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spasticColon posted:
Hey, there's the 4GB 960 at $240. (don't buy that)
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Mar 19, 2015 19:49
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at the TitanX
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Goonspeed. I hope you get your money's worth. 
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Mar 19, 2015 20:14
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spasticColon posted:
That's my take on it. If I bought a TX I'd feel stupid still using my years-old 2412M, and be more likely to buy a 4K or one of those LG 1440p 21:9 screens, which turns $1k into something closer to $2k.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:24
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Darkpriest667 posted:Yup you get to buy the K6000 which is about 4 grand and has half the VRAM. Funny enough, where VRAM actually loving matters. The 12 GB of VRAM on the Titan X is virtually loving useless to most gamers but EXTREMELY important in compute work. Pretty pathetic. Except the K6000 had 12GB of VRAM too. But don't let the inability to distinguish between 6000 and K6000 get in the way of your rants. :V
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Mar 19, 2015 20:24
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Rastor posted:Hey, there's the 4GB 960 at $240. I know about that card but the memory bus is still 128-bit. 
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Mar 19, 2015 20:25
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spasticColon posted:
I would argue that the stacks of $295 GTX 970 Amazon Warehouse cards are the "mid-range": http://amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00NNXVPS2/ Especially if you can bug Amazon and get them to cough up a Witcher download code which would probably subsidize you another $30-40.
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Mar 19, 2015 20:45
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Zero VGS posted:I would argue that the stacks of $295 GTX 970 Amazon Warehouse cards are the "mid-range": http://amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00NNXVPS2/ I'm not bothered by used cards or whatever, save for the fact that the buy 970, return 270 (or whatever) scam is probably still going strong. It's just not worth the hassle. Card makers should embed an RFID chip under the gpu itself or something else on the PCB that is difficult to remove, so the card can be scanned on return and it's exact details clearly matched against what was purchased.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:04
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EoRaptor posted:I'm not bothered by used cards or whatever, save for the fact that the buy 970, return 270 (or whatever) scam is probably still going strong. It's just not worth the hassle. Wait, what?
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Mar 19, 2015 21:23
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Cat Army 
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The Iron Rose posted:Wait, what? Buying something, taking it out of the box, sticking something else in the box (like rocks even) and returning it (sometimes even re-shrink-wrapping it) is along standing tradition with computer parts. I also commented on how card makers could stop this scam cold.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:46
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BurritoJustice posted:If you'll read Anandtechs report on it BurritoJustice posted:The main people who miss the FP64 performance are people who don't even do anything remotely double precision Gwaihir posted:Sucks for "hobbyists" but realistically the number of people that applies to was vanishingly small in the first place.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:48
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Again, I get it if you needed it that sucks a lot, but in this case being as it is a tradeoff to provide more performance in one metric rather than artificially gimping it its actually less a crappy business practice than usual.
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Mar 19, 2015 21:50
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As a potential Titan X purchaser, I'm glad that I'm not paying more for FP64 silicon and all the associated costs of additional complexity (lower yield, etc). There is no free lunch when it comes to increased die size; are you similarly upset that they didn't add in an extra 16 ROPs for the same price? SLI and CF are infrequently used (though the rate is growing AIUI), but at least they do something valuable to most users: run games faster. FP64 is a total waste of silicon for basically all users. My understanding is that the silicon cost of SLI is also quite small.
