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Re all the "bench Hai/Balls" chat: it's a shame M3 didn't get relegated, we could have seen C9 Looper/Dade (both were close to signing with C9T over the offseason)
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Apr 20, 2015 17:36
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archduke.iago posted:Re all the "bench Hai/Balls" chat: it's a shame M3 didn't get relegated, we could have seen C9 Looper/Dade (both were close to signing with C9T over the offseason) Dade has fully given up though at this point.
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Apr 20, 2015 17:37
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archduke.iago posted:Re all the "bench Hai/Balls" chat: it's a shame M3 didn't get relegated, we could have seen C9 Looper/Dade (both were close to signing with C9T over the offseason) Re: this concept. I wonder if Starhorn Royal Club will break up now that they got relegated in China. Although I don't know which if any of their players would want to move somewhere else.
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Apr 20, 2015 17:38
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Libertine posted:Re: this concept. I feel like Insec will definitely not lose his career and could make another international move, but you have to feel Namei's mystique will have run out. The rest I'm sure will get games in China on that roster or elsewhere.
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Apr 20, 2015 17:39
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Libertine posted:Re: this concept. You could put together a theoretical zombie roster of WFX Seraph/Insec/Pobelter/Altec/Zero if you wanted to pillage SHRC, Altec is probably skilled enough to act as the Uzi. Problems include no real support staff and Seraph being forced onto non carry champs.
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Apr 20, 2015 17:45
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archduke.iago posted:Problems include
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Apr 20, 2015 17:46
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archduke.iago posted:Re all the "bench Hai/Balls" chat: it's a shame M3 didn't get relegated, we could have seen C9 Looper/Dade (both were close to signing with C9T over the offseason) The rumor I heard was that c9 wanted to make an offer to Dade but it wasnt even 20% what royal offered. I wouldn't call that close.
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Apr 20, 2015 19:25
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Sereph is a good utility-based top laner, but the issue is that he's been on teams that have been absolutely toxic garbage and he tilts just as hard as anyone when the team environment is so bad. He's already considered an exempt non-resident so he can fill a spot on any NA team without using up their Korean/EU import slots. He'd honestly be an upgrade on a lot of teams as long as he doesn't end up on a team like CLG where everyone is arguing and nobody wants to practice. Namei was still considered one of the best AD Carries in the world this most recent season too. There's nothing wrong with Zero or InSec either, just makes me think that when the Koreans flooded into China, there were much better combinations than an okay Korean support, a fluctuating aggressive jungler, and a solid safe-style ADC. I can see InSec trying his hand in NA or EU, I don't think he wants to go back to Korea (I haven't heard a single player talk about wanting to go back to Korea after leaving -- MakNoon straight up retired) It's still a bit of an iffy with the Koreans in China right now. I can't imagine that buying their contracts out, even if the team has been relegated, will be cheap. If anything, I feel like these lovely Chinese organizations would basically hold the players hostage until they can sell their contracts out for some outrageous amount. I really like the way Loco talked about integrating Lustboy into TSM, making sure he fit in with everyone, making sure he was speaking English during practice to become more fluent, making sure he wasn't lonely. We're starting to see that a little more now than last season and the seasons before. Team Liquid is taking care of Piglet, Winterfox all seem to get along really well (Besides lovely management) and Fnatic are doing really well for themselves. Impulse, against all odds, look like the happiest team in the world outside of games. If anyone's looking for Junglers in NA, I think they should take a look at players like Eve from Samsung -- still a bit rough, but if you take care of them I think they'll do extremely well after their first split in NA. KicksYouInHalf posted:The rumor I heard was that c9 wanted to make an offer to Dade but it wasnt even 20% what royal offered. I wouldn't call that close.
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Apr 20, 2015 19:58
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Lustboy has talked about how much better the environment is in NA both in terms of how fans behave and how the management treats players, to the point that he apparently has nightmares over her experience there. I'm glad he's happy now  The point is that Korea's environment is apparently lovely enough that it is infinitely better to stay in a region that is still not super competitive internationally or just retire than go back.
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Apr 20, 2015 20:02
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Dumb random question- during games, what do the coaches and other team staff watch backstage? Do they see the same thing the audience does sans audio? Are they able to listen to team communications without speaking to the team themselves?
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Apr 20, 2015 20:33
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pahuyuth posted:Dumb random question- during games, what do the coaches and other team staff watch backstage? Do they see the same thing the audience does sans audio? Are they able to listen to team communications without speaking to the team themselves?
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Apr 20, 2015 20:38
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The EU series seems to have developed a tradition of having coaches watch from the front of the audience, the stream shows reaction shots a bunch.
