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FISHMANPET posted:I also did another thing: 6 chests per train cart? You're a brave man. I once built a 10 cart train station and the number of chests each cart could support was something like 6-6-6-5-6-6-6-5-6-6 I had to rebuild the whole thing when I noticed that stuff was going into the wrong cart.
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Aug 5, 2015 16:57
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Yeah, depending on where your train stop is, a wagon will work with 6 or 5 inserters. It's silly, and will hopefully get fixed, but such is alpha life. (this is actually my only gripe with trains, though...)
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Aug 5, 2015 17:04
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Truga posted:Yeah, depending on where your train stop is, a wagon will work with 6 or 5 inserters. It's silly, and will hopefully get fixed, but such is alpha life. My main gripe with trains is that they are mainly an RP thing. For pure efficiency I'm willing to bet that a blue conveyor highway will ship more materials per second every single time. Plus adding stations and enlarging the train network costs a lot of time. I wish there was some sort of logistics middle ground were trains could be easier to work with when you just want to make a circle that transports materials. Right now trains can do a hundred things but only about 5 of those things relate the efficiency of your factory and the rest are a train simulator minigame.
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Aug 5, 2015 17:24
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By that logic, why bother with anything at all, just research robots asap and never use anything else.  But yeah, the wagons could hold a bit more than a single chest worth.
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Aug 5, 2015 17:27
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Once you get inserter upgrades, trains can transport way more volume. The problem is that you just really don't need that much volume. Two belts of iron and copper is pretty much all a reasonable sized factory needs, and you can mostly get by with one blue belt of each. Trains only come into their own with massive consumption and you have to deliberately build a factory for that.
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Aug 5, 2015 17:28
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My biggest gripe is that trains are different sizes if they're horizontal or vertical, which means I gotta carry around 4 plans instead of 2 (1 horizontal and 1 vertical for both loading and unloading stations). Normally I play with 1 loco - 2 cart trains or sometimes 2 loco - 4 cart trains and in those cases I only do 5 chests per side because I need gaps in between for power poles and such. But they changed the way unloading works (inserters no longer pull from the center of the object, and will pull directly adjacent to wear the inserter is) so all that stuff is just tweeked a little bit. I like to keep trains at the default 30 seconds because I'm lazy, and 12 total chests is more than enough to feed a train car. In fact I think even 15 seconds is good enough with all the inserter upgrades. So I could probably go down to 5, but then I have to figure out if there's a gap on the left or right end of the train car :sperg:
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Aug 5, 2015 17:30
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RE: big rail networks, I just counted and I have 52 rail stations, but I'm also trying to keep 6 rocket launchers continuously fed. For some reason after I launched the first rocket I didn't a victory notice so I've just kept on playing.
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Aug 5, 2015 17:40
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Zephyrine posted:My main gripe with trains is that they are mainly an RP thing. For pure efficiency I'm willing to bet that a blue conveyor highway will ship more materials per second every single time. Plus adding stations and enlarging the train network costs a lot of time. The advantage to trains is setup cost. A few stacks of rail will take you a lot further than the same amount of express belts and require far, far less material to boot. They also adapt well to upgrading your factory's efficiency. If you're upgrading your supply end from regular belts to express belts then the train can probably handle the extra volume, at most needing some extra cars or another train on the route. Taking belts the same distance means you have to replace the entire length of the highway. Also also trains are the fastest means of getting your character around your factory.
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Aug 5, 2015 18:16
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Bhodi posted:a reasonable sized factory there's your problem
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Aug 5, 2015 18:26
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Not with concrete and a mk2 crammed full of speed enhancements! One blue belt factory can build more belts than you can use; they construct really fast and are easy to just run along and put down. Plus, they only take iron and lubricant. Trains require building a whole bunch of engines which are made slowly and can't be manually crafted, plus a coal feed, plus stations, offloading inserters and chests, and the most valuable asset, space to make the station. It's a lot of work, especially when most people play on rich/big/enhanced patches that are generally not too far from your initial start. Bhodi fucked around with this message at 18:28 on Aug 5, 2015 |
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Aug 5, 2015 18:26
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I have passenger stations at various points throughout my base, and I wanted their station names to be at the top of my list. I name my stations with the resource first, so alphabetically my first station is Battery Deposit. Because I'm  (duh, I'm playing Factorio) I didn't want to just name my passengers stations "AAA Passenger station" and wanted them to be a real word, so I used Bahnhof, which is German for Railway Station.