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Mar 19, 2015 22:09
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PC LOAD LETTER posted:They've both been doing stuff like gimping in drivers + lasering the die to disable compute performance on their non-pro GPUs for years though. The stuff Anand, you, and Gwhair are talking about is more of a recent development that probably still isn't necessary. Its not like NV or AMD are shy of big die sizes for their GPU's or don't know how to engineer GPU's that turn off the power to un-needed portions of the GPU when in use. Heck isn't AMD supposed to be getting a huge performance increase with this whole HBM thing while still on the same 28nm process from TSMC that NV is using? Well when you talk about halo video cards I don't really know what defines "necessary," but it's just a matter of market research/releasing the best fit product for a given use. If most people only use a card for gaming or DP performance, but not both, then all you're doing is making a worse chip by using up die space for one or the other. Previously Nvidia obviously felt that the DP-compute market alone wasn't sizable enough to warrant the expense of developing and producing a distinct chip, but now they do :???: It's about die space and size more than power. It's just a trade off of what you want to be paying for- Even if FP64 hardware units don't get used and are powered off while gaming, they still take up die space meaning the chip is plain more expensive to make while not adding anything useful. And sure more memory bandwidth thanks to HBM mounts removes a bottleneck at higher resolutions/higher supersampling levels, HBM is an entirely new tech that they're both going to use that's distinct from the process. And memory bandwidth itself is useless without the number crunching power to go with it from the shader blocks. I doubt HBM on it's own does anything dramatic to performance at 1920 or 2560 resolutions, but it probably helps a lot at 4k and would let you turn on much higher levels of SSAA at any res. I don't even know what we're arguing about any more other than that earlier guy moaning that the new titan isn't an FP64 tflops upgrade from Kepler or Fermi. So, sorry, the product isn't for you, I'm sure they'll be releasing something focused in that area before too long I guess, and in the meantime you can get even better deals on the existing king of cheap FP-64 performance?
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Mar 19, 2015 22:22
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PC LOAD LETTER posted:They've both been doing stuff like gimping in drivers + lasering the die to disable compute performance on their non-pro GPUs for years though. The stuff Anand, you, and Gwhair are talking about is more of a recent development that probably still isn't necessary. Its not like NV or AMD are shy of big die sizes for their GPU's or don't know how to engineer GPU's that turn off the power to un-needed portions of the GPU when in use. Heck isn't AMD supposed to be getting a huge performance increase with this whole HBM thing while still on the same 28nm process from TSMC that NV is using? It really, really was necessary. At 601mm² GM200 is the biggest die NVidia has ever produced, one of the highest chunks of silicon you can buy these days. Making it hugely larger for niche FP64 performance is moronic, increasing prices/temperatures/power draw for tiny benefit, not to mention being seriously difficult if not impossible to engineer because GM200 is already loving ginormous. Do you seriously think that specialisation that benefits the market it is aimed at is "crappy business practises"? The TitanX isn't gimped, its a better card for the people that will be buying it. There are other, now cheaper, options for people who need FP64. Specialisation, not arbitrary segmentation. There is a huge difference.
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Mar 19, 2015 22:45
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My question for potential TitanX buyers, and I don't mean to be rude, but aren't you worried than when Pascal comes out next year their 980 equivalent will likely blow away the TitanX for half the price? That's pretty much what happened with the 900-series unless my memory is hazy. I guess I just can't justify spending $1-1.5k on a card that will be "out of date" in a year. In terms of G-sync and Freesync: I wonder how long before the first 1440p Freesync monitor comes along, and whether or not Nvidia will forever push Gsync or adopt the new Display port standard and use it? Don't get me wrong, I want that 1440p IPS gsync monitor I've mentioned a bunch of times in this thread, but if I'm prepared to wait another year for a better card I wonder if Nvidia will adopt Freesync by then, or if they ever will? Swartz fucked around with this message at 23:31 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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Mar 19, 2015 23:27
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Swartz posted:My question for potential TitanX buyers, and I don't mean to be rude, but aren't you worried than when Pascal comes out next year their 980 equivalent will likely blow away the TitanX for half the price? That's pretty much what happened with the 900-series unless my memory is hazy. Yeah but that applies to almost every high end video card, if you wait a year you can probably get the same performance for half the price. Hell, depending on when the AMD cards come out you might be able to get nearly the same performance for much cheaper in a matter of a few months. I think most people who buy this thing realize this and are willing to pay to have the performance now rather than in a few months time.
