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Nope, it was just that they wanted to spruce up the design from the blocky one present in TIE FIghter, there's no actual in-universe reason for the redesign and for all intents and purposes there has only ever been one design. I kind of dislike the ball cockpit in the lower defender (and keep in mind that the top design is blockier only because of lower graphics rather than intentionally, the cockpit in it is still meant to be rounded rather than hexagonal). I also like this design as well:  They are both better than the the current model used for X-Wing.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:56
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canyoneer posted:I've seen First Order Special Forces TIE toys, with a red stripe painted on. Those will surely show up in a future expansion along with the Black/orange T70s. Ugh, hopefully this doesn't mean next year (and the year after, with Rogue One coming out) will have wave after wave of slightly differently painted models with a handful of different pilot cards each.
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Sep 23, 2015 16:59
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Tekopo posted:I also like this design as well: This is the best of the three, but it's fractalsponge and thus unofficial. Still, FFG managed to pick the absolute worst Defender design for X-Wing.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:10
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Xenomrph posted:Let any pilot fly any ship (since the physical ship stats (weapons, evade, shields, etc) are static regardless of pilot, and the pilot carries with them their pilot skill # and special ability. I know of at least one exception: The Outer Rim smuggler pilot card for the YT 1300 has lower ship stats than the named pilots.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:13
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Irom posted:sup bruh Ah it was you! Ta for the list. The Seismic Charges have been good, I don't have the M3-A so I can't really use him but I have tried Palob Godhali who was decent. quote:If you're already seeing a bunch of TLTs in your meta, drop the missiles and VI and put sensor jammer on guri. Otherwise just drop missiles and give her firecontrol system and inertial dampeners. The only TLT lists we're seeing just now are mine, I was trying this PILOTS Palob Godalhi (27) HWK-290 (20), Twin Laser Turret (6), Greedo (1) Kavil (33) Y-Wing (24), Twin Laser Turret (6), Unhinged Astromech (1), Squad Leader (2) Guri (40) StarViper (30), Opportunist (4), Proton Torpedoes (4), Autothrusters (2) I was using Palob to make Opportunist work, and trying Greedo with TLT to create pseudo-crits from the TLT fire.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:14
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TIE Defender looks like an interceptor that failed QC miserably It never looks cool 
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Sep 23, 2015 17:16
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Xenomrph posted:Let any pilot fly any ship (since the physical ship stats (weapons, evade, shields, etc) are static regardless of pilot, and the pilot carries with them their pilot skill # and special ability. Certain upgrade options would be locked to ship type. Ditto on certain actions.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:19
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Keiya posted:Aurebesh? Somewhat. Graffiti? Hell no, I can't read that most of the time when the letter forms are ostensibly Latin. Yeah. I think I'm gonna stick with Latin characters on this one. Aurubesh would lose the immediate impact of seeing '80s subway car SLAM SECTOR on it.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:22
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Chill la Chill posted:This was tried with star trek and it was a trainwreck. The problem with separate "base model" + "upgrade character/istic" has always been the aggressive min-maxing we do for tournaments. Star trek/wizkids did it on a simple algorithm that didn't take into account special abilities. FFG might do better, but properly costing abilities has always been difficult when the static value could be applied to many types of base models, like in 40k (40k tried to skirt around it with variable upgrade costs but they do a poo poo balancing job anyway). I feel like doing this for x-wing will only lead to fewer viable types of ships. We do have a problem where only certain pilots can really be used per type of ship, but since the ships handle differently, I'd much rather have that than reducing total types of ships overall. You could make a game with that in mind but the design space for the pilots would be a lot more limited and you'd get less interesting stuff. Even then, you'd probably just see a few aces in the best ships. For example, most of the HWK pilots are really good but their limitation is coming in a HWK which is a trash tier ship. But yeah seeing Picard and Dukat(was it Dukat being the other one?) on everything was boring as gently caress.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:33
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canyoneer posted:I know of at least one exception: The Outer Rim smuggler pilot card for the YT 1300 has lower ship stats than the named pilots.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:36
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Chill la Chill posted:This was tried with star trek and it was a trainwreck. The problem with separate "base model" + "upgrade character/istic" has always been the aggressive min-maxing we do for tournaments. Star trek/wizkids did it on a simple algorithm that didn't take into account special abilities. FFG might do better, but properly costing abilities has always been difficult when the static value could be applied to many types of base models, like in 40k (40k tried to skirt around it with variable upgrade costs but they do a poo poo balancing job anyway). I feel like doing this for x-wing will only lead to fewer viable types of ships. We do have a problem where only certain pilots can really be used per type of ship, but since the ships handle differently, I'd much rather have that than reducing total types of ships overall. And you risk having some seriously broken interactions. Like putting Blount's ability on, say, an ion cannon or TLT ship. Or Keyan flying a PTL A-Wing. Wedge in anything other than an X-Wing.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:36
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Or seeing all the rebel pilots flying the YT-1300 (apart from Corran I guess).