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Aug 5, 2015 18:30
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Trains don't have the bulk capacity of a blue belt, but the logistics are way easier. Running ore from the mines to the smelters is faster with a belt, but resupplying ammo, repair packs, replacement walls, etc. with belts would be wasteful and messy.
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Aug 5, 2015 18:51
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Tenebrais posted:The advantage to trains is setup cost. A few stacks of rail will take you a lot further than the same amount of express belts and require far, far less material to boot. They also adapt well to upgrading your factory's efficiency. If you're upgrading your supply end from regular belts to express belts then the train can probably handle the extra volume, at most needing some extra cars or another train on the route. Taking belts the same distance means you have to replace the entire length of the highway. With belts I just have them go in a straight line and then they branch out in two directions to clear all ore fields, coal and oil on the way. I made a blueprint that places ,blue belts, powerlines and a pipeline in a straight line for 50 squares in a row. I then run in a straight line and place it all down with the personal robot port. It doesn't take long to reach the point where the factory builds more of the parts than I could ever have time to place and as I spiderweb this network outwards in all the compass directions as it siphons the land clean of all resources and bring them right where I need it. To travel throughout the network I drive a car on the conveyors themselves which goes incredibly past. Granted this is all just an experiment in efficiency. Normally I have trains instead because trains are fun and neat and cute but I believe that from a purely practical perspective. That's all there's to them.
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Aug 5, 2015 19:26
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FISHMANPET posted:I have passenger stations at various points throughout my base, and I wanted their station names to be at the top of my list. I name my stations with the resource first, so alphabetically my first station is Battery Deposit. Because I'm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LXOogEoQIc ^ dude has some strong opinions about trains, but some good ideas as far as station naming goes.
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Aug 5, 2015 20:44
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I feel like a train loop touched some of these players in a bad place, the way they rage against loops.
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Aug 5, 2015 21:55
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Bhodi posted:Not with concrete and a mk2 crammed full of speed enhancements! I just meant you need an unreasonably large factory instead. Also I started playing with very low number of deposits , but high richness to offset it to make trains more viable. Much better option IMO.
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Aug 5, 2015 21:59
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As soon as I get the tech for it, I make an engine factory and just set it to go. By the time I have something that uses engines (trains, bots) I have a full chest's worth. Since engines are the only annoying thing to make with any vehicle, having a chest's worth lets you crap out 6 tanks/cars (multiplayer) and/or 20 train engines on a whim.
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Aug 5, 2015 22:39
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Trains are a lot more fun than just another belt.Zephyrine posted:With belts I just have them go in a straight line and then they branch out in two directions to clear all ore fields, coal and oil on the way.
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Aug 6, 2015 00:04
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There needs to be an automated way to deal with biters.
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Aug 6, 2015 04:42
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Krataar posted:There needs to be an automated way to deal with biters. A tank, a personal roboport, and pockets full of repair packs. bonus points for Destroyers.
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Aug 6, 2015 05:35
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ikanreed, can you update your server to 0.12.2?
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Aug 6, 2015 14:57
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Foehammer posted:ikanreed, can you update your server to 0.12.2? I didn't know anyone was still using it. Sure. I'll do that tonight.
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Aug 6, 2015 15:00
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ikanreed posted:I didn't know anyone was still using it. Sure. I'll do that tonight. I wasn't using it, but I'd like to join and screw around with some multiplayer
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Aug 6, 2015 15:25
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When making a new train station on an existing track. You have to pick every single train on the line and tell them to use it to get them to stop there right?
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Aug 6, 2015 16:38
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I think I understand what you're asking, and no, there's no way to change once and have it apply to a bunch of trains. In OpenTTD parlance, you can copy orders (ctrl click on source train, shift click on destination train) but you can't share orders. I think there are train control mods (TheFatController comes to mind, but I haven't used it yet) that lets you access all your train schedules from a single window, so at least you don't have to track them all down. But I'd probably design my rail network so I didn't have to restation all my trains all the time in the first place.
