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ultrachrist posted:I thought it was weird how everyone is white and then there's that random quest with a black succubus. So... there either has to be black people in the world or that is going to be one ineffective succubus, eh?  I just beat the game and it's really good and fun, the ending was slightly flaccid though, I don't understand why Ciri even needed to rely on the Conjunction of the Spheres to teleport to wherever she teleported to if she can do that anyway, and if it were the case that she couldn't teleport there without it, how did she get back?
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Dec 3, 2015 21:51
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Butyraceous posted:
If I remember correctly, her traveling companion taught her. In short, a sage did it.
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Dec 3, 2015 21:55
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Comte de Saint-Germain posted:I should *really* not participate in this discussion, but I will point out that the idea that middle-ages europe was a place of homogeneous skintones is actually a pretty modern creation, a creation that exists, at least partially, because of fictional depictions. Poland was once one of the most metropolitan places in Europe. Additionally, like much of eastern Europe, the place was entirely conquered for a pretty decent chunk of history by the Mongols- and those Mongol populations didn't vanish overnight when the empire receded, but became mixed into the local populations. I realize that but the Poland that the author actually lives in and grew up in is whiter than most American suburbs. That's not to even mention the basic weirdness of the criticism. Is it just a question of the skin color of NPCs in the world? Okay that's an easy fix but nothing about dark skinned Temerians by themselves bears any resemblance to the specific construction of racial identity--e.g., "blackness" itself--certainly nothing in any case that would reflect the specific set of social conditions in which that construction exists in the first place. Would these characters have recognizably non-white features? Accents? Would they have a separate in-universe history and relationship to the fictional society that it mirrors or is in any way recognizable to a person of color playing the game right now? There's just something fundamentally strange about the idea of including real and specific socially constructed racial identities into a fictional society to better reflect the conditions of a modern, existing society thousands of miles away that has no historical relationship with the events that the fiction draws from. The closest analogue I can think of is something like localization--rewriting the universe so everyone speaks English. But even that sort of works on a different "layer" of the game. What's the advantage or benefit of introducing purely superficial changes to the skin color of characters into a world that can't possibly accommodate the relationship those skin colors have to history, from the perspective of a non-white player? I get that it wouldn't hurt anything and there isn't any specific reason not to do it, but I can't see any way that the end result doesn't just resemble the sort of fake multiculturalism normally associated with like, advertising and television sitcoms. Typically, the argument for including non-white characters in SF/Fantasy is that the genres rank escapism ought to be able to work to the benefit of people of color as well as white European audiences, but Temeria is a wartorn shithole almost entirely devoid of heroism or even just not-misery. There's just something off and slightly gross about taking a game that deals pretty directly with the sort of abuse inflicted on ethnic Poles and particularly Jews and asking why there aren't any analogues for American people of color in this story. Edit: I really shouldn't be a part of this discussion either. Just to clarify though I'm not on some poo poo like "oh those drat SJWs ruining gaming!". I think it's a perfectly valid criticism of the genre as a whole. TW3 just seems like a particularly weak example of the specific phenomenon people take issue with. Woozy fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Dec 3, 2015 |
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Dec 3, 2015 23:08
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I think Witcher 3 would lose absolutely nothing if it had people of color. It's an internationally marketed product and it having to stay as close to current-day Poland for some reason is particularly weak: more people would feel included but the story's vision wouldn't suffer. The game doesn't reflect the current-day Poland in a lot of ways and in a lot of ways it refers to medieval mentality and medieval themes but apparently the racial aspect is the one that has to be kept as-it-is-nowadays, right. If you want to refer to it being close to the books then the games have already detoriated so much in so many other key ideas that it doesn't matter either. Having a black man in an inn would have been so much less of a deal in that regard than Geralt purging countless bandits, pirates and deserters just because he can. At the same time saying that racial issues are depicted using elves, dwarves and halflings while the very people those issues refer to are absent from the game is ironic to say the least and manages to directly represent one of those issues. That being said it's not something to hate the game for or discard it but it's also not nothing and I understand people having a problem with it. I would love to see major Mongolian influences in the game. That empire had so much impact on Polish culture especially in middle-ages that for example clothing that Polish people to this day automatically consider to be traditional Polish nobility outfits are just modified versions of Mongolian clothes. Palpek fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Dec 4, 2015 |