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Mar 19, 2015 23:33
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EoRaptor posted:I'm not bothered by used cards or whatever, save for the fact that the buy 970, return 270 (or whatever) scam is probably still going strong. It's just not worth the hassle. I've bought a fuckton of secondhand PC doodads for decades now and I've never once seen that. Nor have I seen anyone in the parts thread or here claim something like that happening, and you can bet they'd be posting about it. 1) If you ever get a brazen box-of-rocks switcharoo and file a chargeback with your credit card, they'll probably take your side. Even if they don't, Amazon/eBay and everyone else are extremely slanted to the buyer's side of things. 3) If stuff is being re-shrinkwrapped and returned as "unopened", then buying new isn't going to save you anyways. Seriously, it is a pretty silly objection to saving a good chunk of money. Now, sure, some people get a DOA card and return that and it can wind up resold as an Open Box, you can usually either get paid return shipping with that or just get an RMA with the card maker. It could not be worth the hassle if your time is valuable, that'd be a valid argument. But the guy I was replying to was saying there needs to an intermediate card between the $200-$330 pricing and I'm saying if you have $200 to spend on a GPU and can't possibly afford $330, then you should be trying to find a deal on the $330 cards instead of asking for some gimpy $250 960ti thingy. Swartz posted:My question for potential TitanX buyers, and I don't mean to be rude, but aren't you worried than when Pascal comes out next year their 980 equivalent will likely blow away the TitanX for half the price? That's pretty much what happened with the 900-series unless my memory is hazy. If you have to worry about the price depreciation of a $1000 GPU, then a $1000 GPU isn't for you.
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Mar 19, 2015 23:38
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Swartz posted:My question for potential TitanX buyers, and I don't mean to be rude, but aren't you worried than when Pascal comes out next year their 980 equivalent will likely blow away the TitanX for half the price? That's pretty much what happened with the 900-series unless my memory is hazy. I'm sure there are people who are buying these things that really can't afford them or are banking on future-proofing or whatever, but at least for me it's a priorities thing. I like PC gaming, spending money on neato things, running games on a 21:9 inch monitor have having them look great, having a trackir struck to my headphones, a Rift on my desk and a buttkicker strapped to my chair. I did not buy a Titan X for a value proposition, I bought it because I want to run games without SLI well. I'm sure you know this, but everything is obsolete very quickly. Did you know that the card that comes out after the 980 equivalent will blow it away as well? efb on the card power thing
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Mar 19, 2015 23:40
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I find that buy selling my cards early enough I dont really lose money anyways. Frankly if I adopt as early as possible, and sell before next gen, I get my money's worth despite price drops (which take a long time, and are fairly minor considering the time involved). I actually bought and sold so many cards I have a 980 now for free + a little  but that's a different thing, and was never really the goal. For a while I was several hundred up but I kept my 780ti 2 weeks too long and lost $300 on it (+ G10 bracket + Kraken x40) due to the 970 surprise. Tough lesson, one I already knew too. Still in the green however. I'd buy a TitanX if it was in my budget but it is just not.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:04
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Swartz posted:In terms of G-sync and Freesync: I wonder how long before the first 1440p Freesync monitor comes along, and whether or not Nvidia will forever push Gsync or adopt the new Display port standard and use it? Seems unlikely that nvidia will adopt. Hell, I've already seen people online saying G-sync is "better" and stuff. At the very least they will cash in on the licensing as long as they can.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:17
