind a lawyer doesn't necessarily work in a vacuum, in a firm there are other lawyers who may handle the same thing or handle other stuff if the partners are busy. So if you call Wexler & McGill, they may give you McGill for elder or criminal law or whatever, at a reduced rate, with the idea that the junior lawyer is doing most of the work but it's still being passed by the senior lawyer to make sure it's kosher. So McGill gets a huge quality bump out of this. At least this is how it worked at a law firm I'm working with - junior lawyer drafted a letter, partner spent a few minutes looking at it and perhaps made a few suggestions. You get all the quality at a reduced cost, the junior guy is learning something but still produces a quality product and ends up with a nice Avvo rating, and I save money. Everybody wins.
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Mar 19, 2015 15:41
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No Wave posted:I guess I don't really understand how he was supposed to afford what looks like $7k/month offices with no business, or how he was supposed to match Kim's salary with no business, or how loving over Kim's career forever was supposed to make her like him more, especially because she already likes him. Yeah he really needed probably a quarter of a million to renovate that place, put down a deposit and have a few months' rent and utilities on hand, and hire a paralegal and a secretary. Also I thought the 30k was spent getting the billboard and suits so I'm not really sure what the deal was there. Probably falls under "it's a television show don't think about it."
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Mar 19, 2015 15:43
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echronorian posted:it is pretty obvious Jimmy is trying to get his brother interested in law again That and earlier Saul accused Chuck of getting sick because he read about the billboard stunt. Chuck said no, he was sick because he went outside. But maybe Saul showing him he's doing well and has a lot of legitimate clients will also be good for Chuck. Oh yeah, like this guy said: EatinCake posted:I think it has more to do with how Chuck's condition get's better/worse depending on how he thinks Jimmy is doing, so he's trying to get him to not worry about him as much. At the end of the episode where he gets tased, once Jimmy's alleviated his concerns he gets noticeably better.
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Mar 19, 2015 15:48
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I interpreted that whole deal as Jimmy getting way ahead of himself. He clearly wasn't thinking realistically about Kim jumping ship, and he wasn't being realistic about how much money he'd actually be pulling in with elder law. He found a little bit of legitimate success and he instantly went overboard with finding a swanky office ("Gotta look successful to be successful, right?") and trying to lure Kim over, despite her being so close to being partnered with HMM. He figured with the nice office, competent partner and steady clients, he'd be making enough to pay for the office in no time.
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Mar 19, 2015 15:50
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monster on a stick posted:We don't know where the money went, it was vague, so the money may very well be at HHM. Then Kim formalizes the deal and gets them to hand over the money. I was thinking in terms of how it's mentioned the public would want Craig to go away for a long time for this, but maybe you're right.
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Mar 19, 2015 16:09
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There's no reason to think Mike is doing anything weird with the money. They didn't explicitly say where he was taking it in their conversation, because dramatically it works better for that shoe to drop in the next scene. Jimmy probably made a call to the DA's office, pre-emptively said the Kettlemans had taken the deal, and advised them to expect his "courier" with the embezzled funds that day. Regardless, I don't think this is something the show wants us to dwell on or second-guess, because both BB and BCS are written in a very "what you see is what you get" kind of way.
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Mar 19, 2015 16:26
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Mike gave the money to the smoke monster.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:27
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monster on a stick posted:We don't know where the money went, it was vague, so the money may very well be at HHM. Then Kim formalizes the deal and gets them to hand over the money. I think handing the money over to Kim introduces an unnecessary complication. As soon as Betsy Kettleman finds out that "the authorities" don't yet have it, she's going to go all psycho (even more so) and start plotting ways to get it back (unrealistic, of course, but she'll probably think that all she has to do is find just the right thing to say), all the while trying to think of a better hiding place, possibly offering Kim a bribe and/or accusing her of having something to do with having it stolen from the house, and refusing to agree to the deal. The alternative would be to give it to Kim, and she doesn't tell the Kettlemans she has it. But I suspect that would be unethical; if it's not, it should be. In any case, lying to her client, especially about something that big, is probably not a position Kim would want to be in. But if Mike takes it straight to the DA, many of the Kettlemans' decisions are automatically made for them.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:34
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Nail Rat posted:Yeah he really needed probably a quarter of a million to renovate that place, put down a deposit and have a few months' rent and utilities on hand, and hire a paralegal and a secretary. Also I thought the 30k was spent getting the billboard and suits so I'm not really sure what the deal was there. Nah, I think folks are getting the wrong impression. Saul has made some decent, not amazing, but decent money doing elder for real - quite a bit of time passed between episodes I think (at least a month or two). I just think he hates doing it - it's not him. But he's not unsuccessful, either. The $30,000 he was likely able to replace. However, it wouldn't surprise me if the loss of that $30,000 does screw him up as the counted on cushion for renting the new place. We'll have to see there. But everyone thinking Saul isn't really successful, I don't know where you're getting that. He's doing fine at a job I don't think he likes very much.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:50
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Betsy Kettleman is Walter White. A criminal who is in way over their head and making a series of escalatingly bad decisions. I'm excited to see where it goes.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:50
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There was just a lot of weirdness here. Why did Hamlin care so much about keeping the Kettlemans when they'd only be able to bill them for 200 hours, max, and when they didn't have any money anyways? It's not like anyone would think less of a firm for getting dropped by obvious crooks.