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Dec 4, 2015 00:11
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Mongols aren't black. The Northern Realms aren't Poland. CDPR didn't actually design this setting. Glad that's all straightened out with the token Ofieri added to the game. We can stop talking about it now.Comte de Saint-Germain posted:Yeah, he was in the base game but got cut for reasons. He just never made sense for the expansions or DLC for other reasons. His previous role in the game was in a quest chain that eventually became the basis for Hearts of Stone, but between the initial implementation (for W3) and the full expansion (HoS) it was totally rewritten, to the point that you wouldn't recognize the quest at all. It was a story about the Catriona plague, Mr. Mirror, and some Nilfgaardian researchers. Maybe after we're all done with the game I can drop some more details, the cut stuff with Iorveth was mostly my stuff, so it makes me sad we never got to use him. So when are you doing the Enhanced Edition? You are doing an Enhanced Edition aren't you? Aren't you?
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Dec 4, 2015 00:48
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Mystic Stylez posted:I gotta concede one thing though, it must take a lot of talent to make a game this loving good and have a looting mechanic so atrociously bad that half the challenge of the game on a console is being able to open containers/examine stuff. "Big pile of chests? Better throw some candles on top of everything as well."
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Dec 4, 2015 01:18
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I swear in the patch notes at one point there was something about Geralt ignoring candles placed on top of chests but I don't think it ever actually worked.
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Dec 4, 2015 01:25
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The hearts of stone voice work is so loving good all i want to do is listen to gaunter o'dimm talk about what a shithead olgierd is all day. True across the whole series really, i was talking with a buddy of mine at work a while back about how much more engaging even the idle peasant banter in W1 is than the usual crap overheard in other games of the time. I saw a mudcrab the other day, filthy creatures!! andrew smash fucked around with this message at 07:51 on Dec 4, 2015 |
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Dec 4, 2015 07:46
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I can only assume their voice director is loving great. I mean don't let me downplay the VAs' talents, going for UK theatre people for the most part seems to have been the right call. But even the people that do a lot of voice work sound better in the Witcher games than in other games. Script probably helps too.
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Dec 4, 2015 07:51
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Woozy posted:I realize that but the Poland that the author actually lives in and grew up in is whiter than most American suburbs. That's not to even mention the basic weirdness of the criticism. Is it just a question of the skin color of NPCs in the world? Okay that's an easy fix but nothing about dark skinned Temerians by themselves bears any resemblance to the specific construction of racial identity--e.g., "blackness" itself--certainly nothing in any case that would reflect the specific set of social conditions in which that construction exists in the first place. Would these characters have recognizably non-white features? Accents? Would they have a separate in-universe history and relationship to the fictional society that it mirrors or is in any way recognizable to a person of color playing the game right now? There's just something fundamentally strange about the idea of including real and specific socially constructed racial identities into a fictional society to better reflect the conditions of a modern, existing society thousands of miles away that has no historical relationship with the events that the fiction draws from. The closest analogue I can think of is something like localization--rewriting the universe so everyone speaks English. But even that sort of works on a different "layer" of the game. Yes, Sapkowski's poland is lily-white, and largely culturally homogeneous, but he didn't make these games. He doesn't even like them. We rewrite his stuff constantly. A non-insignificant portion of the studio isn't Polish, including me. But I think with HoS we answered how we can be a little more diverse in our representations of people while still being true to the essential Polishness of the place. I think we answered it well enough that your questions seem a little disingenuous. I really don't want to blow this up, as the criticism we received on this subject was *really* minor. Some people tend to get bent out of shape over this stuff in a way that is totally out-of-proportion to the actual criticism. You see it also in regards to feminist criticisms, which for some reason really get under some people's skin in a way that's not appropriate. (I'm not accusing you of being out of proportion, btw, I think you are making reasonable points.)