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Swartz posted:My question for potential TitanX buyers, and I don't mean to be rude, but aren't you worried than when Pascal comes out next year their 980 equivalent will likely blow away the TitanX for half the price? That's pretty much what happened with the 900-series unless my memory is hazy. Honestly, there will always be a newer, shinier card around the corner, so unless that new Pascal is going to replace the GTX Titan X in about a month or something, I wouldn't pay it no mind. I wouldn't expect NVIDIA to support FreeSync any time soon. They sunk a bit of money into G-Sync, and as right now, G-Sync seems to be the superior solution seeing as its current implementation can support 30 FPS and does not produce any ghosting. Maybe in about half a decade they'll adopt it if Intel has already done so before them and AMD ironed out all of the kinks. If you're fine for another year, then wait.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:21
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If I buy a TitanX it'll be because I want to have a great gaming experience for the next year. I'm pretty confident that it will provide that.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:27
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MaxxBot posted:Yeah but that applies to almost every high end video card, if you wait a year you can probably get the same performance for half the price. future ghost fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Mar 20, 2015 |
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Mar 20, 2015 00:40
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beejay posted:Hell, I've already seen people online saying G-sync is "better" and stuff. GrizzlyCow posted:G-Sync seems to be the superior solution seeing as its current implementation can support 30 FPS and does not produce any ghosting. Maybe in about half a decade they'll adopt it if Intel has already done so before them and AMD ironed out all of the kinks. haha. Anyway, what is this 30fps thing? Not something I have heard.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:51
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beejay posted:haha. Anyway, what is this 30fps thing? Not something I have heard. The two FreeSync monitors that you can actually buy right now have high minimum refresh rates (48hz and 56hz), and below those points the experience is really bad, essentially. PCPer also noticed large amounts of ghosting on FreeSync monitors versus identically specced GSync monitors. Link is up the page for more info, including how GSync manages to stay good under its minimum refresh using smart framebuffer tricks.
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Mar 20, 2015 00:57
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beejay posted:haha. Anyway, what is this 30fps thing? Not something I have heard. Because a G-Sync-enabled monitor has a memory buffer on the monitor, it can continue to refresh a frame indefinitely with no loss of visual fidelity. Like, you could hack it to turn it into a very expensive picture frame, if you wanted to. Because Freesync does not make use of a memory buffer, and merely refreshes what the existing pixels are already displaying by re-energizing them, what happens over time as a Freesync monitor continues to sit on a frame is that it begins to wash out to white. If the framerate drops, and the interval between refreshes goes long enough as a result, our eyes perceive this effect of washing out dozens of times per second as flickering. So we've got a problem: G-Sync modules drive the cost of adaptive refresh up, which means that you're not going to get its benefits unless you shell out the extra dough. Conversely, Freesync doesn't work well unless you've got a beefy video video card, which means you'd better spend a little extra to make sure your framerate stays above 36/48/whatever minimum. The budget PC gamer buying a new video card is still hosed either way. SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Mar 20, 2015 |
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Mar 20, 2015 01:08
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So when the new AMD card comes out, what's going to be easier to sell, 2 980s or a single Titan X ? Rather, which will take the bigger hit. I'm guessing the 980s.
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Mar 20, 2015 01:17
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veedubfreak posted:So when the new AMD card comes out, what's going to be easier to sell, 2 980s or a single Titan X ? Titans have always held value well. The OG Titan is performance on par to slower than a 970 but still sell for 600-700~. You can get second hand titan blacks more easily than used titans, bizarrely.