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Mar 19, 2015 17:52
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Shbobdb posted:Betsy Kettleman is Walter White. A criminal who is in way over their head and making a series of escalatingly bad decisions. I'm excited to see where it goes. She is going to end up killing Mike.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:09
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No Wave posted:There was just a lot of weirdness here. Why did Hamlin care so much about keeping the Kettlemans when they'd only be able to bill them for 200 hours, max, and when they didn't have any money anyways? It's not like anyone would think less of a firm for getting dropped by obvious crooks. It was a high profile case . Also, he's a dick.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:22
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No Wave posted:I guess I don't really understand how he was supposed to afford what looks like $7k/month offices with no business, or how he was supposed to match Kim's salary with no business, or how loving over Kim's career forever was supposed to make her like him more, especially because she already likes him. The office didn't seem all that big, though it did have some more parts we didn't see (the awesome kitchen for instance), so renovating it probably wouldn't be a huge endeavor. The short version of how the office plan works is that he's doing well enough to have a minimum of $30k on hand, probably closer to $40k+, he knows a way to renovate it on the cheap (because he's Jimmy), and he's only doing it with Kim on board to ease the legal tedium of Elder Law for him. Here's my detailed view of what Jimmy's approach would be, based on my interpretation of the character (because I like  about stuff like this, I guess):FINANCES: -Jimmy is doing enough Elder Law business to have boxes of files sitting at Chuck's place and earn a legit $30k-ish in what seems like a relatively short time. In any event, he certainly doesn't have no business. -Assuming half of the $30k we know he has on hand (since he puts it back with the Kettleman's money) goes to establishing the lease, he's left with $15k. The down payment may be bigger, but since he was already looking at it we have to assume he had the financial means to acquire it in the near future before he gives that money back. -Kim buys into the firm as a full share partner, or co-managing partner. In plainest terms, they each own 50% of it. She likely gives Jimmy a tidy sum to that end, because friends or no that's just what you do. We'll call it $10k, Saul's back up to $25k. It's a BIG risk for Kim, and that along with their friendly relationship means that she can basically set her own price, and Saul would probably let her join as a partner for free, but I also don't see her wanting to get full partner status without chipping any money into the new firm. -Kim's salary is based on the work she does for her clients. Presumably she's doing the hardcore lawyering and Saul's off gathering clients at Bingo. She's not charging as much per hour, but she gets to keep 100% of what she makes instead of the firm charging $300 an hour while she's paid $50 an hour, or the like. Assuming she stays as busy as she is at HHM (a safe assumption given the number of clients Jimmy has and the fact that they'll get more clients with an actual office), Salaries shouldn't be drastically different at first. PERSONNEL -There are a lot of factors at work with Kim's career (Kim being a really good Lawyer with years of experience vs. Hamlin's willingness to gently caress her over). I don't think leaving HHM (even to work for Jimmy) is going to completely ruin her career, but as I've said it's a risk. -Any work that can be done just by Kim and Jimmy is done by them in the beginning. Painting the office, moving furniture, answering the phone, etc. I don't see them hiring on paralegals or secretaries right away. A receptionist is probably a necessity to project a good image, but that's only $8-10 an hour since they just need a pretty body at the door. FURNISHING -Jimmy absolutely has a way or idea to get the rugs, chairs, desks, equipment, and other such items on the cheap through one scheme or another. If nothing else, he knows a lot of old people, and old people tend to have a lot of furniture that they don't need. Getting a $500 couch instead of being paid for a $50 will is a total Jimmy thing to do, in his mind he's just taking something they don't need anyway, or it's a minor exploitation in the name of the greater good. This could have led to a great montage of him febreezing a TON of furniture and/or storing his future office stuff at Chuck's until he moves it in, sadly we won't get to see that. Or he works an angle with pawn shops, or there's some other wackiness I can't even imagine. At any rate, call it $20k in paint, carpet, and various furnishings. It would pretty clearly be the bare minimum, but I trust Jimmy to improvise and make the most out of what he can get his hands on, and it would be LIGHTYEARS ahead of his current office. He'd probably let the view do most of the work for him. -Kim can probably be counted on to furnish her own office, so I don't count that as an expense for Jimmy. Jimmy's not a dumb guy, and I don't expect he would buy the office suite without a strong expectation of his business continuing to grow. What made this episode so crushing is that the Kettlemans were handing him Kim joining the firm on a silver platter, it would just be a matter of time before she got sick of the cornfield, and by defending them he almost certainly keeps the money they gave him so he has the funds to pick up the office. He just has to be selfish to make it happen, but instead he puts Kim (and to a lesser extent the Kettlemans and below even that the county's fiscal wellbeing) first. I will grant that it's not a situation where the show is explicitly laying out how Jimmy is going to pay for setting up the entire office (and given that he doesn't get it rolling that's fine, the time's better spent on other things), but they've shown me enough to where I can believe it's a very real possibility.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:23