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Apr 20, 2015 20:45
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Okay. I was basically just wondering how much, if any, of the play by play or game analysis is heard by coaches and then communicated to the team after a match. Like for example, and I'm paraphrasing here, "loving PICK/BAN SEJUANI YOU DOLTS". The analysts sometimes (always? for some teams) seem to have a better idea of why a team is losing/winning than the coaches presumably do (based on performance in subsequent games) and I wondered if it was against the LCS rules for coaches to hear any sort of analysis in real-time.
isaboo fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Apr 20, 2015 |
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Apr 20, 2015 20:51
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pahuyuth posted:Okay. I was basically just wondering how much, if any, of the play by play or game analysis is heard by coaches and then communicated to the team after a match. Like for example, and I'm paraphrasing here, "loving PICK/BAN SEJUANI YOU DOLTS".
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Apr 20, 2015 20:55
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Sports announcers are really just there to blather, not to be right about anything important. LCS is the same way. If a coach can pick up anything of value from listening to them he is so bad that his team is hosed anyway.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:01
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i really think Incarnation will be sick for C9 and should sort a lot of problems. ppl talk about Hai's shot calling a lot, but it's worth remembering that Incarnation coached a (mechanically pretty weak in a lot of areas) SK to worlds, and it seems to me like his influence on their play at that time was pretty big.. also so many people have been repping his strength as a mid, even tho he's still untested in pro play. febiven and nuke have both said he's the best mid in EU a bunch of times.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:01
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Incarnation is basically the western Apdo. I think nearly any team in the LCS would get better by adding him. Maybe the only teams I wouldn't put him on are TSM (who already has a great mid) and... H2K? Maybe?
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Apr 20, 2015 21:02
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SC Bracer posted:Lustboy has talked about how much better the environment is in NA both in terms of how fans behave and how the management treats players, to the point that he apparently has nightmares over her experience there. I'm glad he's happy now Lustboy showed up to NA and instantly became top 3 for supports with aphro and xpecial, this season clearly number 1 above all other NA and probably best in NA and EU (EU is trash and I refuse to watch the shitshow). He makes better money, is a star in his region, has to be drowning in fangirls (or guys), and has a team of people that are having a good time doing their jobs. NA for Lustboy is incredibly good.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:10
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Flameingblack posted:Probably not any, since you always see people arguing with Locodoco over who made a bad-call in game and there's no way for him to just check on it himself. The TL reality show thing has clips of their ingame comms layered over some of their matches which don't seem to be the snippets Riot releases publically, so I think the teams might actually get copies of their own audio?
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Apr 20, 2015 21:12
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Apprentice Dick posted:Lustboy showed up to NA and instantly became top 3 for supports with aphro and xpecial, this season clearly number 1 above all other NA and probably best in NA and EU (EU is trash and I refuse to watch the shitshow). He makes better money, is a star in his region, has to be drowning in fangirls (or guys), and has a team of people that are having a good time doing their jobs. NA for Lustboy is incredibly good. You add to that that CJ is famously an awful org to work in, or was - Blaze in particular.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:13
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What makes you guys think Incarnation will be like a panacea for whoever signs him? He seems like a completely untested quantity to me, and there are lots of people who do just as well in solo queue as he does who have never even sniffed competitive or have tried at it and failed. Like if I was a really struggling team I might try him out, but I wouldn't throw out a long experienced competitive player for him.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:19
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IXIX posted:The TL reality show thing has clips of their ingame comms layered over some of their matches which don't seem to be the snippets Riot releases publically, so I think the teams might actually get copies of their own audio? Yea the teams can request their comms. Montecristo did that, and when asked why CLG sucked a dick that day on summoning insight he'd always say, 'I dont know I havent gotten the comms yet..." In the semi finals video for TSM Legends they also put some scenes with the comms on there and lemme tell you, TSMs comms compared to any other team I've seen are ridiculously clean. Its a high stakes team fight and Bjerg is just calmly saying,"I'm going around, keep chasing, I'll get apollo." Where as once you clean all the distortion from a FNC comm file its just huni yelling unintelligible gibberish for 40 minutes straight Libertine posted:What makes you guys think Incarnation will be like a panacea for whoever signs him? He seems like a completely untested quantity to me, and there are lots of people who do just as well in solo queue as he does who have never even sniffed competitive or have tried at it and failed. Its a bet on talent. As a league prospect this guy is like 80 mechanics, 80 champ pool, 80 upside. Because theres no minor league LAN you can't put a number on his LAN play, but it doesnt matter. Are you going to get anyone who is even close to his skill that also has shown ability on LAN? Probably not. There are 2 team situations where Incarnation makes sense: 1. A team full of other up and coming talent that you're trying to develop into an LCS team, essentially C9 2.0. Or 2. A team full of veterans that are very good that can carry incarnation through growing pains while making use of whatever promise he shows on LAN, aka C9 1.0 Just like in Sports, any big market team that wants to win would prefer to acquire young talent after its already been vetted by breaking in on a weaker team. No one likes to trade for the prospect thats only had time in AAA if they are expected to start. Unfortunately Incarnation wouldnt be as much of a help to C9 next season if they had to wait for him to suffer through a spin another team for 1 split. TSM got extraordinarily lucky to grab Bjergsen after he did develop on a loser team for a bit. Same with Santorin. Jerkface fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Apr 20, 2015 |