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Dec 4, 2015 10:47
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This is actually more true to its source material than almost any adaptation of a fantasy series I've seen so I don't know that you rewrite his stuff "constantly". Sapkowski seems like an angry old dude.
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Dec 4, 2015 11:51
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Why is it that sometimes when I parry I get stunned? Drowners or the Hounds of the Wild Hunt do this, for instance. Is it because they use heavy attacks (I can't find a way to tell if they are or not, the animations are not always very clear to convey this) or something?
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Dec 4, 2015 11:57
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Furism posted:Why is it that sometimes when I parry I get stunned? Drowners or the Hounds of the Wild Hunt do this, for instance. Is it because they use heavy attacks (I can't find a way to tell if they are or not, the animations are not always very clear to convey this) or something? Pretty sure the game tells you to avoid parrying monsters and to dodge instead.
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Dec 4, 2015 12:05
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The Sharmat posted:This is actually more true to its source material than almost any adaptation of a fantasy series I've seen so I don't know that you rewrite his stuff "constantly". Palpek fucked around with this message at 12:31 on Dec 4, 2015 |
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Dec 4, 2015 12:28
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I could swear I read an interview from him where he basically said the written word is the only legitimate way to tell a story.
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Dec 4, 2015 12:30
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That may as well be true, I mean his next trilogy was a fantasy version of the Hussite Wars complete with actual historical figures in historical locations - he's obviously been hidden behind a wall of books most of his life. Still it doesn't change the point that he never blocked other media from using his source material and even when he had a chance to say 'use the universe I created but don't touch Geralt' - he didn't.
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Dec 4, 2015 12:35
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Polish man in his 60's doesn't care about videogames, news at 11
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Dec 4, 2015 12:46
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Why don't they have guns in the Witcher? The game wouldn't suffer if there were guns. There would have been guns in Poland. It looks like the world matches the technological and social development of the 1500s if not the 1600s, where there was surely at least 1 gun
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Dec 4, 2015 13:43
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Xeremides posted:Pretty sure the game tells you to avoid parrying monsters and to dodge instead. There's a specific point in the tutorial where they tell you that if you parry just before they attack you counter-attack. But from what you're saying, I assume it means this applies only to humanoids?
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Dec 4, 2015 13:46
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Eustachy posted:Why don't they have guns in the Witcher? The game wouldn't suffer if there were guns. There would have been guns in Poland. It looks like the world matches the technological and social development of the 1500s if not the 1600s, where there was surely at least 1 gun Mages make guns obsolete. Until recently mages were actually a military asset for both the North and Nilfgaard. The Northern Realms are not Poland.
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Dec 4, 2015 14:20
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Furism posted:Why is it that sometimes when I parry I get stunned? Drowners or the Hounds of the Wild Hunt do this, for instance. Is it because they use heavy attacks (I can't find a way to tell if they are or not, the animations are not always very clear to convey this) or something? Yes. Some enemies have attacks that break your parry. These attacks still do less damage than if they had hit clean, but cause Geralt to stagger afterwards. As far as I'm aware any attack that can break your parry cannot be countered with a timed riposte (pressing Parry just before the attack hits), and any attack that does not stagger on parry can be countered with a riposte. Drowners specifically have two different attacks: a lunging attack with two hands that will break parry and stagger, and a close range quick attack that is subject to both parry and riposte. Which attack they use appears to be based primarily on their distance from Geralt. The safe way to figure out which attacks can and cannot break through parry is to have Quen active when you try. If you try to parry a heavy attack with Quen, the shield will break but you won't be staggered. If you try to parry a light attack, the attack will do zero damage and Quen shield will be totally unaffected.