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Sep 23, 2015 17:37
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Tekopo posted:Or seeing all the rebel pilots flying the YT-1300 (apart from Corran I guess).
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Sep 23, 2015 17:39
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Xenomrph posted:That makes sense, as the named pilots are flying the unique ship Millennium Falcon, which has modifications a "stock" YT-1300 doesn't have. I think FFG said before that if they could go back, they'd probably change the way that works, putting the stat bonus on the MF title card rather than the pilots(because you can actually take two Falcons as it is now). This is how they're doing the JumpMaster now- you can get the stock model or the Punishing One which has upgraded firepower.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:43
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Panzeh posted:if they could go back They can, through the magic known as "printing errata," but they don't want to. 
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Sep 23, 2015 17:45
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Lemon Curdistan posted:They can, through the magic known as "printing errata," but they don't want to. It would be a huuuge errata, though. They'd have to change all the pilot costs and the MF card and I think if you're going to do that there's some other things they'd want to do, too.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:46
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Panzeh posted:It would be a huuuge errata, though. They'd have to change all the pilot costs and the MF card and I think if you're going to do that there's some other things they'd want to do, too. Yeah. It would be nice but all the alt arts and big card are all done with the old stats and I really like my han solo movie card inside millenium falcon big card.
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Sep 23, 2015 17:50
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Has FFG said anything about doing pilot "booster packs", where you get new ship tokens/pilot cards/maybe upgrade cards, but no miniature? I think that could be a cost effective way to let players expand their pilot roster options without, say, needing to drop $15 on a mini they may not need (or more likely, confusing consumers by having 2 identical minis in stores that actually have completely different cards).
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Sep 23, 2015 18:40
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Xenomrph posted:Has FFG said anything about doing pilot "booster packs", where you get new ship tokens/pilot cards/maybe upgrade cards, but no miniature? How many people would actually buy the boosters, as opposed to just proxying the cards, though?
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Sep 23, 2015 18:45
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They never have and they never will, because they make way more money selling you a toy spaceship each time you buy a blister.
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Sep 23, 2015 18:46
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jivjov posted:How many people would actually buy the boosters, as opposed to just proxying the cards, though?
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Sep 23, 2015 19:15
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grassy gnoll posted:They never have and they never will, because they make way more money selling you a toy spaceship each time you buy a blister. I would think printing cards is cheaper than making minis; there's the potential for an insane profit margin.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:21
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jivjov posted:I would think printing cards is cheaper than making minis; there's the potential for an insane profit margin. Then you'll have to convince FFG that this insane profit is real, because what grassy gnoll said isn't just speculation, it's FFG's official position on the subject. They've been asked in interviews several times whether they'd ever do card-only X-Wing expansions and they've said that their model with X-Wing is to always sell people a ship.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:31
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Kai Tave posted:Then you'll have to convince FFG that this insane profit is real, because what grassy gnoll said isn't just speculation, it's FFG's official position on the subject. They've been asked in interviews several times whether they'd ever do card-only X-Wing expansions and they've said that their model with X-Wing is to always sell people a ship. Sadly there is a reason they bury desirable cards with expensive ships like the Tantive and the Raider. Want the paper? Buy the plastic.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:34
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Maybe it's also to keep them visible? I can see a lot of clueless LGS owners keeping card clamshells with the RPG LCG which is also an issue. The same can be said for online, when you might buy an LCG/RPG card pack instead.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:38
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Kai Tave posted:Then you'll have to convince FFG that this insane profit is real, because what grassy gnoll said isn't just speculation, it's FFG's official position on the subject. They've been asked in interviews several times whether they'd ever do card-only X-Wing expansions and they've said that their model with X-Wing is to always sell people a ship.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:48
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Xenomrph posted:That's dumb, they're dumb. You've seen the FFG sales chart that goes vertical when they started X-Wing, right?
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Sep 23, 2015 19:53
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Poopy Palpy posted:You've seen the FFG sales chart that goes vertical when they started X-Wing, right? I haven't, but I imagine it looks like a barely tilted L-shape, right?