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Apr 20, 2015 21:20
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Libertine posted:What makes you guys think Incarnation will be like a panacea for whoever signs him? He seems like a completely untested quantity to me, and there are lots of people who do just as well in solo queue as he does who have never even sniffed competitive or have tried at it and failed. Yeah, I don't know why you pin your hopes on a guy with no competitive experience in the short term. I believe some of the hype about his mechanics but he's probably not going to take over as primary shotcaller. He's a good long term investment for c9, or good for a team that has great shotcalling from elsewhere than mid.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:25
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Libertine posted:What makes you guys think Incarnation will be like a panacea for whoever signs him? He seems like a completely untested quantity to me, and there are lots of people who do just as well in solo queue as he does who have never even sniffed competitive or have tried at it and failed. He's consistently been the number one challenger player on both EU servers multiple times and across consecutive seasons, and he has experience successfully coaching one of the better LCS teams. It's just really hard for me to see a way that those two things don't equal success, but you're right, he is an unproven quantity. I'm just making a guess, but I suspect he would immediately be a top 2 or 3 midlaner in whatever region he chooses to go to.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:25
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Libertine posted:What makes you guys think Incarnation will be like a panacea for whoever signs him? He seems like a completely untested quantity to me, and there are lots of people who do just as well in solo queue as he does who have never even sniffed competitive or have tried at it and failed. his coaching for SK seemed incredibly good and did a lot for the team, so i think he'll be very sound at decision making and rotations, for one thing and normally i'm really doubtful of solo q superstar kinda dudes (like ppl always saying pobelter is a god lol) but his dominance over eu challenger has been insane, way more so than anyone else i can think of. every single eu mid laner seems to think he's the poo poo. it just seems like he is the real deal man i dunno. now i gotta rewatch this poo poo... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUh_XcG_3Hs e. also he's loving danish (like they all are) if anyone's gonna start standing up to bjerg in na it will be him Lovechop fucked around with this message at 21:30 on Apr 20, 2015 |
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Apr 20, 2015 21:28
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Also where is this developed talent for a short term fix? No one in the na challenger scene is world class, there are some eu mids that are good but already on established teams that are about as good as an eu team can be, and the Koreans are tied up in Chinese contracts worth millions. The gamble needs to be taken because there just isn't viable talent that doesn't need a ton of development to begin with.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:30
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SC Bracer posted:Also where is this developed talent for a short term fix? No one in the na challenger scene is world class, there are some eu mids that are good but already on established teams that are about as good as an eu team can be, and the Koreans are tied up in Chinese contracts worth millions. The gamble needs to be taken because there just isn't viable talent that doesn't need a ton of development to begin with. People always say this but good players break out as top tier players every year from nowhere.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:39
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Disinterested posted:People always say this but good players break out as top tier players every year from nowhere. Oh I agree. But they're also gambles in terms of making the jump to being truly world class. There is no established affordable world class player readily available to c9 that we know of that won't have to go through growing pains imo. Even c9 in their insane rookie season got spanked at worlds.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:46
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the best argument for new talent was all the mid laners in EU challenger last split - fox, febiven and PoE were all absolute animals. i dunno how all those NA teams with bad mid laners can complain when there's talent like that floating about, could have picked any of those man up.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:55
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SC Bracer posted:Oh I agree. But they're also gambles in terms of making the jump to being truly world class. There is no established affordable world class player readily available to c9 that we know of that won't have to go through growing pains imo. Even c9 in their insane rookie season got spanked at worlds.
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Apr 20, 2015 21:58
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Forgiven is doing AMA on reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/339wrn/konstantinos_forg1ven_tzortziou_ama/ Had an interesting comment about Rekkles: Forgiven posted:I will try to give a pretty circular answer here. I also wonder what rekkles is going to do next. This is a pretty decent AMA, Forgiven is nothing if not honest in these kinds of scenarios. He also talks about SK needing to work together better, he says they all try to one man hero-ball too much.