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It wouldn't cost even close to 30k to renovate given the location and year. My office in Texas leased a completely new location with a warehouse and loading dock and the bulk of the work to get it prepped cost 20k. A lot of that was installing fixtures and putting in walls and doors, which this suite pretty much already had.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:29
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Do we know for a fact that Jimmy is renovating the new offices himself? I assumed the developers were building the place and he was considering leasing it. My assumption was that he was going to be renting out a brand-new office suite that was about to hit the market. I can rent a much smaller but very nice shared office in the bay area for $600 a month, exclusive of supplies and furniture, and share a receptionist with other renters, in 2015. In Albuquerque in the 90s I doubt even a giant, very nice office would go for something like $10K, unless he was buying it.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:46
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After BCS they need BK:CC, Betsy Kettleman: Career Criminal. Every episode she digs herself a little deeper so the pilot starts with her lying on her tax form about the amount of dependents she has, at about midseason we crossover to the BCS timeline with stealing money from the government, and by the season finale she's on the run from the UN Council for war crimes in Laos.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:49
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Maggie Fletcher posted:Do we know for a fact that Jimmy is renovating the new offices himself? I assumed the developers were building the place and he was considering leasing it. My assumption was that he was going to be renting out a brand-new office suite that was about to hit the market. It's likely the building was renovating it themselves. Probably had a renter for several years who just left and they decided to get new carpet.
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Mar 19, 2015 18:59
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Oh BTW great job whoever decided to follow up Jimmy showing the office to Kim and then having the next shot be a man and woman's hands holding each other. For a second there I thought it was Jimmy and Kim, especially since we hear Kim's voice, but the camera pulls back to reveal that it's the Kettlemans in the HHM conference room.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:02
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Maggie Fletcher posted:Do we know for a fact that Jimmy is renovating the new offices himself? I assumed the developers were building the place and he was considering leasing it. My assumption was that he was going to be renting out a brand-new office suite that was about to hit the market. In the immortal words of Mahatma Gandhi: Who gives a poo poo? My Lord...I know goons are gonna goon, but y'all are about about the most inconsequential poo poo known to man.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:29
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NowonSA posted:The office didn't seem all that big, though it did have some more parts we didn't see (the awesome kitchen for instance), so renovating it probably wouldn't be a huge endeavor. The short version of how the office plan works is that he's doing well enough to have a minimum of $30k on hand, probably closer to $40k+, he knows a way to renovate it on the cheap (because he's Jimmy), and he's only doing it with Kim on board to ease the legal tedium of Elder Law for him. Wow.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:32
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I bet NowonSA threw together a spreadsheet for this.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:35
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I wasn't around for the actual Breaking Bad thread, but I haven't seen anything this autistic since the dissertations on "what is satire" in the South Park thread from several years ago.
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Mar 19, 2015 19:54
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NowonSA posted:The office didn't seem all that big, though it did have some more parts we didn't see (the awesome kitchen for instance), so renovating it probably wouldn't be a huge endeavor. The short version of how the office plan works is that he's doing well enough to have a minimum of $30k on hand, probably closer to $40k+, he knows a way to renovate it on the cheap (because he's Jimmy), and he's only doing it with Kim on board to ease the legal tedium of Elder Law for him. touched by the 'tism
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Mar 19, 2015 20:09
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Actually the money, and Mr. Kettleman, was stabbed
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Mar 19, 2015 20:10
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The office thing is really, really simple: Jimmy was being unrealistic about what he could buy with that bribe money and his elder law income. Once he paid back the bribe money, he could no longer even unrealistically dream about using that office.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:12
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FogHelmut posted:I wasn't around for the actual Breaking Bad thread, but I haven't seen anything this autistic since the dissertations on "what is satire" in the South Park thread from several years ago. Do you not have mirrors in your house?