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Mar 20, 2015 01:23
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veedubfreak posted:So when the new AMD card comes out, what's going to be easier to sell, 2 980s or a single Titan X ? As long as they're still being sold (and there isn't a 1080 or 1070) I've found the resale value is excellent. However, the 980 is the one nvidia card I can see getting price cuts. I think the ball is more in AMD's court for that though with their release as to what happens to the price of the 980. Titan's seem to hold value even when it was always a bad gaming value card. However, I remember you saying you got yours for $450 a pop so I wouldn't worry either way tbh edit: if you were looking for advice (I know you arent asking for it lol) I'd probably sell 2x 980's and get a titan x, particularly if I wasn't going to lose money on it like in your case. Even as someone who supports SLI more than most, if there is ever a single card that performs similar for a similar amount of money I would go single card every single time. Usually higher end SLI cards crush single cards enough (per dollar, at least) to justify possible issues with it but the Titan x just seems so close. The only issue is in benchmarks the OC Titan X comes close to 980 SLI... non-oc'd. There is a lot on the table after you OC the two 980's I'm sure however the margin is quite a bit smaller than it has been in the past. The only way I'd consider keeping 2x 980s in this case is if I was already on edge for what I wanted performance wise. Conversely, I just dumped a 970 for a 980 and I dont know why. I'd have been much better off with another 970, but perhaps in the back of my head I think I'll SLI it later. Not to say the 980 sucks, its really good. 1gnoirents fucked around with this message at 02:09 on Mar 20, 2015 |
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Mar 20, 2015 01:26
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Subjunctive posted:If I buy a TitanX it'll be because I want to have a great gaming experience for the next year. I'm pretty confident that it will provide that. well for $1000 you'd hope
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Mar 20, 2015 02:09
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1gnoirents posted:As long as they're still being sold (and there isn't a 1080 or 1070) I've found the resale value is excellent. However, the 980 is the one nvidia card I can see getting price cuts. I think the ball is more in AMD's court for that though with their release as to what happens to the price of the 980. Titan's seem to hold value even when it was always a bad gaming value card. However, I remember you saying you got yours for $450 a pop so I wouldn't worry either way tbh That's what I'm debating. If I can get my hands on a single Titan X I'll probably pick it up and flip these 980s. I'm probably one of the few edge cases where 12gb of memory might end up useful. Plus that neat little script someone coded for switching between surround and extended doesn't seem to work with SLI.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:30
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could always get two titan x's Btw for those who want compute, you'll have to wait another gen, soiunds like it'll be worth it though quote:In fact, the company is touting Pascal as having roughly 10 times the power of its current flagship card, the Titan X. EDIT: That's in terms of CUDA compute performance—definitely impressive, but don't expect the first Pascal card to actually deliver 10 times the gaming performance levels of the Titan X.
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Mar 20, 2015 02:38
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Anyone wager what a pair of 5850s with water blocks are worth on Craigslist? I'm reaching the "oh poo poo" point financially and need to dump these things for cash. Alternately, anyone wanna buy a pair of 5850s with water blocks? 
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Mar 20, 2015 03:12
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Gwaihir posted:... beejay posted:Hell, I've already seen people online saying G-sync is "better" and stuff. GrizzlyCow posted:G-Sync seems to be the superior solution seeing as its current implementation can support 30 FPS and does not produce any ghosting
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Mar 20, 2015 03:23
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Was really kind of hoping freesync would be exactly the same to push gsync modules out of the picture but if it is indeed better... oh well, more money gone in my future
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Mar 20, 2015 03:59
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Oh wow, great timing with that article. I await the formal review with bated breath.
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Mar 20, 2015 04:00
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Anandtech has a review as well and also saying they are basically the same performance wise. http://www.anandtech.com/show/9097/the-amd-freesync-review
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Mar 20, 2015 04:34
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good
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Mar 20, 2015 04:49
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1gnoirents posted:good Anandtech doesn't go anywhere near the depth that PCPer did, and what PCPer have to say on motion blur and low-Hz performance is pretty compelling for GSync.
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Mar 20, 2015 05:34
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Zero VGS posted:If you have to worry about the price depreciation of a $1000 GPU, then a $1000 GPU isn't for you. To say nothing of the fact that Pascal might come in both PCIe and NVLink versions, the latter of which might end up being the 'smoking gun' a lot of people have been waiting for to finally ditch their Sandy and Ivy Bridge chips. Full system upgrades generally run anywhere from $1500-2000, depending on what you can grandfather over to the new build, which going to Broadwell or Broadwell-E won't be a whole hell of a lot. PSU, sound card (if applicable), SSDs, and optical drives, and you'll probably be factoring in an SATA Express or M.2 SSD to replace your old 2.5" form-factor boot drives. BIG HEADLINE fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Mar 20, 2015 |
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Mar 20, 2015 05:37
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