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Sep 23, 2015 19:53
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Xenomrph posted:That's dumb, they're dumb. pretty sure FFG is finding great success with this business model so it is in fact your opinion that is bad and dumb
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Sep 23, 2015 19:54
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Xenomrph posted:That's dumb, they're dumb. And yet here we all are, buying plastic spaceships.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:54
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I trade fantasy cardboard for sci-fi plastic. It's really a lateral move, I swear.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:01
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Kai Tave posted:And yet here we all are, buying plastic spaceships.  I'd just like to get "expansions for expansions" that don't involve buying minis I don't need. It just seems like a really obvious product to make, and easy to implement. Oh well, I'll keep buying minis. Also I've been eyeing some of the bigger ships just because the minis are neat, how easy is it for the little fighters to blow them up? One of the things I liked in the PC games was that fighters could tackle big ships and take them out if the player had the right knowledge/skill (and to a lesser degree, armament).
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Sep 23, 2015 20:04
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Xenomrph posted:Guilty as charged. The huge epic ships play a different kind of game from the standard. If you're worried about their balance, don't. It's almost always better to take more normal ships than a huge ship in math terms because of how much it costs to trick out a huge.
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Sep 23, 2015 20:20
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The epic scale ships are tougher than they initially appear because they have an inherent ability to recharge their shields by spending energy, so they can be a hard nut to crack if you go against one thinking "oh it's just like a Decimator only bigger," plus they have an action that essentially gives a section an evade on every attack. That said, energy isn't an unlimited resource and with proper coordination you can very easily force a huge ship player into a difficult choice of "do I dump my energy into the shields, or do I save it to activate my weapons?" I played part of the campaign that came with the Tantive IV a while back, the first mission of which is "the Tantive with some upgrades versus Howlrunner and 5x generic TIEs," the objectives for which were for the Imperial player to cripple one of the Tantive's sections or for the corvette player to prevent that from happening for six rounds until it could jump to hyperspace. It came down to a nailbiter on the last round where I had one last TIE in position to attack and needed two hits to bypass the corvette's brace maneuver and do the final damage I needed and I got hit/eye. So in six rounds with a virtually unupgraded TIE swarm I almost managed to cripple one of the Tantive's sections. Presumably with better/more upgraded ships (like, say, Interceptors) it could be accomplished quicker (but of course in further parts of the campaign the Rebel player starts getting more ships to play with).
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Sep 23, 2015 20:29
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grassy gnoll posted:New PBP game happening, Strobe with his same list and hopefully less dice fuckery, vs. YOU???. Not sure if anyone else has gotten in first, but I'm in if the slot's still open! First PbP I've done for X-Wing, so I'm not sure whether I should wait for confirmation as to whether or not there's still a vacancy before sending you my list, although I suppose it's not going to change anything - here's the list I'll use, if given the opportunity: Keyan Farlander -Veteran Instincts Ten Numb -Mangler Cannon Wedge Antilles -Engine Upgrade
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Sep 23, 2015 22:23
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Xenomrph posted:Guilty as charged. Other things to do with minis you don't need: Give them to your niece/nephew String them up hanging from your car's mirror Mail them to me
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Sep 23, 2015 22:56
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Kai Tave posted:The epic scale ships are tougher than they initially appear because they have an inherent ability to recharge their shields by spending energy, so they can be a hard nut to crack if you go against one thinking "oh it's just like a Decimator only bigger," plus they have an action that essentially gives a section an evade on every attack. That said, energy isn't an unlimited resource and with proper coordination you can very easily force a huge ship player into a difficult choice of "do I dump my energy into the shields, or do I save it to activate my weapons?" Yeah if you look at the costs of the forces involved you can kinda tell why the huge ships are suboptimal. Yeah, they have the energy stuff to help them but they kind of need it to function as anything close to their huge point costs.
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Sep 23, 2015 23:51
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Admittedly, it can be dangerous to loiter too close to the larger ships because if you wind up placed wrong you can and will get run right the gently caress over. I lost one TIE outright when the Tantive's aft section swung into it during a turn. Another thing that can make a difference is the fact that because of the fact that the Tantive and Raider specifically come in two sections that unless you're careful with your maneuvering sometimes you can wind up out of position to take a shot at the section you want to shoot at.
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Sep 24, 2015 00:21
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Major Isoor posted:Not sure if anyone else has gotten in first, but I'm in if the slot's still open! First PbP I've done for X-Wing, so I'm not sure whether I should wait for confirmation as to whether or not there's still a vacancy before sending you my list, although I suppose it's not going to change anything - here's the list I'll use, if given the opportunity: Have I got good news for you.
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Sep 24, 2015 00:21
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Kai Tave posted:Admittedly, it can be dangerous to loiter too close to the larger ships because if you wind up placed wrong you can and will get run right the gently caress over. I lost one TIE outright when the Tantive's aft section swung into it during a turn. Another thing that can make a difference is the fact that because of the fact that the Tantive and Raider specifically come in two sections that unless you're careful with your maneuvering sometimes you can wind up out of position to take a shot at the section you want to shoot at.
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Sep 24, 2015 00:48
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