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Apr 20, 2015 22:25
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K8.0 posted:Sports announcers are really just there to blather, not to be right about anything important. LCS is the same way. If a coach can pick up anything of value from listening to them he is so bad that his team is hosed anyway. Now imagine a coach that's legitimately competent and knows the analyst desk is 100% correct, and there's nothing they can do to fix it. The life of a coach. quote:You add to that that CJ is famously an awful org to work in, or was - Blaze in particular. Can you imagine going from Captain Jack to WildTurtle?
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Apr 20, 2015 22:40
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SC Bracer posted:Lustboy has talked about how much better the environment is in NA both in terms of how fans behave and how the management treats players, to the point that he apparently has nightmares over her experience there. I'm glad he's happy now While I'm sure Korean fans can be quite terrible, this seems like an easy thing to say when you're on top. Faker probably doesn't take much flak, while someone like Seraph got completely eviscerated by CLG fans and the community in general. Spirit is cute and very talented and on the perennial darling LPL team, so he has a massive fan following. Players like Xiye and Yuzhe who are even on the same team take all the abuse when they gently caress up.
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Apr 20, 2015 22:48
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Apprentice Dick posted:Lustboy showed up to NA and instantly became top 3 for supports with aphro and xpecial, this season clearly number 1 above all other NA and probably best in NA and EU (EU is trash and I refuse to watch the shitshow). He makes better money, is a star in his region, has to be drowning in fangirls (or guys), and has a team of people that are having a good time doing their jobs. NA for Lustboy is incredibly good. The Lustboy/WildTurtle duo wasn't particularly good when Lustboy first joined. They didn't really start to gel until playoffs where they became a really good duo and Lustboy cemented himself as a top support in NA.
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Apr 20, 2015 22:54
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A bit late, but talking about what made the EU finals sloppy; mostly it was an inability to understand power spikes properly and playing their comps badly that resulted in losses, it seems. This was really obvious in game 5 when Unicorns picked a scaling comp but fought during the Rumble/Ahri spikes. And in general, because they all skirmished, the team with the earlier spike won.Redmark posted:While I'm sure Korean fans can be quite terrible, this seems like an easy thing to say when you're on top. Faker probably doesn't take much flak, while someone like Seraph got completely eviscerated by CLG fans and the community in general. I've heard it discussed by Chobra and others but Korean fans are more..clinical with their criticism, rather than directly hateful, but it still stings. It definitely might be just that Lustboy was stuck on a flagging CJ for awhile and suffered because of the high expectations of CJ fans over a long period
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Apr 20, 2015 23:06
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CJ Entus was just a very stubborn organization in general, who wouldn't replace players no matter how poorly they were doing, and they never really seemed to direct their players around much either. Eventually it worked out, Space and Coco got a whole lot better, but probably only because the talent pool in Korea got a whole lot smaller. Coco only has to compete against GBM, Faker, and occasionally Easyhoon (GE Tigers are an all-around team that just had really, really good synergy)
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Apr 20, 2015 23:26
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Hypocrisy posted:The Lustboy/WildTurtle duo wasn't particularly good when Lustboy first joined. They didn't really start to gel until playoffs where they became a really good duo and Lustboy cemented himself as a top support in NA. So..... after like 3 weeks in NA on a new team.
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Apr 20, 2015 23:26
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Deft and Pawn claim that Korea still smashes them in scrims though, but that might just be teamwork and communication more than anything Bonus: An interview with Deficio about what he did to improve with his language and analysis. Amazing how much he does and how far hes gone.
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Apr 20, 2015 23:31
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Sexpansion posted:Incarnation is basically the western Apdo. I think nearly any team in the LCS would get better by adding him. Maybe the only teams I wouldn't put him on are TSM (who already has a great mid) and... H2K? Maybe? from apdo's lolwiki "Riot Korea ended up banning Apdo for 1000 years because of his elo boosting service. A girl, famous in the Korean LoL scene for wanting to seduce pro players, had a crush on Apdo. Apdo who, at the time, had a girlfriend continuously refused her advances. The girl went to his elo boosting service to ask him out, but he ignored her leading her vindictively give Riot Korea proof of his elo boosting business. As a consequence, his main account was banned until 3013 and he received a 2 year ban from competitive play. This ban became the main reason for the creation of many alternate accounts."
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Apr 20, 2015 23:38
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He's the western Apdo insofar as Apdo is a solo queue monster who consistently bodies the best mids of Korea and China. Though Apdo doesn't even want to go pro, he makes more money from streaming and soloqueue than he would on a pro contract, and with far less expectations/commitments.
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Apr 20, 2015 23:47
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