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Mar 19, 2015 20:15
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What I want to know is why we haven't seen Jimmy (or any of the characters, really) suffer from sort of sepsis or toxic shock syndrome. These characters are almost never shown explicitly urinating or defecating, they obviously have bathrooms but all we ever see is people talking in them. Are we supposed to believe that in the BCS/BB universe people just don't poop, or can hold it for days, weeks, months at a time? One could argue that it shouldn't be an issue since we also rarely see them eat, but that only raises further complications. Why aren't people constantly passing out from hunger or dehydration? How do supermarkets and restaurants stay in business if no one patronizes them? Is the need to eat on a regular schedule some kind of disability or medical condition in the BCS/BB universe? Is Walt Junior's compulsive need to eat breakfast is a complication resulting from his cerebral palsy? If so, consider we also never saw Walt Junior poop, so where did all that turkey bacon and orange juice go? Question after question that is raised and never answered. Vince Gilligan is a loving terrible writer.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:46
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Beef Hardcheese posted:What I want to know is why we haven't seen Jimmy (or any of the characters, really) suffer from sort of sepsis or toxic shock syndrome. These characters are almost never shown explicitly urinating or defecating, they obviously have bathrooms but all we ever see is people talking in them. Are we supposed to believe that in the BCS/BB universe people just don't poop, or can hold it for days, weeks, months at a time? One could argue that it shouldn't be an issue since we also rarely see them eat, but that only raises further complications. Why aren't people constantly passing out from hunger or dehydration? How do supermarkets and restaurants stay in business if no one patronizes them? Is the need to eat on a regular schedule some kind of disability or medical condition in the BCS/BB universe? Is Walt Junior's compulsive need to eat breakfast is a complication resulting from his cerebral palsy? If so, consider we also never saw Walt Junior poop, so where did all that turkey bacon and orange juice go? Question after question that is raised and never answered. Vince Gilligan is a loving terrible writer. A man was seen peeing in this very episode! God do you even watch this show
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Mar 19, 2015 20:52
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There's a reasonable chance that the 'Chicago sunroof' involves urine, as well.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:56
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Beef Hardcheese posted:What I want to know is why we haven't seen Jimmy (or any of the characters, really) suffer from sort of sepsis or toxic shock syndrome. These characters are almost never shown explicitly urinating or defecating, they obviously have bathrooms but all we ever see is people talking in them. Are we supposed to believe that in the BCS/BB universe people just don't poop, or can hold it for days, weeks, months at a time? One could argue that it shouldn't be an issue since we also rarely see them eat, but that only raises further complications. Why aren't people constantly passing out from hunger or dehydration? How do supermarkets and restaurants stay in business if no one patronizes them? Is the need to eat on a regular schedule some kind of disability or medical condition in the BCS/BB universe? Is Walt Junior's compulsive need to eat breakfast is a complication resulting from his cerebral palsy? If so, consider we also never saw Walt Junior poop, so where did all that turkey bacon and orange juice go? Question after question that is raised and never answered. Vince Gilligan is a loving terrible writer. I think you may be on to something. I mean even when Hank was on the toilet we didn't actually hear any bowel movements.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:05
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Sadly it was off the top of my head. To paraphrase Mike, something about the notion that renovating that place was impossible just rubbed me wrong. I'm clearly no expert about this stuff since I didn't even think about the building providing renovations as part of the lease. I'll just keep my overanalyzing to myself going forward, we'll all be the better for it.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:08
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Hobo Clown posted:A man was seen peeing in this very episode! God do you even watch this show When? I like to keep detailed logs on this topic.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:11
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NowonSA posted:The office didn't seem all that big, though it did have some more parts we didn't see (the awesome kitchen for instance), so renovating it probably wouldn't be a huge endeavor. The short version of how the office plan works is that he's doing well enough to have a minimum of $30k on hand, probably closer to $40k+, he knows a way to renovate it on the cheap (because he's Jimmy), and he's only doing it with Kim on board to ease the legal tedium of Elder Law for him.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:18
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Frostwerks posted:When? I like to keep detailed logs on this topic. But this show doesn't have any logs.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:27
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Well clearly SOMEONE must defecate, or there would never have been a sex toilet.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:46
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His name is Chandler
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Mar 19, 2015 22:01
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Bobby Digital posted:But this show doesn't have any logs. 
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Mar 19, 2015 22:54
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NowonSA posted:Sadly it was off the top of my head. To paraphrase Mike, something about the notion that renovating that place was impossible just rubbed me wrong. I would a thousand times rather read an (admittedly a bit spergy) analysis of the Better Call Saul show in the thread devoted to discussing Better Call Saul than a single one of the zero-content no-effort shitposts people responded to your effortpost with.
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Mar 19, 2015 22:57
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