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Aug 6, 2015 16:43
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It's not *all* the time but too often still. I keep procrastinating when it comes to building new stations and just extend the conveyor network further out from each station.
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Aug 6, 2015 16:51
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Personal roboport makes things so easy. I can poo poo out bases pretty easily
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Aug 6, 2015 17:19
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Zephyrine posted:It's not *all* the time but too often still. I keep procrastinating when it comes to building new stations and just extend the conveyor network further out from each station. Name all your iron ore pickup stations IRON. When you add a new one (or remove an old one), then the trains will automatically route themselves to the nearest open station. Also works with dropoffs, but you then have to be careful to have enough trains to saturate your stations so all the drops get filled.
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Aug 6, 2015 20:48
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Kenlon posted:Name all your iron ore pickup stations IRON. When you add a new one (or remove an old one), then the trains will automatically route themselves to the nearest open station. Also works with dropoffs, but you then have to be careful to have enough trains to saturate your stations so all the drops get filled. All stations have all materials. The main problem is that if the rail line looks like this: Base------1------2-------3-----Base (circle) I tell the trains to go Base-1-2-3 But then if I add a station between 2 and 3 named.... 2.5 then the trains will go Base-1-2-3-2.5-base Making a trip around the track that skips all the other stations. So I have to wipe the trains station list and place them out again with new timers
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Aug 7, 2015 05:30
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FYI, when doing orders, if you select an existing station in your orders, and then add a new station, it will go after your selected station, not at the end. No way that I know of to put a new station at the front though.
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Aug 7, 2015 05:40
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FISHMANPET posted:FYI, when doing orders, if you select an existing station in your orders, and then add a new station, it will go after your selected station, not at the end. No way that I know of to put a new station at the front though. Put it at the end and skip until it starts there. Effectively the same.
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Aug 7, 2015 06:29
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Zephyrine posted:All stations have all materials. This is a really weird way to do it. Why does every train need to visit every station? If the issue is that you need multiple stations to fill up a single train, then why do you have more than one train?
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Aug 7, 2015 07:09
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Dr. Stab posted:This is a really weird way to do it. Why does every train need to visit every station? If the issue is that you need multiple stations to fill up a single train, then why do you have more than one train? Three trains with 10 carts each: 2 iron, 2 copper, 2 coal, 2 oil (empty and full) 1 wood and 1 stone. They go to all stations and each station has a network of conveyors from nearby resource nodes. Zephyrine fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 07:26
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Zephyrine posted:Three trains with 10 carts each: 2 iron, 2 copper, 2 coal, 2 oil (empty and full) 1 wood and 1 stone. That's a horrifyingly inefficient way to do things - and you've already discovered at least one of the downsides. Specialization is the way to go, here.
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Aug 7, 2015 11:24
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All trains to all station looks the best though.
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Aug 7, 2015 11:36
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Truga posted:All trains to all station looks the best though. This is false. Having a network of (x) stations with (x*3) trains whizzing about the lot of them looks much better. With decent roundabout design and plenty of parallel sidings, it's quite efficient, too.
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Aug 7, 2015 11:37
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Kenlon posted:This is false. Having a network of (x) stations with (x*3) trains whizzing about the lot of them looks much better. With decent roundabout design and plenty of parallel sidings, it's quite efficient, too. It's still x stations and x*3 trains. But every train stops on most stations.  e: Also, long trains own. Truga fucked around with this message at 12:01 on Aug 7, 2015 |
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Aug 7, 2015 11:54
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Dunno-Lars posted:Put it at the end and skip until it starts there. Effectively the same. But I'm !
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Aug 7, 2015 14:20
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True factorio is leaving the game on over night to fill chests with advanced circuits.
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Aug 8, 2015 07:18
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FISHMANPET posted:RE: big rail networks, I just counted and I have 52 rail stations, but I'm also trying to keep 6 rocket launchers continuously fed. For some reason after I launched the first rocket I didn't a victory notice so I've just kept on playing. That's the spirit!
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Aug 8, 2015 07:22
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