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Dec 4, 2015 14:59
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Furism posted:There's a specific point in the tutorial where they tell you that if you parry just before they attack you counter-attack. But from what you're saying, I assume it means this applies only to humanoids? So some monsters can be countered, but I really only felt it worthwhile on harpy-types. Countering people is the easiest way through bandits in the early game.
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Dec 4, 2015 15:05
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The Sharmat posted:The Northern Realms are not Poland. but at least they have kabobs and pierogies
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Dec 4, 2015 15:08
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Thanks for the tips on parrying/dodging guys!
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Dec 4, 2015 15:25
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Voxx posted:but at least they have kabobs and pierogies
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Dec 4, 2015 15:58
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Palpek posted:Wait, are there kebobs in TW3? In the books, I don't remember if I saw any in game. Nevertheless kabobs own.
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Dec 4, 2015 16:04
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Voxx posted:In the books, I don't remember if I saw any in game. Nevertheless kabobs own.
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Dec 4, 2015 16:07
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Don't taint this thread with donner kepab talk, that whole weird thing europe has with them is a peeve of mine. Everyone has them dammit it's not a local delicacy. CONGRATS to Witcher 3: Wild Hunt, The for winning GOTY at the Game Awards, which sounds pretty official to me http://kotaku.com/the-witcher-3-wins-game-of-the-year-at-the-2015-game-aw-1746116606 
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Dec 4, 2015 17:11
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Does this place do GOTY threads where we track all the GOTY awards, I'm gathering a whole folder of stuff to troll Bloodborne & Fallout folks
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Dec 4, 2015 19:28
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lol at the guy in the comments losing his poo poo calling W3 buggy as hell and is *really* angry about Skellige's Most Wanted. Mine worked since it was released. Console supremacy. 
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Dec 4, 2015 19:42
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The Sharmat posted:I could swear I read an interview from him where he basically said the written word is the only legitimate way to tell a story. I don't think I have ever heard a major author of a fantasy novel or story say they were happy with an adaptation. Almost by definition if you are inspired and dedicated enough to create something unique, you probably aren't going to be completely happy with someone else remaking your vision in a different medium at best its gonna be like looking at a Frankenstein version of your child. I guess this is the current thread for the whole series? I'm just playing these now, finished the first one, now I'm in chapter 1 of the second. In some ways I liked the first more because it was a more pc-focused game, just because I have tendonitis so the more action-y games get the harder they are for me. Still loving story, setting, visuals, costuming, voice acting, etc.
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Dec 4, 2015 21:45
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't think I have ever heard a major author of a fantasy novel or story say they were happy with an adaptation. Almost by definition if you are inspired and dedicated enough to create something unique, you probably aren't going to be completely happy with someone else remaking your vision in a different medium at best its gonna be like looking at a Frankenstein version of your child. There's a fair bit of chat about the first two games and a lot of posters have played through them, so yeah I suppose it's the catch-all Witcher games thread. If you're loving the story and artistic bits man are you in for a treat once you get to Wild Hunt. Each game improves significantly over the last in terms of gameplay and writing and W3 somehow manages to pack 100+ hours of truly solid and deep content in. Maybe a bit unfortunately for you, W3 combat is pretty similar to W2 and more fast-action than the timed clicking in W1. So you might wanna start W3 on a lower difficulty setting and not worry too much about the combat to avoid aggravating your tendonitis. You're not missing anything by doing so.
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Dec 4, 2015 21:55
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Supreme Allah posted:Does this place do GOTY threads where we track all the GOTY awards, I'm gathering a whole folder of stuff to troll Bloodborne & Fallout folks It's sad to see people overlook niche masterpieces like Bloodborne, Metal Gear Solid, and Fallout 4, and give this award to a soulless mass market product. The Witcher 3 is vastly overrated on this forum by people who are blinded by pretty graphics and an average story. It has literally the worst combat ever made, and the game is basically a reskinned version of Assassin's Creed. Not to mention how CDPR lied about offering free DLC, and then proceeded to announce a $25 season pass. Added to that, the game runs at 20 seconds per frame on consoles. The developer comes off as slimy, so I don't even know how they won the developer of the year award. I'm absolutely disgusted and you should be too. Go Bloodborne! 
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Dec 4, 2015 21:57
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drat, even Windows Photo Viewer has less than 20 seconds per frame.
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Dec 4, 2015 22:04
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halwain posted:It's sad to see people overlook niche masterpieces like Bloodborne, Metal Gear Solid, and Fallout 4, and give this award to a soulless mass market product. The Witcher 3 is vastly overrated on this forum by people who are blinded by pretty graphics and an average story. It has literally the worst combat ever made, and the game is basically a reskinned version of Assassin's Creed. Not to mention how CDPR lied about offering free DLC, and then proceeded to announce a $25 season pass. Added to that, the game runs at 20 seconds per frame on consoles. The developer comes off as slimy, so I don't even know how they won the developer of the year award. 
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Dec 5, 2015 00:43
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halwain posted:It's sad to see people overlook niche masterpieces like Bloodborne, Metal Gear Solid, and Fallout 4, and give this award to a soulless mass market product. The Witcher 3 is vastly overrated on this forum by people who are blinded by pretty graphics and an average story. It has literally the worst combat ever made, and the game is basically a reskinned version of Assassin's Creed. Not to mention how CDPR lied about offering free DLC, and then proceeded to announce a $25 season pass. Added to that, the game runs at 20 seconds per frame on consoles. The developer comes off as slimy, so I don't even know how they won the developer of the year award. I'm not even sure the developers are from America. What are they hiding?!
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Dec 5, 2015 01:13
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halwain posted:It's sad to see people overlook niche masterpieces like Bloodborne, Metal Gear Solid, and Fallout 4, and give this award to a soulless mass market product. The Witcher 3 is vastly overrated on this forum by people who are blinded by pretty graphics and an average story. It has literally the worst combat ever made, and the game is basically a reskinned version of Assassin's Creed. Not to mention how CDPR lied about offering free DLC, and then proceeded to announce a $25 season pass. Added to that, the game runs at 20 seconds per frame on consoles. The developer comes off as slimy, so I don't even know how they won the developer of the year award. You forgot to mention the nigh-on criminal downgrading of graphics, taking it from what should be the pinnacle of elite PC visuals and reducing it to a souless and indistinguishable equal of everything else out there. Disgraceful.
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Dec 5, 2015 02:07
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drat aren't the ofieri people of colour? they're kinda like arab brown dudes, that is not a white person at all
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Dec 5, 2015 02:18
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igni can't melt steel beams
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Dec 5, 2015 02:30
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I don't think I have ever heard a major author of a fantasy novel or story say they were happy with an adaptation. Almost by definition if you are inspired and dedicated enough to create something unique, you probably aren't going to be completely happy with someone else remaking your vision in a different medium at best its gonna be like looking at a Frankenstein version of your child. It was a general statement, not referring to just the games based on his work. And to be fair in the same interview he said that CDPR deserved praise for what they had done. As for fantasy authors pleased with adaptations...as far as I can tell GRRM at least used to be quite pleased with Game of Thrones but he's a pretty laid back dude. I just thought that one comment (which I may be misremembering) from Sapkowski was weirdly snobbish given he primarily works in a genre that's still widely considered trashy "genre fiction" in most of the English speaking world. Maybe that stigma doesn't exist in Poland though? Fonzarelli posted:drat aren't the ofieri people of colour? I think they're supposed to look like North Africans. They have a similar range in skin tone with some of them actually being fairly pale with just an olive undertone and some of them being quite dark. I liked the detail in their voice acting where you could tell their native language had a different subject object verb order or whatever from the way they talked. Also that note where the dude gets really mad that someone thought Ofier was Zerrikanian.
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Dec 5, 2015 02:42
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